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Vokey D Grind


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Hi, 

 

Looking at wedges at the moment.

 

I usually go 54/58 for lofts.

 

58 I used out of bunkers at the moment. 

 

Gound conditions for me are so variable in the UK, my home course fairways for distance wedges are medium and fringes tight and Bunkers are fluffy (luckily).

 

Trouble is I can go to a course somewhere else and find course conditions not so easy with poorer bunkers and un watered hard based fairways. 

 

Would 54D12 and 58M08 Grinds give me good variability options or does 58 with a bit more bounce and D work better?

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Not sure I could have 14 bounce on tight lies, However I have never tried this so who knows!

 

Thanks for the input, im trying to reduce how many I need test! Vokey has a big selection available now days since I've bought my current and previous wedges, its clear I need to go get testing with some. 

 

 

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I like the mid to high bounce in the SW and low to mid in the LW. I think that offers good versatility and Bob Vokey himself commonly fits with that formula. I find the M in the lob wedge works well in a variety of conditions including tight lies which important to most players in a LW.  I wouldn't look for more bounce in the LW unless you are really dig with the wedges or struggle out of your fluffy bunkers in which case the D might be the option.  In the SW, I'd consider the 54.10 S grind.  It's a solid, neutral wedge that works in all conditions.  I think the D grind is better suited for a medium to soft conditions LW.  Unless you use your 54 as your go to around the greens and frequently open the face, I'd look at the S grind over the D grind.  I think the S grind is better for full shots and square face pitches and chips.  On tour most of the 54 players go with the S or the F grind paired with a LW that has some relief like the M, L or T.

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I like wedges with a lot of bounce and will have some of the leading edge ground off so I can pick the ball clean off the turf.

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I play 54/D and 58/M.  The 54/D is the primary bunker club.  I think the combo is pretty versatile and the M is nicer on tight lies compared to the D.  Sometimes, I do get into a situation where I want to hit the lob wedge from fluffy rough or soggy ground and the M can be a little diggy.  Overall, I hit the D a little better than the M.  At some point, I'm going to pick up a 58D to experiment with. 

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1 hour ago, Daniel Eason said:

Not sure I could have 14 bounce on tight lies, However I have never tried this so who knows!

 

Thanks for the input, im trying to reduce how many I need test! Vokey has a big selection available now days since I've bought my current and previous wedges, its clear I need to go get testing with some. 

 

 

I was surprised how good the D is out of the sand. I also have like hitting full shots with the grind, so I may get my next 58 with a D instead of K.

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I play a 54D and a 58M currently and they pretty much cover everything I want them to do. The 58 does get tend to dig a little bit if the conditions are too soft or the sand is soft and fluffy.

 

My home course has bunker issues so the M grind is fine. When we get into the wet season though I swap in a higher bounce 58. 

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Interesting responses, so many comments that are useful. 

 

I rarely open the face on either club and prefer to use loft/ball position. 

 

Maybe 58 M could be a little unsuited to my soggy conditions October-March and even bunkers reading some of the input. 

 

If you want to see my course conditions Crossfield kindly demonstrates on this course VLOG video @ 19 mins.

 

I think if you had endless pots of money you'd buy grinds for both winter/summer here in the UK.

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Daniel Eason said:

Interesting responses, so many comments that are useful. 

 

I rarely open the face on either club and prefer to use loft/ball position. 

 

Maybe 58 M could be a little unsuited to my soggy conditions October-March and even bunkers reading some of the input. 

 

If you want to see my course conditions Crossfield kindly demonstrates on this course VLOG video @ 19 mins.

 

I think if you had endless pots of money you'd buy grinds for both winter/summer here in the UK.

 

 

 


if you are not manipulating the face much, I also very much like the S, which some people pointed to above.

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On 8/2/2021 at 3:22 PM, Daniel Eason said:

Not sure I could have 14 bounce on tight lies, However I have never tried this so who knows!

 

Thanks for the input, im trying to reduce how many I need test! Vokey has a big selection available now days since I've bought my current and previous wedges, its clear I need to go get testing with some. 

