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2021 Golf Ball Test


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1 minute ago, OspreyCI said:

I’ll be switching from the BX to the BXS after looking at the data. 

Report back after you do, I did the same and it performs better for me and feels much better. I was expecting to lose a few yards off the tee but haven't noticed that, and my irons/short game have definitely improved. 

 

People who prefer the feel of BX off putter must be using soft mushy inserts. I use a milled putter with no insert and think the softness of BXS off the face is the best of all tour level balls, just the perfect blend of firm and soft without being too much in either direction. 

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43 minutes ago, JDubya89 said:

Report back after you do, I did the same and it performs better for me and feels much better. I was expecting to lose a few yards off the tee but haven't noticed that, and my irons/short game have definitely improved. 

 

People who prefer the feel of BX off putter must be using soft mushy inserts. I use a milled putter with no insert and think the softness of BXS off the face is the best of all tour level balls, just the perfect blend of firm and soft without being too much in either direction. 

Your post made my day. Love the BX and want something a touch softer and a bit more spin around the green. This sounds like the ticket. Thanks.

 

BTW, use a milled putter and never 100% on the BX while putting. 
 

I hope to pick up a sleeve this weekend and try. 

TM Sim2 Max 10.5 GD HD 6s
TM Sim Max 15* Tensei Blue 65S

TM M2 19* Hybrid Fuji Pro S
PXG 0311 Gen3 P 4-GW Elevate Tour S
PXG 0311 Forged 54* Elevate Tour S 
TM MG3 60* HB DG S200

TaylorMade Spider Tour

Titleist ProV1

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4 hours ago, Jeff58 said:


It’s the opposite -


https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1877705816306415

 

If you follow the link, it will eventually allow you to download or view the entire article.

 

Dean Snell disagrees with you. https://www.snellgolf.com/blogs/news/dimple-patterns-and-their-flight-effect

 

"If you have a higher spinning ball, you would look to make the dimples a little deeper, to help keep the flight down. For lower spinning balls, the dimples are typically a bit shallower to help the ball fly higher and stay in the air."

 

I couldn't get to the article, it's behind a paywall.

TSi3 9° Tensei White Prototype 2.0 TX
Epic Flash SZ 15° Kai'li x
Epic Flash 3H 19° Evenflow Black 6.5
i210 4-G Modus3 120x
Glide 3.0 54°/60° Modus3 120x
2 Ball Ten

V1X, CSX-LS, who knows?

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5 hours ago, DLiver said:

The rollout on the irons seems way off to me. Much of the time, my course has really firm greens and I've never had an 8 iron roll out 45 feet.

 

I really miss the dispersion data from last time around. That was always the tie-breaker for me between balls that otherwise performed similarly. It was also interesting how many of the top "tour" balls were noticeably more accurate then others.

I believe they stated the balls were more consistent all around this time, and there were a handful of outliers that they're going to do more testing on.

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Driver: PING G425 LST
3 wood: PING 425 Max
2 Hybrid Callaway Maverick

4 Hybrid Taylormade Superfast

5-UW: Ping i210
Ping 54, Taylor made Hi toe wedges

Odyssey OG 2 Ball stroke lab
Titleist ProV1 left dash/Snell MTB-X/Vice Pro Plus

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10 hours ago, North Butte said:

My own wish list for a ball is distance (of course) along with stopping power on irons and spin on wedges.

 

My idea of "distance" in these test results would be total distance off the driver plus carry distance off 8-iron at the 85mph "slow" speed. Unless I overlooked something I think the AVX was the best by that metric 236.10+125.47=361.57 total. The ball I'm currently playing is Chrome Soft X and the numbers are 230.60+123.10=353.70 total.

 

That almost exactly matches my memory of playing AVX in the past (the original version) which rolled about 10 extra yards off the driver but had driver and iron carry distances pretty much like other urethane balls. 

 

Off the 8-iron Chrome Soft X has 5,805spin and 36.45 descent angle which is in the upper echelons for stopping power. That's about 200rpm less spin than the KIRKLAND and within half a degree of descent angle of the steepest-landing balls in the test. Wedge spin is 7,601rpm again toward the top of the list and only a couple hundred rpm less than the highest wedge spin balls. 

 

If I wanted to switch to AVX in hopes of getting that extra distance (in theory I'd be nearly able to hit one less club into greens on average) I'd have to give up some wedge spin (7,155 instead of 7,601) but a pretty good bit of stopping power. The 8-iron spin of AVX is 400rpm less and the descent angle is 35.34 instead of 36.45 so that combination could possible lead to a bit more release. I do think the current AVX seems to fly higher and possibly stop better than the original version but I'm not tempted. Mostly because the increase in distance is almost entirely rollout with the driver which is unreliable in my experience (it depends on the ball staying the fairway and the fairway being firm). 

