Garmin Approach R10 Portable Golf Launch Monitor

[r.yan163]

Seems to confirm that spin is not directly measured, interesting that mevo/mevo+ measure spin but not the club head and the garmin is the opposite presumably using very similar hardware (although on the Garmin site, as he shows spin is listed as a "radar metric")

 

Still curious to see how accurate the club data matches up to TM or GCQ...

[BSTRONG1313]

7 hours ago, r.yan163 said:

Seems to confirm that spin is not directly measured, interesting that mevo/mevo+ measure spin but not the club head and the garmin is the opposite presumably using very similar hardware (although on the Garmin site, as he shows spin is listed as a "radar metric")

 

Still curious to see how accurate the club data matches up to TM or GCQ...

I think I actually prefer the Garmin way if I think about it. Spin is useful to know for getting accurate distance control and optimal driving distance but I think working on your swing path, face angle, and AoA is going to make a bigger difference on your scorecard. 

[Nevek]

It buffers me that there still isn't a review were the numbers are crosschecked with Trackman or Mevo+

 

Still under embargo?

[North Butte]

38 minutes ago, BSTRONG1313 said:

I think I actually prefer the Garmin way if I think about it. Spin is useful to know for getting accurate distance control and optimal driving distance but I think working on your swing path, face angle, and AoA is going to make a bigger difference on your scorecard. 

R10 does not measure face angle, that is a derived estimate. 

 

But it does measure path and AoA which is very useful. I can certainly imagine that club path is much more measurable than face angle. 

[ironcat]

Pre-ordered. At the very least being able to play your home course from the comfort of your home is worth the price to me, and being able to play new courses at home before you go there in real life is going to be pretty cool, especially as you can play with your friends if they have one...

They will hit it out of the park due to their 42,000 course database.

 

 

Edited July 12, 2021 by ironcat

[mgoblue83]

1 hour ago, North Butte said:

R10 does not measure face angle, that is a derived estimate. 

 

But it does measure path and AoA which is very useful. I can certainly imagine that club path is much more measurable than face angle. 

 

The good news there is that face angle is a very easy and accurate calculation to make based on accurate path and ball trajectory numbers. Trackman does the same thing.

[North Butte]

3 minutes ago, mgoblue83 said:

 

The good news there is that face angle is a very easy and accurate calculation to make based on accurate path and ball trajectory numbers. Trackman does the same thing.

Yes, I think the question is whether something like an R10 can get a good enough ball trajectory estimate during the brief portion of initial ball flight that it sees. 

 

Certainly seems possible, the question is how close to "good enough" do does it end up coming...

[mgoblue83]

2 hours ago, BSTRONG1313 said:

I think I actually prefer the Garmin way if I think about it. Spin is useful to know for getting accurate distance control and optimal driving distance but I think working on your swing path, face angle, and AoA is going to make a bigger difference on your scorecard. 

 

I agree. If those numbers are accurate this is a game changing product for people looking to improve quickly.

[mgoblue83]

1 minute ago, North Butte said:

Yes, I think the question is whether something like an R10 can get a good enough ball trajectory estimate during the brief portion of initial ball flight that it sees. 

 

Certainly seems possible, the question is how close to "good enough" do does it end up coming...

 

I have to think the ball trajectory data (ball speed, launch angle, launch direction) will be good. Those are really easy to measure for radar which gives me a lot of confidence in the club face calculation as well. Those things alone should make this unit a fantastic indoor practice tool.

 

My burning question is how accurate the carry distance, spin, spin axis, and horizontal dispersion numbers are going to be for simulator play.

[North Butte]

15 minutes ago, mgoblue83 said:

My burning question is how accurate the carry distance, spin, spin axis, and horizontal dispersion numbers are going to be for simulator play.

The more I read and think about it, the more I think this is going to live or die by how good a simulator it makes. 

 

It may actually turn out to be a better practice tool than the other $500-class radars which would be good news for a lot of golfer. But if R10 is a really big success it will be as a $600 alternative to much more expensive simulators.

 

Best case it's a playable, fun simulator AND a much cheaper alternative to something like a MEVO+ or Skytrack for practice including club face/path feedback. 

