Shallowness question

[jomatty]

I’m toying with the idea of getting new irons.  No good reason other than I’ll enjoy something new.  My apex pro 19’s are treating me well, and I have no complaints.  There is nowhere convenient to do a fitting and I will likely buy used, and just sell if they do not work out.  I realize this is not the suggested way to do it, but I enjoy the process of trying new things and I can usually not lose much, if anything, when things don’t work out and I just need to resell.

my question is how shallow/steep would you consider my swing.  I’ve been very shallow and have worked to add some steepness.  I’m interested in the Srixon v-sole, but shallow players seem to not get along as well with them.  I’m curious if you guys think I’m too shallow for the vx7’s (in the short irons) to be a good fit.

I'm not specifically looking for swing advice, but certainly will take any suggestions into account.  I’m nervous to put myself out there to get eviscerated, so be gentle lol.  I don’t think I’m ready turn my swing over to a group of unvetted folks on a forum, but I’ll certainly keep tips in mind. My back does not allow me to make as full and deep a turn as I would like and other parts of my swing have had to be compromised to stay healthy. Because of this, and several other factors, length is an issue for me (not terrible but definitely not a strong suit of mine).   I play a lot and the most important thing is to stay active and keep from injuring myself.   

Mostly I’m looking for an answer to if I seem to shallow for Srixon v sole and yes, I know the right way to determine that is through a fitting, but that’s not in the cards right now, for several reasons (not even a store within 1.5 hours I can demo them).  Perhaps a better way to ask the question, rather than about specific irons, is how steep/shallow would you guys rate my swing?  I feel like I’ve changed that part of my swing so much that I have a hard time judging it right now.  Fwiw I’m currently at a 5.7 (I play a course that sets up well for me).

Thank you

Edited July 31, 2021 by jomatty

[LeftDaddy]

Impossible to tell from only a face-on view, but I can virtually guarantee you that you are too steep vs too shallow. This may be a definitional thing of what does shallow vs steep mean. But basically if your shaft was perpendicular to your back line on the way down you’d be shallower. I’m guessing you are thinking more “angle of attack” than “vertical swing plane”.  It could be that your AoA is “shallow” but I don’t see that necessarily either. You have a nice swing though. 
 

And to answer your question, I see no reason why those clubs would present you any problems. If you were worried that you were too shallow, getting them bent flatter would mostly solve that problem.  But my guess based on what little info I have is that your shaft is steeper than it is shallow. 
 

Full caveat, I’m a lowly 10 handicap who can’t know anything about the golf swing because of that…so take this with a grain of salt (though I do believe it is possible to know a lot about golf yet still be working on incorporating those things into your own swing).

Edited August 1, 2021 by LeftDaddy

[glk]

No one can see angle of attack.  Need a launch monitor.   Pitch of shaft in downswing does not correlate to aoa.     Frankly I’d ignore some comment from a random person on a forum about the clubs not working for a “shallow” swing whatever that means .   If you are 1 down with any iron you’ll likely have issues.

[RichieHunt]

As glk said, you're mixing up the terms.  'Shallowing' the club deals more with the plane of the shaft at p5 (when the lead arm is parallel to the ground in the downswing).  

 

Having a 'steep or shallow' attack angle is the angle downward, upward or flat the clubhead is going as it makes contact with the ball.  This cannot be accurately determined thru your typical camera.  You really need to get on a launch monitor to determine that.

 

As glk mentioned, there's no correlation between 'shallowing the shaft' and the attack angle.  I've seen very steep shaft plane golfers hit well upward and others well downward.  The same with more shallow shaft plane golfers.

 

Whether you're talking about the shaft plane or the Attack Angle, if it's shallow or if it's steep for one club than it's going to be steep or shallow for the rest as well.

 

If you have a -2* downward attack with a 9-iron, which is pretty shallow, you can best bet that your 5-iron will have a shallow downward attack (probably lesss than -1* downward).  If your shaft plane is steep with a 9-iron, it's going to be steep with a 5-iron.  

 

As far as fitting irons, it really depends on your swing and a launch monitor can help you better decide what irons best fit you.  I will say that I firmly believe that one of the biggest issues with iron sets is that, more often than not, only a fraction of the set will fit you the best.  But since they sell irons in full sets, you can get yourself into a situation where you may hit the long and mid irons well, but not hit the short irons very well simply because the specs and design are much different.

