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With the Byron recently at -25, lots of beef about the scoring and being a terrible venue. For those of you that don’t like it, fill me in, what’s your issue with it? If they played it as a par 71 or 70 and the same golfers hit the same shots on the same holes but the winning score was 10-12 under do we still have an issue? Is it some sort of complex where people want to see pros struggling instead of making birdies? 

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It's the new normal. People hate everything and everyone now. I even hate this thread. And this keyboard. And I really hate the landscape people with all of the leaf blowers at 6 am. I really hate the

On a course where the scoring is extremely low, it's safe to say bad shots aren't being penalized much. People can get away with par from anywhere, which brings more players into the mix   T

Par is an artificial number.  tourneys are won by the person taking the fewest strokes. Not being the farthest under par!

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4 hours ago, Hattie Pants said:

With the Byron recently at -25, lots of beef about the scoring and being a terrible venue. For those of you that don’t like it, fill me in, what’s your issue with it? If they played it as a par 71 or 70 and the same golfers hit the same shots on the same holes but the winning score was 10-12 under do we still have an issue? Is it some sort of complex where people want to see pros struggling instead of making birdies? 

Because golf is really hard and most of us struggle with it fairly regularly. So it’s nice to see the best in the world struggle a little as well. The ol’ misery loves company scenario. 😂 

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4 minutes ago, TiScape said:

Because golf is really hard and most of us struggle with it fairly regularly. So it’s nice to see the best in the world struggle a little as well. The ol’ misery loves company scenario. 😂 

That was my #1 thought. Thanks 😎

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4 hours ago, Hattie Pants said:

With the Byron recently at -25, lots of beef about the scoring and being a terrible venue. For those of you that don’t like it, fill me in, what’s your issue with it? If they played it as a par 71 or 70 and the same golfers hit the same shots on the same holes but the winning score was 10-12 under do we still have an issue? Is it some sort of complex where people want to see pros struggling instead of making birdies? 

why is is a "struggle"? ... if score doesn't matter, then why does a harder course with more 'struggles' matter? ... "complex"? ... part of golf is the mindset of the player ... we want to see pros tested ... checking your ego is part of the test ... most pros want to be edgy/modern by saying short par threes are more interesting ... bull ... a 240 yd par three into the wind is plenty interesting ... why is it a 'struggle' to play for a 3/accept 4 instead of playing for a 2/accept 3? ... it's all the same in the end, no? ... 

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11 minutes ago, tiderider said:

why is is a "struggle"? ... if score doesn't matter, then why does a harder course with more 'struggles' matter? ... "complex"? ... part of golf is the mindset of the player ... we want to see pros tested ... checking your ego is part of the test ... most pros want to be edgy/modern by saying short par threes are more interesting ... bull ... a 240 yd par three into the wind is plenty interesting ... why is it a 'struggle' to play for a 3/accept 4 instead of playing for a 2/accept 3? ... it's all the same in the end, no? ... 

it’s a struggle because what people want to see essentially is losing control of the golf ball. Whether that be deep rough, super fast greens, whatever, the only thing that these guys can’t handle are conditions where they can’t control the outcome with a high degree of certainty. The skill of the game is watching the incredible control these guys have over their ball, I don’t want to watch them chop it around like the morning 8:30 group at a local course. The “complex” is that I think most people suck at golf, to some degree resent being able to control a golf ball like that, and therefore would rather watch these guys hack it around instead of displaying their skill. 

 

 

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Just now, Hattie Pants said:

it’s a struggle because what people want to see essentially is losing control of the golf ball. Whether that be deep rough, super fast greens, whatever, the only thing that these guys can’t handle are conditions where they can’t control the outcome with a high degree of certainty. The skill of the game is watching the incredible control these guys have over their ball, I don’t want to watch them chop it around like the morning 8:30 group at a local course. The “complex” is that I think most people suck at golf, to some degree resent being able to control a golf ball like that, and therefore would rather watch these guys hack it around instead of displaying their skill. 

 

 

yeah, that's true, but having 'control' means you can have control of a 200 short to the front of the green, and control on the chip/pitch shot ... and, of course, control of ego, philosophically speaking ... and since they can have control, but accept a higher score, what's wrong with that alternative, esp since par doesn't matter? only "low score" ... 

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43 minutes ago, TiScape said:

Because golf is really hard and most of us struggle with it fairly regularly. So it’s nice to see the best in the world struggle a little as well. The ol’ misery loves company scenario. 😂 

Which is why I love watching the US Open.

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Just now, golfortennis said:

 

But it's only "easy" because of the par designation.  Call it a par 66, is it still an easy course?

