2022 TaylorMade Stealth, Stealth Plus, Stealth HD drivers (in-hand photos)

[golfnhack]

I can't help but wonder if TM tested the carbon face with anything but pristine TP 5 golf balls for durability. Something tells me the face won't hold up as well with the sand embedded balls you find at your typical range.

[Pastit]

6 hours ago, QuigleyDU said:

The Gemini was an awesome driver at the time. You could be right I have no clue. I try to trust the rocket scientist that decided to build golf clubs. Lol. I think they are all trying to make us better.. 

 

Please remove “ make us “ and replace with “ profit “.

[Pastit]

6 hours ago, grm24 said:

Seeing that this has been under development by TM for years it's highly improbable their new VC owners had anything to do with it. Excellent article on it.

 

https://golf.com/gear/taylormade-stealth-drivers-fairway-woods-first-look/

 

“We’ve found ways to move driver technology and face design forward,” said Tomo Bystedt, TaylorMade’s senior director of product creation. “But, like anything else, there’s an expiration on certain materials and technologies. As an R&D organization, we’re trying to look into the future and see what our next 5 to 10 years are going to look like.

 

“What we learned is there is no dramatic improvement for titanium, so we could see that writing on the wall about 3 to 4 years ago when we introduced the Speed Injection Technology. Now we were really at the limit of how good — and fast — we could make the face.”

 

Over the next four years, TaylorMade worked diligently on a driver that’s been dubbed the “Carbonwood.” In TaylorMade’s eyes, the 60-layer Carbon Twist Face found on the new Stealth, Stealth Plus and Stealth HD (High Draw) is the future of driver face design. The company is so bullish, in fact, they’re ceasing production of titanium drivers going

I’d love to hear from an expert about whether titanium is becoming too expensive and/ or scarce rather than the above ?

On the “ red “, anyone spotted this is Tigger’s favourite colour - especially on Sundays?

 

ps: Quote-

News

   August 12th, 2021 | Written by IndexBox

Titanium Prices to Keep Elevated on Production Shortages and Rising Demand from the Paint and Aerospace Industries

 

 

 

Edited January 5, 2022 by Pastit

[Getitorloseit]

15 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

My question is........will we see less cracked faces since "carbon wood" is supposedly more durable than titanium like TM claims.  I like the notion of more ball speed but at what cost? 

The ballspeed gains aren't there. It's a good driver. Stealth + is basically a sim with a heavier backweight and neutral CoG. 

 

If you like sim then stealth+ is more forgiving and less fade biased. 

[me05501]

9 hours ago, BottleCap said:

From a guy that has Callaway in his bag

 

And people wonder why the Titleist/Mizuno stans get a rep for exactly that kind of behavior! Nice. 

[me05501]

I think the red face was a calculated move to create exactly the kind of interest evidenced in this thread.

 

Some will love it and others will hate it, but we'll all be talking about it, and we'll all have a level of anticipation between seeing the pics and seeing one out in the wild. 

 

From a viral marketing standpoint it is very effective, which TM needs, because it looks like the face is the biggest change from SIM2 to Stealth. The bodies are very similar except for the graphics. 

[lakecowboy]

I'm interested in the MyStealth, but last year in the MySim2 I was told by my local fitter/golf shop who moves a lot of drivers that if you crack the face/head, the replacement will be a regular Sim2/Stealth.  That's a turn off for me on getting the MyStealth after having cracked two drivers myself and seen a number of drivers crack at my country club.

[QuigleyDU]

3 hours ago, Pastit said:

 

Please remove “ make us “ and replace with “ profit “.

 

Sure, I have no problem with a company making money.. No one should. If you think their driver is too expensive, dont buy it. If no one does, the next one will be less expensive. But, lots and lots will buy it... 

[BirdieBob]

 

[QuigleyDU]

21 minutes ago, BirdieBob said:

 

Pretty cool. 

[meyerssr]

17 hours ago, Carolina Golfer 2 said:

Obvioulsy it's not apples to apples because a driver is much more expensive.  But a TM person has said that MYSpider orders constitute about 40% of all Spider orders, much more than they had anticpated, and that's one of the reasons they brought it to the driver. 

