Recent DQ due to LM stickers on a driver

[golfortennis]

3 hours ago, cardia10 said:

Yeah, we can be like the USGA and create rules that affect the .001% of pro golfers or no one in particular. A rule that affects Zero people should not be a rule. I get the intent, but what is the intent of DQing a kid for a reflective dot on the face that doesn't affect the swing or ball? Just saying it is a rule is fine, but why is it a rule? When the rule was put in the book, was launch monitors even considered? We keep adding layers to the rules, but a better start may be removing the worthless ones first and making the game a little more player friendly.

 

Flip that around.  If you can play with launch monitor dots on the clubface, what else can you put on there?  Why are launch monitor dots ok but not something else?  Need to to step back and look at the bigger picture.  "nothing on the clubface" is pretty straightforward.

 

 

[Soloman1]

Reminds me of explaining to a well-known teaching pro about a circle being 360 degrees, and we measure rotational velocity in degrees per second, not miles per hour.

 

”But what if it’s a really big circle, like 400 degrees?”

[leezer99]

1 hour ago, Soloman1 said:

Reminds me of explaining to a well-known teaching pro about a circle being 360 degrees, and we measure rotational velocity in degrees per second, not miles per hour.

 

”But what if it’s a really big circle, like 400 degrees?”

 

Show him a mobius strip and report back.

[Soloman1]

I think that’s allowed on the clubface, right?

[cardia10]

11 hours ago, golfortennis said:

 

Flip that around.  If you can play with launch monitor dots on the clubface, what else can you put on there?  Why are launch monitor dots ok but not something else?  Need to to step back and look at the bigger picture.  "nothing on the clubface" is pretty straightforward.

 

 

Or you could say “nothing on the club face that affects the flight of the ball” but that would be way too simple for the USGA and rules of golf. That would take the fun away and turn people away from

the game…

[golfortennis]

1 hour ago, cardia10 said:

Or you could say “nothing on the club face that affects the flight of the ball” but that would be way too simple for the USGA and rules of golf. That would take the fun away and turn people away from

the game…

 

Ok, show us what does and doesn't affect the flight of the ball when it's on the clubface.  We'll wait.

[SnowbirdTom]

1 hour ago, cardia10 said:

Or you could say “nothing on the club face that affects the flight of the ball” but that would be way too simple for the USGA and rules of golf. That would take the fun away and turn people away from

the game…

So, who's gonna pay for the testing to prove it does or doesn't affect the flight?  Nothing on the face is simple, straightforward and clear.

 

[golfortennis]

12 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

Reminds me of explaining to a well-known teaching pro about a circle being 360 degrees, and we measure rotational velocity in degrees per second, not miles per hour.

 

”But what if it’s a really big circle, like 400 degrees?”

 

Steve Avery, former major league pitcher was once asked about a turnaround in his season.  He said something along the lines of, "I'm happy to see things turn 360 degrees...or 180 degrees..  I only finished high school."

[huskydawg]

Just buy another head for stickers and use the shaft adapter to change heads.  The rule isn't changing anytime soon so just figure out a way around the problem.

[cardia10]

3 hours ago, golfortennis said:

 

Ok, show us what does and doesn't affect the flight of the ball when it's on the clubface.  We'll wait.

A reflective sticker no where near where a ball should be hit has zero effect. Chapstick on the sweet spot has an effect. This isn't rocket science. If you have a sticker covering the sweet spot, it will affect ball flight. If you have a dot the size of an ink pen end on the toe of the club, it doesn't. I came to this thread and others on junior golf to learn about what my 9 year old may need to know when starting the game. What I have learned is that this example is one of many of why kids act the way they do, why the pay to compete and learn is out of control and why helicopter parents are bad for their kids growth. I'll stick to letting mine have fun learning and just playing the money games with the old guys at the club. There are many more lessons to be learned there. In the end, I bet both sets of kids can walk on to any D3 school they are willing to pay to play at.

Edited May 23 by cardia10

[Soloman1]

The language of the rule might be too difficult for today.

 

I propose, “Don’t put nothin’ on the club face.”

 

Crazy idea, but how about taking the darn things off before a tournament?

 

That’s probably too hard, though.

 

 

[iteachgolf]

51 minutes ago, cardia10 said:

A reflective sticker no where near where a ball should be hit has zero effect. Chapstick on the sweet spot has an effect. This isn't rocket science. If you have a sticker covering the sweet spot, it will affect ball flight. If you have a dot the size of an ink pen end on the toe of the club, it doesn't. I came to this thread and others on junior golf to learn about what my 9 year old may need to know when starting the game. What I have learned is that this example is one of many of why kids act the way they do, why the pay to compete and learn is out of control and why helicopter parents are bad for their kids growth. I'll stick to letting mine have fun learning and just playing the money games with the old guys at the club. There are many more lessons to be learned there. In the end, I bet both sets of kids can walk on to any D3 school they are willing to pay to play at.

The stickers are on the grooves.  On irons the 4 lower stickers absolutely are in play to make contact with the ball. Even with tour players shots on edge of grooves happen all the time. The lower 2 toe ones are in play on woods.  The single sticker is also in play on all woods.  
 