 

 

Not gonna lie, the D off a tight lie is stupid easy. I had thought i was in the bunker so I went over with my 58D and realized it was a super tight lie. Figured whats the worse that could happen, skull it, hit my partner (who I was pissed at anyway), opened it a touch and got it close. I am toying with getting a 54d as well

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14 hours ago, Mobert19 said:

54-10S and 58-12D. This gives me versatility everywhere and I like the high bounce for green side bunkers and generally around the green 

Bingo, I have the exact same setup (except 60-12D in the lob) and it gives all the versatility I need for different lie conditions.  60 is my primary bunker club so prefer the higher bounce there and for tricky rescue shots around green where more bounce (forgiveness) is an advantage for me.

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1 hour ago, manima1 said:

Bingo, I have the exact same setup (except 60-12D in the lob) and it gives all the versatility I need for different lie conditions.  60 is my primary bunker club so prefer the higher bounce there and for tricky rescue shots around green where more bounce (forgiveness) is an advantage for me.

 

What does the S do better vs the D?

 

 

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46 minutes ago, hardcaliber said:

 

What does the S do better vs the D?

 

 

 

I'd rephrase the question as "What does the S do differently than the D?". The S grind creates a full but basically narrow sole. The D grind has a crescent sole that the bounce is wider in the middle and narrow in the heel and toe. The D grind also has a very high measured bounce, so the leading edge sits much higher with a square face. The S grind will sit lower when played square. I would say both are fine to play slightly open, but neither can be played as open as the M grind.

 

The "feeling" I get through the turf is that the S grind is very fast and is more prone to digging. The "feeling" with the D grind is much more forgiving with turf interaction and it likes to be "thumped" into the ground. You have to try them on grass and in sand to really know, but my suspicion is that the D grind fits a wide variety of players because of the high measured bounce, mixed with the versatility of the sole grind.

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17 minutes ago, rsballer10 said:

 

I'd rephrase the question as "What does the S do differently than the D?". The S grind creates a full but basically narrow sole. The D grind has a crescent sole that the bounce is wider in the middle and narrow in the heel and toe. The D grind also has a very high measured bounce, so the leading edge sits much higher with a square face. The S grind will sit lower when played square. I would say both are fine to play slightly open, but neither can be played as open as the M grind.

 

The "feeling" I get through the turf is that the S grind is very fast and is more prone to digging. The "feeling" with the D grind is much more forgiving with turf interaction and it likes to be "thumped" into the ground. You have to try them on grass and in sand to really know, but my suspicion is that the D grind fits a wide variety of players because of the high measured bounce, mixed with the versatility of the sole grind.

 

That makes sense, thanks.

 

Like I said above, I get along really well with my D grind 54 and I'm thinking about converting my 58 to a D as well.  I do like to thump the sole into the ground so that makes sense.  One work around I have found with tighter lies is adding forward press and trying to clip the ball with the leading edge.

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21 minutes ago, hardcaliber said:

 

That makes sense, thanks.

 

Like I said above, I get along really well with my D grind 54 and I'm thinking about converting my 58 to a D as well.  I do like to thump the sole into the ground so that makes sense.  One work around I have found with tighter lies is adding forward press and trying to clip the ball with the leading edge.

 

I get what you're saying. I find with tight lies I actually prefer to open the face a little. Helps catch it low on the face and basically hit a spinner.

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4 hours ago, rsballer10 said:

 

I'd rephrase the question as "What does the S do differently than the D?". The S grind creates a full but basically narrow sole. The D grind has a crescent sole that the bounce is wider in the middle and narrow in the heel and toe. The D grind also has a very high measured bounce, so the leading edge sits much higher with a square face. The S grind will sit lower when played square. I would say both are fine to play slightly open, but neither can be played as open as the M grind.

 

The "feeling" I get through the turf is that the S grind is very fast and is more prone to digging. The "feeling" with the D grind is much more forgiving with turf interaction and it likes to be "thumped" into the ground. You have to try them on grass and in sand to really know, but my suspicion is that the D grind fits a wide variety of players because of the high measured bounce, mixed with the versatility of the sole grind.

