Traditional lofted irons - how many Wrx gearheads still playing ?

[grm24]

35 minutes ago, Glenn Salongo said:

I don't understand why they are called modern and traditional lofts. Isn't it the CG that has moved down (and back)? The loft change is just the compensation for it in my opinion.

Negative ghost rider. Facts on this have been proven otherwise numerous times over the years here. Many older iron designs have vertical COG's lower than many of todays strong lofted irons without having artificially jacked lofts. Hmm. Wonder why? Research and learn.

[Aviador Naval]

40 minutes ago, BIG STU said:

I know where you are coming from here---- I have just started tinkering with hybrids so there is a little conjecture here. To begin with they are designed with hot faces for those of us with slower SS but then again so are some of the newer irons with 2 piece welded faces. I think in a lot of cases shaft selection will make a difference. Another thing I think that would tone down the faces some is the addition of like Speed Foam. I do have a aftermarket clone 28* head I have been experimenting with and like you said I get a lot of spin with it. In fact it tends to balloon with me. I also do not get the distance I need with it because it goes so high. From what little I have experimented I can see this may be a long road to get them where I want to

As you say you’re just starting down the hybrid journey, I offer the following for consideration.  Start right away with heavier shafts at or very near conventional iron length as opposed to the pseudo fairway shaft lengths that come standard.  Also, if you stay in graphite, don’t be afraid to try a flex stronger than normal.

 

I’m now playing two hybrids to cover the traditional 5i thru 3i slots.  Both shafts are 95 gram Stiff at 38.25” and 39” respectively.  Couldn’t be happier - other than moving into the TSi3/ApexPro model from the standard model.  Stronger, more consistent ball flight.  Same ease of use.

[TheDeanAbides]

My newest set is the '99 Apex with 48* PW, 36* 7 iron and 22* 3 iron, although mine is 21*. 

 

Even these are strong compared to my other vintage sets which start at 52* PW. That's traditional. 

[kiwihacker]

4 hours ago, Aviador Naval said:

Do you really have a 21 degree 5i?  I know some sets are stronger than others (and I don’t give a rip what folks choose to play) but 5i @ 21 - Yowzer...

I don't but those lofts I quoted are the Callaway Mavrik irons. 

[TheDeanAbides]

2 hours ago, kiwihacker said:

I don't but those lofts I quoted are the Callaway Mavrik irons. 

The T400 5 iron is 20*! The PW is 38*!

[collje26]

Playing the P7TW which is off of a 47 wedge.

[randshoe]

Stock LLL here

[NRJyzr]

7 hours ago, Glenn Salongo said:

I don't understand why they are called modern and traditional lofts. Isn't it the CG that has moved down (and back)? The loft change is just the compensation for it in my opinion.

 

How strong lofts you need comes down to how far you need to hit your mid-irons for the course you play.

 

That's what the OEMs tell us, but actual CG measurements show it's not only not true, but largely the exact opposite.  CG locations have -not- moved lower and farther back, generally speaking.

 

Or, what grm said.  🙂

 

Edited January 22, 2021 by NRJyzr

[doctorgriffo]

My backup set, to which I often return to like a security blanket, is a set of Nike VR Forged pro combos from 2013 - 35deg 7 iron. The 5 iron blends perfectly into a 24deg cobra f9 hybrid (which they call a 5 hybrid, but is the same loft as my old 4 hybrid - it seems hybrids have had to change to match iron loft jacking). When I play with my new irons, mp20 mmc (7 iron 32deg), I don’t carry a 5 iron but I do with the Nikes and the sets perform pretty much identically.

[cardoustie]

I’m having a hard look at x-forged cb right now, with mmt105 in them, only debate is the AW is 2 months vs two weeks for the rest of the set and my inner PING lover is wanting to wait for i59

[cardoustie]

9 hours ago, bcflyguy1 said:

 

 

3 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

The T400 5 iron is 20*! The PW is 38*!

38 is insane

[cardoustie]

6 hours ago, Aviador Naval said:

As you say you’re just starting down the hybrid journey, I offer the following for consideration.  Start right away with heavier shafts at or very near conventional iron length as opposed to the pseudo fairway shaft lengths that come standard.  Also, if you stay in graphite, don’t be afraid to try a flex stronger than normal.

 

I’m now playing two hybrids to cover the traditional 5i thru 3i slots.  Both shafts are 95 gram Stiff at 38.25” and 39” respectively.  Couldn’t be happier - other than moving into the TSi3/ApexPro model from the standard model.  Stronger, more consistent ball flight.  Same ease of use.

That is my hybrid experience as well .. 80-99g .. but in x.  Actually just had a Kuro Kage silver 80x come in from the bay, under 30 bucks, I’ve never hit the silver (KK blacks in 80 and 90 are a little tip soft for me) but thought it would be a good match to my 5h with a Fubuki 82x

 

it’s two key things for me with my 4h and 5h, how much higher I can hit them ... and how I can still hit greens from 200 out from the rough. The Apex OG are also not hook prone like so many others and I have learned narrow hybrids are WAY better for me vs wide (like the gen2 Apex even ..longer but not as good thru the turf)

 

I had many a lie in two club C’s last year, off the tips, where I was against young kids and had 200 out of the rough and was on or near the green and pin high.  I can think of 10 times over those two 3 day tournaments where I looked at my lie and said to myself “no chance I could get a 4 or 5 iron home” .. especially when there are forced carries over ponds or barranca’s

[TheDeanAbides]

22 minutes ago, cardoustie said:

 

38 is insane

They sell three additional wedges to get you to 54. 🤣

[Yuck]

S55’s one degree weak.  Never played a PW stronger than 47.  My short game is invested in a 52 / 58 wedge setup so I can carry a 3 iron. 

