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One length irons WOW!!!


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27 minutes ago, NRJyzr said:

 

You may wish to check out Value Golf, they have the Pinhawk Vertex iron set.  The site offers some info on the concept.

 

Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with Value Golf, other than as a customer.  🙂

 

Oh hey, a dual length. That sounds interesting as well.

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If you haven't played them, you don't know. If you've demo-ed them but haven't played them, you don't know. If you've played them a little bit, you don't know.   You don't.   There

I went to a Cobra Golf Demo/fitting day Friday to satisfy my curiosity about the one length irons. They had a set made up with their King forged Tec One head. They had a KBS lite steel shaft, regular

I disagree. I think the wedges would be okay once you're used to them, the real issue is gapping in the whole set. Bryson plays all of this lofts a club strong - his 8 iron is 33 degrees @ 6 iron leng

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10 minutes ago, mtg said:

ha that's funny they use the exact lengths I mention

 

I think you could actually rig up any set with those length specs. You're never more than an inch off standard - and that's the 3 iron that's a full inch - most people need to play a lighter swing weight 3 iron anyhow. I typically find most short irons end up needing heavier tip weights so longer length could be definitely be managed with the right set. 

 

If you're using something with a big pocket cavity in the long irons which you'd prob want to to boost launch, they're basically lead tape receptacles anyway.. thinking like MP-54s/Srixon 565 type iron

 

And you'd have to go forged so you can tweak lie angles. 

 

The hard part is removing weight from the wedges or short irons.  Adding weight isn't usually a problem, especially for those of us who wallow in lead tape.  😉

 

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A setup to consider  

Single length 4 through 7, then normal stepped length 8 through wedges.   

An often missed characteristic of single length long irons is THE HEAD FOR 4-6 IRONS IS 7 IRON WEIGHT.    We can bypass the lecture from engineering mechanics class (I attended class and the information sunk in ); the heavier head exactly compensates for a shorter shaft.   Gapping is NOT a mechanics problem; just an issue in your head.  

Many players hit the short irons ( 8 - wedges ) just fine so keep these skills while using single length to simplify long irons.   My set is normal stepped icons for wedges, 9 and 8.    Single length for 7 through 3 iron.   Try it - you may like this setup too.  

Two length doesn't solve anything - just adds another length question.   

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17 hours ago, Rich Douglas said:

No, I am not affiliated with any golf company in any way. But I've played single-length irons at a pretty good level of performance for more than 5 years out of the 32 I've played this game.

 

Your analogy fails because you're implying a continuum that does not exist. These irons are unlike traditional-length irons in significant ways. You cannot effectively project traditional concepts onto this one.

 

I am not interested in what you do or do not believe. I am very much interested in addressing unsupported suppositions from players who have no experience with the subject. 

 

If I post something you can successfully refute, I will be the first in line to change my mind. Have at it.

Have a good day

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Pinhawks are a cast club head so distance and feel suffer.   I play (no advertisement, just data) the Prophet CB from Hirekogolf.com.    They have a forged, hardened stainless face brazed or welded into a cast cavity back body.   Great feel and distance.   Add weight to the long irons using a mix of tungsten power and shafting epoxy in the cavity back.    This places the weight below the impact point where it does the most good.  We can discuss important details if you want to fabricate a test club.   

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Yeah, Wings02 I also am playing the Cobra One length irons. 2 years ago I put together a cheap set of one length irons from a component company. I played them for the whole season and was relatively pleased with them. Last winter I was cruising Ebay and came across a seller that had Cobra F7 one length iron heads for sale. still in factory plastic so I bought a set of them. At a bit less than $100 for 5-GW I figured why not. I'll tell ya they made a huge difference for me. I am 69 yrs old and one of the leagues I play in is an 18 hole senior league that runs 18 total weeks. I had 12 rounds in the 70's which was a season best for me in the last 5 or 6 years. In fact I broke par once and shot even twice. As the saying goes "you can have these when you pry them from my cold dead hands". They have been a Godsend for my game as it was getting old not shooting in the 70's anymore. Took 8 shots off my handicap and 10 years off my age. My advice to anyone thinking about trying one length clubs is do it you won't be sorry.

 

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I'll add another brand to the Comments, Orlimar Intercept SL irons.

Bought a slightly used set from a guy who couldn't hit them. Took me no range time and about 3 rds to get the hang of them. Like Rich Douglas said from 110-190 you're hitting an 8 iron ( 7 iron for me ) every single time. 

