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Advise Requested


j76nj

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Greetings,

 

I'm trying to find some new clubs for my son.    He's soon to be 12 years old and getting larger by the second.   He's 62 inches and 115lbs and has played for almost 4 years.   He also plays left handed, which complicates equipment matters.  He participates in the PGA Jr League and was going to play US Kids events last year (until covid intervened).  He's been using a set of Ping Moxie Jr clubs.   They were ok at the start of last season but they are way too small and light for him now.  

 

When I trying to use the web fit on Ping's website,  he's at the max size for the Prodi G range of clubs.  I don't know how much time he'll get with them at this point.   I also tried web fit for adult clubs using his measurements but I'm concerned about adding too much weight too fast.    

 

I don't get the impression that the people that I've spoken to locally fit many junior golfers in anything other than a boxed set.   I'm curious about other's experiences.   Where did you take your junior golfer at this point?   Did you try to squeak out another year+ in Junior clubs?    Did you move to adult clubs with lighter shafts?    How did you handle growth during this time?   Did you buy new clubs every year?  Did you keep the same heads and swap shafts as they grow?

 

Any guidance or advise would be appreciated.

 

thanks,

jay

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Personally I would look on eBay for US kids and see if you could find a set there. Look for US Kids TS3 63.  I’ve seen more left handed on there recently than right handed. If you could find irons only, you could go that route and spend a little more a nicer junior driver and hybrids. Have heard good things about the ping fairway woods and cobra driver. We haven’t upgraded those yet. Both my boys have full sets of uskids 

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Use something like the Ping adult fitting guide.  Based upon his height (note: with golf shoes on) he is -1" off standard length. Then you just need his wrist-to-floor to get the lie angle. 

 

What's his driver swing speed?  Above 80mph?  He is likely regular flex shaft at his height, age and playing for 4 years already.  If you think steel shaft are too heavy, go with graphite.   You should be able to find some used sets on eBay and being a kid probably in R-Flex already you will have tons of available options. 

 

Driver: Find any OEM driver he likes (Cobra, Ping, etc...). Pull the grip and cut down to desired length.

Fairways: Find any OEM fairway he likes (Cobra, Ping, etc...). Pull the grip and cut down to desired length.

Irons: Probably something with a cavity back and some technology in it.  Pull the grip, cut down -1" and have a shop check the lie angles.

Wedges: Same as irons.

Putter: Endless options here. Just cut to length.

 

Also, if you are really serious, go get fit somewhere...even if you have to drive out of town for it to find a quality fitter.

 

Bottom line is they will adapt quickly.  Get into some "body weight" or light physical fitness routines to help build strength into puberty hits.

 

New_PING_ColorCodeChart_17x22.jpg

Edited by wildcatden

It's no fun when the rabbit's got the gun.

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You guys have just hit on some of the points that I'm struggling with the most.

 

The length of the US Kids 63" set is only half an inch shorter than standard adult length (at Ping).   They say its 5% lighter but don't say compared to what.   They don't post many details.    I don't want to go too heavy too fast.   Then again, I don't want to buy clubs again in 6 months.    That may be inevitable at this point though.

 

I was leaning towards buying adult clubs but I'm weary of the total weight especially for the irons.   I'm probably over thinking this as usual.  

 

Under normal circumstances,  I would have taken to get fitted already.   We've needed to be more careful during Covid.  I plan to take him to a local shop before purchasing.  My experiences with fitting at golf shops have been varied and who knows their experience fitting juniors.    Uncharted waters for me.

 

I haven't measured his swing speed.   He has grown considerably since the end of the fall golf season.      He was getting total distances around 200 at a Drive, Chip and Putt tournament last fall.    I would have guessed he was 75-80 at that point.   

 

Thanks for the replies!

 

 

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4 hours ago, Movingday said:

I see that posted on here a lot. Honest question. Why? What’s wrong with US Kids at 60”

Nothing really wrong with US kids club.  

Adult clubs will open up doors in terms of distance, forgiveness, spin rate, feel and technology.   

 

Most competitive boys in our area have moved onto adult clubs around 11~12 and if you're still using junior clubs, it's a big disadvantage.  

