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do you hit it pure with a 9-iron ?


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By definition , the longer the club and the longer the swing   the more chances exist for errors. More errors  require more compensations   to compress the ball. 
By practicing with shorter clubs , a golfer  makes it easier to ingrain a swing that results in consistently compressing the ball. 
If a golfer can not consistently compress the ball with shorter clubs, it is not likely that he will do so with longer irons. 

 

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19 minutes ago, otto6457 said:

is this sort of like "Everyone wants to drive a Ferrari (driver) before they know how to drive a Big Wheel (wedge)"

 

Yes and no. For example a competent teaching pro will have a beginner learn the swing with a short iron because its loft and relatively short shaft length make it a forgiving club which is much easier to hit consistently straight than a lower lofted-longer shafted club. And the teaching pro won't recommend longer clubs until the student is reasonably proficient with the short club (s).

Sutton focused on the 9-iron because he could reasonably expect to reach his goal of consistently square-solid contact and extremely precise accuracy. And, the 9-iron had the added benefit of breeding good effective swing tempo-rhythm.

So, your analogy of Ferarri vs Big Wheel is a good one for amateur golf play but not as directly applicable for Sutton.

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On 8/20/2021 at 9:12 PM, sharkiesj said:

Funny, Tom Watson did the complete opposite. He says most people, even pros, start with their wedges to warm up and get into a rhythm.  Tom would set his bag down on the range and pull out his 2 iron.  He figured hitting a long iron requires grace, rhythm, balance and tempo.  So why not find it right away.  


agreed. Most people will have an easier time hitting the shorter irons. Lately ive been hitting my 4i more during practice because it’s way harder for me to hit consistently 

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Harvey Penick said the average golfer should spend 90% of their time practicing the short game (chipping, pitching, putting). And if the average golfer were to hit balls on the range, they’re best served to hit most of those shots with the 7 iron… a club not too long, not too short. Good for tempo and strike. 


Worth considering when >50% of the strokes are from inside 50 yards.  
 

And if the average golfer was in a rush to warm up before a tee time and needed to practice efficiently, they should practice their green-side short game with one ball, hitting a chip and then putting that ball for as few of strokes as possible (ideally, up and down). A little pressure and finesse to dial in the mind. 
 

He’d also have said that if it was working for Hal and he was winning, then he wouldn’t change a thing. 
 

If what you’re doing works, you do you… but if it doesn’t, the above is likely better. 

Edited by JDobs
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On 8/20/2021 at 4:39 PM, Fairway14 said:

Hal Sutton used to practice with only a 9-iron. He believed that if could strike a 9-iron consistently solid-pure then his swing was at a point where if he swung a 7-iron, 2-iron, driver etc... would produce fine shots.

I think that on the range most players expect to strike their 9-iron reasonably well and after a few shots with one move on to other clubs.  .  Sutton would strike hundreds of balls with only a 9-iron and a  goal of  totally pure-square-solid ball contact , very precise accuracy.

The point of this thread is to encourage others to consider Sutton's practice strategy, that is don't move on to longer clubs until the swing is producing consistently excellent shots with a shorter length club.

 

Not a bad idea.

 

Not hundreds, but at least 20 or so shots then a few each through the bag. That works best for me.

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I think this story originated from when Hal was young and had to walk out and pick up all those shots. Hitting 9i saved him a ton of steps!!

 

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I feel ya OP Fairway14.... I get the sentiment

 

Always felt if you wanna have a serious practice session you take only 1 club to the range.

 

Now I dont agree it always should be the same club like Sutton but hitting 10 with one club aint a real practice with that club..... might be a good overall bag practice but not next level

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I’ll spend most of my warm up using a sand wedge and 8 iron for the same reason - just looking for a good rhythm and really crisp contact.
 

But for longer practice sessions, I prefer using a 3 or 4 iron. Even with a small target, there is a certain amount of forgiveness baked into the loft/length of a 9 iron that can hide mechanical imperfections. No margin for safety exists with a blade long iron. Get to quick? Probably going to mishit the ball terribly. Get too lazy on the tempo (something a 9 iron swing definitely forgives) and you won’t put enough power into the ball for a proper strike. I feel like if I can get to making smooth, but powerful, swings with a 3 iron then the wedge shots and tee shots will take care of themselves.

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Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, EDT501 said:

Even with a small target, there is a certain amount of forgiveness baked into the loft/length of a 9 iron that can hide mechanical imperfections. No margin for safety exists with a blade long iron.

