Should another one of the majors be played outside the US?

[Shilgy]

1 hour ago, MattTheTaff said:

Who gets to decide if a tournament is a 'Major'? Does it get ratified by an organisation, does it actually exist on paper? Or is it just a social construct that only exist in the heads of the people who say it exists?

 

You know....like.... Canadians, for example.

Or LPGA money counters that accept the Evian?

 

The four mens majors are MAJORS a this point because of tradition.  The womens majors are more closely aligned with the LPGA. What is a major for the women has been a more fluid proposition.

 That is why the talk of “just create a “fifth” will not work.

[smashdn]

14 hours ago, tiderider said:

that's not the worst idea ... 

 

It has some logistical issues.  As I got to looking, a good many of the European ones are happening in august and september, when the PGAT has turned the page so-to-speak.  That doesn't really align with adding cache and prestige (at least in the US) due to coming up against the NFL, but I think they are a far sight better than the wrap around [non] silly season, silly season tournaments.

 

That being said, aside from straight cash, I am not sure how you attract the world's best post Fed Ex cup.  If I were ruler of the golfing world, I would move the PGA 'ship back to August, TPC back to May, encourage guys to play the Irish and Scottish ahead of The OC, and maybe schedule another European Open behind that.  Back to the US to start ramping towards the PGA and the Tour Championship.  

 

I would replace some of those terds in Sept - Christmas with the Euro Opens.  Not sure how you weave Australian Open into the mix.  You Aussies are a long way from everywhere (except NZ).  Maybe do the Australian Open right ahead of the Sony so you fly from OZ to HI?

[smashdn]

18 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

Or LPGA money counters that accept the Evian?

 

The four mens majors are MAJORS a this point because of tradition.  The womens majors are more closely aligned with the LPGA. What is a major for the women has been a more fluid proposition.

 That is why the talk of “just create a “fifth” will not work.

 

Senior majors are an interesting matter.

[munichop]

In some ways the Olympics have become the next coveted thing that will grow the game in the way Paul suggests. And they happen every 4 years all over the world. So if the PGA were to move once in awhile it should be in Olympic years. But I think the Olympics will fill the void he thinks exists.

[Danielson]

Clearly never going to happen, but I would love to see a full on world tour. Unfortunately a lot of the best courses worldwide can't host because they can't fit the amount of hospitality tents and branding required by the PGA.

[MattTheTaff]

59 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

Or LPGA money counters that accept the Evian?

 

The four mens majors are MAJORS a this point because of tradition.  The womens majors are more closely aligned with the LPGA. What is a major for the women has been a more fluid proposition.

 That is why the talk of “just create a “fifth” will not work.

Tradiition is not really answer though, is it?

 

Its an intangible, abstract concept that is akin to 'well, we've always done it like this'.

 

Some of you need to question your ideas on history, authority and 'why the hell are we doing this in the first place'.

[bladehunter]

29 minutes ago, MattTheTaff said:

Tradiition is not really answer though, is it?

 

Its an intangible, abstract concept that is akin to 'well, we've always done it like this'.

 

Some of you need to question your ideas on history, authority and 'why the hell are we doing this in the first place'.

But - that’s akin to saying “ blow it all up “. Well that falls apart when we ask “ why “? 
 

the answer is always “ because we said so “.  
 

ok.  Why would I change to suit one random whim , when the current random whim is working perfectly fine ????

 

Change for the sake of change is part of the insanity paradigm  .  It’s the antithesis of “ doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result “    It’s only insanity if the current result is undesirable to most   ……most do not believe that the current result is undesirable- therefore changing just to change it becomes the new definition of insanity.  

Edited May 24, 2022 by bladehunter

[smashdn]

2 hours ago, MattTheTaff said:

Tradiition is not really answer though, is it?

 

Its an intangible, abstract concept that is akin to 'well, we've always done it like this'.

 

Some of you need to question your ideas on history, authority and 'why the hell are we doing this in the first place'.

 

Hambone effect

Edited May 24, 2022 by smashdn
Left off "effect."

[MattTheTaff]

10 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

But - that’s akin to saying “ blow it all up “. Well that falls apart when we ask “ why “? 
 

the answer is always “ because we said so “.  
 

ok.  Why would I change to suit one random whim , when the current random whim is working perfectly fine ????

