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Titleist TSR vs Ping G430


GolfisLife1
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I know the Ping isn’t out yet. But just looking for your best assumptions here.  
 

I’ve been playing a Ping G410 LST for years now and have loved it.  Went in for a driver fitting last week for first time ever. Found my perfect shaft. But was also fitted for the TSR2.   I was bombing it by the end of the fitting. 9 yards longer carry than my G410. 
 

however. I wasn’t able to hit my G410 with the new shaft I was fitted for. So had my driver head had the same shaft as the TSR I wonder if it would have been a closer comparison?  Also I hit my driver at the beginning of the fitting before I was truly warmed up and bombing it.  By the end of the fitting I had my groove going. 
 

so by the time I pay for TSR2 head. The shaft. Grip taxes etc it’s $900 

 

im not exactly excited to throw down $900 on a single club when I still have questions on the outcome.  Curious what you guys think.  Go ahead and get it or wait a couple months for the new Ping and do it again comparing those?   I’ve always been a Ping driver fan in general.  But these new TSR are Awesome no doubt.  Just hate to drop a grand on a club when others are coming out very shortly after. 

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Also my 2 longest drives of the fitting were both with the TSR2 and riptide lx shaft. 266 and 267 carry.  
 

but I never went back to my driver. Which in hindsight I wish I did after I was truly warmed up.  And I also wish I would have hit the TSR in a Velocore black shaft as well to compare. 
 

i think the average numbers on my Ping are slightly skewed because it was the first club I hit and had a couple not so great ones in there. And the TSR was a beast no doubt. But also had 2 of my longest drives of the day in there. 

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On paper, at your speed, the ventus black doesn’t seem like it would be a good fit for you.  If you want a new driver then just decide if $600 is worth it for 9 more carry yards. $300 for a riptide shaft isn’t worth it in my opinion. You can find the same performance in one of the stock offering if you match up weight and profile.  You could save money and just sell the ventus black and find something with the same weight and profile as the rip tide and keep it in your g410. Ball speed is the same. 

Edited by Rosco1216

G425 Max 8* - Accra TZ RPG 472 M5+
Cobra King Tec 2h 15.5* - Hzrdus Black 85tx
Bridgestone J40DPC 3-P - X7

Mizuno t7 52* - x100
Edel SMS 56* & 60* - KBS black 130x



 

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1 hour ago, dalillama47 said:

Ball speed with your Ping and the TSR is a wash.  If you can get your spin down a couple hundred rpm's with the Ping, You"d be wasting money buying new.  I also don't give a damn, but the Ping is going to be more forgiving as well.

To add to this, it would make sense to do multiple tests (edit) and compare the overall averages. I doubt you will see  a significant difference. 

Edited by nvr3putt
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you said it, should have went back to your driver at the end. always improves over first set and how the big golf fitters upsell like crazy. 

 

As far as the shaft in the G410, most of the Ping heads are heavier than the other brands, so the shaft not working makes sense. If you're going with the TSR your old shaft most likely will play a little different in it. If it were me, I'd do the whole test again at least once before dropping $900, maybe hit the TSR first next time. Lower the loft in the Ping like others said to get spin down a bunch, and try and see where contact is on both drivers. Higher on one than the other always produce less spin 

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5 hours ago, GolfisLife1 said:

Also my 2 longest drives of the fitting were both with the TSR2 and riptide lx shaft. 266 and 267 carry.  
 

but I never went back to my driver. Which in hindsight I wish I did after I was truly warmed up.  And I also wish I would have hit the TSR in a Velocore black shaft as well to compare
 

i think the average numbers on my Ping are slightly skewed because it was the first club I hit and had a couple not so great ones in there. And the TSR was a beast no doubt. But also had 2 of my longest drives of the day in there. 

 

Couple of things.

 

Firstly, you already realize that your Ping, going first and not repeating later, was a mistake. For me personally, even if I stretch out and take a half dozen swings w/o hitting a ball, it takes me at least another half dozen whacks with the ball before getting near optimum speed. That said, I ain't no youngster. :classic_sad:

 

You bring up a point that many(?) seem to ignore. Bad strikes. A poor strike skews the average lower.

 

Personally, I would delete the bad strikes, while keeping track of how many there were, and then take the average SS, launch, and spin rate. That gives you a good picture of how the club performs,,,,,,,, on GOOD strikes.

 

However, you then have to account for how often you make a good strike. "Finding" the SS is important (Duh !)

 

So often I see someone try out drivers in the store. They'll hit 6 different drivers and so often buy the one they had their single best strike with. i.e. "fool's gold". They think they will "learn" how to control it and find the ss more often. Sheesh.

 

Further, you need to analyze the results closer. Especially flight and dispersion.

 

The LM gives you averages. 2 shots down the middle averages 0 dispersion (from center). 1 30 yards left and 1 30 yards right also averages 0 dispersion. Same thing goes for carry, but that is more likely to be very close. Now the LM gives you "Std deviation" so that helps for sure, but,,,,,,,,

 

Also, as you likely know, the same shaft isn't always the right one on a different head, so there's that too.

