*Graphite Design Lovers Anonymous* Tour AD UB vs IZ vs XC and NOW vs TP! ...and HD....and VR

[David Miller]

@third-times-a-charm @phizzy30

Here’s my problem… Was fit into the BB6x which is hard to find (at CC of course) At the end of the fitting he goes “it’s kind of similar but not super close to the XC so i’ll just out that on your fitting sheet” which was ridiculous considering the shaft on my fitting sheet was one I never swung. 

 

Regardless, the stats of the swings he kept (cuz they get rid of the bad ones) we’re great. But, I didn’t necessarily love the shaft in terms of feel. 

 

I hit the ventus black yesterday and it felt great (loved the feel). Stats were good did not blow me away, but still liked it a lot.

 

So now, trying to decide if the ventus blue would be a good middle, or, I should stick with the black which I liked. Or maybe just try to find the BB but again, performed well on my good hits but unsure on my kid hits. 

 

Anything would be appreciated, definetly in a confusing spot right now 

[ak90]

6 minutes ago, David Miller said:

@third-times-a-charm @phizzy30

Here’s my problem… Was fit into the BB6x which is hard to find (at CC of course) At the end of the fitting he goes “it’s kind of similar but not super close to the XC so i’ll just out that on your fitting sheet” which was ridiculous considering the shaft on my fitting sheet was one I never swung. 

 

Regardless, the stats of the swings he kept (cuz they get rid of the bad ones) we’re great. But, I didn’t necessarily love the shaft in terms of feel. 

 

I hit the ventus black yesterday and it felt great (loved the feel). Stats were good did not blow me away, but still liked it a lot.

 

So now, trying to decide if the ventus blue would be a good middle, or, I should stick with the black which I liked. Or maybe just try to find the BB but again, performed well on my good hits but unsure on my kid hits. 

 

Anything would be appreciated, definetly in a confusing spot right now 

I feel for your predicament… just pointing out the obvious here…

 

if it’s ridiculous for you to buy a shaft you’ve never hit that your fitter recommended it’s one step more ridiculous to buy a shaft some guy on the internet recommended that you’ve never hit.

 

if I were you I’d give the BB a run for the rest of the year… I suspect if the performance is good you’ll come to like the “feel”

[third-times-a-charm]

1 hour ago, David Miller said:

@third-times-a-charm @phizzy30

Here’s my problem… Was fit into the BB6x which is hard to find (at CC of course) At the end of the fitting he goes “it’s kind of similar but not super close to the XC so i’ll just out that on your fitting sheet” which was ridiculous considering the shaft on my fitting sheet was one I never swung. 

 

Regardless, the stats of the swings he kept (cuz they get rid of the bad ones) we’re great. But, I didn’t necessarily love the shaft in terms of feel. 

 

I hit the ventus black yesterday and it felt great (loved the feel). Stats were good did not blow me away, but still liked it a lot.

 

So now, trying to decide if the ventus blue would be a good middle, or, I should stick with the black which I liked. Or maybe just try to find the BB but again, performed well on my good hits but unsure on my kid hits. 

 

Anything would be appreciated, definetly in a confusing spot right now 

 

GD themselves say the XC is an update to the BB. All GD profiles are simialr; and the XC is infact extremely similar to the BB so I dont know what the fitter is talking about. There are a few BB users I've read on here who hit the XC and didnt like it but I dont know why or what the circumstances are/were in that.

 

The Ventus Red/Black IMO are nothing like any of the GD offerings. The blue is similar to the newer 'middle of the chart' offerings like the HD and TP.

 

Tbh you can find an ADBB 6x on ebay for pretty damn cheap ($120 or so) compared to the Ventus line - so go buy one and start with that and if you really dont like it buy something else.

[David Miller]

4 hours ago, ak90 said:

I feel for your predicament… just pointing out the obvious here…

 

if it’s ridiculous for you to buy a shaft you’ve never hit that your fitter recommended it’s one step more ridiculous to buy a shaft some guy on the internet recommended that you’ve never hit.

 

if I were you I’d give the BB a run for the rest of the year… I suspect if the performance is good you’ll come to like the “feel”

Yes, you are totally right. I got excited about the black and the numbers from the BB and thought that maybe the Blue would be a great in between which is a far concept to come to. Thanks for bringing me back to reality.

