Anyone Have An Idea of What TM’s Driver Plans Are for 2022?

[radiman]

3 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

Theres only so much you can do now… “expand the sweet spot”… how exactly?
Theres only so much weight to move around… the whole SIM2 is practically carbon except the face, ring and weights. If their is any to be saved and moved its at most a few grams, and wont make any measurable difference.

 

 To be honest, as long as the restrictions are in place, its better off for manufacturers to just get looks and sound right, and provide several heads with options (max, non max, draw, etc). If I was running one of these companies, id offer way more stock options and offer the customizable stuff free (mysim). Or even have limited releases of the same product with different “skins” (paint scheme and headcover). But what do i know!! 🤷‍♂️

Not an engineer.  So, I can't say for certain lol.  But, I hope they don't stop trying.  Otherwise they're just releasing the same driver over and over again with only aesthetic changes.  

[TiScape]

I read Bryson said Cobra is working on a head for him that finds the fairway regardless of where and at what angle the ball makes contact with the face… In his words “one that’ doesn’t suck”. That’s the one I’m waiting for! 😊 

[Red4282]

4 minutes ago, radiman said:

Not an engineer.  So, I can't say for certain lol.  But, I hope they don't stop trying.  Otherwise they're just releasing the same driver over and over again with only aesthetic changes.  

Well Im not saying dont stop trying, but they are already doing your second sentence anyways. Im just saying my marketing would be more geared to customization than performace gains.

[radiman]

6 minutes ago, Red4282 said:

Well Im not saying dont stop trying, but they are already doing your second sentence anyways. Im just saying my marketing would be more geared to customization than performace gains.

I wouldn't agree with that.  I think there are changes being made.  For the most part incremental.  At times I am sure there isn't a lot of difference.  Some releases will see slightly more benefit than others.  But, changes are still happening, or at least attempted. 

[sadclevelandsports]

If changes are so incremental, I wonder if they would consider releasing every couple years.

 

Haha who am I kidding, too many sheep for that to happen (myself included).

Edited October 28, 2021 by sadclevelandsports

[4TheKing614]

I have only played titleist drivers since the 975j until my current gamer the Ts2. This is the year I am almost positive to make a change. For me I am extremely interested in taylormades driver. They are rated so highly 

[radiman]

23 minutes ago, sadclevelandsports said:

If changes are so incremental, I wonder if they would consider releasing every couple years.

 

Haha who am I kidding, too many sheep for that to happen (myself included).

Because new and shiny golf clubs are fun? 🤷‍♂️ 

[Red4282]

1 hour ago, radiman said:

Because new and shiny golf clubs are fun? 🤷‍♂️ 

One word, HOPE

[TheMoneyShot]

2 hours ago, radiman said:

Because new and shiny golf clubs are fun? 🤷‍♂️ 

New clubs make me play better for a couple rounds too🤦‍♂️

[PowerPlayer]

7 hours ago, Red4282 said:

Well Im not saying dont stop trying, but they are already doing your second sentence anyways. Im just saying my marketing would be more geared to customization than performace gains.

Your company would go bankrupt after your first release without question. You, correctly, say that people are paying for hope. People want to have a chance to hit the ball longer and straighter - even if it's 1 out of 10. Have more chances at GIR. Even that rare birdie every couple of rounds on a par 4 hole. I believe there are more breakthroughs to be had in the next 5 years. Most likely in materials engineering and/or precise 3D printing components.   

[grm24]

On 10/4/2021 at 3:14 PM, BraxtonFullerton said:

Though I can't tell you how much I would love the PGA to pick and choose one adapter as the only conforming one going forward.

And exactly how could either the PGA Tour or PGA Of America force club manufacturers to choose one conforming adapter when they do not make the rules of golf. That would be the USGA and R&A. It would never happen. 

[belh22]

Just bring back the adjustable 3hl fairway again please 

[Red4282]

9 hours ago, PowerPlayer said:

Your company would go bankrupt after your first release without question. You, correctly, say that people are paying for hope. People want to have a chance to hit the ball longer and straighter - even if it's 1 out of 10. Have more chances at GIR. Even that rare birdie every couple of rounds on a par 4 hole. I believe there are more breakthroughs to be had in the next 5 years. Most likely in materials engineering and/or precise 3D printing components.   