 

Can buy 380 stickers without tabs for $8 or 160 stickers with tabs for $6. No reason not to remove them and reapply after events are over.  When I use them we remove them after every session. 

[wildcatden]

1 hour ago, cardia10 said:

A reflective sticker no where near where a ball should be hit has zero effect. Chapstick on the sweet spot has an effect. This isn't rocket science. If you have a sticker covering the sweet spot, it will affect ball flight. If you have a dot the size of an ink pen end on the toe of the club, it doesn't. I came to this thread and others on junior golf to learn about what my 9 year old may need to know when starting the game. What I have learned is that this example is one of many of why kids act the way they do, why the pay to compete and learn is out of control and why helicopter parents are bad for their kids growth. I'll stick to letting mine have fun learning and just playing the money games with the old guys at the club. There are many more lessons to be learned there. In the end, I bet both sets of kids can walk on to any D3 school they are willing to pay to play at.

 

The rules of golf offer parallels in other areas of life.  To be honest, I don't personally care if a 6,7,8,9, or even 10 year old played a tournament with LM stickers on the face of their club.  However, if they were DQ'd for such an infraction, it is meant to be a teaching moment. If they are a serious golfer, they will likely only make that mistake one time. 

 

If you are just playing casual non-tournament rounds, put whatever you want on the face of your club. We put spray powder on our driver face during practice rounds to see/measure where he is hitting it on the face. 

 

By the way, I think you are just arguing for the sake of arguing now. 

 

 

[jhoppmann]

OEMs should start to incorporate reflective dot paintfill as part of their R&D and conformity approval 🙂

Edited May 23 by jhoppmann

[cardia10]

15 minutes ago, Jdawg1789 said:

 

If you want your kid to learn how to curse, drink, smoke, and gamble in the men's group so be it.  No serious D3 school is taking a walk on.  They will be reduced to a crappy school playing with and against crappy players just like that men's group.  You are teaching your kid the habit of not competing.  

Or am I teaching a kid that paying and volunteering to play and must have the newest and highest dollar clubs and your parents doing your work for you will allow you to compete and win? Youth golf has turned into essentially a pyramid scheme. I know 2 PGA player on tour, one in the top 50 who will tell you not to waste your time on these kids money grabs. I played 2 division 2 sports (not golf) and got money for both but ZERO players on the golf team played organized junior tours. Most of the team was from Canada or Scotland and hit from the wrong side of the ball. Your game speaks for itself and most coaches see a problem parent and kid from a mile away. Entitlement is like a neon glowing sign.

Edited May 23 by cardia10

[Dpavs]

This is so straight forward it boggles my mind why anyone would question it. If you want to play competitive golf (or any sport for that matter) in any sponsored or sanctioned entity then learn the rules and play by the rules. If you want to disregard the rules, then don't play competitive sports period. Your choice, your life but you do not get to ask for special things to apply because you think they are not fair or you don't think they will impact the outcome of an event. It doesn't work that way in sports, life or anything that I know of.

Edited May 24 by Dpavs

[Movingday]

1 hour ago, jhoppmann said:

OEMs should start to incorporate reflective dot paintfill as part of their R&D 🙂

Damn that’s an amazing idea. 

[TripleBogeysrbetter]

On 5/23/2023 at 12:38 PM, jhoppmann said:

OEMs should start to incorporate reflective dot paintfill as part of their R&D and conformity approval 🙂

I heard at one time.  Strictly a rumor that the reason they're not is two fold.

 

It would piss off trackman but who cares.  Foresight wouldn't need to sell the dots anymore.

 

BTW, anyone looking for dots I know of two folks that would sell thousands for like $25 bucks.

[Pepperturbo]

On 5/17/2023 at 2:44 PM, TroyB123 said:

A more interesting question might be, what would you do if your son just shot a good tournament round and was walking off 19 and tells you he inadvertently left his sticker on?  I guess lean between telling him to dq himself or say it’s his call. I don’t have an issue with the kid calling out someone else if they’d dq themselves for the same thing.  

Telling him what to do or let him make the call does nothing for the future of the child.  He might not say or do anything, or do what he/she thinks you want or would approve.

 

If after a good round, my son, or niece told me he/she did something that the rules see as wrong, and nobody noticed; my initial reaction wouldn't be to protect the field, but to reinforce knowing what's Wrong and do what's Right. 

 

Grooming character lets the child make the call, for the right reasons, thus when you're not around, they will make the Right choice because he/she knows right from wrong, and aware of the consequences.  There again, I am proud of being thought an old world Boy Scout. 

Edited August 30 by Pepperturbo

[Oliver Klozoff]

If you can afford a launch monitor, you can afford the $8 sheet of 250 dots.  This is about laziness.  Don't wanna take the time to remove and reapply the dots.  Teach your kids to remove the dots for tourneys so they don't forget.

[caligolfer2103]

I've been reading this thread with great amusement because we always take our dots off. Then, sure enough, this weekend, my son forgot the dots on his 8i. In this case, one of the kids in his group was nice enough to let him know just when he was about to use it for the first time and so no harm no foul. Had he been DQed, it would have been a bummer, but such is life, live and learn and don't make the same mistake twice!