Upgraded to Cobra F8's soon after and maintained my usual 75-80 score.

I choke down on the wedges for chipping, that's about it. 

Play 6-sw SL, should have tried these years ago.

 

 

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4 hours ago, Pepperturbo said:

Have a good day

Oh, I am. It comes from being positive. Try it!

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2 minutes ago, Rich Douglas said:

Oh, I am. It comes from being positive. Try it!

You should NOT make azz-supmptions about people you don't know because they disagree with you.

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1 hour ago, Pepperturbo said:

You should NOT make azz-supmptions about people you don't know because they disagree with you.

Assumptions? No.

 

Here's wishing YOU a good day! 😁

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I think Cobra's choice to build to 37.5" was a mistake, unless one is say over 6 ft tall.   37.5" is 6i length and most struggling golfers suck with the 6i on up, so why make all your clubs a length you struggle with ?  I've often said the mere reason one hits their 9i way better than there 5i is because of shaft length, plain and simple.  

 

Head loft is still the primary reason for distance and I'm in the camp that 36.5" is a much more usable length for the majority of golfers.  Having max distance or trajectory problems with your SL 6-5-4 is of small consequence as most people looking at SL probably really suck with their longer irons.   With shorter shafts up top, finding centre contact is much more likely to happen, giving more repeatable end-results, and a higher average.  

 

For fun I picked up a new Cobra Junior set of 5-7-9-P-S for $130 new on the Bay.  These are built to 36.25" and have a 42g Junior shaft and Junior grips.  For fun I put 10g of lead tape on the 5i head, removed the Junior grip, put on 5-6 single sided wraps to build up the shaft, and then a CP2 Wrap Jumbo.  With that setup, you'd be surprised what you can do with that club, carry distance and trajectory !  Of course it's easy to over power such a light flexy shaft, but you get the idea.  Previously I built a set of EQ1-NX but didn't get along with such an SGI shaped head as I've been a Mizuno MP player for the last 12 years.  The Cobra Forged Tec OL at least look more like a Player's head.

 

I've been playing SL 9-LW for several years, and reduced length MOI builds moving up from the 9i, and last 2 set were are in 1/4"  or 3/8" increments, or a combo of both ( 1/4" inc 9-8-7 and 3/8" 7-6-5 ).

 

I have a new combo set of ZX7 7-8-9-PW and ZX5 4-5-6-GW incoming and will push my short build to the max.  Shafts will be Steelfiber i110cw and an MOI build ( my new Auditor MOI arrived last week ).  I had a set of clean i110cw 3-9i pulls and bought 6 new Wedge shafts for the project.   I'm planning on 8-LW SL at 36.0" ungripped, then 1/4" increments with 4i at 37.0.  I'm not sure I can get the 4i at that length, but pretty sure I can get the 5i at 36.75".   I don't want to use lead tape. To get my swingweights for such short mid & long irons, I have the Wishon 9g tungsten tip weights, and weighted ferrules from BigFootGolf ( on eBay ).  BigFoot's  coloured aluminum ferrules are 4.5g, the stainless steel are 13g, and the copper are 15g.  I'm counting on the ZX5 in 6-5-4 to give me a launch boost vs the same ZX7 6-5-4, hence my choice of a combo set.  I do the same with my current MP-18 MMC set where I have the Fli-Hi in 6i and 5i to help with launch.  If my Srixon combo set ends up performing "weird" in 6-5-4 with so much weight in the hosel & ferrule,  I'll keep the ZX7 portion and maybe acquire Forged Tec OL 6-5-4, time will tell.

 

With most any off the shelf head, you can readily build SL 7-GW at either 36.25 or 36.5" without jumping through assembly challenges. Getting a 6i very short is where assembly challenges come into play.  A SW and LW will require drilling out of the hosel too to get to 36+ inches.  It certainly is fun to scheme and experiment on these non-standard builds !

 

 

Edited by ARL67
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It's been six weeks playing Sterling SL and I'm enjoying golf now more than ever. I can hit my 4i three times in a row without hesitate. Feeling is great. It's all about confidence: I don't have to think about stance, ball position or whatever, just do the same swing every time and let it fly.

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On 3/16/2021 at 8:39 PM, bullie76 said:

I have a few SL irons in the bag. Six thru gap. But my 52 & 58 are variable length. And my hybrids are variable as well. I do like the concept of SL but I don't think it has to be that way throughout the bag. Play what works for you. 