 

P.S. Tour Speed, which apparently was being hyped ahead of time as a big surprise, certainly isn't any big deal at the 85mph "slow" speed. Compared to the AVX it is pretty much inferior for slow swingers. My distance metric for Tour Speed is 233.81+124.10=357.91 total or about 3-1/2 yards shorter than AVX. The 8-iron spin is 5,502 (vs. 5,393 for AVX), descent angle is 35.58 (vs. 35.34 for AVX) and wedge spin is a paltry 6,620rpm (vs. 7,155 for AVX). 

Great post. We’re the same speed and I have had the same experiences with the original avx and the 2020 chrome soft too. I find the ProV1X to perform the best and the left dash decently similar — but the Chrome Soft X I kind of put in the average category with CS, just a little better.

 

I’m foolishly very tempted to play the new AVX for the rest of the year to see what happens. My eye prefers a low ball flight but obviously not ideal for my swing speed. If AVX holds greens enough it’d be my favorite.

Driver: Honma TW747 10.5*

Fairways: Honma TW747 15* / 18*
Hybrids: Honma TW747 22* / 25*
Irons: Honma TW-X 6-11

Wedges: Honma TW-W4 54* / 58*
Putter: TaylorMade TP Collection Juno (33”)

Ball: Callaway Chrome Soft (2020)

 

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2 hours ago, Fairways_and_Greens said:

Dean Snell disagrees with you. https://www.snellgolf.com/blogs/news/dimple-patterns-and-their-flight-effect

 

"If you have a higher spinning ball, you would look to make the dimples a little deeper, to help keep the flight down. For lower spinning balls, the dimples are typically a bit shallower to help the ball fly higher and stay in the air."

 

I couldn't get to the article, it's behind a paywall.


It’s free if you push the right buttons 😇.

 

It’s not me that Mr. Snell disagrees with. Every objective test I’ve seen comes to the same conclusion. It’s not difficult conceptually. A larger dimple area = equals a larger aircraft wing. A ball with less spin needs a bigger “wing” to stay in the air. The additional drag is the reason low compression/spin ball are at a disadvantage at higher swing speeds. The difference in depth between most soft/low spin balls and something like a V1x is also visually apparent.

 

https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S1877705816306415?token=B72DCE5E8010D05ADD1EAAE7817B4B23E114A47301B5EB58B1A44B622F0CAF807C0F254B46296D73EB0192B1B2FC5166&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20210817224517

 

 

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20 hours ago, JDIL said:

8 Irons for the slow swing speed groups, with 15-20. yards of rollout. Is that normal?  In fact all the speed groups for the 8 iron had a lot of rollout I thought.

That is not at all normal.  They should have hit the 8 irons onto a green to get a more realistic number.

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Titleist TSi2 13.5* Diamana D+ Limited 80X

Titleist TSi2 18* Diamana D+ Limited 80X
Titleist 816H2 23* Speeder HB 8.8 TS
Ping G425 5-UW Steelfiber i95S
Ping Glide 2.0 SS 54* Steelfiber i95S

Cleveland CBX 2 60* DG 115
Scottie Newport M2

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1 hour ago, trapsmv15 said:

Great post. We’re the same speed and I have had the same experiences with the original avx and the 2020 chrome soft too. I find the ProV1X to perform the best and the left dash decently similar — but the Chrome Soft X I kind of put in the average category with CS, just a little better.

 

I’m foolishly very tempted to play the new AVX for the rest of the year to see what happens. My eye prefers a low ball flight but obviously not ideal for my swing speed. If AVX holds greens enough it’d be my favorite.

 

The new AVX is a improvement from the original.  With that said, I am not sure how these won't hold greens for the average golfer.  I have had no problem holding any green I have played.  Unless you are just hitting line drives or play on rock hard/small greens where literally 2 feet is the difference between life and death I don't see any issue with the AVX.   It is not like it is a Velocity. 

 

A bigger issue with the AVX, albeit a small one, is the one-off, unexpected jumper that flies 5 yds farther when not expected.  I think North Butte has addressed this in previous discussions.

 

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4 hours ago, The Pearl said:

 

The new AVX is a improvement from the original.  With that said, I am not sure how these won't hold greens for the average golfer.  I have had no problem holding any green I have played.  Unless you are just hitting line drives or play on rock hard/small greens where literally 2 feet is the difference between life and death I don't see any issue with the AVX.   It is not like it is a Velocity. 

 

A bigger issue with the AVX, albeit a small one, is the one-off, unexpected jumper that flies 5 yds farther when not expected.  I think North Butte has addressed this in previous discussions.

 

Fair points here. I do play on a (really short) course with tiny greens, not often firm but in tournaments they can be. Two feet can actually be a big deal at times even with wedge, but I definitely still put that responsibility on me, not just the ball.

