AT&T Byron Nelson

[MattyO1984]

The Tour heads to TPC Craig Ranch for the first time in the 67th playing of the AT&T Byron Nelson. Interesting field with some bigger names playing that I seem to recall in years gone by.

 

Defending Champion:-

Sung Kang

 

Field:-

Dustin Johnson

Jon Rahm

Bryson DeChambeau

Brooks Koepka

Jordan Spieth

Hideki Matsuyama

Daniel Berger

Jason Day

Sergio Garcia

Rickie Fowler

Matt Fitzpatrick

Matt Kuchar

Lee Westwood

 

Course:-

TPC Craig Ranch

Par 72

7,468 Yards

 

 

[smashdn]

So they weren't big fans of Trinity Forest I assume?

[farmer]

A friend of my son attended, said it was miserable.  Not in the best part of Dallas, inconvenient, awkward parking and no shade on the entire course.  Hard pass from him about attending again.

[Rory4Pres]

2 minutes ago, farmer said:

A friend of my son attended, said it was miserable.  Not in the best part of Dallas, inconvenient, awkward parking and no shade on the entire course.  Hard pass from him about attending again.

 

Nothing an uber ride, bucket hat and a couple cold beers can't fix...

[DON SVO]

I'm excited to see them at TPC Craig Ranch, should be a good watch.

[3whacker]

I smell the Jerry Jones influence on the change of venue...any sporting event in NTX has to have his blessing or it aint happening

[smturner1203]

Anyone know anything about this course? 

[North Texas]

17 minutes ago, smturner1203 said:

Anyone know anything about this course? 

 

I've probably played it 10 times or so over the years. Just an okay course in my book. Nothing all that memorable about it. At least a good half dozen courses in the DFW area I would rather play. 

[seis]

ESPN reporting that DJ is a scratch with a knee issue

[grm24]

10 minutes ago, seis said:

ESPN reporting that DJ is a scratch with a knee issue

Confirmed.

 

https://golfweek.usatoday.com/2021/05/10/dustin-johnson-knee-discomfort-withdraws-a-t-t-byron-nelson/

 

 

[smashdn]

17 hours ago, North Texas said:

 

I've probably played it 10 times or so over the years. Just an okay course in my book. Nothing all that memorable about it. At least a good half dozen courses in the DFW area I would rather play. 

 

The Tour has to be making a ton more money when they go to the TPC courses.  I don't fault them on that ground but I do fault them for moving tournaments to bland courses when there are better courses in the area.  I would love to have heard the conversation regarding Trinity Forest.  I know the tour guys didn't like it but truthfully I don't care what they like.  They don't like being challenged.

[Christosterone]

47 minutes ago, smashdn said:

 

The Tour has to be making a ton more money when they go to the TPC courses.  I don't fault them on that ground but I do fault them for moving tournaments to bland courses when there are better courses in the area.  I would love to have heard the conversation regarding Trinity Forest.  I know the tour guys didn't like it but truthfully I don't care what they like.  They don't like being challenged.

It’s a cool course…

It’s an exemplar of north texas course sensibilities….slight links homages coupled with live oaks and beautifully Texan views

 

plus the star in frisco is just down the road and awesome to visit…

Reckon it’s the only practice facility in the world worth multiple billions of dollars… very cool place

the north texas style of course may or may not translate to tv but I promise u it’s a blast to play and a great representative of our regional golfing tastes

 

Edited May 11, 2021 by Christosterone

[DavidCrockett]

52 minutes ago, smashdn said:

 

I would love to have heard the conversation regarding Trinity Forest.  I know the tour guys didn't like it but truthfully I don't care what they like.  They don't like being challenged.

Trinity Forest is an awesome course, but very different from the norm.    

 

53 minutes ago, smashdn said:

I don't fault them on that ground but I do fault them for moving tournaments to bland courses when there are better courses in the area

 

The problem is that while there are other courses that would be more suitable for the golf aspect of the event, they can't necessarily handle the event.  Dallas/Ft. Worth has a bunch of REALLY good courses, but they can't handle the galleries, parking, etc.

 

For instance, Maridoe CC is an absolute beast of a course, but it's in a tight part of town and doesn't really have the room to handle a giant golf tournament.

 

Trinity Forest would probably be great if it wasn't in North Texas.  Courses like that work in Scotland or Oregon because it isn't 100 degrees in the summer.  Even during the Byron Nelson in May, it can be pretty hot here.  And if it's not hot, it'll be thunderstorms and hail.  Those are your choices in May - heat or hail.

 

As for the Frisco area, just wait until the PGA HQ is finished out.  I'm pretty sure it's hosting the PGA Championship in a few years and I'm assuming it'll host the Byron Nelson every year.  TPC Craig Ranch is just a placeholder for now.

