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Social Media Wars between Juniors Dads


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On 7/12/2021 at 10:53 AM, tiger1873 said:

Recently noticed there is a lot accusations being said about other Junior golfers by their Dad's on social media.   The ones I am seeing are about girls that a lot people follow.

 

There is no mention of names but lots of back and forth between them.  The one girl is a top 10 and the other a top 100 girl.  It's pretty obvious who they are if you read the posts from both parents and notice that they were paired at few recent tournaments.

 

Not sure anyone knows if the rumors are true or has more background???  But it sounds like something happened at a tournament recently.  It sounds like the parents of a few girls are out hand and it's not a good thing.    Which is why I tend to believe the top 10 girls dad comments.

 

 

 

 

If this was about the incidents that happened in Virginia a couple months ago, then I've heard about it. As an official, we're aware of parents coaching on course, seen parents drop balls outside hazards, cheating etc.

 

In this case, one parent videoed another 5-10 times, openly violating rules,  and reported to officials. Video, in my opinion, better than he said she said, but violations nonetheless, and no confrontations. You often see this w/younger players who are on the rise, parents trying anything to help them get there. Similar to USGA in both US Girls and Boys [ one top 5 player was forced to forfeit hole yesterday due to slow play, almost lost match] there needs to be some concrete rules in dealing with parents who cheat the game and integrity. One stroke for first violation, another for 2nd and ban parent from tournament, and ban further if more. That, will get rid of nonsense.

Again, i didn't see video's, but woman who did said they were quite obvious and hopefully he doesn't do again. 

 

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41 minutes ago, JDee1935 said:

If this was about the incidents that happened in Virginia a couple months ago, then I've heard about it. As an official, we're aware of parents coaching on course, seen parents drop balls outside hazards, cheating etc.

 

In this case, one parent videoed another 5-10 times, openly violating rules,  and reported to officials. Video, in my opinion, better than he said she said, but violations nonetheless, and no confrontations. You often see this w/younger players who are on the rise, parents trying anything to help them get there. Similar to USGA in both US Girls and Boys [ one top 5 player was forced to forfeit hole yesterday due to slow play, almost lost match] there needs to be some concrete rules in dealing with parents who cheat the game and integrity. One stroke for first violation, another for 2nd and ban parent from tournament, and ban further if more. That, will get rid of nonsense.

Again, i didn't see video's, but woman who did said they were quite obvious and hopefully he doesn't do again. 

 

 

Did the parent have a GoPro on videoing the entire time?  How in the heck do you get someone on video cheating that many times?  Leads me to believe they knew there were going to be issues.  

 

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There's definitely something more important that I should be doing.
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4 hours ago, JDee1935 said:

If this was about the incidents that happened in Virginia a couple months ago, then I've heard about it. As an official, we're aware of parents coaching on course, seen parents drop balls outside hazards, cheating etc.

 

In this case, one parent videoed another 5-10 times, openly violating rules,  and reported to officials. Video, in my opinion, better than he said she said, but violations nonetheless, and no confrontations. You often see this w/younger players who are on the rise, parents trying anything to help them get there. Similar to USGA in both US Girls and Boys [ one top 5 player was forced to forfeit hole yesterday due to slow play, almost lost match] there needs to be some concrete rules in dealing with parents who cheat the game and integrity. One stroke for first violation, another for 2nd and ban parent from tournament, and ban further if more. That, will get rid of nonsense.

Again, i didn't see video's, but woman who did said they were quite obvious and hopefully he doesn't do again. 

 

 

Curious why the penalties are so lenient.  Caught cheating should be DQ at the first infraction.  

Edited by LeoLeo99
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10 hours ago, LeoLeo99 said:

 

Curious why the penalties are so lenient.  Caught cheating should be DQ at the first infraction.  

 

 

I agree if a parent drops a ball and  kids hits it they then signed the wrong score card. The same thing if the parent is giving outside advice and the kid is following it.   Golf has a lot rules to follow and in a lot cases it means DQ or penalty. 

 

 We are not talking about someone who doesn't know the rules and this wasn't a small tournament.    Not much reason to play a tournament if they allow this sort stuff to go on.

