Rory's Rant - Distance Insights Project - Your thoughts?

[MtlJeff]

Just now, Krt22 said:

That would be a disaster for pace at your local muni and only further hurt the game. Only on this forum will you hear folks say golf is too easy, it's absurd. 

 

I wonder, 300cc is still pretty big. I won't get on a soapbox or anything about but if someone wants to argue that the driver looks a little out of place in the modern game, i could get on board with that

 

I mean it's like 2X+ the size of the next closest club. So i could see the argument

 

But again, overall i'd favor no changes

[FakeClubPro]

13 hours ago, PJE said:

I'm with Rory on this one. Screw the USGA and their Distance Project. 

If Mike Davis had been around in the 1930s, steel shafts would've been banned and we would still be playing with hickory. 

Continuing my rant, we are supposed to trust the judgment of a bunch of people who routinely screw up their biggest tournament, the US Open, e.g., Shinnecock (twice), Chambers Bay, etc.  These guys can't conduct a tournament without doing something stupid at least every other year and yet they seek to make decisions which are going to affect the entire PGA Tour as well as millions of recreational golfers with whom they are clearly out of touch. 

As long as these big wigs at the USGA and PGA enjoy their comp'ed lobster dinners, bar tabs and fine cigars plus big pay checks - they are happy.   A certain TV broadcaster, who smeared a golfer the other day, will tell all these officials how great they are.   He is a typical corporate man.

 

The fans show up to see the golfers not the golf officials, club members, and blundering half blind volunteers wandering around in the rough supposedly stepping on players golf balls.

[HappyGilmoresBoots]

13 hours ago, dcm325 said:

I disagree with the fundamental idea that claims distance as an issue. 
 

The literal point of this game is to get as close to the hole as possible, so you hit the ball as far as you can to give yourself the easiest shot possible to put the ball in the hole. 
 

 

These athletes on average are stronger and faster than ever before... equipment changes aren’t going to effect change in a way the ruling bodies want it to. 

Solution?
Give each contestant a Marlboro red, a can of Miller Lite, and a buffalo wing before they tee off on each hole.

[FakeClubPro]

1 hour ago, MMB1500 said:

 

But bifurcation means that amateur equipment would remain unchanged, meaning golf will still be fun for the average hacker. In other words it would have zero impact on the equipment used by 99%+ of players. 

 

Make the pro play with persimmon woods but they can use big Tapcon screws.  So if they hit it on the screws they might get a few yards.  Make the shafts out of bamboo.   Make all the players putt with a Billy Baroo. 

 

Let the PGA, USGA and RA go back to their free lobster dinners, open bar tab and free cigars.  They are pretty useless.

 

[me05501]

I think one strategic miscalculation by the equipment rulesmakers was setting the maximum driver head size and somehow believing that the mandatory maximum wouldn't immediately become the de facto minimum. 

I know there are "player's" drivers that are 430cc in volume but that's only a few percent less than the maximum.  

 

I think a ton of us probably played the Taylor Made drivers that were 300, 320 or 360cc's. The 360 seemed plenty big to me, and most better players opted for one of the smaller heads. The Ping TiSI was about 300cc's or slightly bigger. That seems like it would have been a better place for driver heads to land...maybe a cap at 360cc. But it's clearly too late now. 

[Krt22]

8 minutes ago, MtlJeff said:

 

I wonder, 300cc is still pretty big. I won't get on a soapbox or anything about but if someone wants to argue that the driver looks a little out of place in the modern game, i could get on board with that

 

I mean it's like 2X+ the size of the next closest club. So i could see the argument

 

But again, overall i'd favor no changes

I can actually see some merits to that too, mainly if the head is smaller, you tee it lower, and the driver swing becomes much closer to the rest of the bag. It might simplify the game for some, a mini driver definitely was a good bandaid for me a few years ago

[Ferguson]

Changing club or course design will work for a while but after a period of time, distances will become.....................

 

 

[J13]

Roll the ball back for pro's.  Easiest thing to do.  Honestly, I'm not opposed to them rolling it back for everyone.  It would allow golf courses to play shorter which would speed up rounds which would make everyone happy, especially golf courses who would gain tee times.  It's a no brainer.

[MtlJeff]

12 minutes ago, FakeClubPro said:

As long as these big wigs at the USGA and PGA enjoy their comp'ed lobster dinners, bar tabs and fine cigars plus big pay checks - they are happy.   A certain TV broadcaster, who smeared a golfer the other day, will tell all these officials how great they are.   He is a typical corporate man.

 

The fans show up to see the golfers not the golf officials, club members, and blundering half blind volunteers wandering around in the rough supposedly stepping on players golf balls.