Yes indeed.  The only clubs in my bag that are SL are my edel irons 5- GW...everything else is VL.  

 

My SW is +1".

 

 

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13 hours ago, ARL67 said:

I think Cobra's choice to build to 37.5" was a mistake, unless one is say over 6 ft tall.   37.5" is 6i length and most struggling golfers suck with the 6i on up, so why make all your clubs a length you struggle with ?  I've often said the mere reason one hits their 9i way better than there 5i is because of shaft length, plain and simple.  

 

Head loft is still the primary reason for distance and I'm in the camp that 36.5" is a much more usable length for the majority of golfers.  Having max distance or trajectory problems with your SL 6-5-4 is of small consequence as most people looking at SL probably really suck with their longer irons.   With shorter shafts up top, finding centre contact is much more likely to happen, giving more repeatable end-results, and a higher average.  

 

For fun I picked up a new Cobra Junior set of 5-7-9-P-S for $130 new on the Bay.  These are built to 36.25" and have a 42g Junior shaft and Junior grips.  For fun I put 10g of lead tape on the 5i head, removed the Junior grip, put on 5-6 single sided wraps to build up the shaft, and then a CP2 Wrap Jumbo.  With that setup, you'd be surprised what you can do with that club, carry distance and trajectory !  Of course it's easy to over power such a light flexy shaft, but you get the idea.  Previously I built a set of EQ1-NX but didn't get along with such an SGI shaped head as I've been a Mizuno MP player for the last 12 years.  The Cobra Forged Tec OL at least look more like a Player's head.

 

I've been playing SL 9-LW for several years, and reduced length MOI builds moving up from the 9i, and last 2 set were are in 1/4"  or 3/8" increments, or a combo of both ( 1/4" inc 9-8-7 and 3/8" 7-6-5 ).

 

I have a new combo set of ZX7 7-8-9-PW and ZX5 4-5-6-GW incoming and will push my short build to the max.  Shafts will be Steelfiber i110cw and an MOI build ( my new Auditor MOI arrived last week ).  I had a set of clean i110cw 3-9i pulls and bought 6 new Wedge shafts for the project.   I'm planning on 8-LW SL at 36.0" ungripped, then 1/4" increments with 4i at 37.0.  I'm not sure I can get the 4i at that length, but pretty sure I can get the 5i at 36.75".   I don't want to use lead tape. To get my swingweights for such short mid & long irons, I have the Wishon 9g tungsten tip weights, and weighted ferrules from BigFootGolf ( on eBay ).  BigFoot's  coloured aluminum ferrules are 4.5g, the stainless steel are 13g, and the copper are 15g.  I'm counting on the ZX5 in 6-5-4 to give me a launch boost vs the same ZX7 6-5-4, hence my choice of a combo set.  I do the same with my current MP-18 MMC set where I have the Fli-Hi in 6i and 5i to help with launch.  If my Srixon combo set ends up performing "weird" in 6-5-4 with so much weight in the hosel & ferrule,  I'll keep the ZX7 portion and maybe acquire Forged Tec OL 6-5-4, time will tell.

 

With most any off the shelf head, you can readily build SL 7-GW at either 36.25 or 36.5" without jumping through assembly challenges. Getting a 6i very short is where assembly challenges come into play.  A SW and LW will require drilling out of the hosel too to get to 36+ inches.  It certainly is fun to scheme and experiment on these non-standard builds !

 

 

 

I'd push back on length being the biggest reason you hit a 9i better than a 6i. Loft is massive factor in limiting spin axis tilt (offline shots). Head weight also increases MOI a good bit. And your 9 iron target is just a lot closer to you, giving somewhat of an illusion you're more accurate with it (which you are, just saying a closer target is easier to hit). I honestly don't think the 1.5 inches is the biggest issue. If 37.5" is such a constraint to your ball striking then god knows how you can play a 42" fw not to mention something approaching 45. 

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A millisecond before contact, the ball does not know what iron head is coming at it, though the ball would prefer something centre faced on a good path -> shorter shafted mid and long irons will achieve better on those 2 items for a struggling golfer.   Excess or bad spin is a function of not-centred contact and/or poor path.

 

If one wants a taste of SL or reduced length without going in whole-hog, then one can easily try:

SL 9-PW-GW a 36.0" ungripped

then going up a 3/8" increment at 0.5 SWP per club for an easy MOI build , 5i ending at 37.5" ungripped  ( 1/2" shorter then typical stock )

 

Though I actually like this scheme better for more of a commitment to reduced length and easily buildable  ( MOI build ) :

SL 9-PW-GW a 36.0" ungripped

8i at 36.25"

7i at 36.50"

6i at 36.875"

5i at 37.25"

 

Again, I'm talking about golfers struggling with their longer irons.

