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Srixon Z585s to Apex 21s -- V sole issue?


Elee913
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Late last season I made an impulse switch from some Callaway Big Bertha 19s to the Z585s.  I had actually been hitting the Big Berthas well, but my handicap dropped from the high teens to low double digits, and I wanted a lower profile iron.  I was hitting the Z585s in a store and they had a barely used set they were offering a great deal on, so I pounced without really testing out other clubs.  I know, I know.  I should have tested more, but I got such a good deal that I don't think I'll lose much on the resale.

 

But now I'm regretting the decision because I just haven't hit the Z585s well on the course.  I have a huge tendency to hit the Z585s thin, something I have not experienced in the past with my irons (in fact, irons have always been my strong suit).  I have a shallow swing (rarely take a divot), and I've been reading about how the V-soles might lead to thin strikes.  Has anyone else experienced this issue with their Srixons?  I would say I hit my irons thin almost 1/3-1/2 of the time, which is way too much.  

 

I did try the Apex 21s in a store the other day, and I found that I was really striping these clubs very consistently, and longer than my Z585s.  I know the lofts are slightly lower (30.5 vs. 31), but the consistency of the strike for the Apex 21s were so much better, with very few thin strikes (albeit on a mat, not yet on grass).  And I loved the feel relative to my Z585s (although it might be in large part due to the cleaner strikes).

 

Does this make sense with respect to the V-soles leading to more thin strikes?  I know there is a huge debate in the forum on the relative love for Srixons Z series irons vs. the Apex.  But at this point, I'm almost ready to go back to my Ping G15s with the thin strikes on my Z585s.

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I think people are too quick to think the V Sole makes a big difference in contact. It definitely looks different, but in play the difference should be subtle even on the 5 series. If you just forget they're there and hit your shot you probably won't notice much of a difference from just the sole. Maybe it gets in your head a little bit. 

 

Have you checked the length of your shafts to make sure they're standard or the right length for you? 

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Callaway Mavrik Max 3+

Callaway Rogue 4 wood

Srixon ZU85 4/23

Srixon Z565 w/ Matrix Ozik F15 shafts 5-PW

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43 minutes ago, me05501 said:

I think people are too quick to think the V Sole makes a big difference in contact. It definitely looks different, but in play the difference should be subtle even on the 5 series. If you just forget they're there and hit your shot you probably won't notice much of a difference from just the sole. Maybe it gets in your head a little bit. 

 

Have you checked the length of your shafts to make sure they're standard or the right length for you? 

I for one will respectfully disagree about the V Sole contact.  Played 785's for a couple of years  and when the new model Srixon's came out I tried the 5's.  Contact was not good and most of the time were thinned shots.  I have since gone to the 7's, and the thinned shots are gone, much crisper contact.

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Tour Edge Exotics, EXS 220, 21*, Ventus 4T 6S or Ping G425 19* hybrid Tensei Orange

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What Color dot on the G15? Trusty G5 red dot were a favourite,so the Cally BB replaced the G15?Srixons are not a G15 replacement,eg Ap2,T200,hope this helps.

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41 minutes ago, dalillama47 said:

I for one will respectfully disagree about the V Sole contact.  Played 785's for a couple of years  and when the new model Srixon's came out I tried the 5's.  Contact was not good and most of the time were thinned shots.  I have since gone to the 7's, and the thinned shots are gone, much crisper contact.

 

Good to know. I have played Z765s, Z785's and have a few Z585 long irons. The soles have never been an issue for me, but I've never had the 5-series in anything shorter than a 6 iron. 

