2 iron shaft in 3 iron head?

[DewSweepingMoose]

Kinda weird question but here we go....I had bought (what I thought) was a 3 and 4 iron shaft (KBS $ taper S+) to complete a set of 5-PW pulls I bought on ebay. These are all going in some refinished MP-14s.

Now I've been getting them all prepped to stick together, the 5-PW are going to fit perfect. But noticed that the 3 iron is really struggling to get on the 3 iron shaft, even after a lot of tip prepping. I then noticed in super faint etching on the butt, looks like the clowns (feel ok calling them clowns now after multiple screw ups on their part) have actually sent me a 2 & 3 iron shaft. 

Would there be any reason for the 2 iron shaft being diff tip diameter?
Will I have a noticeable playability diff having a 2iron shaft in the 3 iron head (and 3 shaft in the 4 head)?

Many thanks for any guidance 🙂

[ScottyGolf]

what is the code on the iron?  That should indicate if it is Parallel or tapered.

[DewSweepingMoose]

4 minutes ago, ScottyGolf said:

what is the code on the iron?  That should indicate if it is Parallel or tapered.

 

Sorry for the crappy pic, tough to not get a glare!

[ScottyGolf]

well, I thought it would have had a TT or P, 370 or 355 somewhere on it.  Wonder if Stuart will chime in as he seems to be the guru on these things.

[Stuart_G]

1 hour ago, ScottyGolf said:

well, I thought it would have had a TT or P, 370 or 355 somewhere on it.  Wonder if Stuart will chime in as he seems to be the guru on these things.

 

@Howard_Jones is more familiar with the codes than I am - I don't work much with steel shafts but...

 

 

2 hours ago, DewSweepingMoose said:

Would there be any reason for the 2 iron shaft being diff tip diameter?

 

I assume the hosel was thoroughly cleaned with no remaining epoxy residue from any previous use?

 

One reason I can think of that the tip would not fit is that you you got a parallel tip version of the shaft instead of a taper tip shaft.   You should use calipers to measure and verify the actual tip diameter.   

 

However - I could be wrong but I didn't think KBS made a parallel version of the $-taper.   (you can't seem to buy them direct from KBS or golfworks).  However they do make a parallel version of the $-taper lite.   So maybe you got a parallel version of the $-taper lite instead of the heavier $-taper.

 

Which also means another possibility is that that if it really is an $-taper and originally was a taper tip - it might have been tip trimmed and the taper removed.

 

Was the shaft new/uncut when bought?   or a pull?

What was the length of the shaft before you made any cuts?

What is the raw shaft weight?  and what is the current length if you did any cutting?

 

 

Edited November 30, 2022 by Stuart_G

[RBARG]

Just butt trim to length and tip prep those bad boys and stick them in the head.

 

Get a set of calipers to really find out if they are tapered or not.  Fitment in the hosel in and of itself won’t be an indicator.  Some fit much tighter than others and require grinding to fit.

[Howard_Jones]

2 hours ago, ScottyGolf said:

well, I thought it would have had a TT or P, 370 or 355 somewhere on it.  Wonder if Stuart will chime in as he seems to be the guru on these things.

im not able to see the model code at all on my screen, but if its a TRUE TEMPER shaft, and 0.370, the model code starts with the letter U, while tapers has the same model code without that U

Example
UDGXLI 100 = 0.370, Dynamic, Gold wgt sorting, X flex, Long version. Irons, X100 sub flex
DGXLI 100 = 0.355, Dynamic, Gold wgt sorting, X flex, Long version. Irons, X100 sub flex

Parallels is most often 41 uncut, so we expect to see the 41.00 on top of the U letter on parallels, while Tapers comes in discrete length, (some models of .370 does too), so look for the U letter or lack of it.

Project X uses TT in the model code for Taper Tip, and "no TT" on 0.370 models 

[D0ch0l1d4y]

I find that with hard to read things on the internet, they become easier if colors are inverted:

 

Code is: S+ 21 156230'  17. 4. 17. AK

 

Seems more like a serial number than a shaft code.

