Jump to content

Good players shaping driver shots


playit
 Share

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, playit said:

I'd like to know if pros can shape their driver shots with these modern big driver heads for draws/fades to fit the dogleg shapes. And what about mere mortals, amateurs?

All pros can.  It seems that most favor one predominant shape, but can still move it either way.

 

My son is an amateur college golfer and he works it both ways with ease.  I favor a fade and really have to work to draw it.  Just depends on what skills you work to develop.  Pro's and college golfers hit thousands of balls each week at specific targets/distances and try to do it with different shapes.  Most recreational golfers hit a few balls before they play and don't really work at it.  It's more fun to buy a new driver with a movable weight/hosel.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, playit said:

I'd like to know if pros can shape their driver shots with these modern big driver heads for draws/fades to fit the dogleg shapes. And what about mere mortals, amateurs?

Modern golf theory basically says that players should only work driver one way… if you try to play a fade on one hole and a draw on the next, you are increasing the chances you’ll hit a double cross and be way outside your usual miss range.

 

id say all the pros can work it both ways, but most choose not to… even Bubba, as famed as he is for moving the ball, only works it one direction off the tee.

  • Like 2

As of  10/11/2021

9 Callaway Mavrk Sub Zero with Ventus Black 7X

13 Degree Srixon 3 wood Project X Black 6.5

19 Degree Sub70 939 Pro with Proforce V2

4 Utility Sub70 699u 22 degree Proforce V2

5-GW Srixon Zx5 with Project X 6.5

Sub70 286 54

Sub70 JB Low Bounce 58

SeeMore milled Tri-Mallet fit and built at SeeMore 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't have any problem hitting fades or draws. All I do to go from fade to draw is move the ball forward in my stance two inches. That extra bit of swing before contact allows me to turn the club over. This isn't the only way to go from fade to draw, but for me it's the easiest way. I favor the fade because there's only one hole on my home course that works better with a draw.

Quote

Do you think any pros would ever move the weight on a driver head to shape a shot?

Not during a round, as that's illegal. Rule 4-2 of the Rules of Golf states: “During a stipulated round, the playing characteristics of a club shall not be purposely changed.”

  • Like 1

Cleveland Launcher HB Driver 10.5 degree

Cleveland Launcher Halo Hybrids 16, 19, 22 degree

Cleveland Launcher HB Irons 5-SW

Cleveland CBX 2 Wedge 60 degree

All with senior flex graphite shafts

JumboMax Ultra Lite size M on driver, size S on the rest

Taylor Made Daddy Long Legs putter, Winn Dri-Tac Jumbo Lite Pistol Putter Grip

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As long as people are able to unintentionally hit monster hooks and giant slices, other people will be able to manufacture draws and fades.  Until they design a club that is utterly hook/slice proof, pros will be able to work the ball either way.

  • Like 2

You didn't plan to fail, you failed to plan!

SIM/9*/UST Elements Platinum
M5/15*/Kai'li 70s//M5/19*/Kai'li 70s
Titleist u500 3/Recoil Hybrid Proto 100 f4

SUB 70 649 MB Raw 4-PW/Recoil Proto 110 f4
Mizuno t20 Raw 51*/56*/61*/KBS Tour 120 s
Bastain Milled BM-009 Long Neck Proto
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Pros can ABSOLUTELY work it both ways on command, but as mentioned above, like to stick with a stock shot for consistency. Back in the mid '90's, a local kid whose parents were friends of ours, was giving the mini-tour a run. He was a +5 cap and could hit the ball a mile. We were over visiting his folks (poker night) and he was hanging out with us. During a break, I asked how his game was going. He said it was a little off right now because he was learning how to draw the ball. My jaw almost hit the floor! Here's a +5 telling me he doesn't know how to hit a draw! I would have thought he had every shot in the book, but actually, he had gotten where he was playing his stock cut shot. Made me realize just how important it REALLY was to be able to work the ball both ways.

 

I CAN work the ball both ways. However, I prefer a slight cut with my driver & FWs and a slight draw with my irons. Just the way it is.