I dont think it would but who knows for sure, we are just speculating.  Im curious why you think there will be a breakthrough tho. Distance (ball speed) is maxed per restrictions. The 5900 moi cap has been hit as well. The ONLY “improvement” i can see being done is driver head that gets near the 5900 moi cap but doesnt spin off the planet like the past models that acheived the number. Incredibly tough task to do, physics almost doesnt allow it, if you want to be looking at a normal looking driver anyways. 3d printing wont do anything im afraid, its a cool manufacturing process, but thats about it. 

[Red4282]

5 hours ago, grm24 said:

And exactly how could either the PGA Tour or PGA Of America force club manufacturers to choose one conforming adapter when they do not make the rules of golf. That would be the USGA and R&A. It would never happen. 

This brings up a good point. The biggest change wont be from tech itself but perhaps from usga and r&a. Unfortunately it seems like they want to roll distance and forgiveness back. 🤷‍♂️

[4TheKing614]

5 hours ago, grm24 said:

And exactly how could either the PGA Tour or PGA Of America force club manufacturers to choose one conforming adapter when they do not make the rules of golf. That would be the USGA and R&A. It would never happen. 

This should change. I strongly feel the USGA is ruining the game. They don’t look for player input. You have a bunch of people holding back the game. They make decisions and change them later. I personally think we should find a new ruling body. May never happen, but neither will my disdain for the USGA without changes in how they are doing things. 

[mogc60]

2 hours ago, 4TheKing614 said:

This should change. I strongly feel the USGA is ruining the game. They don’t look for player input. You have a bunch of people holding back the game. They make decisions and change them later. I personally think we should find a new ruling body. May never happen, but neither will my disdain for the USGA without changes in how they are doing things. 

Oh cmon, they changed how to take a drop. I’m sure that was well needed and has made the game sooooo much better. Buncha suits making stupid changes that do nothing for the game. 

[Cactus Jack]

The TXG boys confirmed TM will launch a new driver early 2022, but it will NOT be a SIM3. They didn't say what it will be, but it sounds like there will be an entirely new product line. 

[kerila07]

New name, colors, and increased price.

[youngwaldo]

25 minutes ago, kerila07 said:

New name, colors, and increased price.

All correct.  

 

Wk

[4TheKing614]

3 hours ago, mogc60 said:

Oh cmon, they changed how to take a drop. I’m sure that was well needed and has made the game sooooo much better. Buncha suits making stupid changes that do nothing for the game. 

Look what they are doing with equipment. They made regulations. Decided after making them didn’t like them so they are changing them. After people spent thousands on them. They go after the dumbest stuff and then feel like they accomplished something. These men are forgettable. They don’t even ask the people who are the faces of the game their thoughts. They limited length. Face speed. Who today is better off because they anchored the belly putter? Who will be better off because they want to get rid of arm lock? If armlock is so great they why isn’t everyone doing it? 
Talk of rolling the ball back to make golf courses still playable? Seriously. The game is in a good place outside of cost. LEAVE IT ALONE!!!!!

[radiman]

26 minutes ago, 4TheKing614 said:

Look what they are doing with equipment. They made regulations. Decided after making them didn’t like them so they are changing them. After people spent thousands on them. They go after the dumbest stuff and then feel like they accomplished something. These men are forgettable. They don’t even ask the people who are the faces of the game their thoughts. They limited length. Face speed. Who today is better off because they anchored the belly putter? Who will be better off because they want to get rid of arm lock? If armlock is so great they why isn’t everyone doing it? 
Talk of rolling the ball back to make golf courses still playable? Seriously. The game is in a good place outside of cost. LEAVE IT ALONE!!!!!

Don't forget the groove rule change.  Us amateurs were just putting way too much spin from the rough and making a mockery of the game haha.  

[TheMoneyShot]

2 hours ago, kerila07 said:

New name, colors, and increased price.

Just like everything else that is going up in price…

[Lemonde]

Looking for TM to revive the 435/440 head! 

[Str8Putt]

4 hours ago, kerila07 said:

New name, colors, and increased price.

I wish they'd go away from the white head/trim not really a fan

That said not looking forward to a price increase. Drivers are already ridiculously priced

[Valtiel]

On 10/28/2021 at 7:49 AM, getitdaily said:

Revolutionary is hard to believe given how everyone is doing the incremental thing. 

 

On 10/28/2021 at 8:05 AM, toddyc said:

Also they are already at the rule limits. Not sure what could possibly be revolutionary about it 

Some limits have been hit but certainly not all. COR is maxed, but only in the center of the face for most clubs with how quickly that numbers drops off being one of the measurements of "forgiveness". The MOI limit has been reached, but only by PING and PXG. I don't believe Taylormade has come particularly close yet. 
 