[bcflyguy1]

1 hour ago, cardoustie said:

 

38 is insane

That's an 8 iron LARPing as a PW. LOL

[DaveGoodrich]

Recently, I have been bending my iron sets to 5* loft gaps in the mid-irons.  So I have "traditional" lofts in the short irons (48* PW) and "semi-jacked" lofts in the long irons (25ish* 5-iron).  I do this by bending the short irons weak, and the long irons strong. If you have a set with constant offset, or minimal progressive offset, you can get more bounce and less offset in the short irons, with still tolerable offset in the longer irons. 

[vmann]

59 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

They sell three additional wedges to get you to 54. 🤣

Someone will start a thread asking if they should use 5 or 6 wedges.  And whether they should be forgiving or not. 

[rsballer10]

MP-18 MB's for me - 48* PW, 20 degree 3 iron.

 

While I am "traditional" I'd argue there's no such thing. Traditional means 52 degree pitching wedge, and to my knowledge the original sand wedge was between 58-60 degrees.

 

I am not a purist, I bent my irons the way I did for better gapping though-out the set. I think the real crime is the increments, not what number the manufacturer stamps on the bottom. Call it whatever sells the most.

[brew4eagle]

3 hours ago, doctorgriffo said:

My backup set, to which I often return to like a security blanket, is a set of Nike VR Forged pro combos from 2013 - 35deg 7 iron. The 5 iron blends perfectly into a 24deg cobra f9 hybrid (which they call a 5 hybrid, but is the same loft as my old 4 hybrid - it seems hybrids have had to change to match iron loft jacking). When I play with my new irons, mp20 mmc (7 iron 32deg), I don’t carry a 5 iron but I do with the Nikes and the sets perform pretty much identically.

2013 Pro Combo security blanket is exactly what I have

[NRJyzr]

2 hours ago, bcflyguy1 said:

That's an 8 iron LARPing as a PW. LOL

 

It's stronger than my 7 iron.  LOL

 

[BlkNGld]

"Traditional" and "Old School" are relative terms.

 

Kinda like music... one day it's current, then it falls under classic.   Then, as my brother  who's a few years older pointed out, the day the music you grew up on is classified as "oldies" it hurts.

[NRJyzr]

29 minutes ago, BlkNGld said:

the day the music you grew up on is classified as "oldies" it hurts.

 

There's an oldies station here in Twin Cities.  Made me laugh when I started hearing Van Halen and Metallica on that station.

 

[GLF4EVR]

7 minutes ago, NRJyzr said:

 

There's an oldies station here in Twin Cities.  Made me laugh when I started hearing Van Halen and Metallica on that station.

 

Get ready, there will be another step for being even older.  I am in the "classic rock" category.

[MSB16]

I like a 47-48* PW, but I like my long irons strong with today's tech. I like my 4-iron around 20* with maybe a 0.5* larger gap between all clubs than standard. Maybe a yard or 2 wider yardage gaps, but works well for me. Leaves room for 3 other wedges and not too bad of a gap to the 5-wood/driving iron. 

[collje26]

5 hours ago, Yuck said:

S55’s one degree weak.  Never played a PW stronger than 47.  My short game is invested in a 52 / 58 wedge setup so I can carry a 3 iron. 

Did that for awhile! Now I go 47,54,60 so I can carry a driving iron/3 iron and a 5 wood for two different flights. Alot of course I play have short par 4's/short par 5's/long par 3's oddly enough.

[M_B_H]

I play Mizuno MP-18 MB and SC's, so all of irons are traditional lofts. I may not be the longest iron player but I know my distances and the feel is unmatched. 

[EddieEdwards]

47 pw.  This happens alot.

 

On the green pin high.

Curt: what did you hit?

Eddie: it's playing 160

Curt: yeah, but what did you hit?

Eddie: a 6 iron

Curt: 160 thats an 8 iron.  Mike what are hitting?

Mike: 8 iron.

Curt: I'm hitting an 8 iron. Eddie we're not asking you anymore.

[dlygrisse]

On 1/21/2021 at 7:31 PM, Hawkeye77 said:

Reading “The Complete Golfer” by Harry Vardon (1905) right now. He says, “Always use the club that takes the least out of you.”  
 

But he also says, “Do not be tempted to invest in a sample of each new golfing invention as soon as it makes his appearance.” So what the h does he know, lol. 

It’s been many years since I’ve read that book. I think Harry played the same basic set most of his career. 

[dlygrisse]

On 1/22/2021 at 2:25 AM, grm24 said:

Negative ghost rider. Facts on this have been proven otherwise numerous times over the years here. Many older iron designs have vertical COG's lower than many of todays strong lofted irons without having artificially jacked lofts. Hmm. Wonder why? Research and learn.

The hollow headed thin faces have a lot to do with it. 
The ball launches really high because of the springy face, combine that with lower loft, higher CG and you basically get a bag full of high launching low spinning hybrids. It’s all carefully engineered so the marketing department can claim higher launch and more distance.  

[cardoustie]

10 hours ago, bcflyguy1 said:

 

 

32 minutes ago, dlygrisse said:

The hollow headed thin faces have a lot to do with it. 
The ball launches really high because of the springy face, combine that with lower loft, higher CG and you basically get a bag full of high launching low spinning hybrids. It’s all carefully engineered so the marketing department can claim higher launch and more distance.  

 

Except hollow and high CG is awful for my swing ... or anyone’s of off firm lies .. ymmv