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Kisner's wedge set up


mvhoffman
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I’m sort of in the same situation. I have 46, 50, 56, and 58. I simply love having a 56 and will never not have one in the bag and I felt like I’m not giving anything up even with the 6 degree gap between 50 and 56. 
 

With that said, i’m not sure if I could remove my 50 and only have 46, 56, 58 without having some trouble with 115-100 yard shots. Do you want a 52 out of the bag to have an extra hybrid, 2/3 iron, or 5/7 wood? Or rather, what shot do you feel like you don’t have in the bag that you want added in rather than your 52?

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13 minutes ago, skraly said:

If I read the WITB correctly his 54 is bent to 52.  Giving him 46-52-60

I didn’t notice that. 

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2 hours ago, TigerInTheWoods said:


What you need to do is work out how far you hit your PW 

 

47* - 142 full 
51* - 130 full 
55* - 112 full  

60* - 100 full  

 


 

I think for many ams it’s a better idea is keeping the 4 wedges and dropping your 4 iron for a 22* ish hybrid or utility to improve long club gapping, which is much more difficult to get right and not bunch you. Driver - 3w (or 4w) - 5w (or 7w) - Hybrid or utility - 5-9 - P, G , S, L. 

 


 

 

Not a long hitter - 7i 140yds.You'd be surprised how much Par 3 yardage factors over how far I'm hitting my pw. Once long, forced carry Par 3 come into play - heck with 4 wedges.......I need a traditional 3wd 

 

D 5w 7w 9w 5h 6i-pw 50 54 58 is my go too set up.....3w 5w etc 46 52 58 goes into long courses bag set up 

 

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41 minutes ago, driveandputtmachine said:

Kisner is a pure ball striker.  He hits everything pure(he's on the PGA Tour), however he is not the longest player on tour.  So it stands to reason he hits very few wedges for approach shots into greens on par 4's and probably rarely has a par 3 he's hitting one of those wedges.  When he misses greens, he has dialed his short game with multiple shots he can hit with the 60 and his 54(bent to 52).  

 

At the same time, some of the par5's that the long guys are hitting mid and long irons into, he's hitting hybrid, fairway wood, or utility iron into and having more options in those areas allow him to score better to help alleviate his distance gaps.

 

In no way am I saying he is short, because he hits it further than most people on the planet, but when you are 169th on the tour in driving distance, having smaller gaps in your distance in the top end of the bag makes sense when you are constantly playing courses over 7200 yards and are hitting mid irons and longer into most par 4 greens.

 

I think that is part of it for sure but I think another part of it is that he is more of a feel player.  Feel players are more likely to make a club they can hit higher and longer land shorter with lower trajectory when they feel it is the right approach as opposed to clubbing down or feeling like they need an additional wedge to cover a gap.  

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8 hours ago, animalgolfs said:

Not a long hitter - 7i 140yds.You'd be surprised how much Par 3 yardage factors over how far I'm hitting my pw. Once long, forced carry Par 3 come into play - heck with 4 wedges.......I need a traditional 3wd 

 

D 5w 7w 9w 5h 6i-pw 50 54 58 is my go too set up.....3w 5w etc 46 52 58 goes into long courses bag set up 

 

How far are you hitting your 54 that you need a 58?  I hit my 7i about 145 to 150.  By the time I get down to my 54 it's going about 60 yds and I'd much rather hit a half a 54 for 30 or 40 yards than try to hit a 58.  An easy swing with a 54 or 50 is much more effective and less stressful than a hard swing with a 58.  

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One of those deals where there is no etched in stone way to do things. One has to do what fits their individual game. Me I am a lot different that I play older clubs with more traditional lofts. My PW is 48 and then the SW 56 and I have also started practicing and carrying my 60* again, But that is what works for me and it may not work for you or anyone else. I had to revamp my game entirely due to aging and a dehabilitating back injury. Now days if I have over 200 yards to a Par 5 I aint going for it because I can not reach. I may pull the 7 wood instead of the 3 wood and leave me a lay up of say 100 yards or so in which I can hit my PW. I say what ever you experiment with and can work with on your game. Myself I will admit I am Old School as heck but I do not cut down others even if they carry 4 wedges or more. 

