Building A Swing To Minimize Lower Back Pain

[tinman143]

Hi all - I'm a dude that lives with chronic lower back pain/soreness. Adding golf to things does not help. That being said, I will NOT give up this game! Something worth noting is that after golfing, the area that is super sore is my lower right back. I'm right handed so it's my trail side that is barking...not the left. FWIW I'm also an EE guy so I have suspicions that there's some ties there OR it could be that my hips dont fully rotate on the backswing (I dont consciously try to restrict my hips). Just throwing potential causes out there.

 

For those out there that deal with lower back issues, have you built a swing that puts less strain on the lower back? Are there pointers I can consider implementing to deal with it? Happy to add a vid of my swing if that helps. TIA

[hoselrocker]

I’m a lower back pain sufferer as well.  Stenosis at L5 S1 and other stuff going on. It feels like a dagger in the spine. Enough about me - I’m no expert on the swing but I can say from my own issues that you’re swing issues like EE are a result of the bodies desire to protect itself from further harm from an inherently back stressing golf swing.
As hard as I try my body will never let me get into great golf positions so I (we) have to make it work other ways. 

Here’s what I’ve done and it’s going to sound goofy. I tried this again yesterday and it allowed my to play 18 and shoot a 79 (fantastic score for me) with minimal back issues the next day - are you ready? 
YouTube Bobby Jones swing. I stumbled on it a couple years ago and tried it at the range and on the course but like all things golf never stuck with it. It’s a very old school swing but he swings it so fluidly and easily with minimal tension. I’m sure others more versed in the swing might say it’s not a good model but it allows me to play with no pain. So on those days where I’m not playing golf swing and trying to force results (never going to happen for me) I tell myself on the tee - swing like Bobby Jones. My .02 cents for what that’s worth.
Good luck but I’m interested in the replies as well!

 

edit: try to find the video where Mr. Jones is describing how he hits the ball and build around that. I just went on the Tube and there are many videos of his swing. 

Edited August 6, 2021 by hoselrocker

[dlygrisse]

24 minutes ago, hoselrocker said:

I’m a lower back pain sufferer as well.  Stenosis at L5 S1 and other stuff going on. It feels like a dagger in the spine. Enough about me - I’m no expert on the swing but I can say from my own issues that you’re swing issues like EE are a result of the bodies desire to protect itself from further harm from an inherently back stressing golf swing.
As hard as I try my body will never let me get into great golf positions so I (we) have to make it work other ways. 

Here’s what I’ve done and it’s going to sound goofy. I tried this again yesterday and it allowed my to play 18 and shoot a 79 (fantastic score for me) with minimal back issues the next day - are you ready? 
YouTube Bobby Jones swing. I stumbled on it a couple years ago and tried it at the range and on the course but like all things golf never stuck with it. It’s a very old school swing but he swings it so fluidly and easily with minimal tension. I’m sure others more versed in the swing might say it’s not a good model but it allows me to play with no pain. So on those days where I’m not playing golf swing and trying to force results (never going to happen for me) I tell myself on the tee - swing like Bobby Jones. My .02 cents for what that’s worth.
Good luck but I’m interested in the replies as well!

 

edit: try to find the video where Mr. Jones is describing how he hits the ball and build around that. I just went on the Tube and there are many videos of his swing. 

I can relate.  My basic swing philosophy has changed from more of a body driven approach to using the MDLT approach. It’s similar to Jones in that it’s more of a arm swinging method.  
 

also compare Tigers swing in 2019 vs. what he was doing before he hurt his back. His swing is much smoother, it’s like he is just sensing the swing of the club not firing the hips and driving the legs. He finishes more balanced with the driver with everything coming through more level. 
 

I have 100% quit worrying about body position and just think about swinging the club to the target. 