If one can hit their 6i well at stock 37.5" and a 38.0" 5i, then SL or reduced length is probably of little benefit to someone with those striking skills.

Edited by ARL67

WITB: Sun Mountain 4.5LS
Titleist TSi2 11* with Evenflow White 65

Titleist TSi2 18* hybrid with Evenflow White 90
Titleist TS2 23* hybrid with Accra FX300H
Srixon ZX7 / ZX5 4-GW with Steelfiber i110cw
Cleveland RTX Zipcore 54* & 58* Full with Steelfiber i110cw
Seemore Platinum M7 Tour with SS Flatso 3.0
Set #2: MP-18 MMC 5-PW with Steelfiber i95cw
Set #3: MP-18 MMC 5-PW with Steelfiber i110cw
Set #4: MP-4 5-PW with Steelfiber i110cw

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On 3/17/2021 at 5:08 PM, ARL67 said:

I think Cobra's choice to build to 37.5" was a mistake, unless one is say over 6 ft tall. 

 

 

I thought Cobra built to 37"? Edel is at 37.5", IIRC.

 

But why couldn't you have a Cobra set at 36.5"? You'd have to adjust the lie angles, of course, but I don't see any other limitation.

 

The Wishon EQ1-NX irons are designed around a 36.5" shaft, but they can be built for longer ones. 

Driver: Titleist TSi3 (Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black RDX 60)
2W: TM Mini Driver
3H: Ping G410 (19 degrees)

4H: Ping G410 (22 degrees)
Irons: Wishon EQ1-NX Single Length 5I-SW (UST Mamiya Recoil 780 ES “S” Flex 86 grams)

LW: Callaway Mack Daddy 4
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14 hours ago, mtg said:

 

I'd push back on length being the biggest reason you hit a 9i better than a 6i. Loft is massive factor in limiting spin axis tilt (offline shots).

Yes and yes.

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2W: TM Mini Driver
3H: Ping G410 (19 degrees)

4H: Ping G410 (22 degrees)
Irons: Wishon EQ1-NX Single Length 5I-SW (UST Mamiya Recoil 780 ES “S” Flex 86 grams)

LW: Callaway Mack Daddy 4
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6 hours ago, Rich Douglas said:

I thought Cobra built to 37"? Edel is at 37.5", IIRC.

 

But why couldn't you have a Cobra set at 36.5"? You'd have to adjust the lie angles, of course, but I don't see any other limitation.

 

The Wishon EQ1-NX irons are designed around a 36.5" shaft, but they can be built for longer ones. 

Edel irons are whatever rhe fitting says ir should be for best results. 

 

When I was fitted I hit all manner of combinations of length, loft, lie, shafy weights and flexes.

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The worst part of SL is that I do not think you can determine if they will help you hitting in a simulator, on the range or after one or two rounds on the course.

 

This past year I gave a set of F7's a run for four rounds and a few range sessions.  I discovered my years and years of playing competitive golf I am fine with the longer short irons, even the mid irons are fine, but the longest irons are not for me.  Not because I couldn't elevate them(granted their peak height was a bit lower than I am used to) but because I did not find a launch window I liked.  I scored right around my handicap at the time.  My handicap neither improved nor got worse with the clubs.  I was not a fan of the larger mid irons and the spin numbers weren't what I like in the mid longer irons.  Could I have tried different shafts and bending to get them where I wanted?  Probably, but I knew I had a weird length setup already that worked for me.

 

I gave them to a buddy who was just starting out in golf(has played maybe a year at this point with some regularity).  They worked great for him, he's still playing them and his exacts words were, why aren't all irons like this instead of different lengths?  Going in with a truly open mind to a SL experiment is 100% necessary

 

All this to say I think CUSTOM length for all clubs, up to and including single length is something there is not enough people looking at.  You go and get fitted and they fit you on the 7 or 6 iron.  Then just build your set in the standard 1/2" increments.  You go and get fit in SL and it is whatever length option they have (except Edel).  You may be a 6 iron length SL golfer, a 7, or even an 8.  Length and shaft weight are so over looked it is not even funny.

