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Club adjustability during round


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1 minute ago, NJBigFish22 said:

I was watching a few different club review videos on YouTube and prompted a question.  If you have a driver that is set up at 10*, but is adjustable, are you able to adjust the loft during a round?  I would think the 14 club rule somehow applies, but not sure. 

Nothing to do with the 14 club limit, it still only counts as one club.  But Rule 4.1a(3), as above, strictly prohibits it, and it you make a stroke with the club after you've adjusted its playing characteristics, you are dq'd.

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1 hour ago, NJBigFish22 said:

Thanks for the replies, I figured it wasn’t allowed, but just wasn’t sure.  

 

Your next question might be, "I know I can't change the settings, but what if the head becomes loose during my round? Am I allowed to tighten it?"

 

Yes, you may. It's here in Interpretations:

 

4.1a(2)/1 – Meaning of “Repair”


Examples of repair include:

 

Replacing lead tape that fell off during a stroke. Given the nature of lead tape, if the lead tape will not remain on the club in the same location, new tape may be used.

 

Tightening clubs with adjustable mechanisms that come loose during the round, but not adjusting the club to a different setting.

 

 

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Knowledge of the Rules is part of the applied skill set which a player must use to play a round of competitive golf.

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1 hour ago, sui generis said:

 

Your next question might be, "I know I can't change the settings, but what if the head becomes loose during my round? Am I allowed to tighten it?"

 

Yes, you may. It's here in Interpretations:

 

4.1a(2)/1 – Meaning of “Repair”


Examples of repair include:

 

Replacing lead tape that fell off during a stroke. Given the nature of lead tape, if the lead tape will not remain on the club in the same location, new tape may be used.

 

Tightening clubs with adjustable mechanisms that come loose during the round, but not adjusting the club to a different setting.

 

 

Thank u for this. Had a random guy I got paired with give me grief when i was tightening the loose head back to the original setting. We weren’t even playing in a match against each other. Told me this is against USGA rules twice. Had to hold in telling him to call them and report me. 

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I actually submitted a rule change request to the PGA about this few months ago related to this.

 

The rule makes sense that you shouldn't be able to adjust the playability of the club during a round, as that would be like having an extra club(s) in the bag.

 

But here is my gripe.  I have an adjustable hybrid that I like to play at two different settings.  In order for me to do this legally, I have to buy the exact same club twice and carry both of them in my bag.

 

I feel that each setting should count against the 14 club limit.  So if I want to use this club at 2 different settings, then I should be able to carry only 13 clubs but be able to adjust that club to the 2 different settings I like.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, abenjami said:

I actually submitted a rule change request to the PGA about this few months ago related to this.

 

The rule makes sense that you shouldn't be able to adjust the playability of the club during a round, as that would be like having an extra club(s) in the bag.

 

But here is my gripe.  I have an adjustable hybrid that I like to play at two different settings.  In order for me to do this legally, I have to buy the exact same club twice and carry both of them in my bag.

 

I feel that each setting should count against the 14 club limit.  So if I want to use this club at 2 different settings, then I should be able to carry only 13 clubs but be able to adjust that club to the 2 different settings I like.

 

 


Interesting idea.  Presumably you’d have to declare your settings in advance of the round?  Otherwise, starting with 13 clubs and the ability to adjust one, you really begin with a lot more than 14 clubs (until you “lock in” the second setting). 

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1 hour ago, jimbo123 said:


Interesting idea.  Presumably you’d have to declare your settings in advance of the round?  Otherwise, starting with 13 clubs and the ability to adjust one, you really begin with a lot more than 14 clubs (until you “lock in” the second setting). 

 

Yeah, that was my thought.  You declare your settings before the round.

 

When I submitted the request, I really made it from an amateur perspective and explained it like this.  If a pro wants to play two different settings, Titleist, TM, Callaway or whoever will just give them two different clubs.  But for guys like us, we have to pay 2x to play the same dang club in a tournament.

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1 hour ago, Newby said:

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/ben-crane-handled-an-eight-stroke-penalty-better-than-you-would-have

 

Is this still a penalty? I can't see anything in the Equipment Rules

 

No 

In those days 2017 a player received a penalty for carrying a non conforming club.

Now the player is only penalised under this rule if he makes a stroke with such club.

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9 hours ago, abenjami said:

 

Yeah, that was my thought.  You declare your settings before the round.

 

When I submitted the request, I really made it from an amateur perspective and explained it like this.  If a pro wants to play two different settings, Titleist, TM, Callaway or whoever will just give them two different clubs.  But for guys like us, we have to pay 2x to play the same dang club in a tournament.

