Lexi needs mental help….

[MelloYello]

28 minutes ago, OrangeGravy said:

She hasn't a normal tournament for years either.  It's not just a major thing, it's a golf thing. She's expecting to choke. 

At this point, everyone knows she's gonna miss the critical putts or chips/pitches. She knows everyone expects it and she knows we know, that she knows. 

 

Best thing is to accept that it's hard and move on. 

 

There's no piece of advice that's going to somehow resolve the issue. She just has to keep placing herself in contention and fighting through the nerves in hopes she breaks through. 

 

The people who are so quick to claim "it's mental" do so suggesting there's an easy fix relating to mindset. IMHO, there is not. Anxiety is real--and her strokes in critical moments prove it--but picturing everyone in their underwear just isn't the answer if you ask me. 

 

Winning breeds winning and losing breeds losing. She's got to hang tough and keep fighting until she wins. 

 

How many tournament victories has Minjee Lee thrown away over the last decade because of lackluster putting? You think she's worried about that right now? No, sir.

[nvr3putt]

At this point, would it hurt her to experiment with nicotine (vaping or chew)?  

[Wardman]

She should go meet Tiger and have some lessons about playing in stressful environments.  I would say Michele Wie experienced similar issues and much was based upon expectations that were set by others for he.

[nvr3putt]

15 minutes ago, Wardman said:

She should go meet Tiger and have some lessons about playing in stressful environments.  I would say Michele Wie experienced similar issues and much was based upon expectations that were set by others for he.

What about Se Ri Pak's dad? If I recall correctly, he made Se Ri sleep in cemeteries at night. 😬

[Zitlow]

Bobby Jones on putting: "Now putting is an elusive part of the game for recreational players playing a congenial round of golf with their friends to seasoned professional players coming down the stretch in contention to win a tournament. In almost all cases the player is his or her own worst enemy."

 

"Trying to keep the putter head artificially close to the ground throws off the stroke interrupting the natural flow of motion for pros and dubs alike"

 

"An effective putting stroke should simply be a pendulum motion of the shaft as the putter head describes an arc. Up, down and back up with the butt of the instrument pointing at the belly button throughout the stroke."

[JosephNewton293]

Seems like a great person with her interaction with the fans but when she gets in contention it simply become OMG here we go....

[JK Ward]

Lexi’s chipping has looked scoopy to me for some time now. Very uncommon look from a pro. 

[bladehunter]

20 hours ago, MelloYello said:

 

Best thing is to accept that it's hard and move on. 

 

There's no piece of advice that's going to somehow resolve the issue. She just has to keep placing herself in contention and fighting through the nerves in hopes she breaks through. 

 

The people who are so quick to claim "it's mental" do so suggesting there's an easy fix relating to mindset. IMHO, there is not. Anxiety is real--and her strokes in critical moments prove it--but picturing everyone in their underwear just isn't the answer if you ask me. 

 

Winning breeds winning and losing breeds losing. She's got to hang tough and keep fighting until she wins. 

 

How many tournament victories has Minjee Lee thrown away over the last decade because of lackluster putting? You think she's worried about that right now? No, sir.

I think it’s person dependent. 
 

for me I’m very mechanically minded in general.  I want to know how things tick. Everything.  From my car to my home to my body to my mind. Even my animals body and mind etc. can’t really care for something if you don’t know the parts and how it works. 
 

studying the psychology and biology of the brain/body has been a godsend to me and my game.   You still need to experiment on yourself to see what clicks. But it sure does help speed up the process when you know things that are understood science or at least has a large consensus behind it.  
 

I guess some people may not be this way. If you drive a car and don’t know how it works , I don’t get that.  If you own a home and don’t know which way the ceiling joists run so that you can name the load bearing walls. I don’t get that.  So there maybe people who can’t click with the knowing of our wiring and workings.  I guess. I’m not sure how you just keep trying the same thing and expecting a new result though ? 