 

I got lucky as a kid in the 90's a guy replacing the shafts in my irons pre butt cut everything based on dropping off my 7 iron with him, and the clubs I was playing had variable hosel lengths.  Low and behold I play roughly a 1/4 set now based off of a 38" 7 iron.  A fitter down in Georgia figured this out that after playing in High School and college with this weird lengths, and the Mizuno rep even doctored the 14's I played similarly that after my initial fitting we went through the entire bag.  Lead tape galore on my high school and college sets

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On 3/15/2021 at 9:51 PM, OsnolaKinnard said:

I have been playing edel SLS01 irons for going on my 3rd year.  My irons are all 37" long.  I am also 6'4" tall.  I love SL irons for the short irons.  The 7-GW work like magic for me.

 

That all being said...I use TEE CBX ironwood for my 4 and 5 iron and an 18* cbx119 Hybrid.

 

I have found what works for me, allows me to feel comfortable over the ball, and heightens my enjoyment of the game. 

 

Being a taller golfer, I never felt comfortable with anything less than an 8 iron, and as my clubs were always +1"...that pretty much puts me at the 37" range.  

 

Is there a learning curve?  Yep.  Is there some re-training?  Yep.

 

SL is not magic, but if you're a taller golfer...don't let thr talk from manlets scare you away from longer short irons.

 

Aren't yours 38"?  You said 37.

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I tried them and my issues seem to be well discussed here, the long irons were low bullets with effectively no spacing between the 4-6, 7-8-9 were awesome, W-G were too long and went straight up in the air.

 

I'll admit, I probably didn't give them the full college try and just cut my losses and sold them off to some other poor unsuspecting soul at a 50% discount.  I could see some benefit if this set was essentially custom made for you across the bag ala Bryson, but even he needs help to elevate the long irons, special shafts to fit what he needs, and pretty aggressive loft changes on a lot of his clubs to fit his gapping.  So if I had full reign of Cobra's R&D staff to fit my clubs to me perfectly, I think there is a lot of merit to it, but just buying them off the rack is a different story (or was for me). 

SIM2 - G410 LST - something random - G410 Crossover 20* - i500 5-W (5i 2* strong, 6i 1* strong) - MD 52*, PM 58* & 64* - F22
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4 hours ago, driveandputtmachine said:

The worst part of SL is that I do not think you can determine if they will help you hitting in a simulator, on the range or after one or two rounds on the course.

 

This past year I gave a set of F7's a run for four rounds and a few range sessions.  I discovered my years and years of playing competitive golf I am fine with the longer short irons, even the mid irons are fine, but the longest irons are not for me.  Not because I couldn't elevate them(granted their peak height was a bit lower than I am used to) but because I did not find a launch window I liked.  I scored right around my handicap at the time.  My handicap neither improved nor got worse with the clubs.  I was not a fan of the larger mid irons and the spin numbers weren't what I like in the mid longer irons.  Could I have tried different shafts and bending to get them where I wanted?  Probably, but I knew I had a weird length setup already that worked for me.

 

I gave them to a buddy who was just starting out in golf(has played maybe a year at this point with some regularity).  They worked great for him, he's still playing them and his exacts words were, why aren't all irons like this instead of different lengths?  Going in with a truly open mind to a SL experiment is 100% necessary

 

All this to say I think CUSTOM length for all clubs, up to and including single length is something there is not enough people looking at.  You go and get fitted and they fit you on the 7 or 6 iron.  Then just build your set in the standard 1/2" increments.  You go and get fit in SL and it is whatever length option they have (except Edel).  You may be a 6 iron length SL golfer, a 7, or even an 8.  Length and shaft weight are so over looked it is not even funny.

 

I got lucky as a kid in the 90's a guy replacing the shafts in my irons pre butt cut everything based on dropping off my 7 iron with him, and the clubs I was playing had variable hosel lengths.  Low and behold I play roughly a 1/4 set now based off of a 38" 7 iron.  A fitter down in Georgia figured this out that after playing in High School and college with this weird lengths, and the Mizuno rep even doctored the 14's I played similarly that after my initial fitting we went through the entire bag.  Lead tape galore on my high school and college sets

Wishon (Sterling and EQ1-NX) are designed around an 8-iron length (36.5"). You can, of course, fit them with longer shafts. But you'll have to adjust the lie angles accordingly. This in addition to whatever deviation you normally are from standard, if any.

