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Torrey South ready for the U.S. Open


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Posted (edited)

Greens are running. Rough isn't as bad as the Farmers traditionally is. Fairways are baked; you'll see some monster drives. Grounds crew says -3 is winning. I said -7, and have my money in June. 

 

Edited by Hack Daddy
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Titleist84 said:

I hope Phil can pull it off

It would be awesome if he did but he does not play that track well especially after the redo. Rahm is the favorite and it isn't a surprise. Torrey seems to always have repeat guys who play not well outside of the few flyers.

Edited by MUNIGRIT
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This is something that I never thought I would say but if they can get the conditions at Torrey similar to the the way they were at Kiawah that would be just great in my book.

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1 hour ago, MattyO1984 said:

This is something that I never thought I would say but if they can get the conditions at Torrey similar to the the way they were at Kiawah that would be just great in my book.

Are you saying that the PGA does the US Open better than the US Open? 

 

If so, I would agree.  Ever since Quail Hollow in 2017, IMO, the PGA of America has been tracking in the right direction with their tournament set-ups.  Along with QH2017, Bethpage (2019) and this year's tournament were especially encouraging. 

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Looking forward to watching the players hack it out of that rough. My wrists still hurt from the last time I played there a week after the Farmers and that was 5 years ago. Curious to see how the Farmers Open rough compares to the U.S. Open rough.

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1 hour ago, Vinnieluvv said:

Looking forward to watching the players hack it out of that rough. My wrists still hurt from the last time I played there a week after the Farmers and that was 5 years ago. Curious to see how the Farmers Open rough compares to the U.S. Open rough.

its been a relatively dry year here in SoCal and having lived in SD before I dont think they will get the rough they would like for the US Open, but I think they will get the greens the speed they wish...Then it all come down to what off shore breeze and June gloom overcast they get, if it blows the scores will be high, if not they may eat the course up

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Did I hear something?  Oh yeah, it's the start of the chants for Phil to win.  San Diego raised PM finally get's the grand slam.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Golf10 said:

 

Amen.  As a muni and a normal tour course I love it.  For a US Open it's disappointing.  Part of the lure of the US Open is the iconic venues.

 

I agree, great course for a tour event. 

For US Open, love the rotation of the iconic venues.  Haven't seen one recently at Baltusrol or Hazeltine.  

Would like to see a return to Cherry Hills and Inverness. 

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1 hour ago, MUNIGRIT said:

Torrey played great as a USO course last time. Why do you guys hate it?

 

Oh I don't hate Torrey at all.  It's a great municipal course, one of the best in the country.  It also plays great every year in the regular tour event.  I just don't like a US Open there.  Admittedly I'm old school but I like my Opens at great classic tracks like Oakmont, Shinnecock, Pebble, etc.  Hell I'm stoked for it to be at LACC in a couple years - a great George Thomas track. 

 

I don't think it played as a great Open in 2008.  It reminded me of the Buick Open where Tiger came back to win.  Other than that it was not compelling at all...for me.  Again, everyone is different.  Yes, I'm looking forward to the Open as I love the competition.  It's just not as good as it could be at a great course.

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2 hours ago, Ichiro said:

 

I agree, great course for a tour event. 

For US Open, love the rotation of the iconic venues.  Haven't seen one recently at Baltusrol or Hazeltine.  

Would like to see a return to Cherry Hills and Inverness. 

 

All of those are great courses Ichiro.  It's tough for them to get an Open now because the USGA is going to more of a rota like the Open Championship.  My thoughts on these:

 

- Baltusrol - on the schedule for 2029 PGA.  Currently in bed with the PGA.  Hanse did an excellent Tillinghast restoration there

- Hazeltine - I think Oakland Hills and Erin Hills in the midwest will get one before Hazeltine.  Had a PGA/Ryder Cup not long ago

- Cherry Hills - Great track that some people say is now too short at its altitude

- Inverness - Could see them getting one but when?  Andrew Green did great work there

  • 2021 U.S. Open: June 17-20, Torrey Pines Golf Course, San Diego, Calif.
  • 2022 U.S. Open: June 16-19, The Country Club, Brookline, Mass.
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On 5/29/2021 at 4:33 AM, straightshot7 said:


as someone who lives in San Diego I couldn’t disagree more.

 

I don’t even get the resident rate at Torrey, but when I have played it, the conditions have been good.