 

Like the plan. Will keep you updated 

[David Miller]

3 hours ago, third-times-a-charm said:

 

GD themselves say the XC is an update to the BB. All GD profiles are simialr; and the XC is infact extremely similar to the BB so I dont know what the fitter is talking about. There are a few BB users I've read on here who hit the XC and didnt like it but I dont know why or what the circumstances are/were in that.

 

The Ventus Red/Black IMO are nothing like any of the GD offerings. The blue is similar to the newer 'middle of the chart' offerings like the HD and TP.

 

Tbh you can find an ADBB 6x on ebay for pretty damn cheap ($120 or so) compared to the Ventus line - so go buy one and start with that and if you really dont like it buy something else.

I was looking on ebay and the cheapest and only one up there right now is about $250 which seems a little steep. If I can find one for $150 or less I’ll pick it up for sure.

Maybe in the meantime I’ll try to grab a ventus black as I know that performs well (unsure about my misses in terms of grouping as they were taken out of the fitting) 

[Qegurezi]

18 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

See, the XC is soft in the handle and the Ventus Blue and Black are super stiff in that area.  Feel wise, the XC will feel like neither IMO.  Feel is subjective though.  However, since you're asking, I would say that the Ventus Black is the most similar in terms of launch and spin. 

 

Isn't it the Red and Black that are super stiff in the handle? The Blue is a softer handle than those two i thought. 

 

Loving the Blue 7 in driver.   

Edited July 11, 2022 by Qegurezi
Spelling

[dmeeksDC]

3 hours ago, Qegurezi said:

 

Isn't it thew Red and Black that are super stiff in the handle? The Blue is a softer handle than those two i thought. 

 

Loving the Blue 7 in driver.   

You are correct. Also, the GD AD shafts are at the core a blueboard profile so even if it says softer handle, it is a softer handle within that profile compared to the other GD AD shafts. 
 

I would think Ventus Blue or Diamana TB would be more like them than Ventus Red or Black, which is not to say those shafts would not work and work well. Ventus Red is my favorite Ventus. 

[phizzy30]

8 hours ago, Qegurezi said:

 

Isn't it the Red and Black that are super stiff in the handle? The Blue is a softer handle than those two i thought. 

 

Loving the Blue 7 in driver.   

First question, yes.  Second question, yes, but the handle still feels pretty stiff compared to the likes of a true white board profile IMO.   

[third-times-a-charm]

Well, I am a clown so I have an AD TP 6 coming to test against the reigning champion AD XC 6. I just dont know if I want to tip the TP.

Edited July 11, 2022 by third-times-a-charm

[OspreyCI]

6 hours ago, third-times-a-charm said:

Well, I am a clown so I have an AD TP 6 coming to test against the reigning champion AD XC 6. I just dont know if I want to tip the TP.

We are all here supporting you!!! Love it man!! Can’t wait to hear more about your comparisons! 

[third-times-a-charm]

Took the TP and XC out yesterday to the range for a short while before a storm rolled in. Both tipped .25" but the TP is playing at 45.25" and the XC at 45" (end of buttcap measurements).

 

I will swinging like crap and was feeling off, not a good day so not a good test. Been staying up late watching ST S4, and did a lot of cardio this week; and this morning woke up sick. So - makes sense 🤣

 

TP - One the good strikes I could see the TP definitely had a nice high peak height. Feel was great with a nice load and good ball compression at impact.

 

XC - About the same as my other comments above.

 

One thing of note is my SS was about 1MPH higher on average with the TP than the XC. I doubt that from the extra .25" of length - maybe better timing?

 

Need to go test more next week.

[OspreyCI]

10 hours ago, third-times-a-charm said:

Took the TP and XC out yesterday to the range for a short while before a storm rolled in. Both tipped .25" but the TP is playing at 45.25" and the XC at 45" (end of buttcap measurements).

 

I will swinging like crap and was feeling off, not a good day so not a good test. Been staying up late watching ST S4, and did a lot of cardio this week; and this morning woke up sick. So - makes sense 🤣

 

TP - One the good strikes I could see the TP definitely had a nice high peak height. Feel was great with a nice load and good ball compression at impact.

 

XC - About the same as my other comments above.

 

One thing of note is my SS was about 1MPH higher on average with the TP than the XC. I doubt that from the extra .25" of length - maybe better timing?

