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What is everyone’s opinion on this? I was going to play lightly used Miura MB 101s but have a potential smoking deal on brand new Honma T world Rose Proto MB. A lot of my local builders say modern Miura (post buy out) isn’t as good as they used to be and while focus is on crafting the Honma model is more about performance while being equal on craftsmanship. 

 

What is your opinion? I’ve seen a couple threads from a while back but thought I’d refresh 

 

EDIT:  First off I want to thank you all for the input. It helped me get a great starting point. After hitting these two side by side here is what I have found. 
 

The Miuras felt a touch better, but it was so dang close on center strikes. The Honmas also felt amazing. The strike on the Honmas to me felt a bit crisper. They both sound phenomenal again all personal preference 

 

For whatever reason the Honmas were more consistent and easier for me to hit. I’m a pretty steep player so it’s possible it comes down to that touch of extra bounce. 
 

They look nearly identical. The finish on the Miura makes the top line look a touch smaller but we measured and they are the same. Blade length is similar just a bit different shaping. 
 

if you are in the market I’d highly recommend giving both a look. The Honmas were as close to Miura feel as I’ve ever hit but ultimately Miura still wins this category.

 

As far as QC is concerned my set came exactly to spec from what was advertised so I might’ve just gotten lucky. I was impressed with the happened on the box and use of Face Progression instead of Offset. 
 

I’m excited to game these and to see it up I’d say these two are on the same playing field (at least with these specific irons) with advantages and disadvantages to each that will be player dependent  

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Miura > Honma   End conversation. 

I used to own some amazing Honma woods.  Modern Miura clubs are IMO different from what they used to be.  However, I am not convinced that supposed performance difference is worth considering for most

Thats interesting, I play the Miura 101 and love them, they were my first miura and I thought they lived up to the hype. I've also heard from my builder who has a big Miura account, that many of his c

8 minutes ago, bscramer11 said:

What is everyone’s opinion on this? I was going to play lightly used Miura MB 101s but have a potential smoking deal on brand new Honma T world Rose Proto MB. A lot of my local builders say modern Miura (post buy out) isn’t as good as they used to be and while focus is on crafting the Honma model is more about performance while being equal on craftsmanship. 

 

What is your opinion? I’ve seen a couple threads from a while back but thought I’d refresh 

I used to own some amazing Honma woods.  Modern Miura clubs are IMO different from what they used to be.  However, I am not convinced that supposed performance difference is worth considering for most amateur golfers.  Which set depends on your confidence, ball striking skill and if you want slightly stronger lofted Protos.  Both are the same material.  Miura 101's are amazing irons, except face progression is more than I like, for some reason.  Otherwise, specs/lofts are similar to my 620MBs.

 

Then there's the unknown: Rose's time with Honma was very short-lived.  He may have had a hand in designing those irons but if they were that amazing, I am inclined to think he would have stuck with them longer even after leaving.   

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1 hour ago, Pepperturbo said:

I used to own some amazing Honma woods.  Modern Miura clubs are IMO different from what they used to be.  However, I am not convinced that supposed performance difference is worth considering for most amateur golfers.  Which set depends on your confidence, ball striking skill and if you want slightly stronger lofted Protos.  Both are the same material.  Miura 101's are amazing irons, except face progression is more than I like, for some reason.  Otherwise, specs/lofts are similar to my 620MBs.

 

Then there's the unknown: Rose's time with Honma was very short-lived.  He may have had a hand in designing those irons but if they were that amazing, I am inclined to think he would have stuck with them longer even after leaving.   


 

That seemed to be the verdict of old vs new Miura around my high end club guys. Still great but not what they used to be.
 

im more confident over a blade than I am over forgiving. I’m a 5 handicap but leave a lot of putts on the course and I mean a lot. Ball striking is my strength. 
 

