Takeaway Handpath - Forearm Action

[nickpiro]

Hope everyone is doing great! 
 

Been playing golf coming into my third season and have had a few lessons each year just to keep progressing. 

 

Originally, when I started playing I was super dumped inside on the takeaway, rolled it wide open, it was nasty.

 

I've done a ton of work to correct that but I cannot seem to find something mentally or physically to correct that initial move/lift. Shaft stays in a much better place now, but when I see video it is all part of this forearm roll/handpath move & lift right at the start.  

 

There was a couple training videos on the tube that had you hold an alignment rod with a club and make sure that rod is on the thigh at P2. Tried that to create some feels, but looking for someone who has battled this with some hope and success that would be willing to share some insights. 

 

Cheers! 

 

 

[glk]

I got the club head behind my hands early too.   lead to a flat shaft backswing with a steep move down coupled with EE and a flip.

 

Iteach had me do the stick drill - put an driveway marker into the butt end of the club and do as you describe - keep it touching my left side until p2 then slide it down my left leg and have the stick point somewhere between the ball and the toes at p3 - he has recently posted a video on putting it onto the right side so you start with the arms pretty close to where they would be at p2.      Todd Casabella has a couple of ways to approach this too.      

 

What I learned was that arms and pivot need to move together in synch and wrist set is very important - some get to p2 without much forearm roll but then set the wrists more horizontal and flatten the shaft then.     arms leading pivot too much can cause this, poor wrist set, and just plain old rolling the arms from the start.      a way to get this without a stick is to keep the left elbow pointing down through the backswing.   another thing is to keep the right forearm above the left in the takeaway.

 

have to go slow in your reps.     good news is you can do this without even hitting balls but it will take months- took me about 4 months before i could take it to the course consistently and then longer to really get it - still need to pay attention - having a mirror for feedback is faster and easier than video.

 

the stick drill    https://www.instagram.com/p/ByN9TMMFGh-/

stick on right side   https://www.instagram.com/p/B-kuVOOl1B6/

https://www.instagram.com/p/CArLoP8llFa/

https://www.instagram.com/p/CKWc9zVlzg5/

 

 

[nickpiro]

@glk Thank you so much.

 

That was exactly what I was looking for. 

 

Super appreciate the time and help. 

 

 

[RobertBaron]

Hands in, club out. 
 

From your perspective during the swing, you should never see the logo on your glove. 

[nickpiro]

30 minutes ago, RobertBaron said:

Hands in, club out. 
 

From your perspective during the swing, you should never see the logo on your glove. 

Simple. I love that. 

 

Thanks! 

[me05501]

Hold a Frisbee or similar out in front of you like a steering wheel. On the way back, turn the steering wheel to the LEFT. That's the feel. I struggle with this too!

[Mr_Wolfe]

Great advice on here. Don't let the hands roll open.

 

Mr. Wolfe

[nickpiro]

1 hour ago, me05501 said:

Hold a Frisbee or similar out in front of you like a steering wheel. On the way back, turn the steering wheel to the LEFT. That's the feel. I struggle with this too!

 

Like this visual, thank you! 

 

[LukeDonaldsTiger]

Monte‘s No turn cast has helped my takeaway/backswing enormously.

 

Also, I like Justin Thomas‘ takeaway a lot. Looks simple and gets in all the right positions.

 

The takeaway is actually the easiest part to copy from the tour pros just by mimicking it, in my opinion. 

[wagolfer7]

My opinion is a flat shoulder turn, is usually a contributor for people that struggle to consistently keep the club in front of them.  Proper shoulder rotation can really clean the takeaway up. Lead shoulder needs to go down. Padraig's comment about getting the lead shoulder passed the right side of the ball (for RH golfer) during the backswing is a great way to keep this simple for full swings.  

 

 

  

[wagolfer7]

1 minute ago, LukeDonaldsTiger said:

Monte‘s No turn cast has helped my takeaway/backswing enormously.

 

Also, I like Justin Thomas‘ takeaway a lot. Looks simple and gets in all the right positions.

 

The takeaway is actually the easiest part to copy from the tour pros just by mimicking it, in my opinion. 

 

I respectfully disagree.  I think a lot of people think that copying the grip, posture and takeaway from PGA players is easiest.  Looking the same / similar is not always the same thing as what they are doing.  And it really depends on who's looking. 

 

Most amateurs look more different in the setup to P2 than they may think.  Posture is the easiest one to look at.  We can't even stand at the ball the same way the PGA players do.  Most amateurs will have more knee flex, butt out and poor spine angle compared to PGA players.  But I think most amateurs feel it's "close enough" and want to work on something more exciting like shallowing or swinging faster.  I believe it's the same with the takeaway.  Amateurs may think they have a good one, but in reality it's not the same as what they see on tour.      

[LukeDonaldsTiger]

13 minutes ago, wagolfer7 said:

 

I respectfully disagree.  I think a lot of people think that copying the grip, posture and takeaway from PGA players is easiest.  Looking the same / similar is not always the same thing as what they are doing.  And it really depends on who's looking. 

 

Most amateurs look more different in the setup to P2 than they may think.  Posture is the easiest one to look at.  We can't even stand at the ball the same way the PGA players do.  Most amateurs will have more knee flex, butt out and poor spine angle compared to PGA players.  But I think most amateurs feel it's "close enough" and want to work on something more exciting like shallowing or swinging faster.  I believe it's the same with the takeaway.  Amateurs may think they have a good one, but in reality it's not the same as what they see on tour.      

