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JT dropped by Ralph Lauren


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No one wears RL anyway. Years ago everyone did but not now.   Can’t tell you the last time I saw a golf shop that carried RL as a main line. In fact most don’t carry it at all
I used to say dumba** after a missed putt but realized  most of my friends were offend. 😆

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...In responsibility to my integrity I've decided to discontinue any thought of doing business with Ralph Lauren at this time...   ...It's my hope that Ralph Lauren will do the necessary ref

PC strikes again. No forgiveness even after you have a heartfelt apology

This isn't them saying they don't forgive him, they even say they're willing to partner with him again.   Language changes over time. Words that were once socially acceptable change as well.

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53 minutes ago, tiderider said:

people younger than 40 should check out eddie murphy's RAW or Delirious ... or Andrew Dice Clay ... but those were funny ... still are, most parts ... 

 

 

Ha 😂

 

Eddie Murphy was totally insane! God, he could do basically none of those gigs now and back then the people couldn’t even breathe we were laughing so hard. 

 

And Dice...I won’t even get started.

 

Look, it’s true, we were far more insensitive back then in what was acceptable.

 

Times change.

 

Thats all there is to it. 

Edited by bscinstnct
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Yes, no, and no.

 

Not sure what your reply has anything to do with what I posted.

 

I'll go slow for you...

 

I

Would

NOT

Have

Dropped

JT.

 

If I'm the CEO in this exact situation I would have accepted the apology, had a private conversation with JT along him please don't make a fool of us in the future for standing by you.  And I would release the appropriate statement so that all the offended people have something to hang their hat on.

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1 hour ago, CasualLie said:

Yes, no, and no.

 

Not sure what your reply has anything to do with what I posted.

 

I'll go slow for you...

 

I

Would

NOT

Have

Dropped

JT.

 

If I'm the CEO in this exact situation I would have accepted the apology, had a private conversation with JT along him please don't make a fool of us in the future for standing by you.  And I would release the appropriate statement so that all the offended people have something to hang their hat on.


 

The CEO?

 

I could see JT being fired well before the CEO even found out and fired somebody for not firing JT before the CEO found out himself!

 

The CEO of RL is running a global business. I doubt they bother him about firing a guy who sells a few polos ; )

 

I mean, if you look at the statement, it wasn’t the even the CEOs name at the bottom. It was,

 

-Ralph Lauren Corporate Communications 

 

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, bladehunter said:

Right.  I’d do the same if mic-Ed up.  I’d clam up and not speak.  
 

which then begs the question.  Why mic them up ?  If you Aren’t hearing real talk.  Why listen ?  That same white washed version you’d give juniors in your group isn’t real.  Real is 4 buddies and no mics.   That’s whne real happens.  I’m all for real. I don’t care to hear the fake.    And on top of that I’m not for punishing real   personally.  
 

people need to understand that cussing ones self out is a natural right.   It’s healthy and it’s not wrong.  We’re now  into  coo-coo land where speech against ones set is also outlawed.  Let’s go back to authentic. 

Lots of words to choose from to 'cus yourself out'  and the list of words not to use is really pretty short. I don't think too many people want to hear racial or homophobic slurs.

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Too bad much of the world gets butt hurt at nothing, imo. These are only words. If a single word can change the world in this manner then people are way too sensitive.  I just don’t get it. We grew up with casual insults being a game, see who can win the sharpest quickest comeback game. Nobody got hurt, just gained mental toughness.

 

I think JT needs to forget sponsors for a year and let his sticks do the talking. They will come back, on his terms.

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6 hours ago, sethdavidsdad said:

No one wears RL anyway. Years ago everyone did but not now.   Can’t tell you the last time I saw a golf shop that carried RL as a main line. In fact most don’t carry it at all
I used to say dumba** after a missed putt but realized  most of my friends were offend. 😆

RL had 6.16 billion in sales last year. The brand overall seems to be doing okay. Can't speak specifically to the golf clothes, but keep in mind sponsoring a golfer is not just about selling their golf line, but promoting the company in general.

Edited by 2bGood
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I've only read a few pages of this thread so forgive me if it has been mentioned.

 

His choice of words would be completely forgotten if they didn't drop him. It was covered by golf channel for 12 hours after but thats it. There was no story on ESPN, nothing on CNN, Fox, Good Morning America, no Facebook posts calling for action on JT or RL. RL dropping him and the eye rolling and mild backlash is the story, not what he said.

 

I understand RL is much larger than golf, and appeals more toward the LBGTQ than anything golf ever will. But RL lost in this ordeal and the PR, not JT.