 

most people I know do not even like the Crossings. 


it’s not a championship level course, nor does it have views like Torrey.
 

the two courses are not even comparable.

 

Also just my opinion and their opinions though. 

They view of what...many of us have seen the ocean before and the course isn't as scenic from a tee box view as it is made out to be like it is from the perspective of a paraglider flying out over the ocean looking back at the course where you can then see the cliffs and such. That is why that area is flooded with paragliders because it is beautiful looking back at the course from flying out over the ocean. TP as a whole is also not very well conditioned unless the pros are on the way.  The bunkers and greens were in good condition but the driving range was crap. 

 

The third hole  for instance, the view from the tee box: 

Torrey Pines South Hole 3 : golf

 

View looking back at the hole from a paraglider's perspective

Torrey Pines (South) | Courses | Golf Digest

 

Number 4 from the tee box

Makeover mulligan: The 4th at Torrey Pines South - The Fried Egg

 

Number 4 from a paraglider's perspective

2019 Torrey Pines South Course Rehab | Parks & Recreation | City of San  Diego Official Website

 

You can't see any depth of this from the tee on these two for some reason "iconic" holes.  From the tee box 3 and 4 are rather basic golf holes as with pretty much all of the holes on the course. It cost $350 dollars to book a tee time in advance on TP and $250 if you do the get there at 3 a.m. dance like my group did  and it was in no way worth it other than I played with some great people.  I played the Crossings at Carlsbad first and was thinking that it was as good as it was then TP would be off the charts....I wished I had reversed the order that I played them as TP was a let down.  

 

The Crossing at Carlsbad is inside of a nature preserve and this is one of the many great holes viewed from the tee box. The photo doesn't even do justice to how high up this tee shot is as it is from a forward tee box. 

The Crossings at Carlsbad Golf Course Review and Photos - Golf Top 18

 

You are playing through the verticality at Crossings at Carlsbad this isn't true on TP

The Crossings at Carlsbad - 2021 All You Need to Know BEFORE You Go | Tours  & Tickets (with Photos) - Tripadvisor

 

No photo description available.

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Personally if it is a little drier and they are unable to irrigate enough to get a dense thick rough that US Opens are famous for, it might actually challenge players more tbh. That thin, wispy, wiry rough that allows players to get a club on the ball and hit shots into greens is a challenge too and a total change in mindset. Actually giving players the option to hit into greens when a drive finds the rough instead of just hacking it out to the fairway and a number prevents a wedge/putting fest in my opinion and allows more players to shine if they are on their game. Should you be rewarded for hitting it miles off the fairway? No and I am not advocating for a reward or no penalty but you should at least be able to advance the ball to around the green IF you hit a great shot. Not just be forced to layup. In my opinion...of course I worked a club that forced that so it is what it is. 

 

Granted HDaddys post was Thursday and three weeks out from the first round of the 2021 US Open so there is plenty of time to grow grass especially roughs. Ill assume that you played the course to post those insights, which is directly contrary to one full time tour caddies assertions that courses close months in advance to host events (paraphrasing) but they don't heck we allowed member play up until the Sunday, we stopped members tee times at 1 the Sunday of US Open week. 

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Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, Righty to Lefty said:

They view of what...many of us have seen the ocean before and the course isn't as scenic from a tee box view as it is made out to be like it is from the perspective of a paraglider flying out over the ocean looking back at the course where you can then see the cliffs and such. That is why that area is flooded with paragliders because it is beautiful looking back at the course from flying out over the ocean. TP as a whole is also not very well conditioned unless the pros are on the way.  The bunkers and greens were in good condition but the driving range was crap. 

 

The third hole  for instance, the view from the tee box: 

Torrey Pines South Hole 3 : golf

 

View looking back at the hole from a paraglider's perspective

Torrey Pines (South) | Courses | Golf Digest

 

Number 4 from the tee box

Makeover mulligan: The 4th at Torrey Pines South - The Fried Egg

 

Number 4 from a paraglider's perspective

2019 Torrey Pines South Course Rehab | Parks & Recreation | City of San  Diego Official Website

 

You can't see any depth of this from the tee on these two for some reason "iconic" holes.  From the tee box 3 and 4 are rather basic golf holes as with pretty much all of the holes on the course. It cost $350 dollars to book a tee time in advance on TP and $250 if you do the get there at 3 a.m. dance like my group did  and it was in no way worth it other than I played with some great people.  I played the Crossings at Carlsbad first and was thinking that it was as good as it was then TP would be off the charts....I wished I had reversed the order that I played them as TP was a let down.  