[bladehunter]

19 hours ago, nvr3putt said:

What about Se Ri Pak's dad? If I recall correctly, he made Se Ri sleep in cemeteries at night. 😬

Dead people can’t hurt you. My property butts up to a 159 year old cemetery. I walk my dog after midnight loads of times and nobody has jumped out and grabbed us yet 🤣 

[jt2gt]

2 hours ago, JK Ward said:

Lexi’s chipping has looked scoopy to me for some time now. Very uncommon look from a pro. 

Although every one of her full swings looks scoopy to me. 🤣  

[Golf Dino]

Quote

What about Se Ri Pak's dad? If I recall correctly, he made Se Ri sleep in cemeteries at night. 😬

 

Quote

Dead people can’t hurt you. My property butts up to a 159 year old cemetery. I walk my dog after midnight loads of times and nobody has jumped out and grabbed us yet  🤣 

@nvr3putt @bladehunter

 

This exchange has all the makings of a teen fantasy/horror show . . . the blonde heroine and star battling both demons, and her fear of demons by the most unorthodox practice of sleeping in cemeteries, countless hours of practice, the confiding in that special someone who just "gets them" and helps them bridge the challenge.  Perhaps throw in a villan or two and the the mean girl and were all set to go.  Where is Joss Whedon?    😂

 

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Golf Dino

[bodmanza]

1 hour ago, bladehunter said:

I think it’s person dependent. 
 

for me I’m very mechanically minded in general.  I want to know how things tick. Everything.  From my car to my home to my body to my mind. Even my animals body and mind etc. can’t really care for something if you don’t know the parts and how it works. 
 

studying the psychology and biology of the brain/body has been a godsend to me and my game.   You still need to experiment on yourself to see what clicks. But it sure does help speed up the process when you know things that are understood science or at least has a large consensus behind it.  
 

I guess some people may not be this way. If you drive a car and don’t know how it works , I don’t get that.  If you own a home and don’t know which way the ceiling joists run so that you can name the load bearing walls. I don’t get that.  So there maybe people who can’t click with the knowing of our wiring and workings.  I guess. I’m not sure how you just keep trying the same thing and expecting a new result though ? 

Wholeheartedly agree that each person is different. When I get thinking mechanics, beyond just simple adjustments, I lose the plot entirely. I get excessively micro focused on my hands, the clubface or feet or something rather than what I am actually trying to do: hit the back of the golf ball.

 

I have been playing since I was 5 years old (39 now) and most of my success comes when I am grooved to feel confident I can repeat whatever I am doing - often it is not overly pretty, but it is predictable. 

[Rapidcat]

1 hour ago, bladehunter said:

Dead people can’t hurt you. My property butts up to a 159 year old cemetery. I walk my dog after midnight loads of times and nobody has jumped out and grabbed us yet 🤣 

'Yet' is the operative word.

 

Give it time🙂

[EagleAteBirdie]

Suggesting Lexi "needs mental help" implies she is mentally impaired and I very much doubt that is the case or she wouldn't be where she is now.  I expect she is mentally stronger than most of us when it comes to performing at the highest level in sport.

 

Could she benefit from expert coaching that helps further improve mental performance for elite athletes that perform under extremely stressful conditions?  Possibly, yes. 

[Cwebb]

5 hours ago, JK Ward said:

Lexi’s chipping has looked scoopy to me for some time now. Very uncommon look from a pro. 

 

Yeah, I can't recall every seeing another top ranked tour player, who has a weight shift into their back foot through impact.  Morgan Pressel pointed it out that she at times does it with the putter. 

 

She has got to where she is with raw talent and power

[nvr3putt]

5 minutes ago, Cwebb said:

 

Yeah, I can't recall every seeing another top ranked tour player, who has a weight shift into their back foot through impact.  Morgan Pressel pointed it out that she at times does it with the putter. 

 

She has got to where she is with raw talent and power

Even more bizarre is that the weight ends up on the front side of her lead foot. And then she bounces a few times backwards.

WTF! Is she training to be a long drive champ?