 

Need to go test more next week.

Looking forward to hearing more about the TP with some healthy strikes on it😉

[third-times-a-charm]

On 7/16/2022 at 7:15 AM, OspreyCI said:

Looking forward to hearing more about the TP with some healthy strikes on it😉

I never thought I would put the same shaft in play in all 3 woods but here I am. Tbh i really only see this with GD shafts - in pro bags. Seen plenty of guys with AD DI throughout, but never with other companies really?

 

Range session went great this morning with the TP's in the bag. I left the XC at home this time just to focus on the feel of what I had installed.

 

I actually also put the AD TP 8 back in the 7 wood after not liking it and I was hitting it pretty well today, too.

 

I need to get these out on the course and see where the balls end up vs my past rounds with the other shafts but so far so good.

[OspreyCI]

32 minutes ago, third-times-a-charm said:

I never thought I would put the same shaft in play in all 3 woods but here I am. Tbh i really only see this with GD shafts - in pro bags. Seen plenty of guys with AD DI throughout, but never with other companies really?

 

Range session went great this morning with the TP's in the bag. I left the XC at home this time just to focus on the feel of what I had installed.

 

I actually also put the AD TP 8 back in the 7 wood after not liking it and I was hitting it pretty well today, too.

 

I need to get these out on the course and see where the balls end up vs my past rounds with the other shafts but so far so good.

Great stuff a man. I have about 6 more rounds again with the TP in my driver. The thing just works for me. Does it have the greatest feel or anyting outstanding? No, it just works. I like to change shafts several times a year, but I just don’t see me going away from it anytime soon. 

[third-times-a-charm]

1 hour ago, OspreyCI said:

Great stuff a man. I have about 6 more rounds again with the TP in my driver. The thing just works for me. Does it have the greatest feel or anyting outstanding? No, it just works. I like to change shafts several times a year, but I just don’t see me going away from it anytime soon. 

I dont know if it's the FTT in the shaft I'm responding to, but with my 'new swing' which is basically me really trying to have a more gradual transition instead of aggressive I can feel the shaft being more forgiving than others at impact. When I strike the ball poorly with driver for instance - on the toe which is my miss - and I get that sensation of the head twisting/feeling loose at impact, the end results is always much better with the TP than with the other shafts.

 

Edit: I just read about FTT and apparently thats what it's SUPPOSED to do 😂 https://proschoicegolfshafts.com/tech-fast-taper-technology/

[STalon89]

I was disappointed that they discontinued the BB, until I hit the XC.   Its just so smooth for a low spin low launch shaft

[hitnfades]

I have been keeping up with this journey and thread. I have now converted the top of my bag to all GD shafts. I am playing:

 

Driver - IZ 6x and 6s (winter)

Apex UW 17* - DI 7s (1st purchase)

Apex UW 21* - UB 7x

 

Last upgrade is currently being built this week and should have it early next week. I just dropped off my Epic Max 3W to be reshafted with the UB 7x to replace the original shaft. I was playing PX/Aldila driver and fairway shafts prior to this transition. These GD shafts have really stepped up my game. I could see me possibly replacing the DI with the UB in the 17*.  This club was preowned when I picked it up back in November so I did not have a shaft choice. The UB to me feels like a tighter DI. Also, this shaft gives me a bit of a draw and keeps the big miss to the right out of my game. Time will tell, but so far so good. It has been a positive change on the course as well noticeable by playing partners and myself. I have been very happy with all of these shafts and now understand the hype GD shafts receive. 

[third-times-a-charm]

Played 18 with the TP in driver today. No range time, just walked up to the first tee.

 

I was 7/13 on fairways when using driver on the tee and 11/13 if you count playable drives in bounds just in slight rough off the fairway.

 

I have to do some distance calcs but those stats are pretty damn good as is even if the TP is a little shorter than the XC.

[third-times-a-charm]

More rounds in the books with the TP in all woods. Theyre working so well I'm afraid to touch them, now. The shaft ho in my wants to keep trying more stuff but I dont want to make my TP's angry 🤣

 

Played 18 holes on Friday and went 13/14 on fairways with the driver. Played 9 on Saturday and was 4/5 - and just got home from 9 more holes today and was 5/6 with driver.

