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USGA and R&A announce proposal to limit golf ball performance for elite level competition


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1 minute ago, RCGA said:

 

If you want to play in a professional event, you play the pro driver. 


Simple.

 

If you win the US Am and play the Masters, I'm sure someone will give you a pro driver if you're that hard up for cash. 

 

It's not just about having the club - it's about having it perform for you the way your normal one does. It's learning your new carry distances, how to work it, all that stuff, which is going to significantly reduce your chances of playing well enough to make a cut. The margins at that level are small, so using the pro driver all the time is going to kill off your chances in other events you play in. 

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https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/articles/2023/12/revised-golf-ball-testing-conditions-to-take-effect-in-2028.html

 

The new rule is posted.  Thanks USGA for shortening my drive 10+ yards...

 

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10 minutes ago, RCGA said:

 

If you want to play in a professional event, you play the pro driver. 


Simple.

 

If you win the US Am and play the Masters, I'm sure someone will give you a pro driver if you're that hard up for cash. 

So no chance to get fit, minimum time to adjust and then boom go play in a major.

 

Not such a great idea.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Ty_Webb said:

 

It's not just about having the club - it's about having it perform for you the way your normal one does. It's learning your new carry distances, how to work it, all that stuff, which is going to significantly reduce your chances of playing well enough to make a cut. The margins at that level are small, so using the pro driver all the time is going to kill off your chances in other events you play in. 

 

Oh no. Those poor amateurs who have to adjust to a slightly different driver before playing the US Open, Open or Masters. 

 

How do these elite ams ever cope with elevation changes, temperature changes, wind, etc.

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1 minute ago, MattC555 said:

 

10y shorter for average elite male. 

 

That's all that's need to save Pebble, huh? This will accomplish nothing and we'll be right back here again in 2035. 

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2 minutes ago, RCGA said:

 

Oh no. Those poor amateurs who have to adjust to a slightly different driver before playing the US Open, Open or Masters. 

 

How do these elite ams ever cope with elevation changes, temperature changes, wind, etc.

It's a change that most of the field won't have to deal with that they will. All those other things everyone has to handle. 

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2 minutes ago, MattC555 said:

Pretty chart with no supporting test data. Basically trust us this is the impact and it won’t be worse.

 

Also that doesn’t nothing to change the pro game. Those who claim it’s driver and flip wedge it’s still going to be that for the longest guys if the numbers are actually true 

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1 minute ago, RCGA said:

 

10y shorter for average elite male. 

 

That's all that's need to save Pebble, huh? This will accomplish nothing and we'll be right back here again in 2035. 

First thing you posted that most will agree with and exactly what all the anti roll backers have been saying from

day 1.

 

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1 minute ago, GoGoErky said:

Pretty chart with no supporting test data. Basically trust us this is the impact and it won’t be worse.

 

Also that doesn’t nothing to change the pro game. Those who claim it’s driver and flip wedge it’s still going to be that for the longest guys if the numbers are actually true 

 

Here is the new test:

 

"The revised ball testing conditions will be as follows: 125-mph clubhead speed (equivalent to 183 mph ball speed); spin rate of 2200 rpm and launch angle of 11 degrees. The current conditions, which were established 20 years ago, are set at 120 mph (equivalent to 176 mph ball speed), 2520 rpm with a 10-degree launch angle.  Limit will remain unchanged at 317 yards with a 3-yard tolerance"

 

 

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2 minutes ago, MattC555 said:

 

Here is the new test:

 

"The revised ball testing conditions will be as follows: 125-mph clubhead speed (equivalent to 183 mph ball speed); spin rate of 2200 rpm and launch angle of 11 degrees. The current conditions, which were established 20 years ago, are set at 120 mph (equivalent to 176 mph ball speed), 2520 rpm with a 10-degree launch angle.  Limit will remain unchanged at 317 yards with a 3-yard tolerance"

 

 

And Keegan Bradley lost 30-40 yards with the proposed specs. That’s alot more than 8-11 yards they claim and Keegan is probably in that 110 range based on his 305 avg distance 

 

they should have provided all their test data showing the actual numbers from those various groups. But I doubt they actually have any

Edited by GoGoErky
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4 minutes ago, Ty_Webb said:

It's a change that most of the field won't have to deal with that they will. All those other things everyone has to handle. 

 

Let's change the game for every golfer because we don't want to burden a couple hundred ams who play pro events each year. 

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1 minute ago, GoGoErky said:

And Keegan Bradley lost 30-40 yards with the proposed specs. That’s alot more than 8-11 yards they claim and Keegan is probably in that 110 range based on his 305 avg distance 

 

they should have provided all their test data showing the actual numbers from those various groups. But I doubt they actually have any

 

I agree.  They claim in the release that 30% of current balls would pass the new test, but fail to share which balls that would be. 

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Just now, RCGA said:

 

Let's change the game for every golfer because we don't want to burden a couple hundred ams who play pro events each year. 

Or, and hear me out here, change the game for no golfers.

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2 minutes ago, GoGoErky said:

And Keegan Bradley lost 30-40 yards with the proposed specs. That’s alot more than 8-11 yards they claim and Keegan is probably in that 110 range based on his 305 avg distance 

 

they should have provided all their test data showing the actual numbers from those various groups. But I doubt they actually have any

 

I believe that was a test ball that was being developed as a possible option.  Not necessarily the option they were going to go with.

Swing hard in case you hit it!

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Just now, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

This change will be noticed by few only. 