Edited by mrshinsa
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7 minutes ago, Movingday said:

My 13 year old weighs 80 lbs. and is 58”, he’s playing TS3 57. So are we saying every 12 year old should be in adult clubs or it’s size dependent?

Height and Weight doesn't have much to do with it.  How fast can he swing the club?  My kids buddy is 15, 5'8" and 120 lbs soaking wet.  Club head speed is 113 mph.

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I am GenX.  If you really think I care about what you have to say, I don't.

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18 minutes ago, Movingday said:

He was around 80 mph last fall. Haven’t measured after the winter 

He probably should be in Adult Clubs with at least a senior Shaft.  If he were around 83ish should probably look at Adult clubs with a graphite regular flex shaft.  Maybe steel shafts depending on weight.  He would definitely benefit from the technology in a GI iron over what he is swinging with USKG.  Possibly even a SGI.  Those irons are made for people with slow swing speeds and he would be able to hit them 10 yds further with better decent with more spin.

 

18 hours ago, j76nj said:

Greetings,

 

I'm trying to find some new clubs for my son.    He's soon to be 12 years old and getting larger by the second.   He's 62 inches and 115lbs and has played for almost 4 years.   He also plays left handed, which complicates equipment matters.  He participates in the PGA Jr League and was going to play US Kids events last year (until covid intervened).  He's been using a set of Ping Moxie Jr clubs.   They were ok at the start of last season but they are way too small and light for him now.  

 

When I trying to use the web fit on Ping's website,  he's at the max size for the Prodi G range of clubs.  I don't know how much time he'll get with them at this point.   I also tried web fit for adult clubs using his measurements but I'm concerned about adding too much weight too fast.    

 

I don't get the impression that the people that I've spoken to locally fit many junior golfers in anything other than a boxed set.   I'm curious about other's experiences.   Where did you take your junior golfer at this point?   Did you try to squeak out another year+ in Junior clubs?    Did you move to adult clubs with lighter shafts?    How did you handle growth during this time?   Did you buy new clubs every year?  Did you keep the same heads and swap shafts as they grow?

 

Any guidance or advise would be appreciated.

 

thanks,

jay

 

Left Handed does complicate things.  My kid swings em left handed as well.  I would of made you a deal on a set my kid used at 12, but just traded into TM.  The benefit of Left Handed is you can find used and previous years models pretty inexpensive.  Tinker with Adult Used Drivers.  In irons look for an 80 gram steel shaft that is used.

Edited by heavy_hitter
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I am GenX.  If you really think I care about what you have to say, I don't.

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14 hours ago, wildcatden said:

Use something like the Ping adult fitting guide.  Based upon his height (note: with golf shoes on) he is -1" off standard length. Then you just need his wrist-to-floor to get the lie angle. 

 

What's his driver swing speed?  Above 80mph?  He is likely regular flex shaft at his height, age and playing for 4 years already.  If you think steel shaft are too heavy, go with graphite.   You should be able to find some used sets on eBay and being a kid probably in R-Flex already you will have tons of available options. 

 

Driver: Find any OEM driver he likes (Cobra, Ping, etc...). Pull the grip and cut down to desired length.

Fairways: Find any OEM fairway he likes (Cobra, Ping, etc...). Pull the grip and cut down to desired length.

Irons: Probably something with a cavity back and some technology in it.  Pull the grip, cut down -1" and have a shop check the lie angles.

Wedges: Same as irons.

Putter: Endless options here. Just cut to length.

 

Also, if you are really serious, go get fit somewhere...even if you have to drive out of town for it to find a quality fitter.

 

Bottom line is they will adapt quickly.  Get into some "body weight" or light physical fitness routines to help build strength into puberty hits.

 

New_PING_ColorCodeChart_17x22.jpg

Alright, I have headed down the rabbit hole! Holy crap my eyes are watering from looking at clubs and specs all day. 
I’m going to ask what may be obvious questions, but I’m not an equipment guy. I’ve been playing my off the rack clubs for almost 20 years, but I want my boys to have what they need to be competitive. (That I can afford)
When you say “take the grip off and cut an inch” are you meaning do that myself or have that done at a shop?

USKids 57 seem to be  3.5 in shorter than men’s if I’m looking at that correctly. So can you cut 3.5 in off and not effect club performance? 