[ScottSilverman]

Does anyone know the sequence of getting from the R10 to the hitting screen?  In other words, I have seen it connects via bluetooth, I assume that goes to a phone/ipad and the garmin app.  How do you then connect to the E6 software and a projector?  Can it go through a macbook that is connected via HDMI to a projector?

[Simpsonia]

5 hours ago, North Butte said:

The more I read and think about it, the more I think this is going to live or die by how good a simulator it makes. 

 

It may actually turn out to be a better practice tool than the other $500-class radars which would be good news for a lot of golfer. But if R10 is a really big success it will be as a $600 alternative to much more expensive simulators.

 

Best case it's a playable, fun simulator AND a much cheaper alternative to something like a MEVO+ or Skytrack for practice including club face/path feedback. 

 

Best case it's a playable, fun simulator AND more accurate than cheaper alternatives that offer fun, playable simulators like the RMotion or Tittle X which are fun, but nowhere near accurate enough for serious sim usage and practice purposes. 

 

One of the things I'm most curious about is accuracy on high spin wedge shots for dialing in the short game. 

Edited July 12, 2021 by Simpsonia

[JourdanM]

Very close to pulling the trigger - really surprised one of the big guys hasn't had a video review yet...

[Str8Putt]

2 hours ago, JourdanM said:

Very close to pulling the trigger - really surprised one of the big guys hasn't had a video review yet...

Same. Still trying to figure how Let Play Thru got a review out before Rick or some of the bigger channels although I think he did mention at the end of the video he got it from the place he buys his stuff from.

I know Rick did review/commercial for RF

[North Butte]

8 hours ago, Str8Putt said:

Same. Still trying to figure how Let Play Thru got a review out before Rick or some of the bigger channels although I think he did mention at the end of the video he got it from the place he buys his stuff from.

I know Rick did review/commercial for RF

It's possible they only sent pre-release samples of the product to people who they knew would give positive reviews. Wouldn't be the first company to use that particular marketing ploy

[Nevek]

19 minutes ago, North Butte said:

It's possible they only sent pre-release samples of the product to people who they knew would give positive reviews. Wouldn't be the first company to use that particular marketing ploy

 

At this point it wouldn't be a surprise if Garmin is overselling on its accuracy

[North Butte]

47 minutes ago, Nevek said:

 

At this point it wouldn't be a surprise if Garmin is overselling on its accuracy

I may be wrong but I think the most popular videos about R10 are the Let's Play Through guy. A few thing I've noticed from his videos. 

 

1) He says he has not actually compared it to other launch monitors or simulators but just compared the R10 shot by shot data to how the shot looked or to what flag it landed near. 

 

2) He has been using G80 before receiving the R10 so for launch monitor purposes he's comparing it to a very basic model.

 

3) He seems to me to be judging mostly whether R10 will be adequate as a simulator, which he has found it very impressive.

 

That's a great "review" in the sense of what it's like to use. Not a technical "review" at all in the sense of accuracy, limitations, etc. I'm not saying he's some sort of ringer or fake review by any means. But he was a beta tester for the R10 and is basically saying that they have a viable and usable product that does what it says on the box.

 

It's about like when Titleist sends test balls to someone who has been playing Pro V1 since 2003 and asks them to give a "review" of the new version. It's not fake, the golfer will probably give an honest opinion. But that opinion will be from the perspective of someone who thought the previous Pro V1 was the best ball on the market. The Let's Play Through guy has found G80 to meet his needs and finds R10 to work fine as a G80 replacement while also being a simulator. That's good but doesn't tell us much about how a pickier, more technically oriented reviewer will judge R10.

 

Garmin's niche within this market space seems to be dual-purpose devices where the launch monitor function gets at most equal billing with something else. With G80 it was a (very good) handheld GPS that also functions as a pretty good launch monitor. With R10 it's a decent simulator that also functions as a potentially very good launch monitor. 

 

Edited July 13, 2021 by North Butte

[Str8Putt]

3 hours ago, North Butte said:

It's possible they only sent pre-release samples of the product to people who they knew would give positive reviews. Wouldn't be the first company to use that particular marketing ploy

Possible but I'm pretty sure he said he got it from the place he buys all his stuff from and they hooked him up. 