 

You also have to take a look at swing weight, which will change with the longer shafts. And you cannot assume anything. When I switched to the EQ1-NX, I also switched to graphite shafts (which were about 30g lighter). I normally build at a D2 swing weight, and these were precisely matched at D1.5. But they felt too light--much more than you'd think with just a half-point change in swing weight. (Which I normally cannot detect.) It was because of the change in gross weight. Ironically, I regripped them with Winn Excel grips--about 10g lighter. That pushed the swing weight up to D3, even though it dropped the static weight even further. Voila! They now "feel" right, which is the point of fitting.

 

Not seeing an improvement is a good reason for not switching. I'm a single-digit, but my iron play was my weakest area. It is now not. 

Driver: Titleist TSi3 (Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black RDX 60)
2W: TM Mini Driver
3H: Ping G410 (19 degrees)

4H: Ping G410 (22 degrees)
Irons: Wishon EQ1-NX Single Length 5I-SW (UST Mamiya Recoil 780 ES “S” Flex 86 grams)

LW: Callaway Mack Daddy 4
Putter: Bloodline (center-shafted mallet)
Ball: Titleist ProV1 (2021)

Glove: Bionic Performancegrip Pro

Shoes: Sqairz 20/20

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1 hour ago, J_Tizzle said:

I tried them and my issues seem to be well discussed here, the long irons were low bullets with effectively no spacing between the 4-6, 7-8-9 were awesome, W-G were too long and went straight up in the air.

 

What you experienced at the low-lofted end is quite common and a good reason not to make the switch. 

 

A good rule of thumb: take the longest iron in your current set that you're good with--I mean good; you hit it well and predictably, with good gapping from the next shorter club. Then take a single-length set. If your longest effective club in the traditional set is, say, a 4-iron, it will likely be a 5-iron in a single-length set. This is because about 85% of a club's carry is due to loft, with the other 15% or so due to shaft length, which you don't get in a single-length set.

 

The gap that is created is often filled with a hybrid or two. Wishon is now including in the EQ1-NX hybrids that can be built either to the length of your irons or to traditional lengths. I'm fine with my traditional hybrids, so I haven't checked out the Wishons. Besides, it's hard to "check them out." You really end up purchasing them from your fitter sight-unseen. This is true with most single-length sets of irons, too (except the Cobras).

Driver: Titleist TSi3 (Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black RDX 60)
2W: TM Mini Driver
3H: Ping G410 (19 degrees)

4H: Ping G410 (22 degrees)
Irons: Wishon EQ1-NX Single Length 5I-SW (UST Mamiya Recoil 780 ES “S” Flex 86 grams)

LW: Callaway Mack Daddy 4
Putter: Bloodline (center-shafted mallet)
Ball: Titleist ProV1 (2021)

Glove: Bionic Performancegrip Pro

Shoes: Sqairz 20/20

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33 minutes ago, Rich Douglas said:

What you experienced at the low-lofted end is quite common and a good reason not to make the switch. 

 

A good rule of thumb: take the longest iron in your current set that you're good with--I mean good; you hit it well and predictably, with good gapping from the next shorter club. Then take a single-length set. If your longest effective club in the traditional set is, say, a 4-iron, it will likely be a 5-iron in a single-length set. This is because about 85% of a club's carry is due to loft, with the other 15% or so due to shaft length, which you don't get in a single-length set.

 

The gap that is created is often filled with a hybrid or two. Wishon is now including in the EQ1-NX hybrids that can be built either to the length of your irons or to traditional lengths. I'm fine with my traditional hybrids, so I haven't checked out the Wishons. Besides, it's hard to "check them out." You really end up purchasing them from your fitter sight-unseen. This is true with most single-length sets of irons, too (except the Cobras).

 

Yep I'd agree with all that for sure.  If I wanted to spend the time working through the bag and modifying things here and there I think you could make it work, but re-learning 25 years of golfing might be difficult for my little brain.  I do like the idea earlier someone mentioned of giving their F7s to a buddy that doesn't play much and he loves them.  I actually have a friend that I think the concept of SIL would really work well for.  

SIM2 - G410 LST - something random - G410 Crossover 20* - i500 5-W (5i 2* strong, 6i 1* strong) - MD 52*, PM 58* & 64* - F22
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On 3/16/2021 at 6:14 PM, Rich Douglas said:

Here's the strongest argument against going with single-length clubs: you don't want to. And there's nothing wrong with that!

Not true at all. All the data I've read is confusing and contradictory, as well as reliant on physical skills only few possess.  I've been playing golf for 60 years, and I've assimilated a set that works for me. Plus, I'm on a fixed income.  If you'd like to provide me a set, I'll be happy to try them out--I'm very curious, as we all are.  Thanks for sharing your story.