[bullie76]

I like her and would love to see her win more. But I'm afraid she has been scarred beyond repair. Wouldn't hurt for her to go see a sports psychologist or a different one if she has already been to one. 

[bladehunter]

2 hours ago, bodmanza said:

Wholeheartedly agree that each person is different. When I get thinking mechanics, beyond just simple adjustments, I lose the plot entirely. I get excessively micro focused on my hands, the clubface or feet or something rather than what I am actually trying to do: hit the back of the golf ball.

 

I have been playing since I was 5 years old (39 now) and most of my success comes when I am grooved to feel confident I can repeat whatever I am doing - often it is not overly pretty, but it is predictable. 

Oh now I agree and I should clarify. 
 

i only think mechanics really in practice time. I work on figuring out the whys   off course . Same as the mental mechanics.  Implement them in everyday life situations then golf then golf under pressure.  But by the time it’s on course it’s never a really mechanical thought.  
 

in course I’m “ contact “ only player. I’m only seeing the back of the ball. When making a swing.  I may see flights or wind before I step in.  But I’m not sitting  there checking grip etc while over the ball.  Nope. It’s all reactionary then. The mental side has to become that too.  You will consciously begin to realize the negative self talk walking in the moment it happens.  You can get to where you recognize it , Tell it where to go ( with your own personal recipe ) and walk it out the back of your mind.  Takes seconds once you’re really committed.  And the more often you do it. The less times you have to consciously do It. It will start to happen without you being aware of it. That’s basically “ feel “ for the mental game.  When you Stop even realizing your brain is reacting to the fight or flight reflex.  The fight becomes the  default.  And your able to reboot automatically.  

Edited June 29, 2022 by bladehunter

[8602081]

5 minutes ago, nvr3putt said:

Even more bizarre is that the weight ends up on the front side of her lead foot. And then she bounces a few times backwards.

WTF! Is she training to be a long drive champ?

 

She has her own unique style of swing for all her clubs.. 

 

[bladehunter]

2 hours ago, EagleAteBirdie said:

Suggesting Lexi "needs mental help" implies she is mentally impaired and I very much doubt that is the case or she wouldn't be where she is now.  I expect she is mentally stronger than most of us when it comes to performing at the highest level in sport.

 

Could she benefit from expert coaching that helps further improve mental performance for elite athletes that perform under extremely stressful conditions?  Possibly, yes. 

That’s also mental help.  It’s always relative. 
 

the brain of the guy trying to make a 4 footer to win his club championship isn’t releasing any different reactions that the guy who has a 4 footer to win the us open.  The guy who has the putt to win the open will tell you his putt is harder.  But that’s in his context.  If you hooked them both up to monitors. They’d be reacting very much the same assuming desire to win is equal.    We must not act like these people on TV aren’t humans. They have no special powers.  Playing golf on TV isn’t in the top 25 most stressful occupations.  I think almost of ams do them selves a disservice by putting them up on a superhuman pedestal.  There’s no physical or mental reason why an amateur can’t be a better putter than the best players on earth.   

[Cwebb]

16 minutes ago, nvr3putt said:

Even more bizarre is that the weight ends up on the front side of her lead foot. And then she bounces a few times backwards.

WTF! Is she training to be a long drive champ?

I think what happened is that she was so talented and good at a very young age, that some obvious basic mechanics and technique "issues" were overlooked.

 

It's a tough spot to be in as a teacher and player of when to just leave it alone or attempt to force change. 

[mokedaddy]

21 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

That’s also mental help.  It’s always relative. 
 

the brain of the guy trying to make a 4 footer to win his club championship isn’t releasing any different reactions that the guy who has a 4 footer to win the us open.  The guy who has the putt to win the open will tell you his putt is harder.  But that’s in his context.  If you hooked them both up to monitors. They’d be reacting very much the same assuming desire to win is equal.    We must not act like these people on TV aren’t humans. They have no special powers.  Playing golf on TV isn’t in the top 25 most stressful occupations.  I think almost of ams do them selves a disservice by putting them up on a superhuman pedestal.  There’s no physical or mental reason why an amateur can’t be a better putter than the best players on earth.   