At what point would you go from senior to reg flex? I assume this is all about swing speed

Thanks in advance for the help and screw you guys for showing me the rabbit hole lol
 

Edited by Movingday
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3 minutes ago, Movingday said:

Alright, I have headed down the rabbit hole! Holy crap my eyes are watering from looking at clubs and specs all day. 
I’m going to ask what may be obvious questions, but I’m not an equipment guy. I’ve been playing my off the rack clubs for almost 20 years, but I want my boys to have what they need to be competitive. (That I can afford)
When you say “take the grip off and cut an inch” are you meaning do that myself or have that done at a shop?

USKids 57 seem to be  3.5 in shorter than men’s if I’m looking at that correctly. So can you cut 3.5 in off and not effect club performance? 

Thanks in advance for the help and screw you guys for showing me the rabbit hole lol
 

 

We haven't done it, but yes, some juniors get adult clubs cut down that much.  My kid certainly does on the drivers and fairway woods. Have not done it on irons as we are still USKG TS3-57's.  There are some WRX dads here on the Jr Golf Forum that have had their kids playing adult heads with graphite ladies flex (or senior flex) since they were 51" tall (with respect to the USKG sizing being used as a guideline).  There is some debate as to whether introducing heavier irons too early could  help or hinder long term swing development.

 

Your 13 year old weighs 80 lbs. and is 58”, he’s playing TS3-57.  Sounds about right as he is on the smaller side for his age, correct?  As a comparable, my 10YO is 57" (golf shoes on) and weighs the same and he plays TS3-57 with the junior steel shaft.  When my kid gets to the next height in the USKG spec (60"), we will be moving on to adult heads and likely graphite senior flex cut down -1".  We probably won't do a professional iron fitting until the next set after that because....well....he likely will be only 11 years old when he hits 60" and it just doesn't matter yet.  Instead, I'll be finding a deal on eBay and cutting them down.

 

And yes, “take the grip off and cut an inch” I am saying do it yourself. But if you can't, the shop is your or a friend who can is your next option.

 

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It's no fun when the rabbit's got the gun.

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2 minutes ago, wildcatden said:

 

We haven't done it, but yes, some juniors get adult clubs cut down that much.  My kid certainly does on the drivers and fairway woods. Have not done it on irons as we are still USKG TS3-57's.  There are some WRX dads here on the Jr Golf Forum that have had their kids playing adult heads with graphite ladies flex (or senior flex) since they were 51" tall (with respect to the USKG sizing being used as a guideline).  There is some debate as to whether introducing heavier irons too early could  help or hinder long term swing development.

 

Your 13 year old weighs 80 lbs. and is 58”, he’s playing TS3-57.  Sounds about right as he is on the smaller side for his age, correct?  As a comparable, my 10YO is 57" (golf shoes on) and weighs the same and he plays TS3-57 with the junior steel shaft.  When my kid gets to the next height in the USKG spec (60"), we will be moving on to adult heads and likely graphite senior flex cut down -1".  We probably won't do a professional iron fitting until the next set after that because....well....he likely will be only 11 years old when he hits 60" and it just doesn't matter yet.  Instead, I'll be finding a deal on eBay and cutting them down.

 

And yes, “take the grip off and cut an inch” I am saying do it yourself. But if you can't, the shop is your or a friend who can is your next option.

 

Yes, he’s tiny for his age. I’m guessing Google is my friend here, but what tools are needed to cut a shaft? And he’s 58” with shoes off, so I guess I need to measure in his golf shoes? 

 

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2 minutes ago, Movingday said:

Yes, he’s tiny for his age. I’m guessing Google is my friend here, but what tools are needed to cut a shaft? And he’s 58” with shoes off, so I guess I need to measure in his golf shoes? 

 

 

Yes, measure with golf shoes on. I'm sure it adds 1/2" to 3/4" at most).   You can go from using a dremel tool to an angle grinder when cutting things like a graphite shaft.  I'm no expert. You can ask questions over in the WRX Tech forum to get an idea for some of the tools of the trade. It can get expensive or be done cheaper.

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/forum/18-wrx-club-techs/

 

 

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It's no fun when the rabbit's got the gun.