 

What I’ve liked about the V1X is the consistency and jumpers do worry me even if they’re small. The margins are thin where I play. It seems the B XS also performed well for the slow swing speed. Before this came out not knowing better, I was tempted to try the e12 contact. But if I’m concerned now about the AVX spinning I highly doubt the e12 would fit my needs. I do have a soft spot for Bridgestone balls but Titleist is just so darn good.

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Driver: Honma TW747 10.5*

Fairways: Honma TW747 15* / 18*
Hybrids: Honma TW747 22* / 25*
Irons: Honma TW-X 6-11

Wedges: Honma TW-W4 54* / 58*
Putter: TaylorMade TP Collection Juno (33”)

Ball: Callaway Chrome Soft (2020)

 

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7 hours ago, trapsmv15 said:

Fair points here. I do play on a (really short) course with tiny greens, not often firm but in tournaments they can be. Two feet can actually be a big deal at times even with wedge, but I definitely still put that responsibility on me, not just the ball.

 

What I’ve liked about the V1X is the consistency and jumpers do worry me even if they’re small. The margins are thin where I play. It seems the B XS also performed well for the slow swing speed. Before this came out not knowing better, I was tempted to try the e12 contact. But if I’m concerned now about the AVX spinning I highly doubt the e12 would fit my needs. I do have a soft spot for Bridgestone balls but Titleist is just so darn good.

 

It is hard to beat the Prov1x.  The 2021 version is sublime. You can make an argument it is basically the equivalent of a one-decision golf ball. Price being the only variable if one is inclined to not play the lostgolfballs.com golf balls. 

 

I argued last year that the real value of the ball test is that it narrows down the choices so that it is pretty easy for a golfer to pick one ball if that is there desire.

 

I am certainly going to give the B XS is go here shortly. 

 

 

 

 

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15 hours ago, flushem said:

these are the brand new balls I must avoid as mid swing speed golfer:

  • Kirkland Performance+ 2.0
  • Inesis Tour 900
  • Wilson Staff Model
  • Mizuno RB Tour X

*I took out Pinnacle Range ball and Refurnished ProV1 from the selection

I'm a mid ss player.  I haven't played any of the balls other than the Kirkland.  I do not get the results they get in the test.  The Kirkland actually performs better for me than the 2019 TP5x (haven't played the 2021).  Not just you, but anyone, should try a sleeve of whatever balls they like, afford or have access to before making any judgement based solely on the MGS test.

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21 minutes ago, wantacigar said:

...should try a sleeve of whatever balls they like, afford or have access to before making any judgement based solely on the MGS test.

 

Agree. I would fall in their slow ss player and I find the Wilson Duo Pro is as long off the tee for me as any ball I have ever played, 2 piece, 3 piece, surlyn urethane, etc.

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Ping G410 Plus 12°/Xcaliber SL55, Maltby KE4 TC 5w/Xcaliber SL FW r flex, Maltby KE4 HyWay 21°/Xcaliber SL r flex, Maltby KE4 Tour TC 4h/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Maltby KE4 Tour TC 5h/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Maltby KE4 Tour+ 6-G/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Maltby TSW 54° and 58°/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Mizuno Bettinardi C06

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I love my Snell MTB-X, but I'd like to do a couple things: Bring my driver flight down a little without sacrificing carry distance, and get even more spin in the short/mid-range game. Looks like the B XS is a must-try and would accomplish exactly those things. The ProV1X would, as well -- wish I'd jumped on that deal Titleist had back in I think April.

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I think you can make a case that the 50/55 yd pitch test is pretty useless.  How many of these shots does the average golfer, let alone good golfer have in a round.  Other than perhaps a 3rd shot on a par 5, I can't think of many scenarios assuming a golfer is playing the proper tees.

 

Greenside spin and fitting that spin to your chipping technique is far more important I am guessing.

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MID SWING SPEED IRON

ROBOT AVERAGES

Club Speed: 77 mph

Ball speed: 108 mph

Launch Angle: 20.89

Spin: 6,052

Carry Yards: 158.69

Total Yards: 173.54

 

A 77mph 8 iron that carries 159 yards?  I don't think so.  Something seems off with the distances they were claiming.

Callaway Epic Max LS MMT 70X

Titleist TSi2 13.5* Diamana D+ Limited 80X

Titleist TSi2 18* Diamana D+ Limited 80X
Titleist 816H2 23* Speeder HB 8.8 TS
Ping G425 5-UW Steelfiber i95S
Ping Glide 2.0 SS 54* Steelfiber i95S

Cleveland CBX 2 60* DG 115
Scottie Newport M2

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8 hours ago, The Pearl said:

I think you can make a case that the 50/55 yd pitch test is pretty useless.  How many of these shots does the average golfer, let alone good golfer have in a round.  Other than perhaps a 3rd shot on a par 5, I can't think of many scenarios assuming a golfer is playing the proper tees.

