Teachers - Examples of Perfect Swing Change Practice @ Range

[Lefty_3Jack]

Winter is coming and those of us in the top half of the country will be limited in playing. This is the time that people will try to make swing changes and most of their golf club holding time is at the range or inside.

 

if you were advising a student on how to practice at range, how would you divide up their time in that hour or so? 

A few rehearsals, a few slow-concentrated “change the picture” swings while not worrying about contact/ball flight and then one or two regular swings focused on a target? Would you limit it to a time frame or number of balls?

[xmanhockey7]

Depends on the change. For some people they should be doing nothing but super exaggerated rehearsals then slow motion swings with video feedback. As they get better over time they can start to add more speed. For others your plan is good. Regardless they need video feedback to see if they’re doing it correctly. 

[Soloman1]

There are more modern and efficient ways now than trying to watch yourself on video. It's 2021. There are 3D systems for training that give real-time audio feedback so the player seeks the motion on their own. For example, ribcage and pelvis rotation at the top of the can be set and the player hears a tone when they're in range. 

 

Or stays in forward tilt at top or impact. Or has the targeted side bend at top or impact, etc.

[swh0507]

10 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

There are more modern and efficient ways now than trying to watch yourself on video. It's 2021. There are 3D systems for training that give real-time audio feedback so the player seeks the motion on their own. For example, ribcage and pelvis rotation at the top of the can be set and the player hears a tone when they're in range. 

 

Or stays in forward tilt at top or impact. Or has the targeted side bend at top or impact, etc.

I would love to hear what 3D systems that you are talking about and their accessibility. I know of KVest and Gears, but I would not categorize either as easily accessible. 

[Soloman1]

Some examples of a biofeedback system that costs hundreds, not thousands or tens of thousands:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rsg678Bqq6M

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTBoWzJybQU

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Awk1827o6Y

 

[xmanhockey7]

3 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

Some examples of a biofeedback system that costs hundreds, not thousands or tens of thousands:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rsg678Bqq6M

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTBoWzJybQU

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Awk1827o6Y

 

If they can swing it and know what to look for that’s great. 

[Scottbox]

Assuming you'd prefer not to go down the 3D rabbit hole, get your teacher to video you doing the change from the proper angles. And then, when you practice, work on that change using many exaggerated rehearsals before you go to the ball (referring to the video if you need to). Then, hit balls at pretty slow speed. Like, take an 8 iron and try to hit it 90 or 100 yards while doing the new move. Disregard the ballflight completely. This type of practice is very stilted arhythmic. All you're worried about is feeling the move. There's nothing wrong with videoing what you're doing, as long as your angles are correct. Hit 5 slow swing balls working on the move, then do 5 regular speed swings not thinking about the change at all. This will help speed up your integration process.

[Soloman1]

2 hours ago, Scottbox said:

Assuming you'd prefer not to go down the 3D rabbit hole...

 

Why is it a "rabbit hole?"

 

 

[Scottbox]

2 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

 

Why is it a "rabbit hole?"

 

 

Oh, gee... shall we list the reasons?

 

1. The learning curve involved with familiarizing oneself with pretty arcane data points is fairly steep for most of us

 

2. The information is less than useless in the hands of someone who doesn't understand how those data points specifically apply to them (or have an instructor who does, such as a Goltec teacher or whatnot)

 

3. The fact that most instructors don't even utilize these various 3D devices yet, so it's left to the poor student to have to research all this info. Good luck!

 

I'm fairly well-versed in golf tech-ery, and this stuff gives me a headache. 

Edited October 19, 2021 by Scottbox

[Soloman1]

3 minutes ago, Scottbox said:

Oh, gee... shall we list the reasons?

 

1. The learning curve involved with familiarizing oneself with pretty arcane data points is fairly steep for most of us

 

2. The information is less than useless in the hands of someone who doesn't understand how those data points specifically apply to them (or have an instructor who does, such as a Goltec teacher or whatnot)

 

3. The fact that most instructors don't even utilize these various 3D devices yet, so it's left to the poor student to have to research all this info. Good luck!

 

I'm fairly well-versed in golf tech-ery, and this stuff gives me a headache. 

 

Are you a golf instructor?

[Soloman1]

29 minutes ago, Scottbox said:

Oh, gee... shall we list the reasons?