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22 minutes ago, wildcatden said:

 

Yes, measure with golf shoes on. I'm sure it adds 1/2" to 3/4" at most).   You can go from using a dremel tool to an angle grinder when cutting things like a graphite shaft.  I'm no expert. You can ask questions over in the WRX Tech forum to get an idea for some of the tools of the trade. It can get expensive or be done cheaper.

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/forum/18-wrx-club-techs/

 

 

Thanks for the help!

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9 hours ago, Movingday said:

Yes, he’s tiny for his age. I’m guessing Google is my friend here, but what tools are needed to cut a shaft? And he’s 58” with shoes off, so I guess I need to measure in his golf shoes? 

 

I just took my daughter’s driver to my local Dicks Sporting Goods to get her driver shortened and they charged less than $10.  Think it was $6 to cut and $3 to save the grip.  

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So standard driver length is 45” and US Kids 60 is 40”. Can you cut a shaft 5”? Or is it better to buy a Flynn shaft at 40” and put the OEM head on it? 
Also, I saw the other thread that suggested the Calloway XR because of its weight. Are there other heads that are optimal for juniors?

Edited by Movingday
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40 minutes ago, Movingday said:

So standard driver length is 45” and US Kids 60 is 40”. Can you cut a shaft 5”? Or is it better to buy a Flynn shaft at 40” and put the OEM head on it? 
Also, I saw the other thread that suggested the Calloway XR because of its weight. Are there other heads that are optimal for juniors?

A driver you should consider is a XXIO driver.  It’s very light but it’s not adjustable.  Not sure if that’s important for you.  You can get a good deal on eBay.  In case you’re not familiar with the brand, it’s owned by Cleveland Golf and it caters to older players looking for a bit more clubhead speed.  It’s an excellent club and brand.

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1 hour ago, Movingday said:

So standard driver length is 45” and US Kids 60 is 40”. Can you cut a shaft 5”? Or is it better to buy a Flynn shaft at 40” and put the OEM head on it? 
Also, I saw the other thread that suggested the Calloway XR because of its weight. Are there other heads that are optimal for juniors?

 

Yes, you can take a driver shaft and butt cut it to length. We just had 7 inches cut off a 46" shaft in senior flex to end up with a "adapter tip to grip" of 39".  Adding the clubhead to the shaft makes it play about 40.25" finished club length.  Prior to that, we had another OEM shaft in L-Flex butt cut down 9".   IMHO, much more than that and you should stick with (ugh) Flynn shafts for which I am not much of a fan.

 

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On 2/26/2021 at 12:13 PM, Movingday said:

Would you do the same for woods? Adult driver seems huge for him

And for irons, something like a Sim Max with graphite? They actually aren’t much more expensive than the Ts3

 

A local store or course should have some kind of 7i for him to demo.  Yeah, I would do the same thing for woods.

 

You knowingly admit that your kid is little.  It is the size of the heart, not the size of the man.  Size is little to no factor in how fast you can swing the club.  It is leg and chest strength.  I have seen some little kids absolutely destroy balls.

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1 hour ago, heavy_hitter said:

A local store or course should have some kind of 7i for him to demo.  Yeah, I would do the same thing for woods.

 

You knowingly admit that your kid is little.  It is the size of the heart, not the size of the man.  Size is little to no factor in how fast you can swing the club.  It is leg and chest strength.  I have seen some little kids absolutely destroy balls.

Stroman - #HDMH (Height Doesn’t Measure Heart). 

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There's definitely something more important that I should be doing.
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3 hours ago, heavy_hitter said:

A local store or course should have some kind of 7i for him to demo.  Yeah, I would do the same thing for woods.

 

You knowingly admit that your kid is little.  It is the size of the heart, not the size of the man.  Size is little to no factor in how fast you can swing the club.  It is leg and chest strength.  I have seen some little kids absolutely destroy balls.

I get that his size doesn’t limit his swing speed. It’s not swing speed that concerns me. It’s the length of the shaft and screwing up his swing. Doesn’t cutting that much off

a driver significantly impact swing weight? It seems wherever I read I get different info on cutting clubs for juniors. 
I really appreciate everyone’s responses. It’s been very informative and helpful. 
What are the pros/cons of just using an OEM head with a Flynn shaft at the correct length vs cutting a shaft 5 inches?

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