 

Greenside spin and fitting that spin to your chipping technique is far more important I am guessing.

 

Don't think I can disagree more with that.

 

For better players that shot is incredibly important. Up and down from 50 for par OR on a par 5, it is almost always an important shot.

 

Same for higher handicappers who leave themselves that shot far more often than very good players.

Edited by nsxguy
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Ping G425 14.5 Fairway Tour AD TP

Adams Idea Pro 20* Aldila Stiff

Ping G20, 5-PW, DGS300 Yellow Dot

Ping Glide Forged, 48, 52, 60, DGS300

Cally PM Grind 56 KBS Tour 115

Odyssey OG 7 (Today)

Titleist ProV1x

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32 minutes ago, ShowMe said:

MID SWING SPEED IRON

ROBOT AVERAGES

Club Speed: 77 mph

Ball speed: 108 mph

Launch Angle: 20.89

Spin: 6,052

Carry Yards: 158.69

Total Yards: 173.54

 

A 77mph 8 iron that carries 159 yards?  I don't think so.  Something seems off with the distances they were claiming.

 

The test 8 iron they used had a loft of 34* which could be around the same loft as a 6 or 7 iron in a more traditionally lofted set. 

 

With that said, mid-high 70's mph mid iron does seem high for someone only swinging their driver 85 mph.

Edited by storm319
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4 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

 

Don't think I can disagree more with that.

 

For better players that shot is incredibly important. Up and won from 50 for part OR a par 5, it is almost always an important shot.

 

Same for higher handicappers who leave themselves that shot far more often than very good players.

 

I didn't say it was not important, I am simply questioning how often a good player has a 50 yd. pitch?  And I did put the exception as being a par 5.

 

No good player is going to have a 50 yd pitch on a Par 4 or a Par 3 unless they have made a grave error.   High handicappers are certainly a different story, but for those folks, urethane ball wedge spin is probably way down the list of concerns.  

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3 minutes ago, NRJyzr said:

 

Agree with nsx.  50-60 yard wedge shot is something that comes up a fair amount on my home course, due to the number of shorter holes.  

 

Ultimately, the fact that they chose a 55 yard shot isn't as important as their creating comparative data between the balls on something less than a full shot.  

 

Taking away the Par 5s, how many times?    Realize that hitting a Driver and a 50 yd wedge is far from the exception for 99% of golfers and course set-ups.

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2 minutes ago, The Pearl said:

Taking away the Par 5s, how many times?    Realize that hitting a Driver and a 50 yd wedge is far from the exception for 99% of golfers and course set-ups.


As Mr. @NRJyzr was alluding to I believe, in their blog during testing they stated that this shot and distance were selected as a point with greater spin differential between models than what they had previously.

Don’t think it had much to do with the usefulness of the shot itself. 

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5 minutes ago, The Pearl said:

Taking away the Par 5s, how many times?    Realize that hitting a Driver and a 50 yd wedge is far from the exception for 99% of golfers and course set-ups.

 

If one hits driver, it could easily be four or five.  I think of the range of that partial shot as 55 to 65 yds, if only because it's a usual range for me.  

 

I'm also counting one of the par 5s, because it's very much a three shot hole in spite of its length (515 or 500, depending on tees) due to the risk-reward nature of the hole (multiple hazards).  I usually try to lay up to 55-70 yds if it can be arranged.

 

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The Ever Changing Bag!  A lot of mixing and matching
Driver: Original One 11.5* (tuned down), NV75 X -or- SpeedZone 10.5*, Aldila ProtoPype 80S, <44" TBD

3w: King LTD, Aldila RIP Beta 90 X -or- TM Stage 2 Tour, Aldila NV105 X
Hybrid:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour 2h or 3h, NV105 S -or- RIP Alpha 105 S

Irons grab bag:  3-PW Mizuno MP37, Recoil Proto 125 F4; 3-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S; 2-PW Golden Ram TW282, RIP Tour 115 R
Wedges:  Dynacraft Dual Millled 52*, SteelFiber i125 S -or- Scratch 8620 DD 53*, SteelFiber i125 S; PM Grind 19 58* -or- Wilson Staff PMP 58*, Dynamic S
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34" -or- Cleveland Huntington Beach #1, 34.5" -or- Golden Ram TW Custom, 34"
Balls: Wilson Staff Duo Professional, TaylorMade TP5, Chrome Soft custom TruVis

GripMaster Roo or Kidd leather grips

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8 minutes ago, Jeff58 said:


As Mr. @NRJyzr was alluding to I believe, in their blog during testing they stated that this shot and distance were selected as a point with greater spin differential between models than what they had previously.

Don’t think it had much to do with the usefulness of the shot itself. 

 

 

Thanks, that makes sense and good call previously by @NRJyzr.

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