Testing the sand

[TomScht]

If striking the bunker sand in a practice swing is a one-stroke penalty, what is the penalty if it is struck three times? 

[sui generis]

8 minutes ago, TomScht said:

If striking the bunker sand in a practice swing is a one-stroke penalty, what is the penalty if it is struck three times? 

 

First, look at R12.2, for penalties:

 

https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-and-clarifications.html#!ruletype=fr&section=rule&rulenum=12&subrulenum=2

 

I'll give you the 2023 version:

 

https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-and-clarifications.html#!ruletype=fr&section=rule&rulenum=1&subrulenum=3

 

Look at R1.3c4 for Applying Penalties to Multiple Breaches of the Rules.

Edited December 7, 2022 by sui generis

[Mr. Bean]

18 hours ago, TomScht said:

If striking the bunker sand in a practice swing is a one-stroke penalty, what is the penalty if it is struck three times? 

 

Today, that is in 2022, it is a 2-stroke penalty and it is still only one 2-stroke penalty unless someone tells you in between that you are not allowed to make such a test. If you continue after that you get another 2-stroke penalty.

 

The penalties will be the same in 2023.

[Warrior42111]

Going back to the 90% of 'tour' players' thing; I wonder if anyone intentionally didn't rake bunkers to give the groups after them (presumably ahead in standings) a worse lie as a way to climb the leaderboard.

 

Now golf is much more of a politeness sport than others where you do whatever you can do win, so maybe that doesn't happen.

[Socrates]

10 minutes ago, Warrior42111 said:

Going back to the 90% of 'tour' players' thing; I wonder if anyone intentionally didn't rake bunkers to give the groups after them (presumably ahead in standings) a worse lie as a way to climb the leaderboard.

 

Now golf is much more of a politeness sport than others where you do whatever you can do win, so maybe that doesn't happen.

Not 100% sure, but I'm fairly sure that on Tour it would be a violation of some sort, resulting in some sort of penalty.  Someone in the know can likely verify that.

[rogolf]

4 minutes ago, Socrates said:

Not 100% sure, but I'm fairly sure that on Tour it would be a violation of some sort, resulting in some sort of penalty.  Someone in the know can likely verify that.

It's usually a fine to the player.  The referees take immediate action to find the offender, including using TV replays and ShotLink data.

[Augster]

Most tour events have volunteers to rake the bunkers even after the caddy does. So if they “miss” one, it’ll get raked by a volunteer anyway. 
 

This kind of silly gamesmanship will be much more likely to happen at the Amatuer level or low level pro tournies where they don’t get a couple hundred volunteers. 

[Warrior42111]

1 hour ago, Socrates said:

Not 100% sure, but I'm fairly sure that on Tour it would be a violation of some sort, resulting in some sort of penalty.  Someone in the know can likely verify that.

I was more referring to lower level tours, where there's less if any TV coverage, less referees etc. 

[Socrates]

46 minutes ago, Warrior42111 said:

I was more referring to lower level tours, where there's less if any TV coverage, less referees etc. 

Even on lower level Tours, you would find the same kind of penalty. 

 

Failing that, I'm sure that someone would take someone aside and "tune them in" as to what is acceptable.  A gentleman's agreement in the parking lot. 🤫

[Abh159]

51 minutes ago, Warrior42111 said:

I was more referring to lower level tours, where there's less if any TV coverage, less referees etc. 

 

Yeah like socrates said if someone actually did this they would end up with 14 broken clubs at the next event they went to.

 

And that would be if they got off easy...

[TomScht]

On 12/8/2022 at 12:01 PM, rogolf said:

It's usually a fine to the player.  The referees take immediate action to find the offender, including using TV replays and ShotLink data.

 Of course such a player will pick up the rake and make an ineffective "effort," leaving footprints and lumps, possibly leaving the bunker even worse.  How would the "fine" be applied is such a case?  What would the fine rule be called, "Failure to perfectly rake a bunker?"

[davep043]

9 minutes ago, TomScht said:

 Of course such a player will pick up the rake and make an ineffective "effort," leaving footprints and lumps, possibly leaving the bunker even worse.  How would the "fine" be applied is such a case?  What would the fine rule be called, "Failure to perfectly rake a bunker?"

Wow, over a year later.  The professional tours have certain codes of conduct that govern their players.  Intentionally failing to care for the course could certainly violate that code, and result in a fine.  Intentionally half-assing it would probably qualify.  

[Strategery]

Slightly off-topic, but I see so many guys wipe the sand on their backswing in the sand. It's so chronic that I think they really don't care.

[rogolf]

1 hour ago, Strategery said:

Slightly off-topic, but I see so many guys wipe the sand on their backswing in the sand. It's so chronic that I think they really don't care.

Just keep reminding them that it's a two stroke penalty (or loss of hole in match play).  Maybe they will change behaviour?

[Rob G 89]

11 hours ago, davep043 said:

Wow, over a year later.  The professional tours have certain codes of conduct that govern their players.  Intentionally failing to care for the course could certainly violate that code, and result in a fine.  Intentionally half-assing it would probably qualify.  

I do recall watching a tourney and scheffler got to the bunker and his first reaction caught on mic was “wow someone should be fined for that rake job”. Is the player or the caddie fined?

[Hawkeye77]

Edit: no reason to bite. 

Edited February 4 by Hawkeye77

[davep043]

11 hours ago, Rob G 89 said:

I do recall watching a tourney and scheffler got to the bunker and his first reaction caught on mic was “wow someone should be fined for that rake job”. Is the player or the caddie fined?

As far as I know, the tour doesn't publish fines, so we'll never know.

[rogolf]

3 minutes ago, davep043 said:

As far as I know, the tour doesn't publish fines, so we'll never know.

I'm sure it's the player that is fined - the caddie is operating under his guidance.