No two brains will look the same on a monitor.  People just aren’t wired the same way.

 

edit:  there may be some similarities but we know very little about how the brain actually works.

Edited June 29, 2022 by mokedaddy

[bladehunter]

1 hour ago, mokedaddy said:

No two brains will look the same on a monitor.  People just aren’t wired the same way.

 

edit:  there may be some similarities but we know very little about how the brain actually works.

I suppose that’s more accurate.  But my point was not that everyone is the same , it was the opposite,  that they Could easily be the same or even the opposite tilted the opposite way …. And that being a pro golfer isn’t a marker for some “ secret reaction “ to pressure. The 4 handicaps brain may react better than the tour pro.  And that “ mental help “ can be sought by any human.  And it be an applicable term.  
 

people over estimate their mental ability and underestimate their own.  In my layman’s opinion.  I value yours. I’m not arguing.  

[mokedaddy]

8 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

I suppose that’s more accurate.  But my point was not that everyone is the same , it was the opposite,  that they Could easily be the same or even the opposite tilted the opposite way …. And that being a pro golfer isn’t a marker for some “ secret reaction “ to pressure. The 4 handicaps brain may react better than the tour pro.  And that “ mental help “ can be sought by any human.  And it be an applicable term.  
 

people over estimate their mental ability and underestimate their own.  In my layman’s opinion.  I value yours. I’m not arguing.  

Yeah I agree totally.  There is nothing inherently special about a pro that allows them to handle pressure or anything else different.  I was just adding that even two pros or two amateur could easily be more different than comparing a pro or amateur.  It all depends on the individual.

 

edit:  I also agree about the mental health aspect.  It’s the attitude of you only seek help if you are “impaired” is the largest driver of stigma and a huge reason many people do not seek help.

Edited June 29, 2022 by mokedaddy

[Pym]

On 6/27/2022 at 1:57 PM, woahnelly said:

Lexi can do all the short game work practice for 12 hrs a day sinking 5 footers - none of that matters when the pressure is on the line. you can't replicate that environment when it's winning time.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I’m kind of being repetitive on my earlier take here and I do think there’s something to performing under pressure but golf, like 3 point make percent in basketball or batting average, is such a game averages over time that I think the “choke” take is way overdone. (If a player grounds out in the bottom of the 9th calling it a ‘choke’ is just way too easy and if the coach hopes to win by getting their player mental help for the next time that situation comes up I feel sorry for their fans.) Pros make about 50% of putts from 8 feet and that percent drops precipitously from beyond 8 feet. So statistically the “choke” takes are like saying she choked for flipping heads instead of tales. 
 

I think there’s no way Lexi and her team are goring back and trying to figure out how to perform at 100% perfection on the last 3 holes of a golf course. They’re trying to figure out how to increase overall performance by a few percent over 72 holes. They know that expecting perfection over a few particularly holes is a recipe for mental self abuse. 
 

I’m with the ‘rework the entire game’ takes. I’m obviously not a pro but watching Thompson next to players like Thitikul, Hataoka, Minjee Lee, Hannah Green, I would say Thompson  is the grittiest of all of them just to get into those positions to win. Totally my opinion but their full swings, short game and putting are downright insane compared to Thompson. She’s a great athlete but sometimes I think it’s pretty amazing she even keeps up with them at all. I think Thompson has performed beyond her talent level. 
 

(I do agree professional mental health support is very helpful for almost anyone in high pressure situations.) 

Edited July 3, 2022 by Pym
Mental health

[Shilgy]

On 6/27/2022 at 11:52 AM, Abh159 said:

The true question is... If you had to choose between Lexi or Will Z to make a 3 footer to save your life, do you go with cremation or a traditional burial? 🤣

 

 

Considering Will Z is perfect on the season from 3’ and in I’ll take Will. And make sure my will is updated first.🤣

[ChronicSlicer]

On 7/3/2022 at 11:40 AM, Pym said:

I’m with the ‘rework the entire game’ takes. 
 