On 10/28/2021 at 12:02 PM, Red4282 said:

Theres only so much you can do now… “expand the sweet spot”… how exactly?
Theres only so much weight to move around… the whole SIM2 is practically carbon except the face, ring and weights. If their is any to be saved and moved its at most a few grams, and wont make any measurable difference.

 

 To be honest, as long as the restrictions are in place, its better off for manufacturers to just get looks and sound right, and provide several heads with options (max, non max, draw, etc). If I was running one of these companies, id offer way more stock options and offer the customizable stuff free (mysim). Or even have limited releases of the same product with different “skins” (paint scheme and headcover). But what do i know!! 🤷‍♂️

 

One of the incremental things is the aforementioned expanding of the COR limit away from the center, keeping the face "hotter" over a wider range. Combine this with high MOI with extremely low CG and you have your hypothetical ideal driver. The only reason high MOI = high spin is because CG is hard to keep down, and I don't think driver companies have tinkered enough yet with bulge/roll and manipulating loft that way. High MOI takes away some of the spin reduction from higher strikes and will tend to cause the driver to be delivered with more dynamic loft. These two things can be mitigated somewhat with design changes. 
 

On 10/28/2021 at 12:14 PM, Red4282 said:

Well Im not saying dont stop trying, but they are already doing your second sentence anyways. Im just saying my marketing would be more geared to customization than performace gains.

I started to believe this is the inevitability, customization and individual value based on that being the focus over performance gains. 

[grm24]

14 hours ago, 4TheKing614 said:

This should change. I strongly feel the USGA is ruining the game. They don’t look for player input. You have a bunch of people holding back the game. They make decisions and change them later. I personally think we should find a new ruling body. May never happen, but neither will my disdain for the USGA without changes in how they are doing things. 

So you're saying the USGA/R&A in the ROG mandate one universal shaft adapter across all manufacturers for woods? Did you actually read my post that you replied to? It appears you didn't. But if you did and still feel that way do you then believe if a universal shaft adapter is mandated for all then the USGA/R&A should also designate only one universal type of grip, shaft, ball, glove, tee, clubhead design/shape, etc for all? <smh>.

 

The USGA does seek input from tour players regardless it you believe it or not.

[grm24]

6 hours ago, Str8Putt said:

I wish they'd go away from the white head/trim not really a fan

SIM2 heads are not a white head/trim.

[4TheKing614]

7 hours ago, grm24 said:

So you're saying the USGA/R&A in the ROG mandate one universal shaft adapter across all manufacturers for woods? Did you actually read my post that you replied to? It appears you didn't. But if you did and still feel that way do you then believe if a universal shaft adapter is mandated for all then the USGA/R&A should also designate only one universal type of grip, shaft, ball, glove, tee, clubhead design/shape, etc for all? <smh>.

 

The USGA does seek input from tour players regardless it you believe it or not.

Read Phil Mickelson's response to their latest change with the driver length. Look at how they treated Justin Thomas a couple years ago when he challenged what they were doing. A bunch of old men who feel they are more important then they really are. 

[Red4282]

8 hours ago, grm24 said:

So you're saying the USGA/R&A in the ROG mandate one universal shaft adapter across all manufacturers for woods? Did you actually read my post that you replied to? It appears you didn't. But if you did and still feel that way do you then believe if a universal shaft adapter is mandated for all then the USGA/R&A should also designate only one universal type of grip, shaft, ball, glove, tee, clubhead design/shape, etc for all? <smh>.

 

The USGA does seek input from tour players regardless it you believe it or not.

It limits innovation as well. Like the cally adapter that allows you to change settings but keep graphics of shaft in same place. Bad idea. If you want a universal adapter, they make them, just buy one.

[Red4282]

1 hour ago, 4TheKing614 said:

Read Phil Mickelson's response to their latest change with the driver length. Look at how they treated Justin Thomas a couple years ago when he challenged what they were doing. A bunch of old men who feel they are more important then they really are. 

I agree that they really do some things that set the game backwards (probably something they actually want), but its also a hard place to be as well. There has to be some regulation and rules in place, just where to draw that line can be tricky. They have gotten a few things right like the flagstick in, and grounding in a bunker. Things that should go: cor limits, groove rule, driver length, many more. One of the funniest ones is I can tee off with my putter legally, i can putt with my driver legally, but i cant put my flatsided putter grip on my driver… huh? Process that one lol