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2 hours ago, driveandputtmachine said:

Kisner is a pure ball striker.  He hits everything pure(he's on the PGA Tour), however he is not the longest player on tour.  So it stands to reason he hits very few wedges for approach shots into greens on par 4's and probably rarely has a par 3 he's hitting one of those wedges.  When he misses greens, he has dialed his short game with multiple shots he can hit with the 60 and his 54(bent to 52).  

 

At the same time, some of the par5's that the long guys are hitting mid and long irons into, he's hitting hybrid, fairway wood, or utility iron into and having more options in those areas allow him to score better to help alleviate his distance gaps.

 

In no way am I saying he is short, because he hits it further than most people on the planet, but when you are 169th on the tour in driving distance, having smaller gaps in your distance in the top end of the bag makes sense when you are constantly playing courses over 7200 yards and are hitting mid irons and longer into most par 4 greens.

This...its what I went to this year.  More up top...Webb Simpson Style as well.  It has taken me a bit to get dialed in to 46, 52, 58 after going 46, 50, 54, 60.  But I think I am getting there...and the Z745 PW has become a great club for me to power up or feather depending on the shot.  

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22 hours ago, mvhoffman said:

I'm thinking about going to Kisner's wedge set up.  He has 46, 54, 60.  Currently I have 46, 52, 56, 60.  Rarely do i use the 52.  Extremely rare actually.  This past week I played in Ocean City, MD at a course (War Admiral) that played 6600 yards from the tees we played and I did not touch it once.  I rarely leave myself that yardage even around my local courses.  

 

My 52 may be going up for sale and getting refilled with a hybrid.  It will be a bunch at the top of the bag, but depending on the course it may be a better bunching than the wedge section of the bag.

 

For this spring and the early part of the summer I had a 46-degree AW as part of my iron set and then 52 and 58 degree wedges. The gap from 52 to 58 was no problem but over time I seemed to end up at what would be the perfect yardage for a 50-degree wedge like 3, 4, 5 times a round. It was unreal how often that was happening.

 

In theory, no reason I couldn't have just invested a little range time and gotten good at taking 15 yards off my 46-degree AW. But I took the easy way out, got rid of the 52 and replaced it with a 50 and 54.

 

Still, I get what he's doing. That's a pitching wedge, a sand wedge and a lob wedge. Nothing limiting about that if you have a good wedge game which Kisner certainly does.

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1 hour ago, LeoLeo99 said:

How far are you hitting your 54 that you need a 58?  I hit my 7i about 145 to 150.  By the time I get down to my 54 it's going about 60 yds and I'd much rather hit a half a 54 for 30 or 40 yards than try to hit a 58.  An easy swing with a 54 or 50 is much more effective and less stressful than a hard swing with a 58.  

58 70yds & I use it greenside/bunkers.....and we play different games

 

I make Ernie Els look like Nick Price in regards to tempo

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18 minutes ago, North Butte said:

The gap from 52 to 58 was no problem but over time I seemed to end up at what would be the perfect yardage for a 50-degree wedge like 3, 4, 5 times a round. It was unreal how often that was happening.

 

This right here....more yardage shots from 50* than  52*

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42 minutes ago, sonnygolf said:

This is very good to hear. I have been stuck trying to work how out how I can play 3 wedges. Glad to know its working for you.  I am def doing this too

PW is full 135 down to flighted 120

52 is full 120 down to flighted 100

58 is full 100 on down.

 

Only shots I don’t love are about 110 downwind, I don’t hit 52 hard enough to stop it and that’s a big 58. 
 

I’m a feel player as far up the bag as I can get though. If I have a full 8 distance I’m hitting flighted 7 every chance I get. Comfortable just kind of punching shots in there, so few wedges have worked for me 

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23 minutes ago, Hattie Pants said:

PW is full 135 down to flighted 120

52 is full 120 down to flighted 100

58 is full 100 on down.

 

Only shots I don’t love are about 110 downwind, I don’t hit 52 hard enough to stop it and that’s a big 58. 
 

I’m a feel player as far up the bag as I can get though. If I have a full 8 distance I’m hitting flighted 7 every chance I get. Comfortable just kind of punching shots in there, so few wedges have worked for me 

I'm very UNcomfortable playing anything but a "stock" swing with an iron. But it's interesting, I end up with the same issue from an only slightly shorter distance when I'm between my shortest iron (46-degree AW goes flies about 108) and my longest wedge when I carried the 52-degree (about 92 yards).