 

 

 

RH

 

 

[MK7Golf21]

I would say drive to a store and get fit, it will be worth it just to try them out before buying. That also usually satisfies the new club itch by hitting them and seeing in person. I have driven 2.5 hours to a pga superstore just to try clubs out and I’ve done that for fittings as well. It’s saved me considerable money and time I would of lost buying before trying.

[jomatty]

3 hours ago, glk said:

No one can see angle of attack.  Need a launch monitor.   Pitch of shaft in downswing does not correlate to aoa.     Frankly I’d ignore some comment from a random person on a forum about the clubs not working for a “shallow” swing whatever that means .   If you are 1 down with any iron you’ll likely have issues.

A lot more than 1 random person has made this comment...

[glk]

4 minutes ago, jomatty said:

A lot more than 1 random person has made this comment...

Seriously?  That’s your takeaway.

Edited August 1, 2021 by glk

[jomatty]

3 hours ago, RichieHunt said:

As glk said, you're mixing up the terms.  'Shallowing' the club deals more with the plane of the shaft at p5 (when the lead arm is parallel to the ground in the downswing).  

 

Having a 'steep or shallow' attack angle is the angle downward, upward or flat the clubhead is going as it makes contact with the ball.  This cannot be accurately determined thru your typical camera.  You really need to get on a launch monitor to determine that.

 

As glk mentioned, there's no correlation between 'shallowing the shaft' and the attack angle.  I've seen very steep shaft plane golfers hit well upward and others well downward.  The same with more shallow shaft plane golfers.

 

Whether you're talking about the shaft plane or the Attack Angle, if it's shallow or if it's steep for one club than it's going to be steep or shallow for the rest as well.

 

If you have a -2* downward attack with a 9-iron, which is pretty shallow, you can best bet that your 5-iron will have a shallow downward attack (probably lesss than -1* downward).  If your shaft plane is steep with a 9-iron, it's going to be steep with a 5-iron.  

 

As far as fitting irons, it really depends on your swing and a launch monitor can help you better decide what irons best fit you.  I will say that I firmly believe that one of the biggest issues with iron sets is that, more often than not, only a fraction of the set will fit you the best.  But since they sell irons in full sets, you can get yourself into a situation where you may hit the long and mid irons well, but not hit the short irons very well simply because the specs and design are much different.

 

 

 

RH

 

 

I did not realize that you could not see attack angle from video.  I definitely am not mixing up the term and do understand the difference between shallowing the club and a shallow angle of attack.  I suppose what I misunderstood is that it could be determined by seeing a video.  Thanks for input

[jomatty]

10 minutes ago, jomatty said:

A lot more than 1 random person has made this comment...

What would you have liked me to take away from your comment.  I appreciate you taking the time, and I didn’t realize you could not guesstimate aoa from a video.  My bad.  
Most people I’ve talked to about the v sole seem to think it works better for people with steeper aoa’s though and if it is impossible to tell from the video I posted I don’t know what else I can say...I posted a question no one can answer from the material provided so not much I can say about that.

Edited August 1, 2021 by jomatty

[jomatty]

3 hours ago, LeftDaddy said:

Impossible to tell from only a face-on view, but I can virtually guarantee you that you are too steep vs too shallow. This may be a definitional thing of what does shallow vs steep mean. But basically if your shaft was perpendicular to your back line on the way down you’d be shallower. I’m guessing you are thinking more “angle of attack” than “vertical swing plane”.  It could be that your AoA is “shallow” but I don’t see that necessarily either. You have a nice swing though. 
 

And to answer your question, I see no reason why those clubs would present you any problems. If you were worried that you were too shallow, getting them bent flatter would mostly solve that problem.  But my guess based on what little info I have is that your shaft is steeper than it is shallow. 
 

Full caveat, I’m a lowly 10 handicap who can’t know anything about the golf swing because of that…so take this with a grain of salt (though I do believe it is possible to know a lot about golf yet still be working on incorporating those things into your own swing).

Thank you, and I agree that skill level and expertise are not at all the same thing.  All my clubs get bent a degree flat.  I’ve worked hard to add some steepness to my aoa as previously I was really picking the ball a lot.  I developed some bad habits when I had some wrist and elbow issues that made me not want to take much of a divot.

I appreciate the feedback

[mgoblue83]

If you aren't willing to take the time to go demo the clubs then you might as well stick with your current irons.