[tinman143]

26 minutes ago, hoselrocker said:

I’m a lower back pain sufferer as well.  Stenosis at L5 S1 and other stuff going on. It feels like a dagger in the spine. Enough about me - I’m no expert on the swing but I can say from my own issues that you’re swing issues like EE are a result of the bodies desire to protect itself from further harm from an inherently back stressing golf swing.
As hard as I try my body will never let me get into great golf positions so I (we) have to make it work other ways. 

Here’s what I’ve done and it’s going to sound goofy. I tried this again yesterday and it allowed my to play 18 and shoot a 79 (fantastic score for me) with minimal back issues the next day - are you ready? 
YouTube Bobby Jones swing. I stumbled on it a couple years ago and tried it at the range and on the course but like all things golf never stuck with it. It’s a very old school swing but he swings it so fluidly and easily with minimal tension. I’m sure others more versed in the swing might say it’s not a good model but it allows me to play with no pain. So on those days where I’m not playing golf swing and trying to force results (never going to happen for me) I tell myself on the tee - swing like Bobby Jones. My .02 cents for what that’s worth.
Good luck but I’m interested in the replies as well!

 

edit: try to find the video where Mr. Jones is describing how he hits the ball and build around that. I just went on the Tube and there are many videos of his swing. 

 

Thanks for your input hosel. I will take 79 ANY FRIGGIN DAY! I think I've seen enough Bobby Jones footage but point taken...smoooth and tension free. FWIW, I played a few rounds in the past month where I focused on tension free swinging (vs my usual hit-it-farthest mentality/aggressive swinging) which resulted in a pain free next day. I just thought it had to do with my stretches vs swinging easy.

 

The range sessions where I'm trying to properly side bend through impact leaves my trail lower back angry with me for a few days. I dont know if this is your case but attempting to do a yoga camel pose would probably send me to ER. Even ending my swing with an arched back/belly extended toward the target/chest pointed up kills my back! I'll leave that to the flexible folks. 😞

[ChaosTheory]

17 years ago I had the same quest.  I switched to what at the time was Natural Golf, and it was 100% successful in eliminating my back pain.  I’m still using it.  Today the same kind of swing is being taught by Todd Graves aka Graves Golf, and by Kirk Junge.  My swing is like Junge.  See YouTube for each.

[nitram]

Most lower back pain for me comes from an over-active lower body. Check out Monte's "No Turn Cast" thread here at Wrx and his video on rebelliongolf.com. I've had several guys tell me this has allowed them to play pain free.

[hoselrocker]

The only other things I might add would be to strengthen your core. Don’t know about you but my core muscles are not conditioned. There are many core strengthening exercises one can do and I’m not talking sit ups. Planks etc and tons of golf specific moves. Also, for those of us with back troubles managing our waistlines is a must. Keeping the weight down lessens the strain on other support muscles that can become imbalanced and aggravate a bad back. Easier said than done I know! I think the core is often overlooked by us weekend athletes and its role in pretty much every sport. 
Another important part for me was playing Bobby Jones golf and playing from appropriate tees which kept me from having to swing harder to keep up. 

[jomatty]

I’m trying to make some changes to protect my back.  Mostly I’m trying to not restrict my hips.  Eventually I’d like my front heel to lift a little.  I’m looking at guys like jack and Phil who seem to have long careers with limited back issues.  My natural swing, or the one I learned when I was younger is more X factor (not that I knew what that was) similar to tiger or JDay.  I feel like if I could free up my front hip more and lift my heel to get more of a turn with less stress on my back it would help with the pain.

[LeftDaddy]

Believe it or not, but “poor posture” at address like Gankas teaches (and the old greats like Bobby Jones used) is way easier on my back than the “athletic” address position that has been taught for the last few decades. Use a rounded upper back and keep your pelvis mostly upright. It’s weird at first and hard to get used to, but after a little while it is much more comfortable. 
 

Also adding that using a foam roller on my back has helped me as I work on some swing speed drills. 

Edited August 6, 2021 by LeftDaddy

[Saltydawg15]

Google Eldoa stretches, this is what Tiger woods used and his coach at the time Dan Hellman has worked with many golfers.
 