Still find it odd that out of all of YouTube he's the only one I've seen review it. Did he break some embargo or something? He has a second video that's a FAQ up.

I do tend to like his videos and had subbed to his channel before the R10 video 

[whumber]

2 hours ago, North Butte said:

I may be wrong but I think the most popular videos about R10 are the Let's Play Through guy. A few thing I've noticed from his videos. 

 

1) He says he has not actually compared it to other launch monitors or simulators but just compared the R10 shot by shot data to how the shot looked or to what flag it landed near. 

 

2) He has been using G80 before receiving the R10 so for launch monitor purposes he's comparing it to a very basic model.

 

3) He seems to me to be judging mostly whether R10 will be adequate as a simulator, which he has found it very impressive.

 

 

 

He was also the first one, by a week or two, to review the SC300i when it was released. He also did a Mevo Plus review when that was released so it's not like the G80 is his only point of reference. Still no idea how he's getting access lately to launch monitors before anyone else.

[Nevek]

3 hours ago, North Butte said:

I may be wrong but I think the most popular videos about R10 are the Let's Play Through guy. A few thing I've noticed from his videos. 

 

1) He says he has not actually compared it to other launch monitors or simulators but just compared the R10 shot by shot data to how the shot looked or to what flag it landed near. 

 

2) He has been using G80 before receiving the R10 so for launch monitor purposes he's comparing it to a very basic model.

 

3) He seems to me to be judging mostly whether R10 will be adequate as a simulator, which he has found it very impressive.

 

That's a great "review" in the sense of what it's like to use. Not a technical "review" at all in the sense of accuracy, limitations, etc. I'm not saying he's some sort of ringer or fake review by any means. But he was a beta tester for the R10 and is basically saying that they have a viable and usable product that does what it says on the box.

 

It's about like when Titleist sends test balls to someone who has been playing Pro V1 since 2003 and asks them to give a "review" of the new version. It's not fake, the golfer will probably give an honest opinion. But that opinion will be from the perspective of someone who thought the previous Pro V1 was the best ball on the market. The Let's Play Through guy has found G80 to meet his needs and finds R10 to work fine as a G80 replacement while also being a simulator. That's good but doesn't tell us much about how a pickier, more technically oriented reviewer will judge R10.

 

Garmin's niche within this market space seems to be dual-purpose devices where the launch monitor function gets at most equal billing with something else. With G80 it was a (very good) handheld GPS that also functions as a pretty good launch monitor. With R10 it's a decent simulator that also functions as a potentially very good launch monitor. 

 

 

I am quite fond of the recent Garmin releases and I owned a G80 as well. The thing is that the R10 offers even more parameters than the Mevo+ or Skytrack, both units costing nearly 4x than the R10.

While the Mevo+ can't compete with Trackman, I think the numbers you are seeing on the Mevo+ are acceptable for most of the uses (my mevo+ struggles a bit with lob shots and long drives). My biggest question on the R10 are the data margin, is it something that is acceptable for a pro or even budget fitter or is it purely a "budget" personal launch monitor

[Britboy]

Interesting thread. I've taken the plunge and sold my Mevo Plus (still got 80% of what I paid for it) and ordered an R10. Love the idea of 'playing' my home course in my outside net and wasn't at all convinced on the driver readings for the Mevo plus when not on full Outdoor tracking mode. Plus the cash balance has paid for my new MP-20 MMCs 😃

[JourdanM]

20 hours ago, Str8Putt said:

Same. Still trying to figure how Let Play Thru got a review out before Rick or some of the bigger channels although I think he did mention at the end of the video he got it from the place he buys his stuff from.

I know Rick did review/commercial for RF

I feel like Rick always does Garmin reviews, too. I certainly trust Garmin products, I love my s62, just want to see SOMETHING. 

[North Butte]

It's only speculation on my part but FWIW it sure sounds like Let's Play Through makes himself available to give early, enthusiastic reviews of tech products in return for being a beta tester or whatever they call someone who get one before they reach the retail distribution chain. 