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12 hours ago, bladehunter said:

Right.  I’d do the same if mic-Ed up.  I’d clam up and not speak.  
 

which then begs the question.  Why mic them up ? 

JT was not mic'd up at the time. What he said was caught on a greenside microphone. JT has stated in the past the he refuses to be mic'd up in an event.

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Clay brought in a new type of comedic style, still going today with some comics, it was out there and got a lot of attention early days

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10 hours ago, Skhacker said:

A lot of people making excuses for JT here. I know I come from an older generation, but whatever happened to being accountable for your actions?

Seems to be a lot of hurt feelings in this thread. JT will be fine. He made a mistake, did NOT make excuses for it like many on here, owned it and is moving on. 

 

From what I have read of the incident, JT has owned up to and is taking responsibility for it. He is certainly being held accountable for it.

I have to commend him for putting out a proper apology, rather than the weak sauce "I'm sorry if anyone was offended".

To be honest, I don't think badly of him for saying it. We grow up with insult-words--sometimes regional, sometimes not--that are hard to shake off; they often come to be used not as direct insults against a particular group, but rather as an expression of personal anger or frustration. I think that's probably what happened in JT's case.

 

Someone upthread said it would be better to drop F-bombs like Tiger. Although probably half meant as a joke, there's a lot of truth in that. While some people may be offended by an F-bomb, it doesn't target any particular vulnerable group or minority; saying it in certain circumstances could even be deemed "edgy," which would then make it useful.

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13 hours ago, Strategery said:

Saying it revealed that he's thinking it. You cannot undo that.

 

RL has the right to discontinue? That's deep. We were totally unaware of this.

 

Do you enjoy coming online and belittling a post with condescending remarks? I bet you are a blast at the 19th hole. 
 

My post was about apologies, forgiveness and free market decisions. Nothing more or less. 
 



 


 


 

 

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My two cents.

 

RL evidently had a termination clause in the contract it had with JT.  It exercised its contractual right and terminated the contract.  RL, wrong or right, made a marketing and business decision that it was in its better interest not to further engage JT as a brand endorser.  I doubt that RL Golf is a significant part of its annual sales and the negative public exposure would likely hurt the overall brand; better to cut the exposure and move on.  
 

I suspect that RL contracted with JT, a young talented golfer, to help sell its products to a young demographic.  In that demographic, different than us older people, slurs once considered humorous and/or acceptable, are no longer acceptable.  Global companies, like RL, are looking to the future, not the past and do not want its paid influencers holding their brands back.  Their money, their rules.

 

And yes, I hear the same words, along with racist expressions, almost weekly at golf courses and locker rooms.  Familiarity of slurs is not an excuse for repetition.

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11 hours ago, 2bGood said:

Lots of words to choose from to 'cus yourself out'  and the list of words not to use is really pretty short. I don't think too many people want to hear racial or homophobic slurs.

Sure.  And I said as much.  But.  This was said under his breathe.  Picked up by a boom mic. Wasn’t screamed at the  crowd.  There was no crowd.  Lol. It’s a literal non issue except for the RL social media pressure.  And as I said. I’m fine with firing anyone for any reason. Even if it isn’t stated at all. I live in an “ at will “ employment state.  And I prefer that. So I certainly am FOR firing for any reason.  
 

It’s just the fake outrage coupled to the companies own hypocrisy that is irking. 

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10 hours ago, 2bGood said:

RL had 6.16 billion in sales last year. The brand overall seems to be doing okay. Can't speak specifically to the golf clothes, but keep in mind sponsoring a golfer is not just about selling their golf line, but promoting the company in general.

RL has been struggling for a while now....especially in North America. RL revenues have been steadily declining since 2014 and their EPS has been all over the map.....all lending to why the stock has been rated as a “sell” for some time. I believe UBS just upgraded the stock to Neutral....seeing some upside down the road.  Perhaps the JT debacle was a risk RL just didn’t want to take on....afraid it would exacerbate their current financial position. 

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43 minutes ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

Someone upthread said it would be better to drop F-bombs like Tiger. Although probably half meant as a joke, there's a lot of truth in that. While some people may be offended by an F-bomb, it doesn't target any particular vulnerable group or minority; saying it in certain circumstances could even be deemed "edgy," which would then make it useful.