 

Then why did they go through all that trouble, spend all those millions to effectively do nothing?  11 yards maximum is NOTHING.  That is within margins to easily regain just with optimization alone.  

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10 minutes ago, clevited said:

I just read the USGAs post on their official decision.  What a load of hot garbage lol.  It will do NOTHING and this stupid issue will just return over and over and over again.  I hope the tours tell them to pound sand and assume governance of themselves and then we all follow what the tours do.  

 

Would love to think that but I've seen this movie before. The OEMs and PGAT stomp and fuss and fuss and stomp and then eventually they do what they always do - they cave to the USGA. The PGAT isnt going to do anything and the OEMs certainly arent going to.

 

Would I love them to? Sure. But they never had before, I have no reason to believe they will now. 

 

Five years from now no one will care and we will just eat the new ball.

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15 minutes ago, MattC555 said:

 

I agree.  They claim in the release that 30% of current balls would pass the new test, but fail to share which balls that would be. 

Which is funny because it was reported earlier in the year by shackleford that none of the balls do and breed just posted that the Titlest professional from

95 wouldn’t pass.

 

 

14 minutes ago, clevited said:

 

I believe that was a test ball that was being developed as a possible option.  Not necessarily the option they were going to go with.

For sure. It’s a prototype, but that’s a long way from the stated 8-11 yards

Just now, clevited said:

 

Then why did they go through all that trouble, spend all those millions to effectively do nothing?  11 yards maximum is NOTHING.  That is within margins to easily regain just with optimization alone.  

Exactly. Setting up for future rollback because this one didn’t work?

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2 hours ago, Foxx said:

There is literally no way major golf ball manufacturers will let a rogue company make truck loads of cash on illegal golf balls.

Because that's what will happen if they only supply rolled back balls to the amateur market.

 

Every golfer who plays for fun will be buying the "non conforming" longer distance balls over the conforming competition shorter balls. Knowing that they axactly do what they claim to do, because they've used them prior.

 

Anyone who wants to maintain a legitimate index will never do this, or at least shouldn't do it.  I may not be a low index any more, but if the fun is in competing (which it is for me), I will have to use the conforming ball.


Frankly I don't see how this is going to work and my guess is the whole thing will be abandoned less than 100 days from now.

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1 minute ago, GoGoErky said:

Which is funny because it was reported earlier in the year by shackleford that none of the balls do and breed just posted that the Titlest professional from

95 wouldn’t pass.

 

 

For sure. It’s a prototype, but that’s a long way from the stated 8-11 yards

Exactly. Setting up for future rollback because this one didn’t work?

Testing the waters. Establishing precedence. When will the frog notice the water is getting hot?

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40 minutes ago, Ty_Webb said:

 

So your solution is for me to just be non-competitive in the lower standard events. I'm a scratch am who plays in stuff. I don't think I'm that unusual. Certainly not on a website like this one. But the point is wherever you draw the line there will be people either better than me, worse than me or around the same as me who will straddle that line and for them you're making life harder than it needs to be. And for what? To take a few yards off Rory's drives. If you think I'm in a group with a miniscule number of players in it, then Rory is in a much more miniscule group than I am. There is no need for a rollback. That seems to be the obvious solution. If players shoot -30 in a week then who wins? The guy who shoots the lowest score. This is a solution in search of a problem. There isn't a problem so they've made one up.

 

I suppose my take on it has been if the ruling bodies are going to do something, then bifurcation is a better choice than roll back for the entire golfing world.  The latter seems dumber to me (to negatively impact millions of players who already struggle with the game). 

 

In the last 40 years (early 80s to today) pga average driving distance is up about 50 yards as well as driving distance of longest players is up 50 yards.  If we project that level of advancement every 40 years, then we will have drives 100 yards longer than today in 80 years.  I know many will say - impossible - we have already maxed out.  If we look at human history and achievement with technology and athletic skill, it seems pretty clear that we will keep advancing in all ways.  

 

Maybe it's not a problem today, but it will be.  And if everyone waits until it is an undeniable problem, then it will be too late.  You can never put the genie back in the bottle.  

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11 minutes ago, clevited said:

 

Then why did they go through all that trouble, spend all those millions to effectively do nothing?  11 yards maximum is NOTHING.  That is within margins to easily regain just with optimization alone.  

At the very least, this will establish a precedent.  The USGA/R&A is also looking at the forgiveness across the face of drivers, and what they call "driver creep" for drivers that become higher CT with usage.  Those are also important.

 

But this establishes a precedent that the USGA/R&A can review driving distances from time to time and change the testing parameters if they deem they are needed. 

 

By the way, their note today says that the very elite might lose as much as 15 yards.  At my swing speed, probably 1 or 2 yards.  And 30% of the balls on today's market would still be conforming.  This may not be enough of a change to satisfy the roll backers, but it is certainly a start.

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5 minutes ago, dcmidnight said:

 

 

 

In each of the survey years, they are measuring the land-use and energy practices of golf facilities.

 

Median Acres of a Golf Course:

2005: 149 acres

2015: 147 acres

2022: 146 acres

 

Golf courses have been getting smaller! SAY WHAT?!!??!

 

Size of Fairways:

2005: 28.8 acres

2015: 27.7 acres

2022: 27.1 acres

 

The amount of land taken up by fairways has been getting smaller!

 

What? You mean all the posts about courses getting longer and the ball going further isn’t true. Facts say not the case.

 

Wonder if those talking points will finally die

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