 

1. The learning curve involved with familiarizing oneself with pretty arcane data points is fairly steep for most of us

 

2. The information is less than useless in the hands of someone who doesn't understand how those data points specifically apply to them (or have an instructor who does, such as a Goltec teacher or whatnot)

 

3. The fact that most instructors don't even utilize these various 3D devices yet, so it's left to the poor student to have to research all this info. Good luck!

 

I'm fairly well-versed in golf tech-ery, and this stuff gives me a headache. 

 

I'll save you the time of answering. I don't want to drag it out.

 

1. No, it's not arcane. It's easy to understand. A 30 second reading of the instructions gets anyone started.

 

2. The software is set to the use the PGA Tour range of motion for address, top of swing and impact. The player simply moves and seeks those positions on their own. Biofeedback is the most efficient way to change a movement pattern.

 

3. There's no research necessary. A two page document explains everything in 8th grade language. 

 

4. Many normal, everyday players use this, not just instructors. Most golf students are smarter than instructors. They're engineers, lawyers, doctors, business people, while most golf instructors barely got out of high school.

 

I don't think you know the technology, or the ease of use, as well as you think you do.

[teddyironboy]

47 minutes ago, Scottbox said:

Oh, gee... shall we list the reasons?

 

1. The learning curve involved with familiarizing oneself with pretty arcane data points is fairly steep for most of us

 

2. The information is less than useless in the hands of someone who doesn't understand how those data points specifically apply to them (or have an instructor who does, such as a Goltec teacher or whatnot)

 

3. The fact that most instructors don't even utilize these various 3D devices yet, so it's left to the poor student to have to research all this info. Good luck!

 

I'm fairly well-versed in golf tech-ery, and this stuff gives me a headache. 

As a recent owner of hackmotion I agree. It’s a pretty awesome gadget but just don’t know how to use it properly. Will have to spend more time with it.

 

DTL and FO videos are good enough to figure out your swing I think. Exact angles aren’t necessary.

[swh0507]

10 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

 

I'll save you the time of answering. I don't want to drag it out.

 

1. No, it's not arcane. It's easy to understand. A 30 second reading of the instructions gets anyone started.

 

2. The software is set to the use the PGA Tour range of motion for address, top of swing and impact. The player simply moves and seeks those positions on their own. Biofeedback is the most efficient way to change a movement pattern.

 

3. There's no research necessary. A two page document explains everything in 8th grade language. 

 

4. Many normal, everyday players use this, not just instructors. Most golf students are smarter than instructors. They're engineers, lawyers, doctors, business people, while most golf instructors barely got out of high school.

 

I don't think you know the technology, or the ease of use, as well as you think you do.

I think you may have a different idea of accessibility. I agree and do believe that biofeedback and data points may be the future. It is very difficult to find cost of these devices because they are geared to instructors  etc. This also shows that you would be better off using these devices under the supervision of an instructor. I looked at your links and tried to find the cost of the device they discuss. I would love to find an affordable biofeedback/3d capture device, however I cannot justify the cost of these yet. I CAN justify the value of going to an instructor who utilizes these devices.

 

 It looks like the 3d device you linked is in the 2-4k range (from used prices). Someone trying to change/improve would be far better off taking 10 lessons in the $100-$200 range in my opinion.

 

 

[Soloman1]

The biofeedback model you saw in the videos is under $500.

[CasualLie]

The mySwing stuff looks cool, but it looks like it could use some updating; i.e. iPad support

[Soloman1]

 

32 minutes ago, CasualLie said:

The mySwing stuff looks cool, but it looks like it could use some updating; i.e. iPad support

 

It's a technology limitation. iPad processor can't support the real-time data crunching and doesn't have a USB port for wireless data transfer. Comes with a tablet anyway.

[golfarb1]

On 10/19/2021 at 7:01 AM, Soloman1 said:

The biofeedback model you saw in the videos is under $500.

The Hackmotion Wrist sensor , which measures only wrist angles and arm rotation has 2 models 

the Pro@$950 and  the Player on special for $395.

Before I moved to smaller quarters 3 years ago  , I looked into Myswing golf. At that time the base model , which measures only upper movement was around $2,000 while the model with all the bells and whistles was north of $6,000. I do not know the current price , but if is below $1,000, then it is a must buy 

Edited October 20, 2021 by golfarb1

[Lefty_3Jack]

Thanks for hacking this (pun intended) for a review on some gadget.