[Hattie Pants]

2 hours ago, smashdn said:

 

The Tour has to be making a ton more money when they go to the TPC courses.  I don't fault them on that ground but I do fault them for moving tournaments to bland courses when there are better courses in the area.  I would love to have heard the conversation regarding Trinity Forest.  I know the tour guys didn't like it but truthfully I don't care what they like.  They don't like being challenged.

There were several things "wrong" with trinity forest.

 

1. People loved Las Colinas atmosphere, surrounding the course were bars, restaurants, nice part of town. 

2. Trinity Forest is located where if you googled "most dangerous neighborhoods in Dallas", it's right there.

3. There's 1 tree on the course. Not a big issue if its 80 like this week, but that first year when it was 100? Nobody was happy.

4. Then came the monsoon. Come to find out dirt cart paths don't work well after down pours the next year. 

5. The schedule change. Once the pga was moved directly after the Byron 2 things happened., 1 a bunch of big names sat out because that what they do the week before a major and 2, no one wants to play a windswept, prariegrass, links style course the week before the PGA which is usually the exact opposite conditions. 

 

That's all I can think of for now. Craig Ranch will be received much better. Not the social scene of four seasons, but a nice part of town that is easy to get to. A parkland style course with some trees and hills, much more suitable the week before a PGA. Plus, it's 5 minutes from the house 😁, going to be a fun week. 

 

Hope the wind is up, or 78 under might win it. 

[North Texas]

My son is playing in the Pro-am today. Teed off at 6:40. Playing with Tom Lewis and Harris English. Guess the pros only play 9 holes?

 

And our head pro is playing in the tournament itself. Qualified by winning a NTPGA event. 

Edited May 12, 2021 by North Texas

[smashdn]

Thought this was pretty neat regarding the course.  The yardage book.  https://golfweek.usatoday.com/lists/yardage-book-tpc-craig-ranch-att-byron-nelson/

 

Might can figure out some strategy.  On number one I would think most would lay up short of the bunker in the flat spot and have 150ish into the green, though from a more difficult angle than if you were right side of fairway.

[jdl]

 

[Christosterone]

Having played this course so much, I’d bet on a ball striker…

 

grainy greens won’t favor putters as much as the normal tour fare…

think open championship style more than bent runways

 

lots or grainy lag putts…

 

ball striker biased course

 

hunch: sergio

 

-chris

[ryan.pager]

So full disclosure, I am a member out there, and have been there the past 5ish years.

 

The course was setup for the tournament MUCH differently that what was originally expected during the past couple months.

 

Examples,

• The greens normally roll around a 10 (bent grass + summer = death). When they stimped em last week, they were at 11, and the plan was to bring them to a 13-14 for the tournament. In the pro am today, they were running an 11.5, so I'm gonna assume they are cutting them down tonight.
• The rough is normally 3-5 inches thick for members (and has been the last couple years). The PGA Tour literally came in, and mandated that we cut down the rough to *no more* than 2 inches. According to them, "the pros don't like to play out of super thick rough". The second cut is still there, but these guys will never get into that kind of trouble unless they shank it.
• The course was supposed to play Par 70, 7400ish yards. Again, the PGA tour came in and said, no, it needs to be par 72, 7400 yards.....aka birdie fest.
• There is literally no wind this week from what I can tell. Normal wind for us is out of the south, and is usually 15-20mph with gusts to 35mph. This week were gonna see mostly 10-15 tops....nothing for these guys.
• They have left the zoysia fairways longer to reduce roll and make the course feel longer. For example, Spieth hit a driver on hole 5 (par 5), and his shot landed and instantly stopped. That is the driest part of the course usually, and gives the most roll -- nada. If it stays this way, youll see a lot of guys trying to fly it rather than hit low bullets.

For reference, on a 567 yard par 5 (hole 12), I watched Bryson this morning go driver - 8 iron to 2 feet, then tap in the eagle. By my count, he was 9 under after 14 holes. Course record is 61 (Ryan Palmer), and that is in jeopardy this week for sure... I could easily see a 59 out there this week. The course is great, and in great shape -- but this is going to be a joke for them. The only defense is the rough + wind, and both of those are not there this week.

 

If your a gambling person, the winner will be -20+ easy.

 

Just my 2 cents 🤷‍♂️

 

 

 

 

[grm24]

7 hours ago, jdl said:

 

 

Then there is the other side of Monday qualifying.

 

 

 

[North Texas]

They played the Monday qualifier on my home course. Was really interesting to see the hole-by-hole stats compared to how we normally play the same holes. .