 

And finally (you're welcome), if it isn't already hard enough, you also have to try to take into account that you're getting into a groove that you can seldom replicate on the course - so that you need to try to quantify as well.

 

I have access to a LM regularly, so I always do multiple sessions, at least 3 or 4, with the same heads and shafts, to make sure the results are what I'm looking for. Even a bad fit I can occasionally hit pretty well,,,,,,, for ONE session,,,,,,, 🤦‍♀️

 

Net-net, personally, if I was back up north where there's only a 5-7 month season, I'd wait for early next year. Where I am (SoFla) it's a 12 month season so I'd likely be more impatient. :classic_laugh:

 

Good luck. 👍

 

 

Edited by nsxguy

Callaway Epic Flash SZ Tour AD TP

Ping G425 14.5 Fairway Tour AD TP

Adams Idea Pro 20* Aldila Stiff

Ping G20, 5-PW, DGS300 Yellow Dot

Ping Glide Forged, 48, 52, 56, 60, DGS300

Odyssey 5K Triple Wide 34" (Today)

Titleist ProV1x

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So this is what I see here.

 

Ping has more ball speed with more loft. If you are on big +, your ping is at 10.5°. Lowering loft to small + (10°), should raise ball speed, lower spin, and lower launch all a touch so match the tsr2. With the slightly high ball speed, the ping seems to have more potential in it, especially after the hosel tweak. 

 

With all that being said, I think tsr2 is hotter across the face. So basically, it's a wash. If there is no other reason (looks, sound, whatever) to upgrade, I don't see a reason. At least imo from the info given here.

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Hold the money, play & enjoy  with your fitted Ventus Black until the G430 comes out and then go try again with the driver shootout.

 

Unless $900 is pocket change in your pants 😉

 

Also, see if you can get actual GPS driver distances from your rounds. That's great stat to have and may open your eyes as it did mine as to whats perception & reality. Plus, it gives you great comparison data next time you are on a LM at some store. If the LM says you carry it 290+, you'll know it's juiced & BS.

 

Last tip, think about a Universal adapter for your shafts, like All-Fit. I got them in mine and I can use my Graphite Design/Ventus shafts in my TM, Callaway or Cobra driver head on a whim. Look up the All-Fit thread in the WRX section for pros & cons

 

 

 

Edited by SwingBlues

Driver: Callaway Rogue ST Max 9* Ventus Black 6S / Graphite Design HD-6X , Top Golf All-Fit Universal adapter

Fairways: Honma 737 13* 3+ wood, Vizard A 50S shaft, Callaway DET 15* Miyazaki C Kua 43S 3 wood
Hybrid:   Cobra Speedzone 3 hybrid 19*

Irons:       Cobra Forged Tec X 5 - PW, TGI 85 stiff shafts
Wedges: Cleveland CBX2 48* KBS TGI 100 shaft. Cleveland Full Face 56* with Catalyst 100 shaft.
Putter:     LAB Golf Mezz.1 ACCRA shaft / Directed Force Reno "2.05 Presse IV tweaked" Putter with BGT Stability shaft
#1 Callaway Chromesoft X LS, #2 Srixon XV 5/6

Moe Norman/Graves Single Plane swing

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Ping is good at what they do best: making drivers that go straight, but not quite as far. 

 

TM/Callaway/Cobra: make drivers that go further, but might be a little more squirrely. 

 

Could be me, but I've never found a Ping head/shaft combo I liked to give me the best of both worlds, but it is what it is. 

 

Now, if you spend $900 on that combo, you're crazy! Check your PM. 

TSR2 8* w/ Ventus Black 6x

TSR2+ 13* w/ Ventus Black TR 7x

Apex UW 19* w/ Ventus Blue 9x or TSR2 21* w/ UB 8s

Apex '21 4-A w/ MMT 105tx
Jaws Raw 54/58 w/ MMT 105s
Betti HexProto 7.0

WITB

 

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Have a club maker extend shaft 3/4” to match length of Titleist.   $25

Spend $875 on significant other. 
 

$900 for 9 yards?  No thanks 

and that was on a simulator and you hit your Ping first. 
 

 

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Ping G425 MAX 9* LAGP Trono 65 X
Ping G425 MAX 17.5 5 Wood
Ping G410 20.5 7 Wood Tour 75 Stiff

Ping G425 4,5&6 Hybrid Tensei Blue TX
Ping i525 7-PW Project X 6.0 IO
Ping Glide 3.0  50 56 60 ZZ115

Ping Anser

 

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You had more ball speed with your Ping driver. If the shaft you tried in the TSR helps you get a touch more launch and a touch less speed you should hit your Ping driver further…. 

