Help my pops with some shaft recommendations

[Douglsss]

INB4 just get a fitting

 

Convinced my pops to play a round with my this past weekend. He hasn't touched a club in about 8 years and I had an extra set he could use, so he decided to play. We never played when we were younger as other sports and activities took priority for us. That being said, he grew up playing a lot and as a teenager caddied in the Buick Open. I don't have a memory of playing a round with him even as a really young kid so I had no clue how this was going to work out.

 

Flash forward to the range before we play - after about 5 mins of warming up and getting a swing together, pops is flushing it. All the way through the bag. It was pretty impressive and his swing was nice and compact. My parents are the crazies who close to 60 years old workout everyday and do crossfit so I didnt expect the clubs to be too much of an issue. We play 18 holes from white tees around 5400 yards and he breaks 90. Also only lost one ball! I bought him a box of titlist velocity and had a few dozen found balls which he didn't need.

 

Ok, on to the clubs:

Driver - Sim2 Max 10.5 - Tour AD IZ 6s playing 44.5

Irons - zx5 4-pw modus 105s cut 1/4 inch upright 2 degrees.

 

Eyeballing driver speed - 170 carry 200 total yards so probably in the 90mph range.

6 iron distance was around 150 carry/160 total or so. 

Ball flight was not very high - would classify it as a low trajectory.

 

Those clubs I have already sold like a true WRX member but I think my pops caught the bug and an xmas gift of clubs will be going his way. 

 

So given that strike seemed more than ok but speed wasn't there, I'm trying to guess around some options on flex for some gear. He did say a few times on some not great strikes the vibrations bothered him so definitely leaning towards graphite. 

 

My current idea:

a 10.5 driver with a 50ish gram regular shaft in a similar profile of tour az id ( high launch low spin ) or high launch/mid spin.

zx5 range irons 6-pw with 80ish gram regular shafts - high/mid profile

4/5 hybrid or SGI irons with 60-70 gram reg shafts high mid profile. Not sure about hybrids as he never hit one before trying mine the other day.

 

TL:DR

Pops is a flusher, hasn't played in almost a decade. Played with shafts too heavy and stiff but strike was good. Need some recommendations on shafts to get him some gently used clubs more his speed. Fitting would be best obviously, but currently he doesn't play enough to warrant that investment.

 

Cheers and thanks!

[Stuart_G]

 

 

 

26 minutes ago, Douglsss said:

He did say a few times on some not great strikes the vibrations bothered him so definitely leaning towards graphite. 

 

Probably a good idea.

 

26 minutes ago, Douglsss said:

My current idea:

a 10.5 driver with a 50ish gram regular shaft in a similar profile of tour az id ( high launch low spin ) or high launch/mid spin.

zx5 range irons 6-pw with 80ish gram regular shafts - high/mid profile

4/5 hybrid or SGI irons with 60-70 gram reg shafts high mid profile. Not sure about hybrids as he never hit one before trying mine the other day.

 

Choosing a good shaft weight or flex is NOT about swing speed.  A good fit for weight is all about how it effects the rhythm and tempo and timing of the player.     And don't assume lighter will always mean faster.  The best speed will come with the best rhythm and tempo and sequencing.

 

Shaft stiffness (when it is important - which is not the case with everyone) can also be largely about his personal preference for how much he wants or expects to feel the shaft load.

 

Sorry but there is just no good way to get any idea of what will work well for him or what wont until he actually starts swinging clubs with different shafts.   There just are no (good or reliable) rules that you can use to plug in swing speed and other swing factors and get out a good shaft recommendation.   The subjective influences usually outweigh the objective ones.

 

 

26 minutes ago, Douglsss said:

TL:DR

Pops is a flusher, hasn't played in almost a decade. Played with shafts too heavy and stiff but strike was good.

 

They very well might be - but it's not a good idea to assume anything was too stiff or too heavy.    e.g. those modus are really not all that heavy and pretty equivalent to most other OEM's reg flex shafts.   Especially if he was getting good contact though the whole round and works on his fitness as much as you say he does.    Now if the quality of the strike had been dropping toward the end of the round that might be an indicator of too heavy.   But that doesn't sound like it was the case.

 

26 minutes ago, Douglsss said:

Fitting would be best obviously, but currently he doesn't play enough to warrant that investment.