 

I could hit the 52-degree really hard with the face hooded a bit and maybe eke 95 or so out of it but for me that's just a stupid swing to be trying from anything other than a perfect lie. 

 

So if I had 100 yards there was no real choice but to hit the AW. Get the greens firm, a touch of breeze behind and my little choke down back in stance AW would end up flying 105 and taking a big bounce forward. 

 

Now I've got the 50-degree and can hit a 96, 97 yard shot without swinging hard. Even with a breeze behind it'll stop pretty quick. 

From August 18, 2021 I will be away from GolfWRX for a while.

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On 8/16/2021 at 9:40 AM, mvhoffman said:

I'm thinking about going to Kisner's wedge set up.  He has 46, 54, 60.  Currently I have 46, 52, 56, 60.  Rarely do i use the 52.  Extremely rare actually.  This past week I played in Ocean City, MD at a course (War Admiral) that played 6600 yards from the tees we played and I did not touch it once.  I rarely leave myself that yardage even around my local courses.  

 

My 52 may be going up for sale and getting refilled with a hybrid.  It will be a bunch at the top of the bag, but depending on the course it may be a better bunching than the wedge section of the bag.

 

 

OP I was in same situation 46, 52, 56, 60 but I dropped the 56 a couple years ago and never looked back.  It was too bunched up.  Now I have 12 clubs and lookin for a hybrid...

I try and like my own posts but can't figure out how...

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I play 47 - 54- 61 and love it. Used to play 46-50-55-60 but the 50 rarely gets used. Took some practice hit flighted shots with 47 to replace the 50, but now I couldn't be happier or more confident in my ability with those shots and wedge set up. Only time I ever wish I had a 50 is if I really have to get the ball up fast from 130 or 135 to get over a tree, other than that I do not miss my 50 at all. 

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6 hours ago, diddy2 said:

I play 47, 52, 58

 

Gives me all the shots I need from 115 and in 

Same here. No need for extra wedges IMO. 
 

47/PW - 137 carry choke down to 125

52/GW - 120 carry choke down to 110

58/LW - 100 carry choke down to 85

 

Many combinations of swings in between but simplified the short game immensely. 

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One of the strongest correlations for success on tour is performance from 175-225yds.  Surprisingly, much more so than performance from 75-125yds.  Kisner, not be a long hitter by tour standards probably feels like he needs that extra club in the long end while at the same time feeling comfortable covering all the yardages on the short end with 3 wedges.  Tour player or not, we should look at the approach shots we commonly face, what our strengths and weaknesses are and select clubs accordingly.  Most players will manage a larger gap with the wedges more effectively than they will with long irons, hybrids and fairway woods. Taking 20yrds off a fairway wood or hybrid and holding a green is difficult for even the best players.  If you're rarely hitting a long club into a green and face a high percentage of wedge shots into greens, the 4th wedge makes more sense.

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45 minutes ago, RobS said:

One of the strongest correlations for success on tour is performance from 175-225yds.  Surprisingly, much more so than performance from 75-125yds.  Kisner, not be a long hitter by tour standards probably feels like he needs that extra club in the long end while at the same time feeling comfortable covering all the yardages on the short end with 3 wedges.  Tour player or not, we should look at the approach shots we commonly face, what our strengths and weaknesses are and select clubs accordingly.  Most players will manage a larger gap with the wedges more effectively than they will with long irons, hybrids and fairway woods. Taking 20yrds off a fairway wood or hybrid and holding a green is difficult for even the best players.  If you're rarely hitting a long club into a green and face a high percentage of wedge shots into greens, the 4th wedge makes more sense.

Precisely why variances are the best option....yes I carry 4 now, but a switch to 3 is fairly simple. As stated - Par 3 and forced carry yardages far outweigh an added wedge- in certain course set ups

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My take on the wedge setup question is that for Amateurs, being precise with yardages from 200+ yards isn't as important as it is with pros, and therefore ams should focus on gapping at the bottom of the bag rather than the top

 

I don't have the SG data to back this up, but i suspect that if you're above a 5 handicap, just making good contact and getting the ball around the green will gain you shots from 200+ out. Bad results will be bad swings rather than being caught between clubs.

 

I also think pros are better at taking distance off a wedge than for longer clubs. Approaches into par 5s is a critical driver of scoring at the pro level, which is why you often see longer hitters with 2 fairway woods, often going to a 4 iron after that. 