Callaway Big Bertha 21 9* w/ HZRDUS Yellow 6.0

Callaway Mavrik Max 3+

Callaway Rogue 4 wood

Srixon ZU85 4/23

Srixon Z565 w/ Matrix Ozik F15 shafts 5-PW

Srixon Z785 AW

Cleveland RTX4 54* and 58*

Cleveland Huntington Beach #11S

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The V soles can have a huge impact on your quality of contact and this has been brought up in threads over the years. You either love them or hate them and I highly recommend anyone buying Srixon irons demo them on grass first. I am a digger and can take a healthy size divot with my short irons and wedges. Can even take a tiny one with my 3 wood If I'm really trying to trap it.  I had a set of 785s earlier this year and never got along with them. You would think the profile would fit me to a tee but the turf interaction was very poor. The contact was more often then not a hair thin and slightly below the sweet spot. I did a range test and alternated between a set of bridgestones, the 785s and a demo PTX Pro. I had no problem middling the other two clubs but the 785 was always just below center. The 785s performed better off mats than actual grass in my case. I sold the 785s for a slight loss and am looking and getting a set of Hogans. The Hogans also have a V sole but the v is closer to the leading edge while the Srixon is more in the middle and I believe this makes a huge difference. The Hogans I felt like I could pound down on the ball and the club would move through the turf like a plow. Probably the best clubs I've ever tried for turf interaction.

 

Callaway Irons are usually on the higher bounce side of the spectrum and I'm also a fan their turf interaction as well fwiw.

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Posted (edited)

I have played the 45, 65, and 85's and now a split set of 4,5,7's.   I take a deep divot, my last club was a Srixon club(The Srixon PGA Tour Rep was a member) and I played with piles of people from super shallow to super steep from barely grass moving to huge divots.  No one had trouble with irons fitted for them.

 

The Vsole makes the club LESS prone to digging, it doesn't stop it, nor does it make you hit the ball thin.  If the fact that 40% of that club played V Sole irons from the 45 to the 85 series doesn't sway you I don't know what to say.

 

I could be that the head weight and shaft weight and length or numerous other things are different enough from clubs you had been swinging for years that they are a bad fit.

 

 

Edited by driveandputtmachine
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  • Driver - Callaway Epic Max LS on Ventus Purple
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  • Hybrid - Cobra King Tec 17* 
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  • Irons - Srixon ZX5 4&5 iron on Recoil 110
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  • Putters -  Odyssey V Line Tank on a BGT Shaft - sometimes Sunset Beach Ocracoke or Mannkrafted MA/66 on UST Frequency Filtered with SS Counter Core
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1 hour ago, naj959 said:

The V soles can have a huge impact on your quality of contact and this has been brought up in threads over the years. You either love them or hate them and I highly recommend anyone buying Srixon irons demo them on grass first. I am a digger and can take a healthy size divot with my short irons and wedges. Can even take a tiny one with my 3 wood If I'm really trying to trap it.  I had a set of 785s earlier this year and never got along with them. You would think the profile would fit me to a tee but the turf interaction was very poor. The contact was more often then not a hair thin and slightly below the sweet spot. I did a range test and alternated between a set of bridgestones, the 785s and a demo PTX Pro. I had no problem middling the other two clubs but the 785 was always just below center. The 785s performed better off mats than actual grass in my case. I sold the 785s for a slight loss and am looking and getting a set of Hogans. The Hogans also have a V sole but the v is closer to the leading edge while the Srixon is more in the middle and I believe this makes a huge difference. The Hogans I felt like I could pound down on the ball and the club would move through the turf like a plow. Probably the best clubs I've ever tried for turf interaction.

 

Callaway Irons are usually on the higher bounce side of the spectrum and I'm also a fan their turf interaction as well fwiw.

I still play the PTx Pro irons that I won here on Golfwrx. I’m getting to the point where they will need to be replaced. I’m leaning towards the zX5/ZX7 combo set or another set of PTx Pros. I was fortunate enough to hit the Srixons on grass with my preferred shaft, so that helped a lot. Both are really good thru the turf, and I’ll be happy with either set new. 

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Driver: 10.5* SIM2 set 1 click lower- Diamana Limited D+ White 70s (Tour sleeve) or AV Raw White 65s (non tour sleeve)

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Irons:  Adams 23* Super 9031 (Proforce Tour Weight Iron shaft), 5-PW Srixon ZX7:  All shafted with DGTI s400
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Posted (edited)

For a functional swing, I can't picture how the sole shape itself could cause a thin strike.