 

The new Diamana GT and a TPB 1K are coming out later this year so I'll prob test again then, but for now I've finally found at least something I can call a baseline that works really well and I've never really had that before.

[phizzy30]

47 minutes ago, third-times-a-charm said:

More rounds in the books with the TP in all woods. Theyre working so well I'm afraid to touch them, now. The shaft ho in my wants to keep trying more stuff but I dont want to make my TP's angry 🤣

 

Played 18 holes on Friday and went 13/14 on fairways with the driver. Played 9 on Saturday and was 4/5 - and just got home from 9 more holes today and was 5/6 with driver.

 

The new Diamana GT and a TPB 1K are coming out later this year so I'll prob test again then, but for now I've finally found at least something I can call a baseline that works really well and I've never really had that before.

So then that makes the two of us that will be testing the new blue board profiles later this year.  As I say this, I can see the wife out of the corner of my eye giving me the evil eye........😬

[third-times-a-charm]

7 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

So then that makes the two of us that will be testing the new blue board profiles later this year.  As I say this, I can see the wife out of the corner of my eye giving me the evil eye........😬

After all these GD shafts and etc I went through the last 60 days my wife definitely gave me the biz. But then I told her how many packages she had come in recently as well 🤣 Luckily they were pretty much all break-even after selling them back off on ebay.

 

 

Edited July 31, 2022 by third-times-a-charm

[phizzy30]

Just now, third-times-a-charm said:

After all these GD shafts and etc I went through the last 60 days my wife definitely gave me the biz. Luckily they were pretty much all break-even after selling them back off on ebay.

 

 

It's not so much the money but rather my impulsivity that's troubling to her.  🤣

[third-times-a-charm]

2 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

It's not so much the money but rather my impulsivity that's troubling to her.  🤣

Ironically enough my wife plays an AD GP so I just said "Babe, I wanna be just like you and hit bombs!" so she rolled her eyes.

[third-times-a-charm]

Well here I am again.

 

 

I am a clown and I am again testing out more Tour AD shafts. In a couple of other threads I mentioned I found an HD 6 finally for driver (which I may have mentioned here that I wanted to try one) and I put it up against my TP. I also picked up an AD VR 8 to put against the TP 8. Oh, and I also picked up an AD VR 7 for driver with was a big failure.

 

Prior to this I did, in fact, make my TP shafts angry (joke from a few posts above) with wandering thoughts. So while on a bad ball striking streak I decided to test some new shafts out.

 

Story time. I think this is like 50 Shades for people who like shafts?

 

AD HD 6

I love(d) my AD TP but I used it when testing some Epic Speed TD heads (standard and DS) with known lofts (10* and 10.5*) and I was enjoying a D4-5 SW for a while so I tipped the TP 1/4". While mostly inconsequential that helped with the higher W and the spin. I still stand by the fact that I love the TP and it's staying in my 3 wood - but the AD HD is basically a TP with a softer tip. Again, as mentioned in the other thread, if you need a little more launch and tip feel the HD is your answer over the TP (or the DI). My current driver is an Epic Speed TC 9* but I havent had it spec checked yet and I'm pretty sure its around 8.7-9.2* in loft and a little open and flat from retail. This paired with the AD HD in the D setting gave me a super nice ball flight today with plenty of carry and roll. So, out goes the TP and in goes the HD into the bag.

 

AD VR 7 in Driver

Failure. I do not like the softer overall feel in driver nor the 70g class weight. It was mostly an experiment for that weight as I'd never really demo or played a 70g class shaft in driver outdoors so this was short lived. YMMV but it wasnt for me. I also didnt like the VR 6 in driver from a test months ago. BUT...

 

AD VR 8 vs AD TP 8 

I go 6-7-8 weights in my 1/3/7 woods which based on whatever loft I'm actually playing is kinda of like a 1/4/6 wood but who's keeping track. After spec checking my Mavrik 20* "7 wood" TC serial head it turns out loft is actually in the low 19's*. So....6 wood? The AD TP 8 was and is a phenomenal shaft but what do we want out of this club? We want to hold greens from ~215+yds out. The AD TP gave a very nice flat fairway wood flight but but off the fairway it wasnt quite holding greens if I didnt get steep and getting steep brings in problems when trying to do it artificially. The switch to the AD VR provided more spin and a visually higher flight. I honestly am not 100% sold on it as I've had so many bad experiments with the AD VR but so far it passes the eye test and given its in a bonded-hosel club and I'm lazy, it's going to stay there for a little bit while I do some on-course testing.