As for the unknown I have some insight to that. While nothing is official here is what I’ve dug up. Apparently Rose had a whole bag contract with Honma. He broke that contract when he decided to play his old TM wedges. TM jumped at the opportunity to resign him. It’s also supposedly no coincidence that the TM P7MB is identical to the Honma T world and new TX series 

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Thats interesting, I play the Miura 101 and love them, they were my first miura and I thought they lived up to the hype. I've also heard from my builder who has a big Miura account, that many of his clients/Miura collectors find the 101/5003 to be their favorite to play. I find the people who get nostalgic about Miura, it always comes back to the baby blades. They don't think Miura should make anything other then those. Lets just say, Nicklaus didn't partner up with Miura San because they aren't top of the line clubs. Rose dropped Homa 5 mins into a contract. Although they might work great for you 

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4 hours ago, OcRockRoller said:

Thats interesting, I play the Miura 101 and love them, they were my first miura and I thought they lived up to the hype. I've also heard from my builder who has a big Miura account, that many of his clients/Miura collectors find the 101/5003 to be their favorite to play. I find the people who get nostalgic about Miura, it always comes back to the baby blades. They don't think Miura should make anything other then those. Lets just say, Nicklaus didn't partner up with Miura San because they aren't top of the line clubs. Rose dropped Homa 5 mins into a contract. Although they might work great for you 

Ya I’m not saying Miura doesn’t make a great iron it just would appear their designs have moved toward the masses not the niche they used to be

 

technically Honma dropped rose haha. He broke a contract on his wedges and then TM made his irons in the P7MB but yes I get what you mean of could’ve smoothed it over. Though money speaks more than anything when there are two identical clubs 

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 You're all over the place here. You were talking about the 101 which is definitely not for the masses, by all accounts I've heard and my from my own account, the 101 is a fine example of a beautiful well crafted blade. If Miura isn't what they use to be, only because they make CBs and irons with higher MOI they you are speaking to my point about people think Miura should only make baby blades. 

 

Also Justin Rose didn't sign with Taylormade, he is currently playing Mizuno irons. Clearly he wasn't happy with his deal, who knows what happened. But the irons didn't blow him away enough for him to keep playing them after he went back to Taylormade driver 

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3 hours ago, OcRockRoller said:

 

 

 You're all over the place here. You were talking about the 101 which is definitely not for the masses, by all accounts I've heard and my from my own account, the 101 is a fine example of a beautiful well crafted blade. If Miura isn't what they use to be, only because they make CBs and irons with higher MOI they you are speaking to my point about people think Miura should only make baby blades. 

 

Also Justin Rose didn't sign with Taylormade, he is currently playing Mizuno irons. Clearly he wasn't happy with his deal, who knows what happened. But the irons didn't blow him away enough for him to keep playing them after he went back to Taylormade driver 

I just was looking for someone who has hit both and can compare. I have a source who works at Honma and there is some bad blood with the whole contract thing. 
 

 

I know Miura makes a good iron but are they as good as they used to be a d is it worth the double price tag compared to Honma. I can’t find many people who have hit both 

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Miura > Honma

 

End conversation. 

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1 hour ago, bscramer11 said:

I just was looking for someone who has hit both and can compare. I have a source who works at Honma and there is some bad blood with the whole contract thing. 
 

 

I know Miura makes a good iron but are they as good as they used to be a d is it worth the double price tag compared to Honma. I can’t find many people who have hit both 

 

 

I get it but you literally asked "everyone's opinion on this" in the OP. The only reason you can come up with that miura isn't "what they use to be" is because they make to many clubs. Not because of the clubs themselves. If they are too expensive, its a no brainer, go with the club you have the hook up with. If you end up like Rose, you can move on from them just as easily as he did without the hassle of a contract. 

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Curious, what do you mean by “a lot of my local builders”? You are making it sound like many have this opinion that Miura is not as good as it use to be, which I have yet to hear from anyone on this forum whom has posted their thoughts about Miura irons. 
 

If you have a Smokin deal on Honma only you will be able to determine if it’s a better choice if Price is a factor. Generally speaking though, you get what you pay for and the Miura is not just about craftsmanship, it performs as good as any other blade out there. On top of that they will be built to spec without question. 

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19 hours ago, bscramer11 said:

What is everyone’s opinion on this? I was going to play lightly used Miura MB 101s but have a potential smoking deal on brand new Honma T world Rose Proto MB. A lot of my local builders say modern Miura (post buy out) isn’t as good as they used to be and while focus is on crafting the Honma model is more about performance while being equal on craftsmanship. 

 

What is your opinion? I’ve seen a couple threads from a while back but thought I’d refresh 

Miura irons are still as good as they were. I think the misconception may have risen from Miura now having  more offerings.

Blade for blade, the feel is the same if not crisper now.

Muscle cavity lineup to bridge the blade-cavity gap. The MC-501 are just sexy and not inferior to blades in performance.