 

You would almost have to bounce the iron off of the ground fairly severely, several inches prior to ball contact for the sole shape to be an issue.  

 

Every slow motion contact video I have ever seen, the iron catches the ball on the way down.  The sole seems to interact with turf, well post contact.

 

Now, if you are hitting most second shots from the cart path, disregard everything I typed.

Edited by morgan1819
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6 hours ago, Elee913 said:

But now I'm regretting the decision because I just haven't hit the Z585s well on the course.

 

Get yourself a tune-up fitting on the Z585 irons. Make sure that lie angle, shaft length or grip thickness are not throwing your swing off. Launch data may give you some clues.

What's In The Bag (Summary as of October 2021, post-MAX changeover)

 

Driver:  Tour Edge EXS 10.5°, set 9.5°; weights neutral   ||  FWs:  Calla Rogue 4W + 7W

Hybrid:  Calla Big Bertha OS 4H at 22°  ||  Irons:  Calla Mavrik MAX 5i-PW

Wedges*:  Calla MD3: 48°... MD4: 54°, 58° ||  Putter: Ping Sigma G Tyne (face-balanced) + Evnroll Gravity Grip

Ball: 1. Srixon Q-Star Tour / 2. Calla SuperHot (Orange preferred)  ||  Bag: Sun Mountain Three 5 stand bag

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7 hours ago, Elee913 said:

Late last season I made an impulse switch from some Callaway Big Bertha 19s to the Z585s.  I had actually been hitting the Big Berthas well, but my handicap dropped from the high teens to low double digits, and I wanted a lower profile iron.  I was hitting the Z585s in a store and they had a barely used set they were offering a great deal on, so I pounced without really testing out other clubs.  I know, I know.  I should have tested more, but I got such a good deal that I don't think I'll lose much on the resale.

 

But now I'm regretting the decision because I just haven't hit the Z585s well on the course.  I have a huge tendency to hit the Z585s thin, something I have not experienced in the past with my irons (in fact, irons have always been my strong suit).  I have a shallow swing (rarely take a divot), and I've been reading about how the V-soles might lead to thin strikes.  Has anyone else experienced this issue with their Srixons?  I would say I hit my irons thin almost 1/3-1/2 of the time, which is way too much.  

 

I did try the Apex 21s in a store the other day, and I found that I was really striping these clubs very consistently, and longer than my Z585s.  I know the lofts are slightly lower (30.5 vs. 31), but the consistency of the strike for the Apex 21s were so much better, with very few thin strikes (albeit on a mat, not yet on grass).  And I loved the feel relative to my Z585s (although it might be in large part due to the cleaner strikes).

 

Does this make sense with respect to the V-soles leading to more thin strikes?  I know there is a huge debate in the forum on the relative love for Srixons Z series irons vs. the Apex.  But at this point, I'm almost ready to go back to my Ping G15s with the thin strikes on my Z585s.

Are the clubs the same length? The v soles main job is to get out the turf quicker. The leading edge actually has less or pretty close to the same amount of bounce as others. 

TaylorMade Sim Max 9* @ 7* Aldila Quaranta Reg
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Ping G425 7wd @ -1 Flat setting Graffaloy Pro Lite 3.5 Reg
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I had a red dot, although over time my swing has gotten steeper such that every time I get fitted I’m fitted into standard loft irons (although I usually only test 7 iron vs. the whole bag).  Yep, the 585s replaced the BB, but it’s because I wanted a smaller profile and my handicap had dropped from low 20s to 12-14.  Maybe it was too large a jump.  

 

I actually pulled out my old G15s this week to try them, and wow, are they large.  I don’t think I can go back to that size head ever again.  

 

Tried the Apex DCBs yesterday, and hit them really well.  I know some compare them to the 19 Berthas, but they feel a whole lot better to me and look smaller.  I don’t know if the Vsole is making a difference, but even when testing them against the DCBs, I just wasn’t getting good strikes on the 585s.

 

 

What Color dot on the G15? Trusty G5 red dot were a favourite,so the Cally BB replaced the G15?Srixons are not a G15 replacement,eg Ap2,T200,hope this helps.
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