I suffered lower back issues and had a few issues with my back spasming until I began doing these stretches. They are designed to help with stenosis.

[marte]

LeftDaddy..."Use a rounded upper back and keep your pelvis mostly upright."

 

Would pulling the tailbone forward (instead of pushing it back and up like I do) be keeping the pelvis mostly upright?

 

I'm 74.  Back pain for 32 years getting progressively worse to the point that I played just one 9 last year (used to play 35-40 rounds years ago) and won't golf this year at all due to the back pain and major surgery (not back related) in the Spring.

 

I'd like to resume playing next spring/summer but can do so only if, like tinman143 said,  I can "built a swing that puts less strain on the lower back".  So looking forward to lots replies on this subject.  Thanks for starting this topic tinman143.

 

ps...while writing this post I took some gentle indoor 1/2 swings with my tailbone pulled forward a bit and it felt fine.  

[Nard_S]

Move your tail bone towards the target. Progressively get it there on back swing and in the lateral shift of transition.  At impact tail bone should be 2-3 inches more forward than address. If you swing like this, the back never hurts. The caveat is don't allow it to fall back, away then lunge it towards target, that's a back killer. I can swing 500 balls a week and I'm 58, have other issues but back is not one of them.

[MountainKing]

13 hours ago, LeftDaddy said:

Believe it or not, but “poor posture” at address like Gankas teaches (and the old greats like Bobby Jones used) is way easier on my back than the “athletic” address position that has been taught for the last few decades. Use a rounded upper back and keep your pelvis mostly upright. It’s weird at first and hard to get used to, but after a little while it is much more comfortable. 
 

Also adding that using a foam roller on my back has helped me as I work on some swing speed drills. 

 

His "poor posture" is probably more correct posture, and the straight lines we see from the young guys on tour are poor.  It allows you to use the part the back that rotates rather than your lower back which doesn't.  I had lower back surgery last year, I've stopped using my lower body so much coming down and rotating my hips more.  I've lost some distance but it seems to really have helped with the soreness.   

On top of swing changes, dropping weight and core strength has really helps as well.  If it's that bad tho, and you want to keep golfing, you probably should consult with your doctor and physical therapist, and not an internet forum. 

[tinman143]

46 minutes ago, marte said:

LeftDaddy..."Use a rounded upper back and keep your pelvis mostly upright."

 

Would pulling the tailbone forward (instead of pushing it back and up like I do) be keeping the pelvis mostly upright?

 

I'm 74.  Back pain for 32 years getting progressively worse to the point that I played just one 9 last year (used to play 35-40 rounds years ago) and won't golf this year at all due to the back pain and major surgery (not back related) in the Spring.

 

I'd like to resume playing next spring/summer but can do so only if, like tinman143 said,  I can "built a swing that puts less strain on the lower back".  So looking forward to lots replies on this subject.  Thanks for starting this topic tinman143.

 

ps...while writing this post I took some gentle indoor 1/2 swings with my tailbone pulled forward a bit and it felt fine.  

The idea is to line up the armpits over the balls of the feet vs in front of toes and ‘round’ your upper back/ shoulders.

 

Lots of suggestions on this thread so far that I will try. Thanks for everyone’s comments. 

[LeftDaddy]

10 minutes ago, tinman143 said:

The idea is to line up the armpits over the balls of the feet vs in front of toes and ‘round’ your upper back/ shoulders.

 

Lots of suggestions on this thread so far that I will try. Thanks for everyone’s comments. 

Yes, which also keeps the pelvis a bit more upright (rather than fully flexed). 

Gankas also suggests you are eliminating the need to goat hump / early extend because the pelvis is already properly positioned closer to the ball. 

[SwingBlues]

15 hours ago, Snowman9000 said:

17 years ago I had the same quest.  I switched to what at the time was Natural Golf, and it was 100% successful in eliminating my back pain.  I’m still using it.  Today the same kind of swing is being taught by Todd Graves aka Graves Golf, and by Kirk Junge.  My swing is like Junge.  See YouTube for each.