[ebrasmus21]

10 hours ago, ryan.pager said:

So full disclosure, I am a member out there, and have been there the past 5ish years.

 

The course was setup for the tournament MUCH differently that what was originally expected during the past couple months.

 

Examples,

• The greens normally roll around a 10 (bent grass + summer = death). When they stimped em last week, they were at 11, and the plan was to bring them to a 13-14 for the tournament. In the pro am today, they were running an 11.5, so I'm gonna assume they are cutting them down tonight.
• The rough is normally 3-5 inches thick for members (and has been the last couple years). The PGA Tour literally came in, and mandated that we cut down the rough to *no more* than 2 inches. According to them, "the pros don't like to play out of super thick rough". The second cut is still there, but these guys will never get into that kind of trouble unless they shank it.
• The course was supposed to play Par 70, 7400ish yards. Again, the PGA tour came in and said, no, it needs to be par 72, 7400 yards.....aka birdie fest.
• There is literally no wind this week from what I can tell. Normal wind for us is out of the south, and is usually 15-20mph with gusts to 35mph. This week were gonna see mostly 10-15 tops....nothing for these guys.
• They have left the zoysia fairways longer to reduce roll and make the course feel longer. For example, Spieth hit a driver on hole 5 (par 5), and his shot landed and instantly stopped. That is the driest part of the course usually, and gives the most roll -- nada. If it stays this way, youll see a lot of guys trying to fly it rather than hit low bullets.

For reference, on a 567 yard par 5 (hole 12), I watched Bryson this morning go driver - 8 iron to 2 feet, then tap in the eagle. By my count, he was 9 under after 14 holes. Course record is 61 (Ryan Palmer), and that is in jeopardy this week for sure... I could easily see a 59 out there this week. The course is great, and in great shape -- but this is going to be a joke for them. The only defense is the rough + wind, and both of those are not there this week.

 

If your a gambling person, the winner will be -20+ easy.

 

Just my 2 cents 🤷‍♂️

 

 

 

 

Good post, thanks for sharing.  

 

So your course normally plays par 70 @ 7400 yards?  Good gravy... 

[ryan.pager]

@ebrasmus21 For the Korn Ferry Tour players / general tournaments yes. The member tees are pretty long (7000ish yds), and is a par 72. You can of course move up, but most of the people Saturday & Sunday mornings play back. Combine that with 15mph winds in your face, and zoysia fairways (no roll), its nutso long.

For reference, I carry my driver 265, and I struggle on some of the par 4's (8, 13, 16, etc). For members they all play over 440yds. I hit more 4-5-6 irons than I would like to admit. Frankly on 13 and 16, I usually go driver -> 7 wood.

[ebrasmus21]

2 minutes ago, ryan.pager said:

@ebrasmus21 For the Korn Ferry Tour players / general tournaments yes. The member tees are pretty long (7000ish yds), and is a par 72. You can of course move up, but most of the people Saturday & Sunday mornings play back. Combine that with 15mph winds in your face, and zoysia fairways (no roll), its nutso long.

For reference, I carry my driver 265, and I struggle on some of the par 4's (8, 13, 16, etc). For members they all play over 440yds. I hit more 4-5-6 irons than I would like to admit. Frankly on 13 and 16, I usually go driver -> 7 wood.

Interesting, sounds like a good test for mere mortals.  At my home course we only have a few par 4s that play over 430 from the tips (par 72 @ 7000 yards).  

[TLUBulldogGolf]

16 hours ago, Christosterone said:

Having played this course so much, I’d bet on a ball striker…

 

grainy greens won’t favor putters as much as the normal tour fare…

think open championship style more than bent runways

 

lots or grainy lag putts…

 

ball striker biased course

 

hunch: sergio

 

-chris

Greens are bentgrass.

 

Also the fairways are zoysia, they shouldn't have anything to complain about condition-wise. 

[QuigleyDU]

Just now, TLUBulldogGolf said:

Greens are bentgrass.

 

Also the fairways are zoysia, they shouldn't have anything to complain about condition-wise. 

Those fairways seem like Velcro.. No roll at all. Makes the course play super simple. They will shred this course. 

[DavidCrockett]

11 hours ago, ryan.pager said:

So full disclosure, I am a member out there, and have been there the past 5ish years.

 

The course was setup for the tournament MUCH differently that what was originally expected during the past couple months.