 

The Crossing at Carlsbad is inside of a nature preserve and this is one of the many great holes viewed from the tee box. The photo doesn't even do justice to how high up this tee shot is as it is from a forward tee box. 

The Crossings at Carlsbad Golf Course Review and Photos - Golf Top 18

 

You are playing through the verticality at Crossings at Carlsbad this isn't true on TP

The Crossings at Carlsbad - 2021 All You Need to Know BEFORE You Go | Tours  & Tickets (with Photos) - Tripadvisor

 

No photo description available.


"Many of us have seen the ocean"...

 

Many of us have also seen canyons and roads. I will take ocean views over views of Palomar Airport Road and canyons. Many, many courses throughout Southern California have verticality and canyon views like that. It's really not that unique. I would prefer both the nearby Arrowood and Golf Club of California in Fallbrook. Both have verticality and lots of canyon views. 

 

I agree the range at Torrey sucks and it is expensive for non-residents. But that doesn't make it a worse golf course than the Crossings. 

 

Torrey, to me, feels like a great course that is a difficult, but fair test of your game. It isn't gimmicky. It's a classic. Not new age, with no rough in some places so your ball can just roll 50 yards and into a hazard (e.g. the Crossings).

 

If all you care about is views and verticality than there are also several spectacular parks you can visit near San Diego for free: Sunset Cliffs natural park, Bay view park, Cabrillo national monument, Mount Soledad, and many others. 

 

If you prefer the Crossings, that's cool. But I don't think you will find it on many lists of top courses in San Diego. Most would choose Maderas, Torrey, La Costa, Aviara and many others over the Crossings, not even counting private courses.
 

https://www.golfdigest.com/gallery/where-to-play-golf-in-san-diego

 

Maybe you would prefer the North Course at Torrey. The par 3, 15th hole has a lot of verticality:

 

spacer.png

 

spacer.png
 

Edited by straightshot7
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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, straightshot7 said:


"Many of us have seen the ocean"...

 

Many of us have also seen canyons and roads. I will take ocean views over views of Palomar Airport Road and canyons. Many, many courses throughout Southern California have verticality and canyon views like that. It's really not that unique. I would prefer both the nearby Arrowood and Golf Club of California in Fallbrook. Both have verticality and lots of canyon views. 

 

I agree the range at Torrey sucks and it is expensive for non-residents. But that doesn't make it a worse golf course than the Crossings. 

 

Torrey, to me, feels like a great course that is a difficult, but fair test of your game. It isn't gimmicky. It's a classic. Not new age, with no rough in some places so your ball can just roll 50 yards and into a hazard (e.g. the Crossings).

 

If all you care about is views and verticality than there are also several spectacular parks you can visit near San Diego for free: Sunset Cliffs natural park, Bay view park, Cabrillo national monument, Mount Soledad, and many others. 

 

If you prefer the Crossings, that's cool. But I don't think you will find it on many lists of top courses in San Diego. Most would choose Maderas, Torrey, La Costa, Aviara and many others over the Crossings, not even counting private courses.
 

https://www.golfdigest.com/gallery/where-to-play-golf-in-san-diego

 

Maybe you would prefer the North Course at Torrey. The par 3, 15th hole has a lot of verticality:

 

spacer.png

 

spacer.png
 

Maybe the North course is better but I was only going to get to play one round out  there and so of course I wanted to play the mythical South course and in my opinion the Crossings at Carlsbad blew away TP by a long shot.  If the Crossings at Carlsbad was placed near the coast in place of TP it would be hosting the US Open and I would have gladly ponied up $250 to play it because it is a better use of the topography of the land.  There is not one hole on the South course that we pulled up to and I thought "holy sh^t" look at this hole.  They are all very basic and straight forward.  If you put the South course in say Temecula it would have no such acclaim that it is given in my opinion.  I didn't say that there aren't better courses in that area as I'm sure that there are but TP is not a great course in my opinion.