 

Change for the sake of change is part of the insanity paradigm  .  It’s the antithesis of “ doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result “    It’s only insanity if the current result is undesirable to most   ……most do not believe that the current result is undesirable- therefore changing just to change it becomes the new definition of insanity.  

Good, now we're getting somewhere. And I agree up to a point. Personally I dont anything will change unless corporate interests tell us things will change.

 

But for those arguing for change, and those defending the status quo, you have to get to the root of the problem. That is: what is the definition of a 'Major'

 

Who decides what is a major, the USGA, RnA, old duffers in green jackets, corporate sponsors, the media, or public opinion?

 

Or can anyone just set up a comp and call it the most prestigious tourney in the world?

 

I think this is the real reason why there is so much controversy around this Saudi tour. Its not because of Greg Norman, lefty, or the heinous human rights abuses in Saudi, its because these boys have real money and are challenging the existing establishment (RnA, USGA, etc).

[MattTheTaff]

17 minutes ago, smashdn said:

 

Hambone

Ad hominim 

[Cincy_Ken]

6 hours ago, rblmp32 said:

 

Majors have their fair share of no namers winning too.  Shaun Michel, Rich Beem, Ben Curtis, Todd Hamilton?    Random guys winning isn't a characteristic of the Players, it happens in majors too.  

None of those names are in the last 10 years.  I don't remember where but I remember reading that there was an inordinate number of odd major winners in the early '00s; some speculated it had to do with the advent of the solid core golf ball.  Besides Phil it seems like a long time since someone outside the top 50 won.

[Cincy_Ken]

1 minute ago, Cincy_Ken said:

None of those names are in the last 10 years.  I don't remember where but I remember reading that there was an inordinate number of odd major winners in the early '00s; some speculated it had to do with the advent of the solid core golf ball.  Besides Phil it seems like a long time since someone outside the top 50 won.

Just pulled up a list, Since Keegan won at #108 in 2011 lowest ranked major winners are Jimmy Walker at #48, two legends of the game in Els and Mickelson at #40 and #115, then Shane Lowry at #33.  Major Champs have been really solid for a decade.  In fairness recent Players champs have been too but Si Woo Kim was more recent than any of the odd major winners

[bladehunter]

44 minutes ago, MattTheTaff said:

Good, now we're getting somewhere. And I agree up to a point. Personally I dont anything will change unless corporate interests tell us things will change.

 

But for those arguing for change, and those defending the status quo, you have to get to the root of the problem. That is: what is the definition of a 'Major'

 

Who decides what is a major, the USGA, RnA, old duffers in green jackets, corporate sponsors, the media, or public opinion?

 

Or can anyone just set up a comp and call it the most prestigious tourney in the world?

 

I think this is the real reason why there is so much controversy around this Saudi tour. Its not because of Greg Norman, lefty, or the heinous human rights abuses in Saudi, its because these boys have real money and are challenging the existing establishment (RnA, USGA, etc).

But if it were only money.   Wouldn’t they get their way ? 
 

i personally believe it to be tradition - tradition that started with the open , and then the us open etc. tradition based upon the start of industrialized history really.  
 

to start a new one now seems fake.  There’s no tradition in todays world. We don’t keep anything.  ( I do ) but most don’t. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by bladehunter

[rblmp32]

2 minutes ago, Cincy_Ken said:

None of those names are in the last 10 years.  I don't remember where but I remember reading that there was an inordinate number of odd major winners in the early '00s; some speculated it had to do with the advent of the solid core golf ball.  Besides Phil it seems like a long time since someone outside the top 50 won.

 

To be fair, none of those guys you listed won the Players in the last 10 years either.  Choi was the most recent, and that was 2011.  

[PoolPond]

No.  It's a USA based tour. Simple as that and as it should be. 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

1 hour ago, MattTheTaff said:

Good, now we're getting somewhere. And I agree up to a point. Personally I dont anything will change unless corporate interests tell us things will change.

 

But for those arguing for change, and those defending the status quo, you have to get to the root of the problem. That is: what is the definition of a 'Major'

 

Who decides what is a major, the USGA, RnA, old duffers in green jackets, corporate sponsors, the media, or public opinion?

 

Or can anyone just set up a comp and call it the most prestigious tourney in the world?