 

If so, he's carved himself a nice little space in the YouTube dogfight. But it's a different space than those UK video-a-day bloggers like Shiels, Crossfield, etc. They're a little more all over the map with what they're going to say about a product. No real advantage to giving them one a couple months ahead of time, they might up and poop all over it if they take a notion.

[prusd]

Hi,

 

Noticed this on the Garmin forum website.  It looks like you get 5 free e6 courses if you are an ios user.  

 

"

• E6 CONNECT COMPATIBILITY: The E6 CONNECT library of content is available to you via Approach R10. Easily play their photorealistic courses whenever you want. Works with PC and iOS versions. Get started with five free courses on the iOS version. Visit the E6 CONNECT website for more details"
• https://forums.garmin.com/outdoor-recreation/golf/f/approach-r10/268182/approach-r10-introduction

[whumber]

On 7/12/2021 at 6:08 AM, Nevek said:

It buffers me that there still isn't a review were the numbers are crosschecked with Trackman or Mevo+

 

Still under embargo?

 

Rick Shiels just talked a bit about his upcoming review during his podcast. Didn't give many details but sounded extremely positive about the comparison to GCQuad.

[gticlay]

8 hours ago, prusd said:

Hi,

 

Noticed this on the Garmin forum website.  It looks like you get 5 free e6 courses if you are an ios user.  

 

"

• E6 CONNECT COMPATIBILITY: The E6 CONNECT library of content is available to you via Approach R10. Easily play their photorealistic courses whenever you want. Works with PC and iOS versions. Get started with five free courses on the iOS version. Visit the E6 CONNECT website for more details"
• https://forums.garmin.com/outdoor-recreation/golf/f/approach-r10/268182/approach-r10-introduction

If so, that would convince me to buy one.  I JUST bought the Mevo then this.  Dang it.

[RCGA]

8 hours ago, whumber said:

 

Rick Shiels just talked a bit about his upcoming review during his podcast. Didn't give many details but sounded extremely positive about the comparison to GCQuad.

 

I just listened to it. He's tried the beta version which had issues and is now testing the production(?) version for a video review. He said the results are "very close" 

 

My guess is that you're within a few yards (vs GC quad) on anything 50-150y. Driver is within 10y. Garmin has more outliers/errors than the Quad, but most will be able to live with given the price. An upgrade over the Mevo and G80, but not as accurate as the Mevo+ 

[rodders]

Not sure this has been posted here prior.

 

 

[North Butte]

13 minutes ago, RCGA said:

 

I just listened to it. He's tried the beta version which had issues and is now testing the production(?) version for a video review. He said the results are "very close" 

 

My guess is that you're within a few yards (vs GC quad) on anything 50-150y. Driver is within 10y. Garmin has more outliers/errors than the Quad, but most will be able to live with given the price. An upgrade over the Mevo and G80, but not as accurate as the Mevo+ 

Well that's a good, safe guess about distances. In terms of guessing (or "calculating") carry distance almost all of the units out there now do a decent enough job. Something like GCquad can guess better than a simpler unit which collects less data and so forth but they all generally do OK on average with distance.

 

But the only reason anyone is interested in R10 is to see if it's a "game changer" by being an under-$1,000 device able to give shot direction and shape as well as clubhead path information. So my interest will be how well it accurately and consistently it reports those parameters compared to much more expensive units. 

 

I'll add my own guesses:

 

1) It's about like you describe it for distance.

2) Shot direction and shape will be comparable to Rapsodo (i.e. close to correct a lot of the time but fairly often completely wonky). 

3) Club path, angle of attack and computed face angle will be problematic and probably not worth trusting in terms of feedback when you're working on your golf swing.

4) On the whole it will make a great simulator, at least as good a launch monitor as Rapsodo/MEVO/SC300i but in launch monitor terms not a replacement for an expensive multi-thousand-dollar monitor.

[North Butte]

1 minute ago, rodders said:

Not sure this has been posted here prior.

 

 

Hate to be a hater but that's a virtually content-free 4+ minutes right there. 

 

A set of a dozen screen shots and a couple bullet lists of features would provide the same info more clearly in 1/4 the time. 

 

It makes the R10 look like a Rapsodo MLM.