 

Whoa whoa let's not drag Lobster dinners, booze , cigars and big paychecks into this OK?

[puttfordoux]

this is what Rors thinks about the distance insight project....

 

Rory throws his club in the water - YouTube

Edited February 4, 2021 by puttfordoux

[puttfordoux]

What is the USGA afraid of? That they can one day no longer trick up a US Open setup so that the pros can't break par? The other majors somehow cope with the low scores.

[milesgiles]

51 minutes ago, Krt22 said:

That would be a disaster for pace at your local muni and only further hurt the game. Only on this forum will you hear folks say golf is too easy, it's absurd. 

 

460’s speed up play????

[FakeClubPro]

36 minutes ago, J13 said:

Roll the ball back for pro's.  Easiest thing to do.  Honestly, I'm not opposed to them rolling it back for everyone.  It would allow golf courses to play shorter which would speed up rounds which would make everyone happy, especially golf courses who would gain tee times.  It's a no brainer.

This would be like the MLB banning corked bats, juiced balls and juiced players. 

[puttfordoux]

2 minutes ago, FakeClubPro said:

This would be like the MLB banning corked bats, juiced balls and juiced players. 

 Jay Monahan, meet Bud Selig.

[milesgiles]

38 minutes ago, J13 said:

Roll the ball back for pro's.  Easiest thing to do.  Honestly, I'm not opposed to them rolling it back for everyone.  It would allow golf courses to play shorter which would speed up rounds which would make everyone happy, especially golf courses who would gain tee times.  It's a no brainer.

 

If it was that easy it wouldn’t have taken 20 years to start the conversation. It isn’t that simple.

 

read a few threads here, read a few sensible opinions, and sooner or later you will realise the 460cc clubhead IS the whole problem. Too big, too forgiving on mishits, too easy to swing hard without fear, too easy to tee high and bomb it over all obstacles at driving distance. 

Result, tees pushed back for everyone, not just the pros, longer slower rounds, more lost balls.

further result, pro golf becomes one dimensional, drive wedge putt don’t bother with anything else.. how dull

[FakeClubPro]

57 minutes ago, Krt22 said:

That would be a disaster for pace at your local muni and only further hurt the game. Only on this forum will you hear folks say golf is too easy, it's absurd. 

 

Ha ha.  So true.  Golf is too easy.  I will remind myself that next time I am out playing.   Give me a backhoe and make me the boss of the grounds crew.   Lots of deep pot bunkers to start, though Tommy Fleetwood knows how to get out of those.  High grass.  Fairways that do not roll forever.

 

Pay me big bucks like these old guys in blue blazers and white buck shoes at the RA, PGA and USGA.   For a few dollars, you know these associations have the dough,  Rory will be crying and Reed will be howling though Reed seems to just get on with it.   I will drive the scores up.

 

 

[CasualLie]

I'm sorry, the continued harping on the 460cc as being the problem is just nonsense. Everyone knows the smaller heads are much easier to hit the center - less space, makes you focus more.  Don't believe me?  Check out the multitudes of threads on playing blades!

 

In all seriousness though, you can put 300cc in all of the PGA Tour's hands and not much would change after the OEMs do a little design work.  No one is winning majors hitting it off the toe half the time off the tee.

 

Oh, and while Rory's message rings true, of course his relatively new found love of the amateur hacks is motivated by $, but not for TM, it's for Golf Pass.  Pretty sure he's getting a cut of the subscription revenue.  Not that this is a bad thing.  It's wonderful when you can appeal to the passes and get paid!

[gvogel]

After Rory blasted the Distance Insights project, he did say that he would welcome playing with equipment that made the game harder.  He said that because he believes that he has the skill to benefit, if all of the elite tour pros play equipment that makes the game harder.  That could be balls that don't go as far, smaller headed drivers, drivers with reduced COR.

 

At least that's what I thought I heard him say after the blast at the USGA/R&A: equipment to make the game more difficult?  Bring it on!

[Cwebb]

1 hour ago, me05501 said:

I think one strategic miscalculation by the equipment rulesmakers was setting the maximum driver head size and somehow believing that the mandatory maximum wouldn't immediately become the de facto minimum. 

I know there are "player's" drivers that are 430cc in volume but that's only a few percent less than the maximum.  

 

I think a ton of us probably played the Taylor Made drivers that were 300, 320 or 360cc's. The 360 seemed plenty big to me, and most better players opted for one of the smaller heads. The Ping TiSI was about 300cc's or slightly bigger. That seems like it would have been a better place for driver heads to land...maybe a cap at 360cc. But it's clearly too late now. 

 

The size of the driver is not an issue for the best.  They center their contact 99% of the time, regardless of whether the driver is 200cc or 460.