Edited by tiger1873
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15 hours ago, leezer99 said:

 

Did the parent have a GoPro on videoing the entire time?  How in the heck do you get someone on video cheating that many times?  Leads me to believe they knew there were going to be issues.  

 

 

 

From what I have heard and read the original run in happened in St Augustine at the start of the year.   There has been rumors and run in with a lot people over the years with this player.  It started back in her US Kids days.

 

 

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On 7/13/2021 at 8:54 AM, tiger1873 said:

 

The problem is when parents are too involved. If your kid is going into high school and you feel the need to be at every tournament and take there score then you have an issue.

 

There are some events we played this year where the dad insists on taking the score and making sure there kids score is correct before handing it in and they do it in front of officials and will argue with the kid who was the scorekeeper. The really bad parents will keep the whole groups score.   These are kids in High School no reason to keep score.  The best events do not allow stuff like that to happen.

 

To me it sounds like maybe the girl who is being called out really doesn't like golf.  But because of early success they keep pushing.   For me if my Kid has a bad day it means we need to work on something. For them and a lot others it means that it's validation to quit.

 

Personally I think that is what is happening.

 

 

 

Spot on.  If the parent wants it more than the kid, the kid will not be successful long term.  They will be on to the fun stuff of college when they get there...…….

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On 7/23/2021 at 9:02 AM, tiger1873 said:

 

 

From what I have heard and read the original run in happened in St Augustine at the start of the year.   There has been rumors and run in with a lot people over the years with this player.  It started back in her US Kids days.

 

 

I know nothing about anything from St Augustine, but you're talking about a 13-14 yr old girl getting instruction during play. Look at it any way, but is [ next to score shaving] a common rules violation.   It won't end well. Best example I can give you is below.

 

Last week, here at CCNC, was the US Junior Am. I watched entire tournament. One of the best players here [ went deep in match play] is now 17. As a 12-14 yr old, his father was notorious for giving golf lessons to his son on course, every hole, zero regard for rules, asked to leave course multiple times. I watched this boy play, and after 1 round, I asked where his father was. He explained his father became too much, and he told him that if he ever came to another tournament, he'd quit golf. They haven't spoken for over a year now. He said his father was cheating and the embarassment ruined golf. That kid, has ability to play on tour today.

 

Bottom line was, no players or parents ever stood up to his father, even though he regularly broke rules, cheated the tournaments and the game. The young girls father did  same, and in that age bracket, parents do need to report him. How else do you fix people thinking they're above rules and traditions of golf?

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12 hours ago, JDee1935 said:

I know nothing about anything from St Augustine, but you're talking about a 13-14 yr old girl getting instruction during play. Look at it any way, but is [ next to score shaving] a common rules violation.   It won't end well. Best example I can give you is below.

 

Last week, here at CCNC, was the US Junior Am. I watched entire tournament. One of the best players here [ went deep in match play] is now 17. As a 12-14 yr old, his father was notorious for giving golf lessons to his son on course, every hole, zero regard for rules, asked to leave course multiple times. I watched this boy play, and after 1 round, I asked where his father was. He explained his father became too much, and he told him that if he ever came to another tournament, he'd quit golf. They haven't spoken for over a year now. He said his father was cheating and the embarassment ruined golf. That kid, has ability to play on tour today.

 

Bottom line was, no players or parents ever stood up to his father, even though he regularly broke rules, cheated the tournaments and the game. The young girls father did  same, and in that age bracket, parents do need to report him. How else do you fix people thinking they're above rules and traditions of golf?

 

I can almost guarantee you that other kids have stood up this girls dad in the past.  The problem is rules were not enforced at the lower level to keep it in check.  I had many run in's with this dad in the past and nothing was ever done. I am also not the only one either. At some point you just give up and have to focus on what you can control and that is your kid getting better.

 

The girls dad in question was on a TV show the local tournaments promoted them and had a vested interest in this kids success. They still do so they will not do anything to stop it.

 

The bigger issue is there are lot copycat dads the same age because well they think what they see is how you get success.