 

It's generally cheaper than ending up with clubs that are a poor fit and having to get a whole new set.

 

BUT - you don't need to do a full priced fitting, you only have to get out and find a place to demo different options.  Demo days are one option, also most retail outlets and even some pro shops have OEM fitting carts and don't charge you to test different shafts - just don't put a lot of faith in the quality of the people working there as fitters.  Just find what feels the best and work from there.   Focus more on dispersion than distance.   Just taking into consideration those two things should get you to a pretty good fit - although maybe not necessarily a perfect one.

 

 

 

Edited August 23, 2022 by Stuart_G

[darkhelmet]

If he can break 90 with too-stiff clubs after not playing for 8 years, a fitting would definitely be worth it.

 

You said that he was flushing it, yet the alternative that you're thinking about is vastly different from the setup he was playing with -- dropping 25g of weight, dropping a flex, and moving to graphite.

 

Because of the vibration issue and his age, graphite sounds like it's probably a move in the right direction.  And with the low ball flight, some version of a regular flex would probably be the answer.   But that's where the fitting comes in.  He's good enough to be telling the fitter what feels right and what doesn't, and then use that with the data from the launch monitor to pick a final setup.  He might do best with a heavier graphite regular flex, or he might fit into a lighter stiff flex.

 

If you're going to spend the money on the clubs anyway, might as well do it right the first time instead of guessing and being upset 3 months later when you find out that he traded his clubs with his buddy because he hit those other ones so much better.

[Stuart_G]

22 minutes ago, darkhelmet said:

He might do best with a heavier graphite regular flex, or he might fit into a lighter stiff flex.

 

With graphite - there is no kind of automatic correlation between weight and stiffness - so don't assume that type of trade-off.   Each model has to be judged independently to find the best flex.

[darkhelmet]

5 minutes ago, Stuart_G said:

 

With graphite - there is no kind of automatic correlation between weight and stiffness - so don't assume that type of trade-off.   Each model has to be judged independently to find the best flex.

 

Wasn't implying there's a correlation there, just pointing out that there's no way to know what combination is going to work until you try different options.

[Douglsss]

Thanks for the replies and I totally agree that really fitting is the best. I don't have a club that wasn't part of a fitting process and am a big fan of the benefits. I play graphite shafts now, just heavier and stiffer than what he would want. I guess I was hoping for a "these are like modus but easier on the bones" suggestion.

 

The weight and flex was just my experience seeing him not really load the shaft but catch the center of the clubface. I suppose if this is his forever old man set of clubs a fitting would probably be worth it - thinking of it that way now. If he uses them a lot or not doesn't really matter if he knows whenever he plays those are fit for him.

 

Again, thanks for the dialogue!

[Stuart_G]

16 hours ago, Douglsss said:

Thanks for the replies and I totally agree that really fitting is the best. I don't have a club that wasn't part of a fitting process and am a big fan of the benefits. I play graphite shafts now, just heavier and stiffer than what he would want. I guess I was hoping for a "these are like modus but easier on the bones" suggestion.

 

Not any close matches - but I might look at the UST Recoil 95's in F3 (reg flex).   But that's a very subjective suggestion - as are ones you might get from others to the same question.

 

 

16 hours ago, Douglsss said:

The weight and flex was just my experience seeing him not really load the shaft but catch the center of the clubface.

 

First of all, you're not going to see any load.  Second how much load there might be (or lack thereof) doesn't  have any direct effect on the results.   So there is nothing lost if there is no loading and nothing gained by adding loading.    It's a very common misconception that there is some ideal or optimal amount of loading - but it's been debunked it's just not true.  

 

So the only thing that's important about the amount of loading is how different loading feels effect the swing.   And for that we have to go back to testing.

 

16 hours ago, Douglsss said:

Again, thanks for the dialogue!

 

No problem

Edited August 24, 2022 by Stuart_G

[jarediogolf]

Sounds like you had a good time playing with clubs that might not have been a great fit. 

 

I think your plan sounds solid! 
Get him some Srixons with graphite shaft to help with vibrations and a halfway decent driver and go have fun. 
 

Then you can build the top and bottom of the bag together. Just go have fun! And don’t wait for Christmas to have fun. Do it now!