 

BT

  • Like 1

 

Cobra LTD Pro 10.5° HZRDUS Blk 75 6.0 @ 44.5"
Cobra LTD Black 14.5° Aldila RIP Beta 80 S @ 43"
Cobra F6 16.5° Aldila RIP Beta 80 S @ 41.5"
Mizuno MP25 4-PW Mamiya Recoil Proto 125 F4
Mizuno MP-T5 52, 56 & 60 - TT Wedge
Grips - Grip Master Master Perforated Midsize

Oddysey Stroke Lab V-Line Blk 33.5"
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Myherobobhope said:

Modern golf theory basically says that players should only work driver one way… if you try to play a fade on one hole and a draw on the next, you are increasing the chances you’ll hit a double cross and be way outside your usual miss range.

 

id say all the pros can work it both ways, but most choose not to… even Bubba, as famed as he is for moving the ball, only works it one direction off the tee.

 

Ok, so what do the pros do when they reach a tight hole with trees in the way and it's a narrow chute to get down the fairway and it doglegs opposite of their normal shape? Say, it's a dogleg left and their bread n butter is a fade. They don't draw it and just hit their fade, but their fade is not much fade? (I tend to think that the shape of pro shots do not move very much as opposed to us mere mortals.) Or I guess they could just count on that hole not being a birdie hole for them.

 

I guess if a tree isn't in the way, they can just aim down the left treeline and fade back to the fairway on a dogleg left.

 

Seems I also recall Trevino trying to learn to draw so he could play the Masters well. I guess that would prove your point, lol. He didn't succeed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, playit said:

 

Ok, so what do the pros do when they reach a tight hole with trees in the way and it's a narrow chute to get down the fairway and it doglegs opposite of their normal shape? Say, it's a dogleg left and their bread n butter is a fade. They don't draw it and just hit their fade, but their fade is not much fade? (I tend to think that the shape of pro shots do not move very much as opposed to us mere mortals.) Or I guess they could just count on that hole not being a birdie hole for them.

 

I guess if a tree isn't in the way, they can just aim down the left treeline and fade back to the fairway on a dogleg left.

 

Seems I also recall Trevino trying to learn to draw so he could play the Masters well. I guess that would prove your point, lol. He didn't succeed.

Scott fawcett says basically to hit three wood and put it back in your stance for the draw… you aren’t changing your swing, just the point of impact…  Not everyone agrees with him, but Will Zalatoris hit three wood all four days at the masters when he needed a draw.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

As of  10/11/2021

9 Callaway Mavrk Sub Zero with Ventus Black 7X

13 Degree Srixon 3 wood Project X Black 6.5

19 Degree Sub70 939 Pro with Proforce V2

4 Utility Sub70 699u 22 degree Proforce V2

5-GW Srixon Zx5 with Project X 6.5

Sub70 286 54

Sub70 JB Low Bounce 58

SeeMore milled Tri-Mallet fit and built at SeeMore 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Myherobobhope said:

Scott fawcett says basically to hit three wood and put it back in your stance for the draw… you aren’t changing your swing, just the point of impact…  Not everyone agrees with him, but Will Zalatoris hit three wood all four days at the masters when he needed a draw.

This, the guy I get lessons from also recommends when faced with a tee shot that demands a different shot shape than my usual, I hit a fairway as they are a bit easier to work with control than the driver. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hit fades, draws, slices, hooks all the time.  If im trying to actually do it is the real question 🤣

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1

Driver (10.5): Taylormade SIM2 (Fujikura Ventus Blue 6S)
3-Wood (13.5): Taylormade SIM2 TI (Fujikura Ventus Blue 7X)
Irons (2I, 4I-7I, 8I-PW): Mizuno MP-20/MMC/HMB (Steelfiber i95 Stiff)
GW (51/11): Cleveland CBX 2 (Steelfiber i70 Stiff)
SW (56/12): Cleveland CBX Full Face (Steelfiber i70 Stiff)
LW (62/6): Cleveland ZipCore Tour Rack (Steelfiber i70 Stiff)
Putter: Bettinardi INOVAI 6.0 Center Shaft
Ball: Pro V1x Left Dash

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I find moving the modern driver any more than 5 yards either way requires a lot of adjustment. Fine on wide open courses but can be limiting on older designs where shaping the ball is the best option. Modern balls don't help...you can see them trying to straighten out in flight. Would love to see heads drop back to 350 to 380cc and be more workable. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, tannyhoban said:

If you ever have the opportunity watch the pros on the range.

 

Not all of them can move it any way they want, that’s a fallacy.