 

I don't know who on earth would want to rework an iron swing that has hit more GIR's in the last decade than anyone else. Sounds like a career ender.

 

[bladehunter]

On 7/3/2022 at 11:40 AM, Pym said:

I’m kind of being repetitive on my earlier take here and I do think there’s something to performing under pressure but golf, like 3 point make percent in basketball or batting average, is such a game averages over time that I think the “choke” take is way overdone. (If a player grounds out in the bottom of the 9th calling it a ‘choke’ is just way too easy and if the coach hopes to win by getting their player mental help for the next time that situation comes up I feel sorry for their fans.) Pros make about 50% of putts from 8 feet and that percent drops precipitously from beyond 8 feet. So statistically the “choke” takes are like saying she choked for flipping heads instead of tales. 
 

I think there’s no way Lexi and her team are goring back and trying to figure out how to perform at 100% perfection on the last 3 holes of a golf course. They’re trying to figure out how to increase overall performance by a few percent over 72 holes. They know that expecting perfection over a few particularly holes is a recipe for mental self abuse. 
 

I’m with the ‘rework the entire game’ takes. I’m obviously not a pro but watching Thompson next to players like Thitikul, Hataoka, Minjee Lee, Hannah Green, I would say Thompson  is the grittiest of all of them just to get into those positions to win. Totally my opinion but their full swings, short game and putting are downright insane compared to Thompson. She’s a great athlete but sometimes I think it’s pretty amazing she even keeps up with them at all. I think Thompson has performed beyond her talent level. 
 

(I do agree professional mental health support is very helpful for almost anyone in high pressure situations.) 

True. But to make the analogy same. Say this batter is .297with runners in scoring position for innings 1-8.   But in the 9th he has a 10 at bat strike out streak with runners on.  And he’s not been on base with no runners on.    That’s what golf is doing to Lexi.  
 

and that’s also one of those stat groups that golf doesn’t have.  I mean I guess it could be compiled. But I’m not aware of a putt make percent or a 3 putt percent for putts attempted on the back 9 of the final round while in the lead or within 2 shots of it.    I’d bet anything it falls off dramatically.   That’s mentally giving up.  Otherwise called a choke.  

Edited July 4, 2022 by bladehunter

[OrangeGravy]

16 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

True. But to make the analogy same. Say this batter is 2.97 with runners in scoring position for innings 1-8.   But in the 9th he has a 10 at bat strike out streak with runners on.  And he’s not been on base with no runners on.    That’s what golf is doing to Lexi.  
 

and that’s also one of those stat groups that golf doesn’t have.  I mean I guess it could be compiled. But I’m not aware of a putt make percent or a 3 putt percent for putts attempted on the back 9 of the final round while in the lead or within 2 shots of it.    I’d bet anything it falls off dramatically.   That’s mentally giving up.  Otherwise called a choke.  

Not only that, but he's talking about 8ft putts. She's missing from 5ft in and missing badly. When the stroke completely changes, it's a choke. She doesn't make that yippy stroke 63 holes of a tournament,  putting or chipping/pitching 

[Shilgy]

43 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

True. But to make the analogy same. Say this batter is 2.97 with runners in scoring position for innings 1-8.   But in the 9th he has a 10 at bat strike out streak with runners on.  And he’s not been on base with no runners on.    That’s what golf is doing to Lexi.  
 

and that’s also one of those stat groups that golf doesn’t have.  I mean I guess it could be compiled. But I’m not aware of a putt make percent or a 3 putt percent for putts attempted on the back 9 of the final round while in the lead or within 2 shots of it.    I’d bet anything it falls off dramatically.   That’s mentally giving up.  Otherwise called a choke.  

I’d call it mentally trying too hard….not giving up.  Same ugly at the worst times results but opposite reasoning.