Again, Sutton's goal with the 9-iron swings/shots was pure contact. That is 100% pure-square-solid contact. And not a few yards off line , but very exacting, precise accuracy.

The above will not happen with a mid or long iron, but consistent perfect shots is attainable with a shorter shafted-higher lofted club, such as the 9-iron. I imagine that Sutton in his prime could strike twenty  consecutive 9-iron shots, all of them carrying within a a range of 137 to 139 yards distance, none more than 2 yards off line. His strategy would only be effective if he is very demanding about 9-iron shot quality. 

Edited by Fairway14

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1 minute ago, Fairway14 said:

His strategy would only be effective is one is very demanding about 9-iron shot quality. 

I’ll counter. Unless you have a very nice range with good balls and real greens to hit to, it’s tough to judge a 9 iron that precisely due to the presence of nicked/cut balls and the inability to see how the ball reacts on landing. Middling strikes with a short iron can still end up close to a pin, even inside of a 2 yard circle. Thats why I largely ignore distances and landing spot on the range these days and just focus on contact and starting direction. On the other hand, I do find that imprecision is magnified with a long iron. A quarter inch off on a 9 iron can still feel good, look good, and land next to the pin. But a quarter inch mishit on a 3 iron is something I can definitively feel in my hand and can see in the ball flight. 
 

I have no doubt Hal Sutton found this method beneficial and had the talent and facilities to tell apart very good and great short iron strikes, but your implication that this is the one true path and that it is something everyone should do is silly. Given a pristine practice facility and a shag bag of ProV1s I’d most happily camp out from 145 (9 iron) and would find that massively beneficial. But given I’m not a member at an exclusive club and don’t have much time in my life for practice, I find I get far more out of my time working with long irons than a short iron. 

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On 8/20/2021 at 6:52 PM, pinhigh27 said:

ya don't really agree. You can fake a 9 iron, you can't fake a 3 iron. 

That is so true.  Depends a great deal on how the irons are set up and what the person is comfortable with.

 

Lots of people have Vokey blade wedges in their bag while really forgiving CB's and hybrids fill the bag.  Having blade wedges in the bag doesn't necessary mean they are striking them solid, though.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Ri_Redneck said:

I think this story originated from when Hal was young and had to walk out and pick up all those shots. Hitting 9i saved him a ton of steps!!

 

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I have very limited range time along with limited playing time.  This year the vast majority of range time has been with 7-PW (Titleist 735cm's).  My GIR's has increased significantly this year.

 

Now the other side of the coin...if I could eliminate the bow-up holes I could tie or break my lowest round in the last 5 years.  Last Saturday.....14 holes are 2 under.  The other 4 holes.....12 over. 

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I think I have read numerous times that Tiger wears out his 8 iron faster than the rest of his clubs; its the one he uses most to practice with. 

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On 8/21/2021 at 7:34 PM, Fairway14 said:

 

Yes and no. For example a competent teaching pro will have a beginner learn the swing with a short iron because its loft and relatively short shaft length make it a forgiving club which is much easier to hit consistently straight than a lower lofted-longer shafted club. And the teaching pro won't recommend longer clubs until the student is reasonably proficient with the short club (s).

Sutton focused on the 9-iron because he could reasonably expect to reach his goal of consistently square-solid contact and extremely precise accuracy. And, the 9-iron had the added benefit of breeding good effective swing tempo-rhythm.

So, your analogy of Ferarri vs Big Wheel is a good one for amateur golf play but not as directly applicable for Sutton.

I know a competent one that advocates 7i and for many would discourage 9i.  Many folks can hit short irons with their swing flaws intact and repeatable.

Edited by Hawkeye77
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On 8/22/2021 at 7:36 AM, JDobs said:

Harvey Penick said the average golfer should spend 90% of their time practicing the short game (chipping, pitching, putting). And if the average golfer were to hit balls on the range, they’re best served to hit most of those shots with the 7 iron… a club not too long, not too short. Good for tempo and strike. 


Worth considering when >50% of the strokes are from inside 50 yards.  
 

And if the average golfer was in a rush to warm up before a tee time and needed to practice efficiently, they should practice their green-side short game with one ball, hitting a chip and then putting that ball for as few of strokes as possible (ideally, up and down). A little pressure and finesse to dial in the mind. 
 