 

You are correct this will not turn out well.  Once you play on a bigger stage you can't intimidate or play loose with the rules.   Kids who are serious are not going to hand away the glory of winning to someone who is not following the rules.  The kids parents and coaches put way too much time in to not make sure the rules are enforced.

 

 

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1 hour ago, tiger1873 said:

 

we are not allowed to post names on golfwrx but I suggest you read through the thread again I am pretty sure you can guess who it is like some.

You're not breaking any WRX policies....if the fathers are creating drama on social media platforms....it's public info for all to see on the internet.

 

Just give us a link to the drama between the 2 fathers.

 

I'm not going to do a CIA search to try to figure out who these 2 girls are.

 

From the Short Game doc....it would be either Pano or Avery Amery.

I have no clue of this other film that was cancelled.

 

You said one of the gals is in the top 10 rankings.

From the WAGR top 10....I don't see any of those gal's dad making a fuss.

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31 minutes ago, KBong said:

You're not breaking any WRX policies....if the fathers are creating drama on social media platforms....it's public info for all to see on the internet.

 

Just give us a link to the drama between the 2 fathers.

 

I'm not going to do a CIA search to try to figure out who these 2 girls are.

 

From the Short Game doc....it would be either Pano or Avery Amery.

I have no clue of this other film that was cancelled.

 

You said one of the gals is in the top 10 rankings.

From the WAGR top 10....I don't see any of those gal's dad making a fuss.

 

 

There have been numerous topics in the past about the girl on this forum involving her dad and some questionable tactics but the mods deleted  the thread. JDee1935 confirmed the videos exists and the accounts on social media happened.

 

To me the biggest issue is why not much was done after it was reported. I doubt we will find this out on this forum unless 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, tiger1873 said:

 

 

There have been numerous topics in the past about the girl on this forum involving her dad and some questionable tactics but the mods deleted  the thread. JDee1935 confirmed the videos exists and the accounts on social media happened.

 

 

All started by you.  She was on TV. Who cares? 

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To regain control, the tournament officials need to enforce discipline, including on the parents. It takes guts to do, but you have to stop nonsense.

 

At the start of the next tournament, read the riot act to the parents. Warn them to stay out of the way, or they will suffer the consequences. If parents still break the rules, have security personnel escort them off premises. If it's horrendous behavior, ban them from the tournament courses for the season.

 

The described incident reminds me of the 1993 movie  about a child chess prodigy, Looking for Bobby Fischer. Near the end of the film, the elimination games for a children's chess tournament is going on. At two separate tables, parents are causing a ruckus about how their kid's game is going. The tournament master calls a time out, confers with the rules officials, and all the parents are thrown out of the tournament chamber. As the doors slam shut, all the children applaud.

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On 7/30/2021 at 12:05 AM, ChipNRun said:

To regain control, the tournament officials need to enforce discipline, including on the parents. It takes guts to do, but you have to stop nonsense.

 

At the start of the next tournament, read the riot act to the parents. Warn them to stay out of the way, or they will suffer the consequences. If parents still break the rules, have security personnel escort them off premises. If it's horrendous behavior, ban them from the tournament courses for the season.

 

The described incident reminds me of the 1993 movie  about a child chess prodigy, Looking for Bobby Fischer. Near the end of the film, the elimination games for a children's chess tournament is going on. At two separate tables, parents are causing a ruckus about how their kid's game is going. The tournament master calls a time out, confers with the rules officials, and all the parents are thrown out of the tournament chamber. As the doors slam shut, all the children applaud.

Great scene and great movie, Searching for Bobby Fischer.

 

The subject of the movie, Josh Waitzkin, never achieved the rank of Grand Master (although his 2480 rating left him close).  Instead, Waitzkin discovered he liked the martial arts more and he has dedicated most of his energy towards it.

 

The child prodigy ended up being very successful as an adult, but took a different path than others had picked for him.

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  • 3 months later...

Why is it that it seems most of the crazy parents/dads belong to Junior Female Golfers?  Very rarely see it on the guys side, but for girl's there are some crazy mom's and dad's.  Social Media is full of these guys.  Helicopter parent's living vicariously through the child's success.  The greatest are the "My daughter hit's it 280 yards" posts.