 

This gets to something I was thinking about reading the thread. I'm old, in my mid-60s. But the F-bomb was always the Word That Shall Not Be Said in terms of polite normal discourse. It was indeed a bombshell. Now it seems it is the F-word that *can* be said without much consequence. But in thinking about the other F-word that got JT into trouble, and the N-word, the R-word, and whatever other epithets that are now deemed offensive and can no longer be said, something occurred to me. I was born in the 1950s, grew up in the '60s and '70s. I never say those other words. Like, never ever, and never had. It's not because I learned the error of my ways, it was just something that never entered my vocabulary. How the heck did someone from a younger generation pick them up so that they would use them, even if it was just on a moment of frustration as a way to release anger? Not just JT but all the other people in the public eye who got into trouble for that sort of thing? I would have thought that being of a younger generation, JT and others would be even less likely to have them lurking in the back of his mind than I do. But given the number of people who are getting into trouble for using them these days, it seems many have them there, and the only way they get in there so that they come out in certain situations is by using them now and then. How does that happen these days? What influences have these folks been exposed to that caused that? I don't think I've lived a particularly sheltered or prissy sort of life, but these just never even occur to me as something to blurt out in the heat of a moment.

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This could be an opportunity for JT to really become involved with the transsexual and homosexual communities across tour stops. He probably has no idea who Tennessee Williams, Truman Capote, or the Pet Shop Boys are so it would not be a lost cause for him to become more cultured. Could totally be a blessing in disguise for young JT.

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First off, I would like to offer kudos to the mods.  IN the not to distant past this would have been locked in a nano-second.  While I'm sure some posts have been deleted, it is good to see some discussion happening.

 

Bladehunter nailed it when he said they showed the "partnership" thing is a bunch of BS.  IT's all business.  Which is perfectly fine, it's being disingenuous, or intellectually dishonest depending on your level of cynicism, that is the issue.

 

And the holier than thou attitude is what is off-putting, both from RL and some posters.  RL no doubt has products made in places that would not cut the mustard if held up to this standard.  Just leave it at we're dropping him.  

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58 minutes ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

From what I have read of the incident, JT has owned up to and is taking responsibility for it. He is certainly being held accountable for it.

I have to commend him for putting out a proper apology, rather than the weak sauce "I'm sorry if anyone was offended".

To be honest, I don't think badly of him for saying it. We grow up with insult-words--sometimes regional, sometimes not--that are hard to shake off; they often come to be used not as direct insults against a particular group, but rather as an expression of personal anger or frustration. I think that's probably what happened in JT's case.

 

Someone upthread said it would be better to drop F-bombs like Tiger. Although probably half meant as a joke, there's a lot of truth in that. While some people may be offended by an F-bomb, it doesn't target any particular vulnerable group or minority; saying it in certain circumstances could even be deemed "edgy," which would then make it useful.


 

I said that about TW! And it’s true because no mater your race sex etc etc...

 

everybody loves to drop an f-bomb at moments of complete self contempt 😂

 

But, your other comment,

 

“We grow up with insult-words--sometimes regional, “

 

This is the heart of it. If the sponsor was of a brand whose customers were more tolerant (or even agree) with what JT said, he’d still have a job.

 

But, RL is, in my estimation, cultivating a brand whose customers, on the whole,  are socially sophisticated and have distaste for this type of “regional” mentality. 
 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, bladehunter said:

Sure.  And I said as much.  But.  This was said under his breathe.  Picked up by a boom mic. Wasn’t screamed at the  crowd.  There was no crowd.  Lol. It’s a literal non issue except for the RL social media pressure.  And as I said. I’m fine with firing anyone for any reason. Even if it isn’t stated at all. I live in an “ at will “ employment state.  And I prefer that. So I certainly am FOR firing for any reason.  
 

It’s just the fake outrage coupled to the companies own hypocrisy that is irking. 

 

Completely agree with the above.  One question for anyone here-- was there any noisy rage on social media from LGBT groups? Or was this more of a media created hysteria? Asking because I don't use social media except for wrx.

 

1 hour ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

From what I have read of the incident, JT has owned up to and is taking responsibility for it. He is certainly being held accountable for it.

I have to commend him for putting out a proper apology, rather than the weak sauce "I'm sorry if anyone was offended".

To be honest, I don't think badly of him for saying it. We grow up with insult-words--sometimes regional, sometimes not--that are hard to shake off; they often come to be used not as direct insults against a particular group, but rather as an expression of personal anger or frustration. I think that's probably what happened in JT's case.

 

Someone upthread said it would be better to drop F-bombs like Tiger. Although probably half meant as a joke, there's a lot of truth in that. While some people may be offended by an F-bomb, it doesn't target any particular vulnerable group or minority; saying it in certain circumstances could even be deemed "edgy," which would then make it useful.

I wish I could give more than 1  LIKE to you for this post.  Insult words, especially those against yourself aren't meant to be literal or against a group--- I bet most don't even think of the origin or true meaning.  If he'd said "JT you Mother effer",  would mothers be outraged because he was targeting them specifically?  The short and honest answer is NO.

Edited by BlackDiamondPar5
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