He’d also have said that if it was working for Hal and he was winning, then he wouldn’t change a thing. 
 

If what you’re doing works, you do you… but if it doesn’t, the above is likely better. 

Excellent first post and welcome to WRX. 🍻

 

A 7-iron from Mr. Penick's day is today's 9-iron or PW with a slightly shorter shaft.

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17 hours ago, GLF4EVR said:

I have very limited range time along with limited playing time.  This year the vast majority of range time has been with 7-PW (Titleist 735cm's).  My GIR's has increased significantly this year.

 

Now the other side of the coin...if I could eliminate the bow-up holes I could tie or break my lowest round in the last 5 years.  Last Saturday.....14 holes are 2 under.  The other 4 holes.....12 over. 

 

Good lord! 12 over in 4 holes?! That had to have been quite an adventure. 

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1 hour ago, jholz said:

 

Good lord! 12 over in 4 holes?! That had to have been quite an adventure. 

Adventure is not the word I would use🙂.  One hole was a double, from just peeking twice.  Most of the rest of the errors were an OTT swing at the wrong time.  So almost all the other strokes were from shots going OB.  Around the third time I hit one out, all I could do after that was just laugh.  It was one of those rounds where you get done & wonder why you gave up drinking 35 years ago.

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On 8/25/2021 at 4:22 AM, Hawkeye77 said:

I know a competent one that advocates 7i and for many would discourage 9i.  Many folks can hit short irons with their swing flaws intact and repeatable.

LOL I wonder if an instructors practice club choice is somehow regionally guided.  Everyone is so physically different, can't imagine students using 7i - 9i.  Every instructor I have talked to uses 5i or 6i because those club lengths fit the majority of people.  I suppose there are exceptions though.  Six iron is my choice when demoing clubs or shafts.

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On 8/24/2021 at 12:54 PM, GLF4EVR said:

I have very limited range time along with limited playing time.  This year the vast majority of range time has been with 7-PW (Titleist 735cm's).  My GIR's has increased significantly this year.

 

Now the other side of the coin...if I could eliminate the bow-up holes I could tie or break my lowest round in the last 5 years.  Last Saturday.....14 holes are 2 under.  The other 4 holes.....12 over. 

You are very likely showing why practicing with only short irons can be a detriment. We all have swing flaws, certain flaws can be masked with certain clubs depending on what it is. Being overly steep or overly shallow makes hitting certain clubs more difficult than others. The blow ups likely happen when you are forced to hit a club that you can't compensate as well with.

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for me, it's the 5i or 7i. every other club follows suit. 

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1 hour ago, Krt22 said:

You are very likely showing why practicing with only short irons can be a detriment. We all have swing flaws, certain flaws can be masked with certain clubs depending on what it is. Being overly steep or overly shallow makes hitting certain clubs more difficult than others. The blow ups likely happen when you are forced to hit a club that you can't compensate as well with.

Will definitely agree.  Just about every time this season, the big score comes from one of the "distance" clubs.  Due to work & home I have very limited time for play or practice.  Only can occur on the weekends & that is limited at times.  The approach shots are the shots that have hurt me the most in the past.  So wanted to really work on that this season.  This has been paying off.  Have been giving myself more chances at scoring well than in the past. 

 

 

 It really seems that I just get "complacent...too relaxed...loss of focus" or something like that & just make the mental error of taking a lazy swing that causes the OB at the worst time.  You want to hit yourself in the head with the club right after you do it because you know exactly what you did wrong.  Then there are the days that you swear your underwear is on backwards cause you can't hit a thing.  Had that 3 weeks ago.  Bet my score then would not have broke 100.

 

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We all know that most ams shouldn't just practice exclusively with the 9i, they should take it off the tee on par 4s and 5s so they can find the fairway. 

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On 8/20/2021 at 10:31 PM, ThinkingPlus said:

I spend all my time warming up with my putter.  Once I am consistently holing out with putter then that swing should allow me to do the same with all my clubs.

 

Thanks, TP. That explains my problem with all the other clubs - I have never/ever consistently holed out with my putter so obviously the rest of the clubs in my bag suck as well. Now I  understand. 🙂

 

dave

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10 minutes ago, DaveLeeNC said:

 

Thanks, TP. That explains my problem with all the other clubs - I have never/ever consistently holed out with my putter so obviously the rest of the clubs in my bag suck as well. Now I  understand. 🙂

 

dave

It just seems logical doesn't it.  LOL!

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