I disagree with this… I’m pretty sure most of them CAN work the ball both directions if needed… I’m an out of shape, mediocre 40 year old with a 5 handicap and I can work the ball both ways.

  • Like 2

As of  10/11/2021

9 Callaway Mavrk Sub Zero with Ventus Black 7X

13 Degree Srixon 3 wood Project X Black 6.5

19 Degree Sub70 939 Pro with Proforce V2

4 Utility Sub70 699u 22 degree Proforce V2

5-GW Srixon Zx5 with Project X 6.5

Sub70 286 54

Sub70 JB Low Bounce 58

SeeMore milled Tri-Mallet fit and built at SeeMore 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, Myherobobhope said:

I disagree with this… I’m pretty sure most of them CAN work the ball both directions if needed… I’m an out of shape, mediocre 40 year old with a 5 handicap and I can work the ball both ways.

They all can move it if forced to.  Many don't like to move it both ways.  They usually have a lot more at stake than your average joe so they play the shot shape they have the most confidence in.  Kenny Perry for example, likely never hit a fade unless it was really, really, really needed (likely never).

  • Like 1

Ping G400 9º TFC 419 Stiff at 45"

Jazz 3 wd Powercoil Stiff
Ping i20 3 Hyb 707H Stiff
Rogue 3iron Recoil 660 F3 +1/2"
X2 Hot 4-PW Recoil 660 F3 +1/2"
Vokey SM2 52º cc, Ping ES 56º and ES 60º
Ping Sigma2 Valor at 34.75"
MCC Align Midsize

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Socrates said:

They all can move it if forced to.  Many don't like to move it both ways.  They usually have a lot more at stake than your average joe so they play the shot shape they have the most confidence in.  Kenny Perry for example, likely never hit a fade unless it was really, really, really needed (likely never).

Just to be clear, I don’t think many work it on the course… I think the days of working the ball are mostly past.

 

that said, all of them can hit a functional shot the other way opposite their regular shot shape… it’s not that hard. 

As of  10/11/2021

9 Callaway Mavrk Sub Zero with Ventus Black 7X

13 Degree Srixon 3 wood Project X Black 6.5

19 Degree Sub70 939 Pro with Proforce V2

4 Utility Sub70 699u 22 degree Proforce V2

5-GW Srixon Zx5 with Project X 6.5

Sub70 286 54

Sub70 JB Low Bounce 58

SeeMore milled Tri-Mallet fit and built at SeeMore 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Myherobobhope said:

I disagree with this… I’m pretty sure most of them CAN work the ball both directions if needed… I’m an out of shape, mediocre 40 year old with a 5 handicap and I can work the ball both ways.

Not all. Not even close. Sure many work it both ways somewhat but not all. And certainly not under pressure.

 

How’s Jason Days fade working out for him?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Myherobobhope said:

I disagree with this… I’m pretty sure most of them CAN work the ball both directions if needed… I’m an out of shape, mediocre 40 year old with a 5 handicap and I can work the ball both ways.

That’s poppycock. How times did Cantlay double cross himself with driver while winning the Fed Ex? More than a few.

 

Tiger was special because he could do it on demand.

 

I don’t care about your game, not one bit.

Edited by tannyhoban
Link to comment
Share on other sites

54 minutes ago, DaRiz said:

DJ has said he hasn’t hit a draw with driver since like 2007 

 

This is Wrx man, the home of ball strikers better than pros!

  • Like 2

Ping G410 Plus 12°/Xcaliber SL55, Maltby KE4 TC 5w/Xcaliber SL FW r flex, Maltby KE4 HyWay 21°/Xcaliber SL r flex, Maltby KE4 Tour TC 4h/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Maltby KE4 Tour TC 5h/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Maltby KE4 Tour+ 6-G/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Maltby TSW 54° and 58°/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex, Mizuno Bettinardi C06

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you can do it, hitting it straight is inherently safer.  Controlling the amount of curve is just another variable that will widen your dispersion, and thereby add risk.  

 

If your natural shot is a big curve, either way, then there are going to be a lot of holes where that shot doesn't "fit."  But if it always turns the same way, and it's reasonably straight, then you can fit that shot into most holes.  I played that way for a long time. 

 

Over the years, I gradually straightened my natural fade/slice, and eventually developed the ability to work it both ways. But I never really try to turn it hard around a corner, etc., because that's usually too risky. 