[Stuart_G]

44 minutes ago, D0ch0l1d4y said:

I find that with hard to read things on the internet, they become easier if colors are inverted:

 

Great Idea!

 

44 minutes ago, D0ch0l1d4y said:

 

Code is: S+ 21 156230'  17. 4. 17. AK

 

Seems more like a serial number than a shaft code.

 

I think that might be "2I" instead of "21" after the "S+".  Notice the lack of a hook at the top - it's different than the other digits that are clearly "1".

 

Don't know for sure but it might mean it's a 2i shaft.

 

Edited November 30, 2022 by Stuart_G

[DewSweepingMoose]

8 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

Was the shaft new/uncut when bought?   or a pull?

What was the length of the shaft before you made any cuts?

Yep brand new. Haven't cut them at all yet so was planning to cut them to the right length after I got the heads stuck on.

 

 

7 hours ago, RBARG said:

Just butt trim to length and tip prep those bad boys and stick them in the head.

 

Get a set of calipers to really find out if they are tapered or not.  Fitment in the hosel in and of itself won’t be an indicator.  Some fit much tighter than others and require grinding to fit.

 

After checking some of the other heads in the 2 iron shaft, it seems like it might be a bit of the tip needing to be ground down a bit and the hosel having build up inside or something. The shaft seems to sit better in some of the other heads. So this kinda leaves me with 2 questions...

 

1) will it be ok to put the 2 iron shaft in the 3 iron head without putting it out from the rest of the set in terms of stiffness/step pattern etc?

 

2) is there any issue with me just grinding down the tip until I get the proper fit?

 

[D0ch0l1d4y]

35 minutes ago, DewSweepingMoose said:

Yep brand new. Haven't cut them at all yet so was planning to cut them to the right length after I got the heads stuck on.

 

 

 

After checking some of the other heads in the 2 iron shaft, it seems like it might be a bit of the tip needing to be ground down a bit and the hosel having build up inside or something. The shaft seems to sit better in some of the other heads. So this kinda leaves me with 2 questions...

 

1) will it be ok to put the 2 iron shaft in the 3 iron head without putting it out from the rest of the set in terms of stiffness/step pattern etc?

 

2) is there any issue with me just grinding down the tip until I get the proper fit?

 

 

1) This is standard "soft-stepping". Effectively you are reducing the flex.

 

2) It depends on what exactly you are grinding and by how much. Sounds like the hosel needs reamed to clean it out. If they are brand new shafts and no current tip prep, then a pass on the belt sander just to rough up the surface may suffice?

[DewSweepingMoose]

25 minutes ago, D0ch0l1d4y said:

 

1) This is standard "soft-stepping". Effectively you are reducing the flex.

 

2) It depends on what exactly you are grinding and by how much. Sounds like the hosel needs reamed to clean it out. If they are brand new shafts and no current tip prep, then a pass on the belt sander just to rough up the surface may suffice?

 

Yeah I've given them a real good rough up so maybe just a clean/ream in the hosel. No idea how I'm gonna do that with my current tool setup hahaha!

Cheers for the help 🙂

[Valtiel]

1 hour ago, DewSweepingMoose said:

 

 

2) is there any issue with me just grinding down the tip until I get the proper fit?

 

Don't do that to a steel shaft, bad idea. You need to do what Stuart suggested and confirm everything first. Digital calipers to confirm tip diameter and clean out the hosel, jumping straight to grinding metal off the shaft when you haven't cleaned the hosel out or confirmed the size of the shaft is a bad idea. 

[Stuart_G]

11 hours ago, Valtiel said:

Don't do that to a steel shaft, bad idea.

 

Agree.   Wall thickness is too thin on steel shafts - not a lot of room for error.