Hmmm... that should be a sign... almost half your orders people are willing to pay an absurd amount for a different look... the stock color choice must be truly hideous 😆 Fire the employee who came up with that one

[meyerssr]

12 hours ago, BottleCap said:

From a guy that has Callaway in his bag

the only traditional looking brands anymore are Titleist and Mizuno. Callaway branches out some, but Taylormade truly is the extreme of new and exotic looks now that Nike is no more. Sometimes it can look good, but if the material finish is wrong it just looks cheap. The face is just cheesy looking on this one.

[phizzy30]

1 hour ago, Getitorloseit said:

The ballspeed gains aren't there. It's a good driver. Stealth + is basically a sim with a heavier backweight and neutral CoG. 

 

If you like sim then stealth+ is more forgiving and less fade biased. 

I had the SIM until recently as my back up head and as you can see, the SIM 2 is my gamer.  I am very familiar with both heads.  Any gain in ball speed is a good thing IMO as long as dispersion is consistent.  I'm not quite sold on the carbon fiber face in terms of durability though. 

[meyerssr]

8 hours ago, Valtiel said:

I think I understand what you're saying, I just don't think the first part is correct. "The further away you get from horizontal cg the more spin" is not true, half of the face is going to decrease spin. It doesn't matter either way though, because as I mentioned in my post above yours, balancing MOI and face bulge is what helps to steer the ball back online when you miss horizontally. I feel like you're coming from the place of "all mishits are off target, therefore more speed is bad", and that is not true. All things being equal, toe strikes will start right and curve left, and vice versa for heel strikes. If they ALL have more speed than that is a good thing on average. You would not want to strategically "slow down" any portion of the face for spin reasons, you would do so for durability ones (different topic). 

You're right in wondering about the explanations for what "increased speed" actually means though, I definitely agree with that. With the way faces are designed I believe they can make the same types of claims as you might see from a casino. I've used this analogy here before, but when a casino claims their slots payout more than anyone else's, the fact is that the computer controlled nature of the machine and the way it can be programmed means they can legally make that claim even if the actual difference is intentionally miniscule. The point is not that TM or anyone else is "holding anything back", although they definitely are in other ways, but all they need to claim "fastest ever" or "increased speed" is a some agreed upon collection of shots and their averages. They need only remove fractions of material from certain parts of the face to increase COR in that area, and thus increase ball speed. This btw is what I think carbon brings to the table; the ability to do this without having to consider metallic limitations in strength and flexibility, buts thats a different topic. 

The second bit is that admitting the gains are based on an average across a wide variety of strikes just isn't very sexy, and it's still accurate and legal to just say "increased speed" because the average player that hits all over the face will likely see an increase on average. 

I did custom club fitting and launch monitor tracking for 15 years. Spin does change as you go more off center. think of it this way. higher on the face = lower spin, lower on the face = higher spin. The more left and right of center, the less "spring" is in the face, so  "back" spin doesn't change all that much direct left and right of center, the face just has less "Pop". left and right from center does generate side spin (gear effect). 

 

Technically you are both right about "more ball speed on off center hits". it can be good, bad or indifferent. More ball speed on the horizontal access is fine as long as the discretionary weight balance is improved to reduce the spin. If you improve the ball speed on off center hits without adjusting the club MOI / Stability, you can easily over-cook a draw or fade.

 

More ball speed without spin control just means miss-hits can go even farther into the woods haha

[Getitorloseit]

5 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

I had the SIM until recently as my back up head and as you can see, the SIM 2 is my gamer.  I am very familiar with both heads.  Any gain in ball speed is a good thing IMO as long as dispersion is consistent.  I'm not quite sold on the carbon fiber face in terms of durability though. 

If you like sim2 (non max) but would love to have the adjustable weight with the added forgiveness that sim2 provided over sim, then stealth+ is your jam. Stealth+ should be slightly lower spin than sim2.