 

I mostly "work the ball" only to let me aim away from trouble and effectively make the fairway wider.  If there is trouble left, I aim down the right center with intent to turn it left a little. It may not turn left a lot, but with a "draw intent," it won't fade, and I'll end up on the right side of the fairway at worst.   Vice-versa with trouble on the right. 

 


 

Taylormade M5 9* w/GD YSQ
Adams Super Pro Hybrid 16* w/NV NxtGen MLT 85
Adams Pro Hybrid 20* w/VS Proto 95
Adams Pro Mini Hybrids 23* and 26* w/VS Proto 95 
Adams CB1 6-PW w/Pro Modus3 105
Vokeys: SM4 TVD 52M, SM8 56D, SM8 60M, all with Pro Modus3 115 Wedge
Odyssey Black Series Tour Design #5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Every tee ball I am trying to hit a small draw. I can't hit a reliable fade. I know basically how to do it.... But I don't try

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Callaway Mavrik 9 w/Aldila Rogue White 60 MSI130

Callaway Mavrik SZ 13 w/Aldila Rogue White 70 MSI130

Callaway Apex 2019 Hybrid w/PX Catalyst 70

PXG 0211 ST 4-GW w/ TT Elevate Tour

PXG 0311 Forged 54 and 60 w/TT Elevate Tour

Putter under NDA--I CANT SAY

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The modern driver head and golf ball don't spin much so it's more difficult to curve the ball.  Most pros these days stick to their go to shot off the tee with driver. 

TM SIM 2, 8* w/Diamana ZF 60TX

TM SIM 15* w/Diamana ZF 80TX

TM Tour Issue Rescue 11 TP Deep Face Ghost Proto 16* HB  w/Thump 105x

New Level NLU-01 21* w/KBS Proto 105x

New Level 623-M 5-PW w/MMT 125 TX

54* Miura HB w/KBS 610 S+, 58* Miura w/KBS Tour Black

Scotty Cameron Studio Select Newport 1

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A lot of it has to do with what degree you shape the ball. And, I will discuss it as tee shots, not just driver shots.

 

First, there's offensive shaping, 

On 9/23/2021 at 10:59 PM, Ghostwedge said:

What's really cool is when they don't even acknowledge the dog leg and take it over the tree's about 280-300 yds down the fairway......

and defensive shaping., such as fading to avoid a hazard to left of fairway.

 

Most people can pull off a basic fade or draw if they just practice a little. After all, you get to set up the ball on a peg - or fluffed grass - and take a stance on level tee box before you hit.

What's In The Bag (Summary as of October 2021, post-MAX changeover)

 

Driver:  Tour Edge EXS 10.5°, set 9.5°; weights neutral   ||  FWs:  Calla Rogue 4W + 7W

Hybrid:  Calla Big Bertha OS 4H at 22°  ||  Irons:  Calla Mavrik MAX 5i-PW

Wedges*:  Calla MD3: 48°... MD4: 54°, 58° ||  Putter: Ping Sigma G Tyne (face-balanced) + Evnroll Gravity Grip

Ball: 1. Srixon Q-Star Tour / 2. Calla SuperHot (Orange preferred)  ||  Bag: Sun Mountain Three 5 stand bag

For details see:  Pending (need protocol to embed file list).

     * MD4 54°/10 S-Grind replaced MD3 54°/12 W-Grind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, tannyhoban said:

That’s poppycock. How times did Cantlay double cross himself with driver while winning the Fed Ex? More than a few.

 

Tiger was special because he could do it on demand.

 

I don’t care about your game, not one bit.

I’m not even sure what you are arguing anymore…

 

professional golfers have the ability to work the ball both directions. Just like they can intentionally hit a ball on the toe or the heel… just because they don’t do it on the course or range doesn’t mean they can’t.

As of  10/11/2021

9 Callaway Mavrk Sub Zero with Ventus Black 7X

13 Degree Srixon 3 wood Project X Black 6.5

19 Degree Sub70 939 Pro with Proforce V2

4 Utility Sub70 699u 22 degree Proforce V2

5-GW Srixon Zx5 with Project X 6.5

Sub70 286 54

Sub70 JB Low Bounce 58

SeeMore milled Tri-Mallet fit and built at SeeMore 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, Myherobobhope said:

I’m not even sure what you are arguing anymore…

 

professional golfers have the ability to work the ball both directions. Just like they can intentionally hit a ball on the toe or the heel… just because they don’t do it on the course or range doesn’t mean they can’t.