 

Having more 'full swing' options with wedges means relatively less skill is required which will help an amateur player more than having a 200 club and a 210 club when anything near the green is a good result.

 

All of this to say is that I think most am players should focus on gaps at the bottom of the bag rather than the top,  as it requires less skill to reap the benefit from multiple wedges than it does from tight gaps at the top

 

 

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21 hours ago, TigerInTheWoods said:

I think this topic gets slightly over complicated. 
 

At as base level, I think that if you hit the ball a decent way, you’re more likely to use your wedges for scoring much more than your irons. I play my course at 7100 and there are maybe 2 holes I’ll have an iron into the green that isn’t a par 3. If you don’t hit the ball a long way and you usually end up leaving yourself short on your approaches into par 4s, you’re also using your wedges a lot, though likely more in the green side-50 yard range rather than 50-140 range. Obviously these demographics will want different things out of their wedges. 

What you need to do is work out how far you hit your PW and how that gaps with your 9i. I play my PW at 47* and it carries 142 on a good strike. Working backwards I figure out what my clock yardages are And see what I can give up if anything

 

47* - 142 full - 130 3/4 - 120 1/2 
51* - 130 full - 120 3/4 - 105 1/2
55* - 112 full - 100 3/4 - 85 half 

60* - 100 full - 85 3/4 - 70 half 

 

My 55* is by far my most used wedge on approaches so dropping it seems stressful. I have tried playing 3 wedges but it feels like giving up too much. 
 

I think for many ams it’s a better idea is keeping the 4 wedges and dropping your 4 iron for a 22* ish hybrid or utility to improve long club gapping, which is much more difficult to get right and not bunch you. Driver - 3w (or 4w) - 5w (or 7w) - Hybrid or utility - 5-9 - P, G , S, L. 

 


 

 

This is exactly how I do it except I don't hit it as far. One round I may not hit one wedge, another round I may not hit another, but I wouldn't want to get rid of them and I like the distances overlapping in the different swing types for that part of my game.

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On 8/16/2021 at 11:40 AM, mvhoffman said:

I'm thinking about going to Kisner's wedge set up.  He has 46, 54, 60.  Currently I have 46, 52, 56, 60.  Rarely do i use the 52.  Extremely rare actually.

 

Key point: Kisner has more time to practice than most of us WRXers. When I redid my bag circa 2017 with a similar idea to yours.

 

I got my current irons and started out 48-54-60 in wedges. Initially I had an MD-PM 60*/10 U-grind. Great for inside 30 yards, but I had distance control problem beyond that. An MD4 58*/8 C-grind knocked the 60 out of the bag after 30 minutes on practice green Thanksgiving weekend.

 

The 48* was a blending of my old iron's 46* PW and CG14 50*. The partial wedge cells had too many overlaps between the two.

 

But I'm finding a problem. On some tight approach shots, the 48* doesn't give me what I need sometimes. Coming up short over water or flying the green into bunker by two yards happens too often. Will have to rethink my wedge mix if my new Mavrik MAX irons arrive before Thanksgiving.  

What's In The Bag (Summary as of October 2021, post-MAX changeover)

 

Driver:  Tour Edge EXS 10.5°, set 9.5°; weights neutral   ||  FWs:  Calla Rogue 4W + 7W

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On 8/16/2021 at 12:40 PM, mvhoffman said:

I'm thinking about going to Kisner's wedge set up.  He has 46, 54, 60.  Currently I have 46, 52, 56, 60.  Rarely do i use the 52.  Extremely rare actually.  This past week I played in Ocean City, MD at a course (War Admiral) that played 6600 yards from the tees we played and I did not touch it once.  I rarely leave myself that yardage even around my local courses.  

 

My 52 may be going up for sale and getting refilled with a hybrid.  It will be a bunch at the top of the bag, but depending on the course it may be a better bunching than the wedge section of the bag.

 

I've always played my pw (46) and a 52 bent to 53 and a 60. Less is better for me. I know my yardages and different options. Also 1 less club to carry. Win-win.

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Kind of the same old thing - whatever works for you.

 

46-50-54-58 here.  Each has their uses, wouldn't ditch any of them.  Top of the bag is driver, 3w, 5w, 24 degree hybrid, 27 degree hybrid, then 6i.

 

I'm not gaining anything scoring wise with another club covering anywhere from 180 - 235 that my woods and hybrids don't already cover well enough.  

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