 

I could have kept on with the AD TP in all woods tbh, but the beauty of the Tour AD line is you can kind of move around a bit into different models and achieve different results with a similar feel - for the most part. I thought I needed a little more launch and spin here and there and found shafts that did just that. I dont know if they'll stick but so far so good. But lets be honest as soon as I change clubheads in these spots like next week, I'll need to test every shaft all over again and since I sold them I have to buy them again. Jokes on me 😂

 

Edited October 22, 2022 by third-times-a-charm

[hagimihale]

On 7/10/2022 at 11:47 AM, third-times-a-charm said:

 

GD themselves say the XC is an update to the BB. All GD profiles are simialr; and the XC is infact extremely similar to the BB so I dont know what the fitter is talking about. There are a few BB users I've read on here who hit the XC and didnt like it but I dont know why or what the circumstances are/were in that.

 

I've hit many of the GD lineup.  XC, BB and MJ have been the best fit for my swing.  XC has a slightly stiffer mid and tip compared to BB.  Lower launch, a bit more stable and have to put more into it to get it to load correctly.  Not surprisingly, its also more anti-left.  XC-7X has been my gamer for a while, but I'm starting to experiment with a BB-7S

 

@third-times-a-charm, I'm jealous that TP works for you.  I was very excited to hit it, but less so after I saw the low/left pattern that resulted...

[Valtiel]

On 7/10/2022 at 8:47 AM, third-times-a-charm said:

The Ventus Red/Black IMO are nothing like any of the GD offerings. T

I'd argue that the MJ is actually quite close to the Ventus Red profile wise, just maybe half a flex softer or so from a CPM standpoint. 

I just picked up an AD-TP 8x from a forum member to test in my 3w, on paper it should be in a similar family to the Blue TR in the driver. 👍

[drscott266]

I recently did a Titleist fitting at my club, since I play GD already we focused on that for the first options. Got fit for a driver in the UB and fairway I switched from a Ventus red to a DI in the fairway. UB ended up in reality being terrible for me, but it may have been the loft of the head.  I immediately switched back to my old setup which is an XC, the kick matches that of the DI way closer, the IB felt super stiff and I had no feel. Reminded me most of Ventus Black but higher flight. Does not work for my swing. 
 

for reference I had good results with Ventus Blue TR and AD XC. I liked Ventus red in fairway but DI gave me more spin so I could hit off deck. I think that also helped me gain carry off tee, so net net it was a gain from the Ventus red, and I swing it easier due to the softer handle. I think stiff handles don’t match my tempo. 

Edited October 22, 2022 by drscott266

[third-times-a-charm]

2 hours ago, Valtiel said:

I'd argue that the MJ is actually quite close to the Ventus Red profile wise, just maybe half a flex softer or so from a CPM standpoint. 

I just picked up an AD-TP 8x from a forum member to test in my 3w, on paper it should be in a similar family to the Blue TR in the driver. 👍

By all accounts I do love the TP, still. I agree it’s very much like the VB TR. I’m holding onto the TP 8 for my 7 wood just in case the next feee rounds with the AD VR don’t go as planned on the course.

 

Funny you mention the MJ and the V Red. I had an MJ but even if on paper they seem similar it feels much softer especially down near the tip and mid-tip area than the ventus does. The new AD CQ might actually be a ventus red killer for those who like GD profiles.

Edited October 22, 2022 by third-times-a-charm

[hagimihale]

@drscott266, I had the same experience with the UB - it just seemed meh.   Both the XC and BB load better for me than the UB.  

[GoTime]

Hit the TSR2 15* today with UB 8X. It absolutely plays at least a half flex soft (from other OEMs i have played, not necessarily within the GD lineup), to me it felt like I was swing a softish Stiff model. Prob would have opted for the TX if they made one. Dont think I would want to tip it to mess with launch conditions though. Still feels great and dont think it'll hurt me once I figure out the timing of it given the softness.

 

How is the feel, profile, performance of the AD DI vs the UB? Seems like the ADDI 80TX would be my next best option if I did want to try TX.

 

For reference I swing driver around 112-115

Edited October 22, 2022 by GoTime