 

I think this is the real reason why there is so much controversy around this Saudi tour. Its not because of Greg Norman, lefty, or the heinous human rights abuses in Saudi, its because these boys have real money and are challenging the existing establishment (RnA, USGA, etc).

A golf major is defined by many facets of history surrounding the event.  This includes; how long it's been a tournament, who's played in it, who's won it, how/why it began, how prestigious the golfers themselves feel it is and fan interest.  Yes the purse is certainly important but if someone thinks they can make a major simply by throwing money at it then the are sorely uninformed.  Case and point, the fan and media interest in the FedEx cup is meager compared to anyone of the majors despite the giant pot of gold. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by BlackDiamondPar5

[widow-maker]

The Majors were formed over a period of time through a consensus of opinion.  No one group controls what is and what isn't a Major.  The USGA, R&A, PGA, PGA Tour, Euro Tour.... none of them can change it because they aren't in charge of it.  If some group attempted to declare that there's a new major, public opinion would not accept it.  The PGA Tour has long wanted a 5th major that they could control, but they don't have the cache to pull it off.  The Majors belong to the people and the Press has long been a guardian for the status quo.  

[buckeyefl]

6 hours ago, MattTheTaff said:

Good, now we're getting somewhere. And I agree up to a point. Personally I dont anything will change unless corporate interests tell us things will change.

 

But for those arguing for change, and those defending the status quo, you have to get to the root of the problem. That is: what is the definition of a 'Major'

 

Who decides what is a major, the USGA, RnA, old duffers in green jackets, corporate sponsors, the media, or public opinion?

 

Or can anyone just set up a comp and call it the most prestigious tourney in the world?

 

I think this is the real reason why there is so much controversy around this Saudi tour. Its not because of Greg Norman, lefty, or the heinous human rights abuses in Saudi, its because these boys have real money and are challenging the existing establishment (RnA, USGA, etc).

They aren't challenging much of anything. 

 

You know the answer to your question about who decides what is a major. If by some one in a billion chance that you aren't trolling then please utilize your favorite search engine.

 

7 hours ago, bladehunter said:

 

 

Change for the sake of change is part of the insanity paradigm  .  It’s the antithesis of “ doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result “    It’s only insanity if the current result is undesirable to most   ……most do not believe that the current result is undesirable- therefore changing just to change it becomes the new definition of insanity.  

Hole in one!

[stinger_gc]

Is @4thand11 Lee Westwood's WRX account??

[smashdn]

How long before we have a LIV Golf Tour Major?

[BlackDiamondPar5]

4 minutes ago, smashdn said:

How long before we have a LIV Golf Tour Major?

[mosesgolf]

One outside of US is enough.   The Open is a world open technically. 

[kmbean]

I think all four should be moved out of the US.  The states have had it good for far too long.

[Yuck]

Another vote for Asia given the growth of the game and the number Sponsors willing to pony up $$$.  Ambivalent whether it is 4 or 5 “Majors”

[BlackDiamondPar5]

3 hours ago, mosesgolf said:

One outside of US is enough.   The Open is a world open technically. 

Exactly and they can move the Open around the world as they see fit. The other three majors were made here and should stay here. Any talk to the contrary is blasphemous heresy. 

[Hawkeye77]

13 hours ago, KizIsTheMan said:

Is @4thand11 Lee Westwood's WRX account??

Westy wouldn’t waste his time with recycled threads - when you see a thread touting the Scandinavian Masters as a major you’ll know Westy is in the house. 

[dalehead]

I think this is another manifestation of the envy many Europeans have for American professional golf. The US PGA Tour is where every player aspires to play. The second best tour in the world, in terms of talent, is the Korn Ferry. DP World Tour? Great for professionals to learn their craft before taking a shot in the US, or for players that can’t compete on the PGA Tour but want to make a nice living in the game.

 

The list of PGA Championship winners includes names like Hagen, Sarazen, Nelson, Snead, Hogan, Nicklaus, Woods. If you think you’re good enough to join that list come to America and tee it up. 
 

3 out of 4 majors in the US? Sounds about right to me.

[MUNIGRIT]

No. 

[bscinstnct]

Canada deserves a major.

 

Well, they would still have it here in the US but call it the Canada Golf Major and Canadians can come free of charge 

 

Well, not free, but your first beer is 1/2 price. 
 

🤣

 

Just kidding Jeff!