Cavity backs now have more offerings.

So I don't think the quality has gone done, they are not a mass-production company.

Another thing to add is that there is no buy-out per se. I think it is more of a marketing/branding thing where someone paid for the rights to market Miura clubs globally and also drive the production requirements for the markets. So you now a feedback from the marketing division on products.

 

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Just now, chonkoa said:

Miura irons are still as good as they were. I think the misconception may have risen from Miura now having  more offerings.

Blade for blade, the feel is the same if not crisper now.

Muscle cavity lineup to bridge the blade-cavity gap. The MC-501 are just sexy and not inferior to blades in performance.

Cavity backs now have more offerings.

So I don't think the quality has gone down, they are not a mass-production company.

Another thing to add is that there is no buy-out per se. I think it is more of a marketing/branding thing where someone paid for the rights to market Miura clubs globally and also drive the production requirements for these markets. So you now a feedback from the marketing division on products.

 

With corrections

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3 hours ago, OcRockRoller said:

 

 

I get it but you literally asked "everyone's opinion on this" in the OP. The only reason you can come up with that miura isn't "what they use to be" is because they make to many clubs. Not because of the clubs themselves. If they are too expensive, its a no brainer, go with the club you have the hook up with. If you end up like Rose, you can move on from them just as easily as he did without the hassle of a contract. 

Reading my original question I wasn’t too clear haha. Also the dig on Rose made me laugh. I just don’t want to be buying and selling a whole lot. 
 

that also makes sense. Seems these guys are less impressed with the design of all the new stuff not the quality aspect. 
 

Miura is a bit up there and I’d pay 2 almost 3x more. Now I can afford them but Honma just kind of caught my eye and wasn’t sure how they feel. Almost seems like a Bettinardi vs Scotty in Japanese irons. I guess I was hoping for a 1 to 1 comparison of both blades.

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3 hours ago, wely324 said:

Curious, what do you mean by “a lot of my local builders”? You are making it sound like many have this opinion that Miura is not as good as it use to be, which I have yet to hear from anyone on this forum whom has posted their thoughts about Miura irons. 
 

If you have a Smokin deal on Honma only you will be able to determine if it’s a better choice if Price is a factor. Generally speaking though, you get what you pay for and the Miura is not just about craftsmanship, it performs as good as any other blade out there. On top of that they will be built to spec without question. 

Out of the 5 high quality builders I talked to 4 of them said Miura had gone down hill since the buy out. Now I don’t know what that means (probably should’ve asked haha) but it could be design, cost, or difficulty on working with them as a company. 
 

all 5 agreed that Honma is right there with Miura and Epon and price might be a driving factor. I’ll have them built to spec regardless but I guess I was hoping for someone who has hit both and could weigh in on feel. A blade is a blade so should perform as such and from what I’ve seen very comparable 

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7 minutes ago, bscramer11 said:

Out of the 5 high quality builders I talked to 4 of them said Miura had gone down hill since the buy out. Now I don’t know what that means (probably should’ve asked haha) but it could be design, cost, or difficulty on working with them as a company. 
 

all 5 agreed that Honma is right there with Miura and Epon and price might be a driving factor. I’ll have them built to spec regardless but I guess I was hoping for someone who has hit both and could weigh in on feel. A blade is a blade so should perform as such and from what I’ve seen very comparable 


who are the club builders? Do they offer Miura clubs new? And what makes them “high quality builders”? 
 

Ian Fraser from Tour Experience golf runs a great YouTube channel, but he also works with many pros and is highly regarded in terms of his club fitting skills by his peers in the industry. He sells all brands including Honma and Miura, and could play whatever he clubs he wants. He games Miura TC-201 irons and he continually speaks about them as being a great performing club and craftsmanship top notch. Maybe reach out through social media and see what he or one of his club builders has to say about the two irons in question.  

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1 hour ago, wely324 said:


who are the club builders? Do they offer Miura clubs new? And what makes them “high quality builders”? 
 

Ian Fraser from Tour Experience golf runs a great YouTube channel, but he also works with many pros and is highly regarded in terms of his club fitting skills by his peers in the industry. He sells all brands including Honma and Miura, and could play whatever he clubs he wants. He games Miura TC-201 irons and he continually speaks about them as being a great performing club and craftsmanship top notch. Maybe reach out through social media and see what he or one of his club builders has to say about the two irons in question.  