[Getitorloseit]

21 minutes ago, meyerssr said:

Hmmm... that should be a sign... almost half your orders people are willing to pay an absurd amount for a different look... the stock color choice must be truly hideous 😆 Fire the employee who came up with that one

Or give him a raise since the custom face color seems to be driving higher revenue...

[meyerssr]

30 minutes ago, Getitorloseit said:

Or give him a raise since the custom face color seems to be driving higher revenue...

This was in regards to the putters.

 

Regardless, if you think they are making a lot of money on that extra $100-$150, your missing the point. The OEMs use these custom color options for mostly product testing and as an option to gain customers. They don't actually make any more money by offering this. What they do gain is knowledge and volume. It helps them understand market interest for future planning and design, and production volume. As much as businesses like this enjoy profit margins, they like volume more, because volume is self-advertising. It's better to have 100,000 of your clubs in play at 5% margin than 20,000 @ 15% margin. As much as performance matters to lots of golfers, perception of dominance is better. And the higher the volumes you can produce (within reason, still can't over shoot demand by a ton), the lower the cost to produce, amongst many other perks.

[Pastit]

20 minutes ago, meyerssr said:

This was in regards to the putters.

 

Regardless, if you think they are making a lot of money on that extra $100-$150, your missing the point. The OEMs use these custom color options for mostly product testing and as an option to gain customers. They don't actually make any more money by offering this. What they do gain is knowledge and volume. It helps them understand market interest for future planning and design, and production volume. As much as businesses like this enjoy profit margins, they like volume more, because volume is self-advertising. It's better to have 100,000 of your clubs in play at 5% margin than 20,000 @ 15% margin. As much as performance matters to lots of golfers, perception of dominance is better. And the higher the volumes you can produce (within reason, still can't over shoot demand by a ton), the lower the cost to produce, amongst many other perks.

I can see you’re not a corporate man. 

[SwooshLT]

5 hours ago, Getitorloseit said:

The ballspeed gains aren't there. It's a good driver. Stealth + is basically a sim with a heavier backweight and neutral CoG. 

 

If you like sim then stealth+ is more forgiving and less fade biased. 

 

WELL STATED! 

[chip75]

Looks like a Yonex CarbonEX, Srixon and Nike decided to have a baby (driver)...

 

And like the Srixon ZX5 and ZX7 that red sole paint looks cheap.

[pccasstpro]

20 hours ago, Valtiel said:

Honest question, if you have these concerns then don't you think the entire R&D and testing department of one of the biggest club companies in the world would be aware as well? For what you're saying to be valid, TM would have had to do zero durability testing and be completely unaware of the problems you're speaking of, which I think we can agree is pretty silly. The fact that you seem to be dismissing carbon fiber out of hand would also suggest you know very little about the material, especially since your M5 is full of it. 

R&D conditions try to replicate failure in a controlled environment. Have you ever been to the R&D facility at TM? I have been quite a few times!  As good as they are, they are not as good as a amateur golfer coming in steep on a traditional over the top path for that ultimate idiot mark on the crown! As as I posted before, those wet and sandy Pinnacle range balls are going to leave some interesting marks on a polyurethaned face. Again real world vs. R&D lab is a big grey area. I was at Callaway for the original C4 launch and they waxed eloquence about how tough the carbon head was compared to traditional materials, and 5 months later it was discontinued and the GBBII was back in the prime spot. 20 years does make a difference but as I said in my original post ; Carbon Fiber is a non impact support material. It’s strength to weight ratio is high , but doesn’t compare to traditional materials. Which brings me to my M5 , that you seemingly think I know nothing about. Carbon Fiber is used , but in a support structure role. So unless you have experience in hitting drives off the top of your crown , the carbon fiber is in a support structure aspect and not on the face on in impact position. It would be interesting to see what the Pre-Preg formulation and overlay pattern is on this face. 