 

With graphite - insufficient prep is a common reason for not being able to get full insertion but that's not the case with steel.   One only has to remove any chrome layer - and that's generally just microns thick.   It's rare that it would interfere with the fit.

 

If you still see chrome, then do a bit more sanding/grinding - but if you're already down to the steel - don't do any more - something else is causing the problem.

 

 

11 hours ago, Valtiel said:

You need to do what Stuart suggested and confirm everything first. Digital calipers to confirm tip diameter and clean out the hosel, jumping straight to grinding metal off the shaft when you haven't cleaned the hosel out or confirmed the size of the shaft is a bad idea. 

 

Another possibility he should check (with calipers) for if that the tip went out of round - was somehow bent ("squashed") to more of a slight oval shape.   So only one axis is interfering with the fit.

Edited December 1, 2022 by Stuart_G

[DYOS4]

Take some pics of your prep work. Something is off here. If it's a brand new KBS shaft, there is no shaft label on the butt end? 

[Valtiel]

9 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Agree.   Wall thickness is too thin on steel shafts - not a lot of room for error.

 

With graphite - insufficient prep is a common reason for not being able to get full insertion but that's not the case with steel.   One only has to remove any chrome layer - and that's generally just microns thick.   It's rare that it would interfere with the fit.

 

If you still see chrome, then do a bit more sanding/grinding - but if you're already down to the steel - don't do any more - something else is causing the problem.

 

 

 

Another possibility he should check (with calipers) for if that the tip went out of round - was somehow bent ("squashed") to more of a slight oval shape.   So only one axis is interfering with the fit.

In my experience at least the most common non-manufacturing related issue is people thinking the hosel is clean when it isn't. I have a guy I used to use that would simply give a couple passes with the wire brush drill attachment you can get from Golfworks and while it removed most loose debris, it tended to just buff/smooth whatever epoxy was still bonded to the hosel walls, especially once that attachment got old. It would look clean with a passing glance but a small mountain of epoxy flakes would still come off the walls with a proper scraping/abrading. Combine that with even tiny differences in hosel size and shaft diameter based on manufacturing tolerances and you have the difference between fit and stuck. 

Edited December 1, 2022 by Valtiel

[DewSweepingMoose]

On 12/2/2022 at 6:54 AM, Valtiel said:

In my experience at least the most common non-manufacturing related issue is people thinking the hosel is clean when it isn't. I have a guy I used to use that would simply give a couple passes with the wire brush drill attachment you can get from Golfworks and while it removed most loose debris, it tended to just buff/smooth whatever epoxy was still bonded to the hosel walls, especially once that attachment got old. It would look clean with a passing glance but a small mountain of epoxy flakes would still come off the walls with a proper scraping/abrading. Combine that with even tiny differences in hosel size and shaft diameter based on manufacturing tolerances and you have the difference between fit and stuck. 

I think was it. I spent more time sanding inside the 3 iron hosel and was able to get the shaft in eventually with enough play to have room for epoxy to create a bond. I wanted to play with them a few times to make sure the heads we're on nice and tight...so far no iron heads flying off into the sunset haha 😉 Thanks for all the help folks!

Came out looking pretty good in the end 🙂
(sorry for the mouth breathing 😂)

 

Edited December 14, 2022 by DewSweepingMoose

[JCAG]

A very useful tool:

https://www.golfworks.com/golf-mechanix-shaft-and-hosel-gauge-set/p/gm1047/

 

 

[Pepperturbo]

It depends on how sensitive you are to your clubs.  Essentially, you're soft-stepping the club.

 

I am a total feel player and have a 3 iron MMT shaft, installed at 39.5" in my 2 iron.  It's supposedly hard stepped, but I can't tell.  It fits nicely with my 4i at 39".   Due to lofts, I don't have a 3 iron in this set. 

 

A while back I decided to have a set of shafts soft-stepped into a backup set of 3-PW irons.  I was bothered all the way though 18 holes, the clubs just felt odd.  Had them pulled a week later.