Most don’t. They play a stock shot and work it that way. When they feel forced to go the other way they often cannot. Working the ball both ways on tour under pressure is the most overrated part of the game attributed to pros on this forum. It’s nonsense.

 

They score well when they can manufacture a shot from trouble (that suits their stock, I should add) and putt well. 
 

That’s what I’m saying. 

Edited by tannyhoban
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Our picks

    • 2022 Farmers Insurance Open Photos - 26 WITBs & New Gear- Discussion and Links
      Please put any questions or comments here
       
      General Albums - 
       
      2022 Farmers Insurance Open - Monday #1
      2022 Farmers Insurance Open - Monday #2
      2022 Farmers Insurance Open - Monday #3
      2022 Farmers Insurance Open - Monday #4
       
       
      WITB Albums - 
       
      Hideki Matsuyama - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Sung Kang - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Adam Long - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Brandon Wu - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Jimmy Walker - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Sam Burns - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Xander Schauffele - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Trey Mullinax - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Daniel Berger - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      James Hahn - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Phil Mickelson - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Aaron Wise - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Justin Thomas - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Lee Hodges - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Jordan Spieth - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Cameron Champ - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Kyle Stanley - WITB - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
       
       
      Pullout Albums - 
       
      New Super Stroke grip - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Tour Aim alignment aids - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Swag Golf: Hideki's caddie bowing at Augusta, signed headcovers – 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Dylan Frittelli's Callaway Apex TCB Sand Wedge (1-of-1 proto) – 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      Bryson DeChambeau's Cobra King LTDx 5-degree driver – 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      NeuroPeak Pro NTel Belt - 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
      JumboMax JMX Zen Lite grips – 2022 Farmers Insurance Open
       
      Cameron Champ WITB has the new Ping i525

       
      Bryson's WITB has the new Cobra LTDx Driver 

       
      Phils new Rogue Driver

       
      Bryson's LAGolf Shaft in the driver

       
      Xander has the triple diamond "S" driver

       
      New SuperStroke grips for 2022

       
      • 8 replies
    • 2022 The American Express WITB Photos (Spotted: New gear for 2022) - Discussion & Links
      Please put and comments or questions here
       
       
      Scotty Cameron putters - 2022 American Express
      New Taylor-Made putters - 2022 American Express
      New Odyssey putters - 2022 American Express
      New Axis 1 model putter - - 2022 American Express
      Patrick Cantlay - WITB - 2022 American Express
      Mitsubishi MMT putter shaft - 2022 American Express
      Ping putter - 2022 American Express
      Abraham Ancer - WITB - 2022 American Express
      Jason Dufner - WITB - 2022 American Express
      Will Zalatoris - WITB - 2022 American Express
      The Surgeon 6109 wedge - 2022 American Express
      LA Golf "DJ Series" shafts (2022 American Express)
       
       
       
      2022 American Express - Monday #1
       
       
       
       
      • 40 replies
    • Sony Open Pics from January 11, 2022 Part 1
      I was able to get out to the Sony Open today to take a few pics.  I guess due to Covid precautions they kept the spectators pretty far from the players.  Also due to camera restrictions they've put in place, I wasn't able to bring the big lens like I normally do. Hopefully they'll ease up on the ropes and I'll be able to get more pics tomorrow!
      • 22 replies
    • 2022 Callaway Rogue ST drivers (in-hand photos)
      2022 Callaway Rogue ST Max driver
       

       
      2022 Callaway Rogue ST Max D driver
       
      2021 Callaway Rogue ST Max 
       
      2022 Callaway Rogue ST Max LS driver

       
      2022 Callaway Rogue ST Triple Diamond LS

       
      Rogue ST exploded views
      • 218 replies
    • Titleist Vokey SM9 Link on Wedge Works Coming Soon- UPDATED Pics Added Pg 4
      Looks like there is a link on Titleist Wedge Works for the new Vokey SM9, but doesn't show any photos yet.
       
      https://www.vokey.com/product/WM137.html#start=4
        • Like
      • 237 replies

×
×
  • Create New...