Rory working with Pete Cowen

[kasting333]

2 hours ago, Scotty1140 said:

 

When he missed that short eagle putt on 2 he was done.  I was rooting hard for McIlroy but pretty much knew it was going to be one of those days at that point.

I was thinking about that putt too. Missing a putt like that and then playing flat in just about every major since 

[elwhippy]

Best move Rory has made in ages. Cowen is the short game guru of all gurus. 

[Arn]

[3whacker]

1 hour ago, MattyO1984 said:

 

I wouldn’t wholly agree with you on the route he has taken to get to the point that he is at but I am minded to agree with you in that the focus on what has made his life what it is, has slipped from what it was or should be. I wonder if there are times that he thinks that he should be experience the human condition more than he has before now almost like Duval. He got to World Number 1, won a major and realised that that was it, the fulfilment for him doing that simply was not there and the focus went. That combined with injuries did it for DD. Whilst Rory’s game has not fallen off the way that Duval’s has, there are signs that he perhaps not as invested in his golf game as he perhaps should be and certainly not in the way that he appeared to be in the past. It will be interesting to see if the move to Cowen revives that at all.

I think you hit on an interesting parallel between him and DD....and hate to go there, but both had relationships that went south, even though they may have seemed to recover on the surface, there may be some deep seeded scars that never heal

[80sFredriksson]

5 hours ago, MattyO1984 said:

Funny, it was just a couple of weeks ago that Rory was saying that he didn’t need to make any changes 🤔

That was before the arnold palmer and players right? perhaps did not really realize the ballstriking was off until then

[Ferguson]

1 hour ago, elwhippy said:

Best move Rory has made in ages. Cowen is the short game guru of all gurus. 

 

And Bob Toski, Eddie Merrins, Dave Pelz, E. Fritz Roberts, Harvey Penick - they're all chops.

[80sFredriksson]

Game from tee still is good imo, need to dial in the wedges and putter

[pinhigh27]

1 hour ago, dlygrisse said:

I think his whole game and confidence feed off his ball striking.  When he isn't hitting it solid or with precision it bleeds over and he looses his confidence in the rest of his game.  If he was puring it, my guess is the putting would improve.  Plus when you aren't hitting it good you tend to leave yourself in more awkward spots.  3 feet above the hole is often worse than 6 feet below etc.  These things happen when you aren't on your game.  

 

Stats can be deceiving if you don't know the big picture.  

Think its generally the opposite where the better you hit it the harder it is to maintain good putting stats from a strokes gained perspective. 

 

If you are striping it and hitting it close often, you have to make those or you are losing strokes putting, versus if you constantly have long putts in, you can gain strokes simply by not 3 putting. 

 

Something similar is seen with driving. If you drive it 350 and in the fairway every hole, you are going to have short approaches all day, which makes it more difficult to significantly separate yourself from a strokes gained perspective. If your only goal was to have a good strokes gained approach, that would be easier to do if you have 200 into every green than 130. You have more opportunity to separate yourself.

 

The 3 feet above the hole worse than 6 below has never been shown statistically. 

[MK7Golf21]

3 hours ago, tungstenplug said:

Pete Cowen has an interesting fee structure. From Golf Digest interview:

 

 

 

Gets 4% of the really big checks and 0% of the small checks. Smart guy

 

 

so what I gather from that is he is going to say no to helping guys on tour that don't finish top 10 often

[ej002]

Snap hook on 10 off of Butler Cabin was the end of him.  He started to cry and they had to cut the coverage away. He made a giant number.  He strikes me as the spoiled everyone gets a trophey type of guy, with millions in the bank.   I will tell you all something - he will never be premier until he fixes his attitude. 

[dlygrisse]

6 minutes ago, pinhigh27 said:

Think its generally the opposite where the better you hit it the harder it is to maintain good putting stats from a strokes gained perspective. 

 

If you are striping it and hitting it close often, you have to make those or you are losing strokes putting, versus if you constantly have long putts in, you can gain strokes simply by not 3 putting. 