This is a pretty good explanation - don't let the grinds deter you toooo much though, I've hit a WIDE open face flop shot with a 56S  just fine, it just moves a bit different through the turf. 

 

If you have the opportunity to work with a titleist fitter through different grinds on medium pitches and short shots around the green it is incredibly valuable to your understanding of your game, whether at a free fitting day, or a paid fitting - well worth it, even if you don't buy a wedge.

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On 8/4/2021 at 8:49 AM, hardcaliber said:

 

What does the S do better vs the D?

 

 

 

I find the S is better on square face full shots and chips.  I barely if at all manipulate the face on the S grind (although it is possible to do so), but almost always manipulate the face on the D grind.

 

S grind will dig more, but I wouldn't classify it as low bounce at all.

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Is S grind like a Cleveland RTX grind? im on these at the moment and it does look it.

 

D grind with 58 is making sense, on S grind "classic" bounce this may had meant going with less bounce on a lob wedge and  working the leading edge as carefully as possible, but everything needs to be right.

 

Had a go with my buddies JAWS with C grind, that seems to be the Vokey S grind but with heel relieve like M/D?

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On 8/5/2021 at 3:48 PM, Daniel Eason said:

Is S grind like a Cleveland RTX grind? im on these at the moment and it does look it.

 

D grind with 58 is making sense, on S grind "classic" bounce this may had meant going with less bounce on a lob wedge and  working the leading edge as carefully as possible, but everything needs to be right.

 

Had a go with my buddies JAWS with C grind, that seems to be the Vokey S grind but with heel relieve like M/D?

The Mid Bounce in the Cleveland RTX Zipcore is similar to the Vokey and Callaway S.  The Callaway C grind would be the M in the Vokey and the X in the Callaway would be the D in the Vokey.  The S would be the same for the Callaway and the Vokey. 

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On 8/6/2021 at 10:01 PM, RobS said:

The Mid Bounce in the Cleveland RTX Zipcore is similar to the Vokey and Callaway S.  The Callaway C grind would be the M in the Vokey and the X in the Callaway would be the D in the Vokey.  The S would be the same for the Callaway and the Vokey. 

 

Thanks this is what I thought. 

 

I've actually had a grind of an old 58 degree RTX wedge with the similar grind to D/M grind and its been interesting to see how it went.

 

Out of tight lies you definitely can tell the difference/benefit of the heel relieve, out of thick rough/spongey lies its like the clubs going straight under. The loft on that is 58 though so d grind in 54 would be probably better to get the pop up.

 

I've got RTX Mid grinds at the moment, I find opening the face not so easy on tight lies so maybe I need to get into this heel relieve type grind. 

 

I like the Jaw S grind as it says it has the heel relieve too.

 

God I wish I could get all these wedges....lol

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Im still unsure about going 60.12.D, does this level of bounce not feel the same as having this much bounce in an S grind.

 

I've always gone less bounce in the 58 compared to 54 so feels a bit backwards, but wonder if heel being reduced allows me to slide under a little easier than S grind.

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, Daniel Eason said:

Im still unsure about going 60.12.D, does this level of bounce not feel the same as having this much bounce in an S grind.

 

I've always gone less bounce in the 58 compared to 54 so feels a bit backwards, but wonder if heel being reduced allows me to slide under a little easier than S grind.

I have RTX 4 and go mid grind in my 54 and low in my 60. Personally it makes sense to have the higher lofted wedge with a more versatile grind and lower bounce if you need to do something fancy and open the face. I use the 54 most of the time if I don't need to do anything special and just hit a plain old chip or pitch, maybe just open the face a touch but mostly square. On the firmer links style course near me I almost only use my 60, the low grind is awesome squared up and with the face open.

 

I also use my 60 out of the sand almost every time, regardless if they're cement or nice and fluffy. 54 only if it's a longer bunker shot with fluffy sand. It really just depends on the conditions of the courses you play and what situations you want to use our wedges for.

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I played a round at a wedding weekend with a friend's bag because I showed up with no clubs.  The highlight of the borrowed bag was the 58 D.  Super easy to hit out of bunkers and rough but more versatile, for me at least, than the K grind.  It gets high marks from me.

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