Edited by hammergolf

TaylorMade Sim Max 9* @ 7* Aldila Quaranta Reg
Ping G425 3wd @ +1 Flat setting Grafalloy Pro Lite HL Reg 
Ping G425 7wd @ -1 Flat setting Ping Alta CB Reg
Ping G425 22 hybrid @ Flat setting Mitsubishi Tensei Orange Raw reg
PXG Gen 3 0311XP 5-PW Mitsubishi MMT 80 Reg

Cleveland CBX Zipcore 50*, 56*, 60* DG Spinner Stiff stepped soft
Evnroll ER7  33” Rosemark grip

 

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On 9/22/2022 at 9:10 PM, mosesgolf said:

Have a club maker extend shaft 3/4” to match length of Titleist.   $25

Spend $875 on significant other. 
 

$900 for 9 yards?  No thanks 

and that was on a simulator and you hit your Ping first. 
 

 

This! I mean if you had an extra 3/4 inch on your ping and hit it second it may well have gone further than the tsr. 

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Just curious here.

How do you get 9 more yards with 150rpm less spin, and 0.3° more launch angle, with lower ball speed? These are almost identical shots????

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On 9/25/2022 at 9:05 AM, Ger21 said:

Just curious here.

How do you get 9 more yards with 150rpm less spin, and 0.3° more launch angle, with lower ball speed? These are almost identical shots????

I was scratching my head trying to figure this out as well. Something is not adding up almost like the machine was making a calculation on a pre determined smash factor. 

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Big Brain Meme GIF by Bayer 04 Leverkusen

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Titleist TSR2 9* with HRZD 5.5 RED CB 50

Titleist TSR2+ 13* with HRZD 5.0 RED CB 60
PXG 0311 Gen 5 XF 19* 3 Hybrid w/ Project X Evenflow Riptide 80

PXG 0311 Gen 5 XF 22* 4 Hybrid w/ Project X Evenflow Riptide 80

PING i525 6-PW w/ UST Recoil Smacwrap 780 F3  

Vokey SM9 50*/56* 

Bettinardi Inovai 6.0 Putter w/BGT Stability Tour Polar shaft 32" Superstroke grip

Lajosi LP-421 35" with Black shaft and Winn grip (back up)

 

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Things I would've said if in that fitting after seeing the numbers:

 

"Too bad the TSR2 doesn't beat my gamer, I really like the look and feel. That Stealth on the other hand looks promising, very straight and the best dispersion. It just launches and spins a tad on the high side. Can you give a lower lofted one to try?"

 

Things I would NOT have said (or thought): "After warming up the TSR2 beats my gamer by a few yards, even though ballspeed is lower despite the lower loft. Maybe I should drop a grand on this."

Callaway Rogue ST Max  10.5°

TaylorMade Stealth 3HL

Cobra LTDx 7W

Callaway Rogue 4H & 5H

Callaway Rogue 6i-PW

Cleveland CBX2 49°

Cleveland RTX Zipcore 55° Mid, 60° Low

TaylorMade Spider Tour Black Small Slant

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This probably doesn’t help anyone… after hitting all three TSR drivers a lot, the R2 reminds me of a slightly more forgiving, better feeling and better sounding G400 LST. I loved my G400 LST. It wasn’t super low spinning but it was the first head with decent forgiveness and relatively low spin that I had ever played. I would say that the ball speed retention is better with the R2 on off center hits.

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Ping had the 400 which was brown, 410 which was red, and 425 which was black, now it’s back to 0s with 430

 

In my opinion they really dropped the ball by not going through the progression and just calling it the 420 and adding green. Smoke drives with the 420. The ads would have written themselves

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All 3 drivers are a wash. I wouldn’t change for $400, let alone $900.

 

1. Ball speed doesn’t mean anything without seeing club head speed and smash factor.

 

2. Theoretical 9 yard difference with the driver means very little out on the course, as courses are rarely perfectly flat. 

 

3. I’m gonna assume you swing at 97-100mph. At that speed, spin is your friend. At 145 ball speed, mid launch and MID SPIN keeps the ball in the air and stabilizes the flight. 15/2500 would be the ideal launch/spin window at those speeds, assuming you hit up on the ball (+2 angle of attack). That’s likely the reason why the Stealth’s dispersion circle was half the size of the others. Yes, the TSR went the farthest, and while you may have hit your longest drives with it, but at 2200 +/- 370, I would be very scared of the random 1800 spin shot, as that would get very knuckle-y and drop out of the sky at the slightest hint of wind.

 

4. Riptides aren’t exactly expensive on the secondhand market last I checked.

 

 

 

If I was your fitter, I’d have had you start your driver, saw those numbers, and then try putting a Ping G425 Max or SFT 10.5° head on your current shaft. Then would have tried a mid/mid shaft as the Ventus Black (very low launch, very low spin) shaft is not doing you any favors. If you were dead set on a Ventus, I would be at the other end of the spectrum: Red, Red TR, Blue.

 

My recommendation would be to hold on to your money, find and test a G425 Max 10.5° head (they’re on sale now!) and eventually the G430 generation heads (since you can just swap your shaft into it). And get a new fitter.

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I take that back. My recommendation is to get a speed training stick and use that for the off-season with proper power generation technique. Assuming you don’t have a physical limitation preventing speed training (back problems, hip problems, etc). At 95-100mph, you have a TON to gain from speed training and you’ll spend less and gain more distance than you ever would from a new driver.

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