 

+ with snowman

 

In my experience, I tried Junge and to me, it's no different to a regular swing with the compression/sheering feeling so I am sticking with Todd. Once the sequence is executing, my back does feel like a one unit movement. It's taken me just over a year to get the swing right. Back is awesome and I walk and push a heavy cart (beers and all) 😁

 

Agree on core strength building as well as hip mobility exercises are keys in keeping my lower back as supple & strong as possible.

[marte]

44 minutes ago, tinman143 said:

The idea is to line up the armpits over the balls of the feet vs in front of toes and ‘round’ your upper back/ shoulders.

 

Lots of suggestions on this thread so far that I will try. Thanks for everyone’s comments. 

Thanks tinman143 and LeftDaddy

[casman]

I'm 68 and have a PARS Fracture at L5 , feels like an ice pick in your spine.

Find a decent back brace it's the only way I get through a round.

Afterwords a good Epson Salt bath and some ice packs.

Try to stay stable over the ball and don't sway , swaying will make it worse.

I just shot 75 from the Blue Tees,  6300 yds at Finley GC in Chapel Hill so there is hope.

 

[Roejye]

Been dealing with a back injury since the end of March. I found out I have degenerative disc disease, I've been going to pt and doing the exercises. The muscles in my back feel like they're very close to normal, but I still have some issues. 

 

I use a stabilizer and I am working on losing weight and strengthening my core. I have really let my core muscles go the past few years and I think it's a big reason why the strain has lasted as long as it has (well golfing hasn't helped.) One thing I've found that had aggravated it has been when I've had to carry something, but also land it in a small area. Other than that, I was doing okay with taking way too much club and trying extended pitch and runs.

 

 

[tinman143]

5 hours ago, SwingBlues said:

 

+ with snowman

 

In my experience, I tried Junge and to me, it's no different to a regular swing with the compression/sheering feeling so I am sticking with Todd. Once the sequence is executing, my back does feel like a one unit movement. It's taken me just over a year to get the swing right. Back is awesome and I walk and push a heavy cart (beers and all) 😁

 

Agree on core strength building as well as hip mobility exercises are keys in keeping my lower back as supple & strong as possible.

 

this is the 2nd endorsement for Graves gold and I will have to do some serious research now. Thanks again everyone and glad to hear people are finding ways to continue this great game despite physical pains!

[N0rs3man]

I've been working on a swing for 5 years that has eliminated all lower back pain, and on a plus note has added 40 yards off the tee. I play pain free and have never enjoyed golf this much...

 

Worst part is thx to Solomon its not worth my time explaining it.. good luck

[torbill]

I’m 77 and am still a mid single digit player.  I’ve had a back problem, due to golf, for at least 35 years.  Had I not changed my swing and my attitude toward exercise I would have been out of golf at about 70, debilitating back problem.

 

I changed to the Jimmy Ballard method, and it has been magic.  Ballard teaches classic golf principles, not modern principles.  In his time he worked with hundreds of tour pros including majors champions - Miller, Seve, Lyles, Strange, Sutton, probably others I can’t think of at the moment.  The man knows his stuff and his technique is back-sparing.  

 

I’m a retired engineer.  I have an excellent understanding of mechanics.  The modern swing tends to put an enormous amount of twisting on the spine, mostly the lower spine.  It’s a shearing action, and lower backs were never intended for serious amounts of shear, any orthopedic expert will tell you this.  The classic swing tends to distribute and reduce the twisting/shearing - hips rotate more, left heel not planted to the ground, greater weight shift.  Also, Ballard teaches NO hitting into a reverse-C, which is a killer over time.  I mean, think about it.  You are encouraged to rotate your shoulders 90 degrees or more with very little hip rotation - enormous shear on the lumbar spine, very few backs will hold up over the long term under this kind of shearing stress.  And some teach holding the head back and hitting into a reverse-C.