[Valtiel]

44 minutes ago, pccasstpro said:

R&D conditions try to replicate failure in a controlled environment. Have you ever been to the R&D facility at TM? I have been quite a few times!  As good as they are, they are not as good as a amateur golfer coming in steep on a traditional over the top path for that ultimate idiot mark on the crown! As as I posted before, those wet and sandy Pinnacle range balls are going to leave some interesting marks on a polyurethaned face. Again real world vs. R&D lab is a big grey area. I was at Callaway for the original C4 launch and they waxed eloquence about how tough the carbon head was compared to traditional materials, and 5 months later it was discontinued and the GBBII was back in the prime spot. 20 years does make a difference but as I said in my original post ; Carbon Fiber is a non impact support material. It’s strength to weight ratio is high , but doesn’t compare to traditional materials. Which brings me to my M5 , that you seemingly think I know nothing about. Carbon Fiber is used , but in a support structure role. So unless you have experience in hitting drives off the top of your crown , the carbon fiber is in a support structure aspect and not on the face on in impact position. It would be interesting to see what the Pre-Preg formulation and overlay pattern is on this face. 

Well i'd argue that in your "steep over the top idiot mark" scenario that the carbon elements on the bottom of the M5 do in fact become impact materials, haha. I get your point though, I just find it hard to believe that Taylormade wouldn't account for these real world variables given that they aren't exactly subtle, especially since they have stated all drivers going forward will feature carbon faces and they won't be returning to metal. That kind of confidence suggests they aren't worried about durability, and the failures of the past certainly wouldn't be lost on them. 

I too would be curious about the pre-preg/orientations/specs of the materials, and I suspect we might see some of the shaft style marketing around those materials, things like tensile strength, varying modulus ratings, and combinations of different types etc.  

[tbone18]

12 hours ago, Getitorloseit said:

The ballspeed gains aren't there. It's a good driver. Stealth + is basically a sim with a heavier backweight and neutral CoG. 

 

If you like sim then stealth+ is more forgiving and less fade biased. 

actually the back weight is only 6g in all models.  The weight is the small silver piece in the back of the head.  TM has made it look like the prior gen weight system but its not.  need Billy Bob's to get these weights in asap.

[ALIF]

I do like the DEEP face. Reminds me of mine Rocketballz Tour driver. That was in the bag for a long, long time! G 400 Max finally kicked it out of the bag. Maybe this club will kick my ping out of the bag.

[khalespace]

7 minutes ago, tbone18 said:

actually the back weight is only 6g in all models.  The weight is the small silver piece in the back of the head.  TM has made it look like the prior gen weight system but its not.  need Billy Bob's to get these weights in asap.

Is the back weight changeable? How about the sliding weight?

[BostonWRX]

Not sure how true this is but

 

[Red4282]

12 minutes ago, tbone18 said:

actually the back weight is only 6g in all models.  The weight is the small silver piece in the back of the head.  TM has made it look like the prior gen weight system but its not.  need Billy Bob's to get these weights in asap.

Wait a minute, 6g? The Og sim was 10 in front 12 in back. Now this one is 10 in front 6 in back, AND we saved weight from the face? Where is it going?

[tbone18]

1 minute ago, Red4282 said:

Wait a minute, 6g? The Og sim was 10 in front 12 in back. Now this one is 10 in front 6 in back, AND we saved weight from the face? Where is it going?

remember there are only 2 pieces of carbon on this club, the crown and face the rest is titanium. Sim2 is all carbon except for the aluminium ring ti face and body cage.  Plus all the heads weigh right around 196g without loft sleeve which is consistent with prior gen heads.

[khalespace]

2 minutes ago, tbone18 said:

remember there are only 2 pieces of carbon on this club, the crown and face the rest is titanium. Sim2 is all carbon except for the aluminium ring ti face and body cage.  Plus all the heads weigh right around 196g without loft sleeve which is consistent with prior gen heads.

Yes, perimeter weighting makes the club head more forgiving.

[tbone18]

13 minutes ago, khalespace said:

Is the back weight changeable? How about the sliding weight?

sliding weight for sure.  now you need a smaller head size torque wrench to remove the back weight.  the old white cobra wrench fits perfect.  it is a screw and a round weight.  By the way the screw has lock tight on it, so might need to add some heat to loosen.