Edited by Righty to Lefty
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On 5/28/2021 at 2:22 AM, Righty to Lefty said:

I don't understand the attraction with Torrey other than it's location in relation to the coast because other than that it isn't a great golf course at all in my opinion.  It is a muni and after playing it once I understand why locals can play it for $65 and even that might be a stretch because it just isn't a great course at all.  The Crossing at Carlsbad is nearby and a way better course because the verticality is felt on the course whereas on Torrey it isn't except for the par 5 that dips down and then back up  to the hole.  The course conditions are also subpar unless the pros are about to play it. I of course will be watching as I just love golf but Kiawah is on a different planet when being compared to Torrey.  

 

On 5/28/2021 at 2:07 PM, Golf10 said:

 

Amen.  As a muni and a normal tour course I love it.  For a US Open it's disappointing.  Part of the lure of the US Open is the iconic venues.

 

I tend to agree.  I played Torrey Pines South a couple years ago and it was a good course but not great.  As a sea side course it certainly doesn't hold a candle to Pebble Beach Golf Links (played that in the late 90s) as a tour course or US Open venue.  As a municipal course it is certainly worth playing at non-resident fees once but not more than that.  I would prefer Torrey Pines South be removed from the US Open rota and other worthy courses added in its place.

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21 hours ago, 3whacker said:

the Crossings at Carlsbad is 6835 yards and slopes at 132....hardly up to Tour Standards, let alone to host a USGA event

Merion is the same yardage as the Crossings at Carlsbad but slope rates at 149 so course length isn't the main predictor of difficulty. Do you think that Pros care what course they play on as long as it is conditioned well and they are writing checks...and more so writing checks.  Torrey Pines is muni...lets not forget so I'm sure if the PGA needed to set up the Crossings at Carlsbad, or any course for that matter, they could do it if need be.  That also has no bearing on the fact that I think that Torrey is not a great course.   

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I've never played Torrey, but I agree that even on TV I don't really get that wow factor that I get from a lot of the other US Open courses (Oakmont, Shinnecock, Merion, and etc.). To be honest I think if Tiger hadn't won there in '08 with the broken leg they wouldn't even be going back this year. That was the only reason 

 

I also don't really get the whole "it's a muni so it's the everyman's course" hoopla. Bethpage and Pinehurst aside, I think a US Open should be played at a place that would be a once in a lifetime type of opportunity if you get the chance to play it. If all I have to do is pony up $200 to be able to play then it's not really that special in my mind. 

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, Abh159 said:

I've never played Torrey, but I agree that even on TV I don't really get that wow factor that I get from a lot of the other US Open courses (Oakmont, Shinnecock, Merion, and etc.). To be honest I think if Tiger hadn't won there in '08 with the broken leg they wouldn't even be going back this year. That was the only reason 

 

I also don't really get the whole "it's a muni so it's the everyman's course" hoopla. Bethpage and Pinehurst aside, I think a US Open should be played at a place that would be a once in a lifetime type of opportunity if you get the chance to play it. If all I have to do is pony up $200 to be able to play then it's not really that special in my mind. 

There is no wow factor to the actual South course at all and only two holes have a view of the ocean and none of the holes interact with it like they do on Pebble Beach. And you get to show up at 3 or 4 a.m. to get a tee time hopefully before noon and pay $250 bucks or $350 in advance and the course simply isn't worth anywhere close to that.  Bethpage, Pinehurst, and Kiawah are on a different planet when compared to TP in my opinion.  Even if I was a local I wouldn't play it very often as I'm sure there are way better courses in the area.  

Edited by Righty to Lefty
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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, Righty to Lefty said:

There is no wow factor to the actual South course at all and only two holes have a view of the ocean and none of the holes interact with it like they do on Pebble Beach. And you get to show up at 3 or 4 a.m. to get a tee time hopefully before noon and play $250 bucks or $350 in advance and the course simply isn't worth anywhere close to that.  Bethpage, Pinehurst, and Kiawah are on a different planet when compared to TP in my opinion.  Even if I was a local I wouldn't play it very often as I'm sure there are way better courses in the area.  


And you’d be wrong 

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I've played Torrey and i agree it's not a "spectacular" course in a lot of ways. You don't drive up to it in awe of the setting. @Righty to Lefty is also correct that the views you always see from above are not what you see playing the course. Hole #4 is a great example, you dont really feel like you are on the ocean, it's further away than the pictures look.

 

Torrey is a US open course because it's long from the tips and they have no problem growing the rough there and getting the greens to play fast.

 

Walk through the gates at Whistling Straights and it's like a surreal sight, like a different planet. That's an iconic course, type setting.

 

If the rough isn't long, i could see -7 to -10 winning it easily

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