I’ll do that.

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1 hour ago, bscramer11 said:

Out of the 5 high quality builders I talked to 4 of them said Miura had gone down hill since the buy out. Now I don’t know what that means (probably should’ve asked haha) but it could be design, cost, or difficulty on working with them as a company. 
 

all 5 agreed that Honma is right there with Miura and Epon and price might be a driving factor. I’ll have them built to spec regardless but I guess I was hoping for someone who has hit both and could weigh in on feel. A blade is a blade so should perform as such and from what I’ve seen very comparable 

 

I feel ya man it's a tough situation, picking clubs without testing them. 101 template is the 5003 Miura giken template, its a decade old design. The are still made in the same factory by the same people. They are just marketed by different people now. Im surprised your guys dont know this stuff, Im also surprised you know that many guys with actual Miura accounts( by that I mean access to Miura giken as well)  I will say I have heard of a different finish in the miura giken 503 with copper underlay have problems but that was one club in one set. But the 101 is their bread and butter, you should have no concern about what you're getting. You are looking for someone to say the Honma is better dont waste your money on the Miura,  but I doubt that will happen. Maybe it will who knows. They only way to find out is to test them for yourself l

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48 minutes ago, OcRockRoller said:

 

I feel ya man it's a tough situation, picking clubs without testing them. 101 template is the 5003 Miura giken template, its a decade old design. The are still made in the same factory by the same people. They are just marketed by different people now. Im surprised your guys dont know this stuff, Im also surprised you know that many guys with actual Miura accounts( by that I mean access to Miura giken as well)  I will say I have heard of a different finish in the miura giken 503 with copper underlay have problems but that was one club in one set. But the 101 is their bread and butter, you should have no concern about what you're getting. You are looking for someone to say the Honma is better dont waste your money on the Miura,  but I doubt that will happen. Maybe it will who knows. They only way to find out is to test them for yourself l

 

I'm still not sure about the North America mb101 irons being the MG 5003. I have Miura Giken Custom World purchased form japan, the TBzero and they look identical to the mb101 demo I had from a North American shop. From my understanding the mb101/TBzero is just an evolution of the 5003. The TC201 and TBzero both were released in Japan at the same time, just like the Miura NA released those 2 same models here in the states. Why would they continue producing two sets of nearly identical blades? It also doesn't make sense from a business standpoint. There is nothing in writing from Miura that the mb101 is the 5003, other than an article from tour spec golf about the mb101's who were just trying to sell "JDM" Miura irons, trying to make them different from the NA iron. 

 

Edited by wely324
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27 minutes ago, wely324 said:

 

I'm still not sure about the North America mb101 irons being the MG 5003. I have Miura Giken Custom World purchased form japan, the TBzero and they look identical to the mb101 demo I had from a North American shop. From my understanding the mb101/TBzero is just an evolution of the 5003. The TC201 and TBzero both were released in Japan at the same time, just like the Miura NA released those 2 same models here in the states. Why would they continue producing two sets of nearly identical blades? It also doesn't make sense from a business standpoint. There is nothing in writing from Miura that the mb101 is the 5003, other than an article from tour spec golf about the mb101's who were just trying to sell "JDM" Miura irons, trying to make them different from the NA iron. 

 

 

 

My builder has a great relationship with Miura Giken and Gobal and built a lot of miuras for a long time, told me that the 101 is the 5003 for the global market. The TBzero was a slight design change to the 5003. If you look at the specs you will see they have different face progressions, different std head weights, and different std lie angles. They are all from the tournament blade (TB) family but have small differences with each progression.

 

 

 

Check out that link and scroll down the first page, you will see I'm not the only one with this info 

 

Also this video will help as well: 

 

 

Edited by OcRockRoller
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11 minutes ago, OcRockRoller said:

 

 

My builder has a great relationship with Miura Giken and Gobal and built a lot of miuras for a long time, told me that the 101 is the 5003 for the global market. The TBzero was a slight design change to the 5003. If you look at the specs you will see they have different face progressions, different std head weights, and different std lie angles. They are all from the tournament blade (TB) family but have small differences with each progression.