 

Examples,

• The greens normally roll around a 10 (bent grass + summer = death). When they stimped em last week, they were at 11, and the plan was to bring them to a 13-14 for the tournament. In the pro am today, they were running an 11.5, so I'm gonna assume they are cutting them down tonight.
• The rough is normally 3-5 inches thick for members (and has been the last couple years). The PGA Tour literally came in, and mandated that we cut down the rough to *no more* than 2 inches. According to them, "the pros don't like to play out of super thick rough". The second cut is still there, but these guys will never get into that kind of trouble unless they shank it.
• The course was supposed to play Par 70, 7400ish yards. Again, the PGA tour came in and said, no, it needs to be par 72, 7400 yards.....aka birdie fest.
• There is literally no wind this week from what I can tell. Normal wind for us is out of the south, and is usually 15-20mph with gusts to 35mph. This week were gonna see mostly 10-15 tops....nothing for these guys.
• They have left the zoysia fairways longer to reduce roll and make the course feel longer. For example, Spieth hit a driver on hole 5 (par 5), and his shot landed and instantly stopped. That is the driest part of the course usually, and gives the most roll -- nada. If it stays this way, youll see a lot of guys trying to fly it rather than hit low bullets.

For reference, on a 567 yard par 5 (hole 12), I watched Bryson this morning go driver - 8 iron to 2 feet, then tap in the eagle. By my count, he was 9 under after 14 holes. Course record is 61 (Ryan Palmer), and that is in jeopardy this week for sure... I could easily see a 59 out there this week. The course is great, and in great shape -- but this is going to be a joke for them. The only defense is the rough + wind, and both of those are not there this week.

 

If your a gambling person, the winner will be -20+ easy.

 

Just my 2 cents 🤷‍♂️

 

 

 

 

 

That's a pretty good update.  Thank you for that.  7400yd, par 72, and cut down rough?  With the rain over the weekend, it'll just be that much more soft and receptive, and they weren't going to get rollout in the fairways anyway.  They are going to demolish that course.  

 

I don't like it when they do that as it diminishes the stature of the course, and this is the first look at Craig Ranch for a lot of people.  There's nothing easy about that course (as you mentioned, the yardage + the wind can make it brutal), but it'll look like a joke if everybody's -20.

[QuigleyDU]

11 hours ago, ryan.pager said:

So full disclosure, I am a member out there, and have been there the past 5ish years.

 

The course was setup for the tournament MUCH differently that what was originally expected during the past couple months.

 

Examples,

• The greens normally roll around a 10 (bent grass + summer = death). When they stimped em last week, they were at 11, and the plan was to bring them to a 13-14 for the tournament. In the pro am today, they were running an 11.5, so I'm gonna assume they are cutting them down tonight.
• The rough is normally 3-5 inches thick for members (and has been the last couple years). The PGA Tour literally came in, and mandated that we cut down the rough to *no more* than 2 inches. According to them, "the pros don't like to play out of super thick rough". The second cut is still there, but these guys will never get into that kind of trouble unless they shank it.
• The course was supposed to play Par 70, 7400ish yards. Again, the PGA tour came in and said, no, it needs to be par 72, 7400 yards.....aka birdie fest.
• There is literally no wind this week from what I can tell. Normal wind for us is out of the south, and is usually 15-20mph with gusts to 35mph. This week were gonna see mostly 10-15 tops....nothing for these guys.
• They have left the zoysia fairways longer to reduce roll and make the course feel longer. For example, Spieth hit a driver on hole 5 (par 5), and his shot landed and instantly stopped. That is the driest part of the course usually, and gives the most roll -- nada. If it stays this way, youll see a lot of guys trying to fly it rather than hit low bullets.

For reference, on a 567 yard par 5 (hole 12), I watched Bryson this morning go driver - 8 iron to 2 feet, then tap in the eagle. By my count, he was 9 under after 14 holes. Course record is 61 (Ryan Palmer), and that is in jeopardy this week for sure... I could easily see a 59 out there this week. The course is great, and in great shape -- but this is going to be a joke for them. The only defense is the rough + wind, and both of those are not there this week.

 

If your a gambling person, the winner will be -20+ easy.

 

Just my 2 cents 🤷‍♂️

 

 

 

 

The PGA tour really does wreck course set up and mute excitement because pampered pro cant be bothered with actually playing golf.. 

[Christosterone]

3 minutes ago, TLUBulldogGolf said:

Greens are bentgrass.

 

Also the fairways are zoysia, they shouldn't have anything to complain about condition-wise. 

Agreed…

 

im not a gambler but I think sergio wins…ball strikers paradise…

at least in my experience

 

-chris 

[TLUBulldogGolf]

8 minutes ago, QuigleyDU said:

Those fairways seem like Velcro.. No roll at all. Makes the course play super simple. They will shred this course. 

 

I can't imagine a better grass to play from. Lack of roll has never really been a big issue for them, looks like a little more wind over the weekend, today looks to be the best day for scoring.

Edited May 13, 2021 by TLUBulldogGolf