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"I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member."
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TaylorMade Burner Driver 10.5*, 3-wood 15* REAX reg graphite
Adams Idea A12 #4 Hybrid 21* VTS Proforce reg graphite
Mizuno MX-23 irons, 4-P, Dynalite Gold regular steel
Putter: 2001 Odyssey 2-Ball, 36" --  Ball: Snell MTB Black

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6 hours ago, Tim Schoch said:

Not true at all. All the data I've read is confusing and contradictory, as well as reliant on physical skills only few possess.  I've been playing golf for 60 years, and I've assimilated a set that works for me. Plus, I'm on a fixed income.  If you'd like to provide me a set, I'll be happy to try them out--I'm very curious, as we all are.  Thanks for sharing your story.

 

The data aren't confusing; the opinions are.

 

As for "physical prowess," I've already addressed that. Whatever is your longest iron in your current set that is effective, single-length irons will (likely) start at one club "shorter." If the lowest loft iron you can currently hit is a 4-iron, for example, then start your single-length set at a 5-iron.

 

Single-length clubs are no more expensive than are variable-length clubs.

 

I'm glad your clubs work for you. Keep on hitting them.

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Driver: Titleist TSi3 (Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black RDX 60)
2W: TM Mini Driver
3H: Ping G410 (19 degrees)

4H: Ping G410 (22 degrees)
Irons: Wishon EQ1-NX Single Length 5I-SW (UST Mamiya Recoil 780 ES “S” Flex 86 grams)

LW: Callaway Mack Daddy 4
Putter: Bloodline (center-shafted mallet)
Ball: Titleist ProV1 (2021)

Glove: Bionic Performancegrip Pro

Shoes: Sqairz 20/20

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  • 2 weeks later...

51095679322_9b57e6e9ac_o.jpg

 

I'm going to give this set some play early this spring.  I built a DIY single length set from some very old cheap MIzuno heads.  It was a lot of fun and I learned boatloads, but they weren't very playable.  The concept continues to intrigue me. 

 

I need the length at 3w and 18* hybrid / 5 wood.  I don't have a ton of swing speed so I don't think it would be very functional at that low loft.  Then I go 37.5" Cobra F9 One Length 21* hybrid.  The head launches nice and high to a great window.  I have some mental block lingering with this club and the 5 iron.  I just find myself swinging hard and pulling up when I have like 190 to a green.  I think with some continued practice and commitment I will come to love this club. 

 

The Pinhawks are interesting.  I have concluded that I am intrigued by single length.  The Mizuno build was a lot of fun and I learned a TON about club specs.  The Pinhawks are significantly more playable than the Mizuno's.  They're moderately forgiving for a cast cavity back GI club.  The torching and removing the badge helps the looks a fair bit.  But the torching is aging quickly.  The head shape is chunky and reminds me of a Callaway x-12 from many years ago.  The technology is fairly basic.  The leading edge is a little too sharp for me, I wish it were more rounded.  It seems like most iterations on Single Length incorporate tech to make up for shortcomings - mostly in more consistent peak heights and carry.  The 5 iron is a little low, but fine.  The 9 and PW are high, but gain not terrible.  They don't feel very good.  Removing the badge made them a little harsher and they weren't great to start.  There just aren't a lot of great other options though.  So far I think they are overall a solid positive with some drawbacks I am willing to overlook.

 

My wedges are at standard shorter lengths.  I feel uncomfortable hitting chips and pitches with the longer length and have always enjoyed hitting a gap wedge into a green. 

 

Overall I'm excited to see if this improves my scoring.  The concept resonates and I kind of enjoy being a little different...

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TaylorMade SIM Max 9*

Exotics EXS Pro 3 Wood 15*

Callaway Epic Flash Hybrid 18*

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Maltby Tour MG 52, 56, 60

KZG Milled

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On 4/4/2021 at 10:15 PM, kleydejong said:

There just aren't a lot of great other options though. 

 

Sure there are. But you can't take a variable length set and DIY into an SL set. 

 

Variable length sets have variable weights in the heads. This is to accommodate the variable length shafts. Thus, a 3-iron head is a lot lighter than is a GW head. When you put in SL shafts, say, at an 8-iron length, you have to remove weight from the 9-GW heads and add weight to the other irons above the 8-iron. If you don't, your swing weights will be off. Adding weight to the low-lofted irons can change their playing characteristics, even if you get it right. How it will change depends on how you add the weight--liquid metal, lead tape, etc.--and where you add it. 