 

 

 

Check out that link and scroll down the first page, you will see I'm not the only one with this info 

 


I’ve read the thread before. They probably are all different in some way but starting with the same mold. But the mb101 and 5003 have 1.5 degree difference in lie angle, so to say they are the same isn’t accurate either. Just seems odd to me that the mb101 and TBzero are more upright than their predecessors. Maybe the weight differences and fp values vary the most from the grinds they get as that is all customizable with the Miura Giken custom world order. 

Edited by wely324
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7 minutes ago, wely324 said:


I’ve read the thread before. They probably are all different in some way but starting with the same mold. But the mb101 and 5003 have 1.5 degree difference in lie angle, so to say they are the same isn’t accurate either. Just seems odd to me that the mb101 and TBzero are more upright than their predecessors. Maybe the weight differences and fp values vary the most from the grinds they get as that is all customizable with the Miura Giken custom world order. 

 

 

I agree, it all seems to be the same mold, the video from TSG I posted above says the same. Only minor differences. My guess on why the mb 101 is more upright than both the 5003 and TBzero,  is the rest of the globe on average is taller than the Japanese market. That would be my guess 

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1 hour ago, OcRockRoller said:

 

I feel ya man it's a tough situation, picking clubs without testing them. 101 template is the 5003 Miura giken template, its a decade old design. The are still made in the same factory by the same people. They are just marketed by different people now. Im surprised your guys dont know this stuff, Im also surprised you know that many guys with actual Miura accounts( by that I mean access to Miura giken as well)  I will say I have heard of a different finish in the miura giken 503 with copper underlay have problems but that was one club in one set. But the 101 is their bread and butter, you should have no concern about what you're getting. You are looking for someone to say the Honma is better dont waste your money on the Miura,  but I doubt that will happen. Maybe it will who knows. They only way to find out is to test them for yourself l

Probably only Miura North America not Giken 

 

im really just looking for someone who has hit both and can weigh in on if the cost difference is worth it or not. I feel confident Miura hasnt changed based on this thread but getting a hold of a Honma Blade and a Miura blade to hit side by side is not an easy feat and as I don’t need fitting and want to spend my money once it’s hard to get them in the same room if you know what I mean. 
 

I’ll prob get the Honmas and if i really don’t like them I’ll just sell them here and get Miuras and probably lose a little on the Honma set 

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The people who say "Miura isn't what it once was" are probably the same people who say they could play on the PGA Tour if they "had the time." It's the same quality now as it's always been, they're just trying different designs now instead of sticking to their "traditional" offerings, I'm sure that upsets the purists.

 

I own the MB-101, and tested the Rose Proto, both are exceptional irons but the sole on the MB-101 fit better for me. Personal opinion the Miura had a better feel compared to the Honma, but feel is largely subjective. As always hit both if you can, but finding a fitter or a retailer with demos of both will be tricky. 

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22 hours ago, bscramer11 said:

Probably only Miura North America not Giken 

 

im really just looking for someone who has hit both and can weigh in on if the cost difference is worth it or not. I feel confident Miura hasnt changed based on this thread but getting a hold of a Honma Blade and a Miura blade to hit side by side is not an easy feat and as I don’t need fitting and want to spend my money once it’s hard to get them in the same room if you know what I mean. 
 

I’ll prob get the Honmas and if i really don’t like them I’ll just sell them here and get Miuras and probably lose a little on the Honma set 

If you want to spend your money once and not worry about equipment for the nest 10-15 years then the Miura in my opinion is the favourite.

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22 hours ago, Josh L. said:

The people who say "Miura isn't what it once was" are probably the same people who say they could play on the PGA Tour if they "had the time." It's the same quality now as it's always been, they're just trying different designs now instead of sticking to their "traditional" offerings, I'm sure that upsets the purists.

 

I own the MB-101, and tested the Rose Proto, both are exceptional irons but the sole on the MB-101 fit better for me. Personal opinion the Miura had a better feel compared to the Honma, but feel is largely subjective. As always hit both if you can, but finding a fitter or a retailer with demos of both will be tricky. 

Thanks. I’ll look at the sole and hit them both tomorrow 

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      2021 RBC Heritage - Tuesday #10
       
       

       
      Custom Cameron putters - 2021 RBC Heritage
      Bettinardi putter - 2021 RBC Heritage
      Robert Streb's custom stamped Vokey wedge - 2021 RBC Heritage
      Ben An's custom stamped Vokey - 2021 RBC Heritage
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