 

Something similar is seen with driving. If you drive it 350 and in the fairway every hole, you are going to have short approaches all day, which makes it more difficult to significantly separate yourself from a strokes gained perspective. If your only goal was to have a good strokes gained approach, that would be easier to do if you have 200 into every green than 130. You have more opportunity to separate yourself.

 

The 3 feet above the hole worse than 6 below has never been shown statistically. 

Rory isn't doing either well now so.....

To your point, I think it depends on the player.  Johnny Miller stated he had that issue in his prime, he hit it close all day every day and thought he should make everything.  Rory on the other hand seems to feed off his ball striking.  He gets that little bouncy step thing going when he is hitting it well.  When he isn't he whines in his pressers and sulks, his gate totally changes, and his whole game suffers.    

 

This is why Rory isn't Tiger, Tiger would scramble his way to a 70 when his swing was broken and grind it to a strong finish.  Rory just pretty much quits.  

Edited March 23, 2021 by dlygrisse

[Pent08]

Since 2011

Average strokes gained tee to green ranking : top 5

Average strokes gained putting : > top 100

 

*Gets swing coach

Edited March 23, 2021 by Pent08
Grammar

[MattyO1984]

46 minutes ago, 80sFredriksson said:

That was before the arnold palmer and players right? perhaps did not really realize the ballstriking was off until then

 

Seems like a pretty dramatic change in the “team” based on just a couple of poor weeks.

[Maximilian]

I like the sound of this! 

 

Pete is the kind of coach that actually gets down in the bunker and shows you how to do it and doesn’t just tell you how to do it. 😎

[Hawkeye77]

 

 

Speed training, two way miss with driver doesn't seem to have much to do with learning how to hit consistent wedges and putting better.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 23, 2021 by Hawkeye77

[Hawkeye77]

3 minutes ago, Maximilian said:

I like the sound of this! 

 

Pete is the kind of coach that actually gets down in the bunker and shows you how to do it and doesn’t just tell you how to do it. 😎

Haha - I've got Cowen's DVD's and I think they are great.

 

But . . . . his explanation/teaching of hitting bunker shots, all the line drawing, etc. is excruciating.  I've no doubt highly skilled pros can learn and adopt his technique (which is pretty traditional).  Not plugging Monte (okay why not) just pointing out I learned so much more with so much less "noise" from a few minutes in a bunker with Monte and the technique is so much simpler.  The rest of Cowen's stuff was really interesting, and in a pretty basic way, (but pretty wordy) - the bunker part I tuned out and never visited again.

[Ferguson]

Everyone laughed and pointed the stink finger at Tiger when he formally rebuilt his swing 3X but it worked.  Sounds to me like he needs a hard restart.   Perhaps, rebuild his game from the ground up, along with finding some peace in his brain. 

 

[mat562]

1 hour ago, ej002 said:

Snap hook on 10 off of Butler Cabin was the end of him. 

 

I remember that well.

 

It was two months before he won the US Open by a huge margin, the first of his four Majors.

[Hawkeye77]

18 minutes ago, Ferguson said:

Everyone laughed and pointed the stink finger at Tiger when he formally rebuilt his swing 3X but it worked.  Sounds to me like he needs a hard restart.   Perhaps, rebuild his game from the ground up, along with finding some peace in his brain. 

 

Cowen is all about ground up, literally!

[Ferguson]

5 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

Cowen is all about ground up, literally!

 

Interesting. 

[bladehunter]

8 hours ago, Ferguson said:

Seems like an abrupt change?    Wonder if he's meeting with Liz?    

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

About this Liz -    Does she have it ? If so ,  Where did she get it ?  And do we know if it has been verified ? 

[bladehunter]

6 hours ago, tungstenplug said:

Pete Cowen has an interesting fee structure. From Golf Digest interview:

 

 

 

Gets 4% of the really big checks and 0% of the small checks. Smart guy

 

That stance alone builds a players mind up.  He’s thinking “ I’ve hired the most confident coach on earth. He’s actually betting on me to make his salary “.  That’s powerful stuff if you think about it.  I like folks like that.  Get on my team and be in it with me.  Not a leach suckling off me.  Awesome !  