 

In the higher-lofted irons and wedges, you'll need to remove progressively more weight for each club. Same issues here, except its a lot harder to remove sufficient weight to make up for the now-heavier and longer shafts. 

 

The Tommy Armour EQL failed--on a manufacturing level--to get this right in the early 1990s. There is no reason to expect a single tinkerer to succeed where they failed. Single length irons didn't begin to work until manufacturers could make heads that (a) all weighed the same and (b) had varying characteristics to make up for the lack of varying shaft lengths. The low-lofted clubs had to have higher CORs while the high-lofted clubs had to have lower CORs. Plus, the CGs for each club head have to vary to help with launch angles. 

 

Then, when you're all done with that, you still need to adjust lie angles; in a traditional set they can range by as much as 6 or 7 degrees. But if your particular setup needs are different from standard--more upright or flatter--you might find yourself trying to bend a club 5 degrees or more. Snap!

 

Between weighting, weight distribution, and lie angles, I just don't see a DIY approach.

Driver: Titleist TSi3 (Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black RDX 60)
2W: TM Mini Driver
3H: Ping G410 (19 degrees)

4H: Ping G410 (22 degrees)
Irons: Wishon EQ1-NX Single Length 5I-SW (UST Mamiya Recoil 780 ES “S” Flex 86 grams)

LW: Callaway Mack Daddy 4
Putter: Bloodline (center-shafted mallet)
Ball: Titleist ProV1 (2021)

Glove: Bionic Performancegrip Pro

Shoes: Sqairz 20/20

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14 minutes ago, Rich Douglas said:

 

Sure there are. But you can't take a variable length set and DIY into an SL set. 

 

Variable length sets have variable weights in the heads. This is to accommodate the variable length shafts. Thus, a 3-iron head is a lot lighter than is a GW head. When you put in SL shafts, say, at an 8-iron length, you have to remove weight from the 9-GW heads and add weight to the other irons above the 8-iron. If you don't, your swing weights will be off. Adding weight to the low-lofted irons can change their playing characteristics, even if you get it right. How it will change depends on how you add the weight--liquid metal, lead tape, etc.--and where you add it. 

 

In the higher-lofted irons and wedges, you'll need to remove progressively more weight for each club. Same issues here, except its a lot harder to remove sufficient weight to make up for the now-heavier and longer shafts. 

 

The Tommy Armour EQL failed--on a manufacturing level--to get this right in the early 1990s. There is no reason to expect a single tinkerer to succeed where they failed. Single length irons didn't begin to work until manufacturers could make heads that (a) all weighed the same and (b) had varying characteristics to make up for the lack of varying shaft lengths. The low-lofted clubs had to have higher CORs while the high-lofted clubs had to have lower CORs. Plus, the CGs for each club head have to vary to help with launch angles. 

 

Then, when you're all done with that, you still need to adjust lie angles; in a traditional set they can range by as much as 6 or 7 degrees. But if your particular setup needs are different from standard--more upright or flatter--you might find yourself trying to bend a club 5 degrees or more. Snap!

 

Between weighting, weight distribution, and lie angles, I just don't see a DIY approach.

 

 

Very good points across the board.

 

As someone who paid over $1,200 for a set of Cobra SL and couldn't get $500 out of them on the BST, my advice is just blow a little money on a SL long iron (longest one you'll have in your set) and try to hit it.  My experience was that the 4-5-6 were completely unplayable, the 7-8 were solid, and the 9-w-g were about unplayable as well.  But the one thing I couldn't make work were the long irons.

 

They were so bad (for me) on the 5th round I tried to play them i actually called my course and had them order me a set of i500s on about the 8th hole.  

 

I still think they work so well for Bryson because of his one-plane swing, its made to just drop the club in the same spot every time, so having all the irons the same length plays to the advantage of that swing style, making them work for a more "normal" swing will take a lot of practice, dedication, and bad rounds to make it work.  If you are a weaker golfer (couple times a year, 100s shooter) I could see some benefit, or if you're just learning the game and wanted something easier (perfecting a 8i swing vs ones for all clubs) I could see some merit to it as well.

SIM2 - G410 LST - something random - G410 Crossover 20* - i500 5-W (5i 2* strong, 6i 1* strong) - MD 52*, PM 58* & 64* - F22
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