 

A back-sparing swing method is key to saving my back.  If you don’t like Ballard, find something other than the modern swing, there are others out there.  Just look at Phil.  Phil never worked with Ballard, and I don’t like some aspects of what he does, getting disconnected and whatnot.  But he is 51 years old, just won a major and has never had a back problem to the best of my knowledge.  Phil’s swing is much more classical than modern.  Rocco had a terrible back problem.  Went to Ballard.  Now claims that he has no back problem.  You do NOT have to do modern swing principles to play great golf!

 

The other thing that I have done is to get religious about exercise.  I do a couple of simple yoga poses and stretching of the big leg muscles and hip flexors.  On my floor, at home, 10 minutes 3X/week - simple, no cost, no special equipment, no personal trainer, no driving to the gym.  My yoga poses are called the plank, and the Superman or Rocketman or somesuch.  Before getting religion my back would go out at least once a season, and it was an automatic two weeks of rest and misery.  I have missed exactly 27 holes of golf due to my back since starting this exercise program, which as I recall is about 6 years now.  When I began this program I could hold the plank pose for a count of 5 and at that point the pain was terrible - I literally thought that my back would never be OK again.  Now I count to 600 with absolutely no pain.  

 

A back sparing swing method and a simple exercise program.  Works for me.  Good luck! 😉

Edited August 7, 2021 by torbill

[tinman143]

Thanks for sharing Torbill👌

[Nickc]

Brian Sparks - easiest swing (and similar)?

[ChaosTheory]

5 hours ago, Nickc said:

Brian Sparks - easiest swing (and similar)?

There is a lot of spine friendliness in his swing.  For me, it’s not as friendly as the Moe Norman type swings.  Everyone is a little different.  Any swing I use that has a conventional arm angle at setup will lead me to have more back twisting, and discomfort, on the down swing.  

[Lefthook]

I’ve had back problems on and off for 20 years, but golf has had a chiropractic impact. A key here is to avoid the dreaded sway past impact. And a means has been to use extra knee bend at address which enables a more angled turn of the pelvis … which in turn enables the spine to do more turn and less sway. Not sure if this is for everyone, but lots of in bend at address works for me. I think of it as being a soccer goal keeper in a penalty kick situation: Ready to jump in all directions.

[Hstead]

Personally, fixing my swing has helped my back tremendously.  I would recommend getting a video lesson or in person lesson with a good instructor.  I was right tilting too early and not staying in left tilt in the beginning of the downswing.  It put a ton of pressure on my right lower back.  Once I fixed the early right tilt, no more back problems.

[tinman143]

7 hours ago, Hstead said:

Personally, fixing my swing has helped my back tremendously.  I would recommend getting a video lesson or in person lesson with a good instructor.  I was right tilting too early and not staying in left tilt in the beginning of the downswing.  It put a ton of pressure on my right lower back.  Once I fixed the early right tilt, no more back problems.

Early right tilt is also an issue for me. What feels did you incorporate to stay in left tilt? I’m glad to hear this alleviated your trail lower back issue 😮. 

[woodriff]

I hear you, and I’m in the club. Tom Watson suggests swinging in a barrel. A more rotary motion. It definitely helped me. 

[NoTalentLefty]

On 8/5/2021 at 8:32 PM, dlygrisse said:

I can relate.  My basic swing philosophy has changed from more of a body driven approach to using the MDLT approach. It’s similar to Jones in that it’s more of a arm swinging method.  
 

also compare Tigers swing in 2019 vs. what he was doing before he hurt his back. His swing is much smoother, it’s like he is just sensing the swing of the club not firing the hips and driving the legs. He finishes more balanced with the driver with everything coming through more level. 
 

I have 100% quit worrying about body position and just think about swinging the club to the target. 

I agree fully. Just came off a Jim Venetos like golf swing to help with hip pain, my back was starting to hurt. Went back to Manuel’s teachings. Played 18 holes and actually felt like I could play another 9. That hasn’t happened in years.