Edited by heavy_hitter
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11 minutes ago, heavy_hitter said:

Why is it that it seems most of the crazy parents/dads belong to Junior Female Golfers?  Very rarely see it on the guys side, but for girl's there are some crazy mom's and dad's.  Social Media is full of these guys.

agree 100%.  Try talking to some of the moms and dads and its like you're speaking to royalty.  Like I 'm sorry.  That's the 1%.  Met alot of cool ones as well. 

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2 minutes ago, TripleBogeysrbetter said:

agree 100%.  Try talking to some of the moms and dads and its like you're speaking to royalty.  Like I 'm sorry.  That's the 1%.  Met alot of cool ones as well. 

Agreed.  I rarely encounter that with guys.  I might be able to name one and he isn't that bad.  On the girl's side it is much more prevalent.  

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37 minutes ago, heavy_hitter said:

Why is it that it seems most of the crazy parents/dads belong to Junior Female Golfers?  Very rarely see it on the guys side, but for girl's there are some crazy mom's and dad's.  Social Media is full of these guys.  Helicopter parent's living vicariously through the child's success.  The greatest are the "My daughter hit's it 280 yards" posts.

 

 

Couldn't agree with you more.   These dad's need to be run off the junior circuit.  They will do anything to win including messing with other kids games. It's almost impossible to repost some of the stuff said and have anyone believe you.

 

I love the dads who claim 280 yards.  Truly if you can do that and break par why are they not pro.  Don't waste your time playing lowly junior tournaments my kid has to play in.

 

Personal Feeling is all this started with the Short Game Documentary.  These crazy dads don't understand everyone including the kids makes fun of them.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, tiger1873 said:

 

 

Couldn't agree with you more.   These dad's need to be run off the junior circuit.  They will do anything to win including messing with other kids games. It's almost impossible to repost some of the stuff said and have anyone believe you.

 

I love the dads who claim 280 yards.  Truly if you can do that and break par why are they not pro.  Don't waste your time playing lowly junior tournaments my kid has to play in.

 

Personal Feeling is all this started with the Short Game Documentary.  These crazy dads don't understand everyone including the kids makes fun of them.

 

 

This guy on social media with the initials TH is wacko.  You know exactly who I am talking about.  He thinks he is royalty because his daughter is a Player.  She is good, but man the stories from other parents about him.  Just crazy and his social media comments prove it.  

 

The more you call him stupid, the more stupid his ...

Edited by heavy_hitter
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1 hour ago, kekoa said:

Dammit Leezer.  I thought you were posting a video of the cheating. 😜

Was actually talking to a dad who’s daughter is in the top 10 of the Toyota Tour Cup yesterday about cheating. Says it still happens at that level. And I’m not sure if you’ve heard but the Players Tour is updating their eligibility requirements. Basically, if you move from the JDT into players and shoot XX over par they are moving you back down to JDT. They had 900 kids join JDT last year and a bunch qualified up into Players and flooded the field. I think this is their way of making sure it’s still competitive. 

There's definitely something more important that I should be doing.
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38 minutes ago, leezer99 said:

Was actually talking to a dad who’s daughter is in the top 10 of the Toyota Tour Cup yesterday about cheating. Says it still happens at that level. And I’m not sure if you’ve heard but the Players Tour is updating their eligibility requirements. Basically, if you move from the JDT into players and shoot XX over par they are moving you back down to JDT. They had 900 kids join JDT last year and a bunch qualified up into Players and flooded the field. I think this is their way of making sure it’s still competitive. 

 

It's stupid to make a cut at certain score.  The only way that is fair is to make a Cut from the field or have kids qualify into certain tournaments going forward.

 

 I think Boys just do not put up with stuff that goes on with girls.  Boys are also much more independent in tournaments.  you do not see a lot girls out there by themselves and sometimes you need to be there to deal with certain parents.

 

 

 It's very common to have girls who do not want to even be in a tournament playing they have no care about golf or the field . Play enough girl tournaments and you just see stuff that just doesn't add up.  The better the field the less likely you will see the drama and that is just something you have to accept.

 

Boys would never do half of what goes on in girls tournaments.  They never make it out the parking lot if they acted like some of the girls do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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