You’re probably right in that physically copying it is the hardest part. Us amateurs need to video ourselves to see what we’re actually doing. 

But generally speaking, from takeaway up until the transition, it’s the easiest part to follow exactly what the pros do. And still, most of us screw it up there already because feel isn’t real. 
And that’s what this discussion is about, so yeah, you’re right heh 😁

[BogeyBrian]

i dealt with this for a long time. The only thing that helped was feeling like i was taking the club back primarily with my right arm/shoulder and letting the left arm come along with the ride. 

 

What i found was...for me....i was pushing in too much with my left arm and it was causing the club to get behind my hands and too inside on the backswing...even if i steepened my shoulders an obscene amount...i couldn't get the shaft steeper on the backswing. 

 

Letting the right arm/shoulder lead on the backswing also helped me turn a lot more in the bs. my left arm was pinning against my chest and not allowing me to turn enough...causing a fake turn with arm over run 

 

 

[golfsticks]

Stand with heels about 1 foot away from wall and figure out how to not hit the wall on the move away to the top, and scraping the wall on the return.  Like this, a fantastic template

 

 

 

 

 

[nickpiro]

10 hours ago, BogeyBrian said:

i dealt with this for a long time. The only thing that helped was feeling like i was taking the club back primarily with my right arm/shoulder and letting the left arm come along with the ride. 

 

What i found was...for me....i was pushing in too much with my left arm and it was causing the club to get behind my hands and too inside on the backswing...even if i steepened my shoulders an obscene amount...i couldn't get the shaft steeper on the backswing. 

 

Letting the right arm/shoulder lead on the backswing also helped me turn a lot more in the bs. my left arm was pinning against my chest and not allowing me to turn enough...causing a fake turn with arm over run 

 

 

Thank you so much for sharing this, super helpful and I like the idea of those feels. 

 

 

[stingerfade]

On 2/26/2021 at 1:44 PM, golfsticks said:

Stand with heels about 1 foot away from wall and figure out how to not hit the wall on the move away to the top, and scraping the wall on the return.  Like this, a fantastic template

 

 

 

 

 

This

[PracticeSwinger]

General question on that aspect… it seems that instructions has moved away from a more ‘laid off’ (with lead forearm pronation ; or maybe more of a upper lead arm rotation during the backswing / after takeaway) in recent years to a ‘straighter’ takeaway (lead forearm under the trail one from a face on view, club outside the hands at P2 from DTL)…

 

I’ve wondered what were the causes for that change; the usual answers I get online seems to be that if you shallow early you’ll get steep coming back (and all show a goofy sucked in takeaway with a tremendous loop coming back to prove it)… or if you are laid off at the top, good chance that you won’t be able to square it up and sh*nk city danger… I get all that – but those look like first degree explanations…

 

With all the transition / sequence / sync up problems we see from guys with too long backswings – and with everyone saying that they love the lead only foot drill (that is designed to help pivot better around the lead heel / hip) but also has them shallow and sync up for everything to pivot effectively… why isn’t the ‘complete’ backswing just an extension of that drill (that would result in an obvious laid off position)?...

 

Don’t kill the messenger – I’m just trying to figure out the benefits of the ‘new instructions’ on takeaway / backswings…

[TheDeanAbides]

On 2/26/2021 at 6:44 PM, golfsticks said:

Stand with heels about 1 foot away from wall and figure out how to not hit the wall on the move away to the top, and scraping the wall on the return.  Like this, a fantastic template

 

 

 

 

 

Is that Faldo?

[Zitlow]

34 minutes ago, MtlJayMan said:

General question on that aspect… it seems that instructions has moved away from a more ‘laid off’ (with lead forearm pronation ; or maybe more of a upper lead arm rotation during the backswing / after takeaway) in recent years to a ‘straighter’ takeaway (lead forearm under the trail one from a face on view, club outside the hands at P2 from DTL)…

 

I’ve wondered what were the causes for that change; the usual answers I get online seems to be that if you shallow early you’ll get steep coming back (and all show a goofy sucked in takeaway with a tremendous loop coming back to prove it)… or if you are laid off at the top, good chance that you won’t be able to square it up and sh*nk city danger… I get all that – but those look like first degree explanations…

 

With all the transition / sequence / sync up problems we see from guys with too long backswings – and with everyone saying that they love the lead only foot drill (that is designed to help pivot better around the lead heel / hip) but also has them shallow and sync up for everything to pivot effectively… why isn’t the ‘complete’ backswing just an extension of that drill (that would result in an obvious laid off position)?...

 

Don’t kill the messenger – I’m just trying to figure out the benefits of the ‘new instructions’ on takeaway / backswings…

 

The golf instruction goal post is always moving. Even the so called experts, scientific and otherwise can't agree on the definitive way to swing a golf club. 

[TheDeanAbides]

3 minutes ago, Zitlow said:

 

The golf instruction goal post is always moving. Even the so called experts, scientific and otherwise can't agree on the definitive way to swing a golf club. 

That's because the ball doesn't care how the club face lines up as long as it does. Stoopid game!

[Barfolomew]

That's why I love a strong grip.... less roll if any.  Watch... backswing... no roll and down swooshhh and snap thru bammm.... see no roll