Not about the course typically, more about the set up. But yes if par was 66 and the greens and fairways were soft and pins accessible I would still find the golf less interesting.

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7 minutes ago, tiderider said:

yeah, that's true, but having 'control' means you can have control of a 200 short to the front of the green, and control on the chip/pitch shot ... and, of course, control of ego, philosophically speaking ... and since they can have control, but accept a higher score, what's wrong with that alternative, esp since par doesn't matter? only "low score" ... 

That’s kinda my point, and why I asked the question if the same players hit the same shots on a par 70 this weekend, everyone would just be cool?  Because the winning score would be less than half of what it was?   

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1 minute ago, Hattie Pants said:

That’s kinda my point, and why I asked the question if the same players hit the same shots on a par 70 this weekend, everyone would just be cool?  Because the winning score would be less than half of what it was?   

Which is really what happens. At least one post mentioned the US Open scenario as what they like. But almost every US Open it seems has at least one hole, sometimes two, designated a par 4 instead of par 5.  Or even designate a short par 4 a par 3. So there go 8-12 shots from the under par designation. It seems no one looks at total score, just plus or minus to par.

  If the USGA decided to call an Open course a par 74 heads would explode with all the “scoring records” being set.

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For me it increases the cases of random winners on tour.  
 

as in , the harder the course , the more often you get the cream at the top .  Not to mention you get a few people close to each other.     A easy course usually has one runaway guy who’s hot , and a bunch trying to keep up by playing Uber aggressively , which almost always leads to a big number eventually.  

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1 hour ago, Hattie Pants said:

it’s a struggle because what people want to see essentially is losing control of the golf ball. Whether that be deep rough, super fast greens, whatever, the only thing that these guys can’t handle are conditions where they can’t control the outcome with a high degree of certainty. The skill of the game is watching the incredible control these guys have over their ball, I don’t want to watch them chop it around like the morning 8:30 group at a local course. The “complex” is that I think most people suck at golf, to some degree resent being able to control a golf ball like that, and therefore would rather watch these guys hack it around instead of displaying their skill. 

 

 

It’s the opposite. We want to see the best control it on a hard course.  Not 5 guys we rarely hear from control it on an easy course.  

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People are obsessed with par and sometimes forget the lowest total number of shots is what wins. If you turn a par 72 into 70 by converting 2 of the shortest par 5's into 4's... suddenly your score to par is lower.. yet... total shots taken is no different. Also, a lot of that rough looked like half the muni courses fairways around here. Not a very punishing course with soft greens with the best in the world playing it... what do you expect?

 

I feel there are bigger fish to fry here.

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2 hours ago, TiScape said:

Because golf is really hard and most of us struggle with it fairly regularly. So it’s nice to see the best in the world struggle a little as well. The ol’ misery loves company scenario. 😂 

 

Most people can't fathom shooting 65 for four days straight. I include myself in that.

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7 hours ago, Hattie Pants said:

With the Byron recently at -25, lots of beef about the scoring and being a terrible venue. For those of you that don’t like it, fill me in, what’s your issue with it? If they played it as a par 71 or 70 and the same golfers hit the same shots on the same holes but the winning score was 10-12 under do we still have an issue? Is it some sort of complex where people want to see pros struggling instead of making birdies? 

 

birdie fest at the Byron was unusual.  No wind, soft conditions, lift clean & place made the course vulnerable, cut was at -6.  

 

I like winning scores around -12.  Best courses are those where any hole is birdieable, or with spots where one can make triple.  TPC Sawgrass comes to mind.   Also, the PGA of America does a good job at this. Their major is a fair test, hard course setups but playable.  Always provides exciting drama like the Masters.   Cannot say the same thing about the USGA. 

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Yep, low score wins.

I think what we are seeing here are 1/2 the posters like the low score outcome, and the other 1/2 would like to watch pro’s in challenging situation more often.

For me it comes down to being the viewer. If its fairway, wedge all day I’ll go to the range rather than watch that. Sure they are good shots, but boring to watch. Those guys are just having a shootout for cash when the winner is -26 and the mid-field -19.

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9 hours ago, Hattie Pants said:

With the Byron recently at -25, lots of beef about the scoring and being a terrible venue. For those of you that don’t like it, fill me in, what’s your issue with it? If they played it as a par 71 or 70 and the same golfers hit the same shots on the same holes but the winning score was 10-12 under do we still have an issue? Is it some sort of complex where people want to see pros struggling instead of making birdies? 

Many people just want to complain about something even if it doesn't really bother them. That line of thinking seems to be happening here much more often. People here are supposedly fans of golf and love it yet there is so much continual negativity about it. Guess that's the world we currently live in. 

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