 

If there were only two possible settings for a club it could be handled. But at least my adjustable clubs have many more possible settings.

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29 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

It has everything to do with the 14 club limit

 

I don't think so, Mr Bean. Long before the modern adjustable clubs, I think that it was still not permitted to modify the loft or lie of a club during the round.

Knowledge of the Rules is part of the applied skill set which a player must use to play a round of competitive golf.

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8 minutes ago, sui generis said:

 

I don't think so, Mr Bean. Long before the modern adjustable clubs, I think that it was still not permitted to modify the loft or lie of a club during the round.

 

And for the exactly same reason as today: modifying a club gives you another club that you did not have before. So it has everything to do with the maximum number of clubs one may have.

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19 minutes ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

And for the exactly same reason as today: modifying a club gives you another club that you did not have before. So it has everything to do with the maximum number of clubs one may have.

 

Forgive me, friends. I should have known better. 🙄

Knowledge of the Rules is part of the applied skill set which a player must use to play a round of competitive golf.

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36 minutes ago, Newby said:

Thanks. But which Rule (of Golf or Equipment) says it is non-conforming?

Does this, from Equipment Rules FAQ, help?

 

Can I attach a piece of tape to my clubface? 


No, external attachments to the clubface are not permitted under Part 2, Section 1a of the Equipment Rules.

Knowledge of the Rules is part of the applied skill set which a player must use to play a round of competitive golf.

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9 minutes ago, sui generis said:

Does this, from Equipment Rules FAQ, help?

 

Can I attach a piece of tape to my clubface? 


No, external attachments to the clubface are not permitted under Part 2, Section 1a of the Equipment Rules.

Thanks but what about -  Exceptions may be made for attachments that do not affect the performance of the club.

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10 hours ago, Mr. Bean said:

 

And for the exactly same reason as today: modifying a club gives you another club that you did not have before. So it has everything to do with the maximum number of clubs one may have.

So, if I started with 10 clubs and adjusted my driver once to a different loft, I would then have 11 clubs and not be in a penalty situation?  Imo, the restriction on club adjustment has nothing to do with the limit of 14 clubs.

And further, the penalties are different for having more than 14 clubs and for making a stroke with a club that was adjusted during the round.

Edited by rogolf
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1 hour ago, rogolf said:

So, if I started with 10 clubs and adjusted my driver once to a different loft, I would then have 11 clubs and not be in a penalty situation?  Imo, the restriction on club adjustment has nothing to do with the limit of 14 clubs.

And further, the penalties are different for having more than 14 clubs and for making a stroke with a club that was adjusted during the round.

 

The penalties might be different but conceptually it's similar.

 

I mean if we want to get really deep here, why is there a 14 club limit in the first place?  The goal is to have the lowest score, who cares how that happens?  If someone wants to carry 23 clubs and I feel like I only want 10 clubs, why does it matter?

 

IMO, given the physical gains humanity has seen since the rules of golf were invented, the current 14 club rule is a hinderance to the less physically strong (as opposed to those who are coordinated,  gifted, or actually skilled but genetically unable to hit a ball 325).  We keep moving the tees back and making the holes longer because some people are hitting the ball longer but it's totally screwing the people who can't hit it that far.  How do you even things up?  Well one solution IMO is get rid of the club limit.

 

Aside from that, stop making the holes longer and make the big hitters learn how to putt and develop a short game.  Don't make a hole longer, put a bunch of fairway bunkers at the 325 mark and let them learn how to hit from the sand.

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4 hours ago, abenjami said:

We keep moving the tees back and making the holes longer because some people are hitting the ball longer but it's totally screwing the people who can't hit it that far.  How do you even things up?  Well one solution IMO is get rid of the club limit.

 

Aside from that, stop making the holes longer and make the big hitters learn how to putt and develop a short game.

 

You have it backwards. A longer hitter would be the one to gain from no club limits. A player whose absolute maximum with a driver is 180 metres can cover all the distances to 60 metres with even, ten-metre gaps with 13 clubs whereas someone who can hit it 300 metres needs to leave much bigger gaps to cover distances down to, say 100 metres. The short hitter will need fewer clubs to cover the distances and has the ability to include specialty clubs to deal with different lies whereas a long hitter needs all the clubs to simply cover the distances.

 

Also, if a player is playing tees that are too long for him/her, it's that person's own personal choice and problem when it comes to their own enjoyment of the round.

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