[bladehunter]

2 hours ago, Krt22 said:

That would be a disaster for pace at your local muni and only further hurt the game. Only on this forum will you hear folks say golf is too easy, it's absurd. 

First off. You’d move up a set or two of tees.  So not slower. Faster. 
 

 

but that’s beside the real point here.  Saying the competition game needs to be harder is not the same as saying it’s too easy.  
 

what we’re wanting is to change where it’s harder.  Make the approach game harder.  You do this by making the tee ball harder.  I don’t personally think we should be hitting 10-12 specialty wedges into greens a round.  It’s made iron sets almost irrelevant....basically you have par 3s ( most of them ) and tee balls on par 4s to Lay up where iron sets are used. Other wise it’s the two extremes of the bag only.  It used to be the other way around.  

[Mookie91]

3 hours ago, milesgiles said:

 

The difference is a 460cc clubhead that can be hit all over the face and still go miles 

I can attest that this is true.  I hit it all over the face and it typically goes miles left.

[milesgiles]

14 minutes ago, Cwebb said:

 

The size of the driver is not an issue for the best.  They center their contact 99% of the time, regardless of whether the driver is 200cc or 460.

 

Matt Wolfe whiffed it twice with a fairway wood off the tee last round US open.

 

not only is your statement not true, if it was..

 

WHY DO THEY NEED A 460 THEN??

[dlygrisse]

These guys aren't tour pros, but they are accomplished players, it's really interesting, and I think they are still suing modern balls here.  At the end watch what happens when they try to swing hard and miss hit some.  Totally different game.  I'll stick with my premise that the VAST majority of gained distance is equipment, and the driver has a huge impact on that.  

(2) WOOD GOLF DRIVER TESTED AGAINST MODERN DRIVER - YouTube

 

[Mookie91]

2 hours ago, milesgiles said:

 

And this can be done. Nobody ‘needs’ a 460. Golf has been played quite happily for 250 years without it. The game isn’t any more popular with it, there are more courses shutting than opening 

They aren’t shutting because they are obsolete.  They are shutting because the game has been in steady decline the last 10 years.

[dlygrisse]

Here are some of the longest drivers in the world trying to hit persimmon, with a modern ball.  Most are struggling to hit 300, 290 seems like a good poke, it's costing them 50 to 80 yards easy, only change...the golf club.  For those of you who think modern training techniques are the biggest difference, you are mistaken, it's the equipment, mostly the driver, and the ball.  I get it Bryson made a big jump, but he's and exception, very few people have picked up the yardage he has.  I'd really like so see Bryson do this test.  

 

 

[Krt22]

21 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

First off. You’d move up a set or two of tees.  So not slower. Faster. 
 

 

but that’s beside the real point here.  Saying the competition game needs to be harder is not the same as saying it’s too easy.  
 

what we’re wanting is to change where it’s harder.  Make the approach game harder.  You do this by making the tee ball harder.  I don’t personally think we should be hitting 10-12 specialty wedges into greens a round.  It’s made iron sets almost irrelevant....basically you have par 3s ( most of them ) and tee balls on par 4s to Lay up where iron sets are used. Other wise it’s the two extremes of the bag only.  It used to be the other way around.  

Just leave the driver at home if you want a challenge, no one needs 14 clubs, bag is lighter, you save $500 a year.

 

You are out of your mind if you think golfers will move up tees because the driver get's harder to hit, I'd say 85% of golfers already play the wrong tees, even with these point and shoot 460cc beasts

Edited February 4, 2021 by Krt22

[Mookie91]

2 hours ago, golfandfishing said:

So we “want to play the same game the pros play” except for with slower and softer greens and from shorter tees?  I don’t see how that’s playing the same game as the pros just because our equipment is the same. Well, it’s the same except for the shaft, the swing weight, prototype tour only heads and other things that already make it different..... 

Remember the Chrome Soft vs Not allowed because of spam?  All the Bladies in here saying, “pros don’t play the same ball as us, it’s a prototype”

[Mookie91]

2 hours ago, Krt22 said:

That would be a disaster for pace at your local muni and only further hurt the game. Only on this forum will you hear folks say golf is too easy, it's absurd. 

This place is magical 😁

[Mookie91]

Who holds the low round at the Waste Management tournament this weekend....Calc 2001

[Krt22]

10 minutes ago, Mookie91 said:

They aren’t shutting because they are obsolete.  They are shutting because the game has been in steady decline the last 10 years.

Exactly, because it's hard, takes a lot of time and effort to get better, and its expensive  Making it even harder (dial back for everyone) or more expensive (bifurcation) would only expedite it's decline