Edited March 23, 2021 by bladehunter

[Jimjam651]

4 hours ago, Superbrit said:

Wonder who the player was, for some reason Jamie Donaldson comes to mind

 

Danny Willet apparently

 

Or so I've heard on the grape vine 🕵️‍♂️

[Londoner]

Pete will sort him.  A few home truths and straight talking Is all Rory needs.

[golfortennis]

6 hours ago, PureStrikes54 said:

Don't know a ton about Cowen's philosophy but pretty sure he teaches a very neutral to slightly left path and Rory played his absolute best golf 6 out and 6 up so the jury is out on this one....

 

He is such a good teacher though hopefully he takes the approach of just maintaining the level of driving, tightening up the short irons and wedges, and slightly improving the putting and Rors should be winning a ton. 

 

Is Cowen a guy who teaches "his swing", or is he a guy that teaches the best swing for you? 

[bladehunter]

9 minutes ago, Londoner said:

Pete will sort him.  A few home truths and straight talking Is all Rory needs.

Yep I agree. And I hope he does.  Rory has the tools. Just 1. Needs a head/mind reset and 2. Someone to show him how to be consistent with putter snd a wedge.  He will be deadly if he figures that out.  

[bladehunter]

6 hours ago, PureStrikes54 said:

Don't know a ton about Cowen's philosophy but pretty sure he teaches a very neutral to slightly left path and Rory played his absolute best golf 6 out and 6 up so the jury is out on this one....

 

He is such a good teacher though hopefully he takes the approach of just maintaining the level of driving, tightening up the short irons and wedges, and slightly improving the putting and Rors should be winning a ton. 

Maybe a dumb question. But I’ll ask. Lol 

 

 

6 out and 6 up.  Are we talking with driver ?  And if so I’m assuming path out and aoa up ?  Or ?  Real question.  I’m curious. 

[Krt22]

3 hours ago, pinhigh27 said:

Think its generally the opposite where the better you hit it the harder it is to maintain good putting stats from a strokes gained perspective. 

 

If you are striping it and hitting it close often, you have to make those or you are losing strokes putting, versus if you constantly have long putts in, you can gain strokes simply by not 3 putting. 

 

Something similar is seen with driving. If you drive it 350 and in the fairway every hole, you are going to have short approaches all day, which makes it more difficult to significantly separate yourself from a strokes gained perspective. If your only goal was to have a good strokes gained approach, that would be easier to do if you have 200 into every green than 130. You have more opportunity to separate yourself.

 

The 3 feet above the hole worse than 6 below has never been shown statistically. 

Im pretty sure the stats say the opposite, the shorter put is almost always easier unless it's a very extreme slope

[PureStrikes54]

16 minutes ago, golfortennis said:

 

Is Cowen a guy who teaches "his swing", or is he a guy that teaches the best swing for you? 

 

From what I've deduced from his videos (this could be entirely different from what he actually teaches his stable of tour pros) I would lean slightly more on a "his swing". He seems to be very focused on loading the body properly, having a neutral path, sequencing properly, and doesn't seem to be a ton of deviation for how this is done. He has said however Rory does all of the "loading" stuff he likes well in spades. Hoping this is more of a "performance manager" relationship where he gets the areas of Rory's game that are extremely lacking and brings them up to a serviceable level while not doing a ton with the actual swing. Will be interesting to see how this unfolds. 

Edited March 23, 2021 by PureStrikes54

[PureStrikes54]

11 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Maybe a dumb question. But I’ll ask. Lol 

 

 

6 out and 6 up.  Are we talking with driver ?  And if so I’m assuming path out and aoa up ?  Or ?  Real question.  I’m curious. 

 

Correct 6 degrees in to out and 6 degrees upward aoa with driver. 

Edited March 23, 2021 by PureStrikes54