True or False: If Scheffler could putt, he'd be the closest thing to prime Tiger of the last 25 years?

[LimaSierra]

Scheffler hits the ball UNBELIEVABLY. His ballstriking stats are seriously out of this world. Scheffler is #1 in almost every category and he is further away from #2 than #2 is to 25th.

 

He is a machine who constantly is in contention, but always seems to lose too many strokes with the flatstick

[ALIF]

True

[golferdude54]

You're forgetting how good Tiger was. In 2006, he gained over 2 strokes on approach shots alone that season. For perspective, only Rory and Adam Scott gained over 2 strokes total for a season.... COUNTING BOTH TEE SHOTS AND APPROACH SHOTS.

 

That means Tiger was literally beating everyone with like 8 clubs to their 13. Scottie is on pace to gain over 2 strokes in both tee shots and approach shots but his ball striking is not on the level of prime Tiger.

[farmer]

Tiger sometimes seemed ordained to win.  Never felt that with Scottie, but he is a hella good player.

[Shilgy]

14 hours ago, golferdude54 said:

You're forgetting how good Tiger was. In 2006, he gained over 2 strokes on approach shots alone that season. For perspective, only Rory and Adam Scott gained over 2 strokes total for a season.... COUNTING BOTH TEE SHOTS AND APPROACH SHOTS.

 

That means Tiger was literally beating everyone with like 8 clubs to their 13. Scottie is on pace to gain over 2 strokes in both tee shots and approach shots but his ball striking is not on the level of prime Tiger.

Right now it’s closer than you seem to think.

 

2006 Tiger was +2.982 and Scheffler is currently at +2.775 tee to green.  Another week like this one where he was over +20 tee to green for the week and his pace will be past Tigers.

 

Shocks me after looking that up but the man is playing fantastic and gotta give him his due credit.

Edited June 5, 2023 by Shilgy
Correction

[golferdude54]

14 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

Right now it’s closer than you seem to think.

 

2006 Tiger was +2.982 and Scheffler is currently at +2.775 tee to green.  Another week like this one where he was over +19 tee to green for the week and his pace will be past Tigers.

 

Shocks me after looking that up but the man is playing fantastic and gotta give him his due credit.

 

The current tee to green stat on PGA Tour website takes into account shots within 30 yards from the edge of the green (categorized as around the green), that is not an accurate stat for ball striking. Datagolf.com even made note of this and recently put a new stat which is unfortunately called SG:BS which is strokes gained off the tee and approach shots in their live tournament stats.

 

If you excluded the around the green stat, Tiger in 2006 would still be over half a stroke ahead of Scheffler instead of Scheffler outpacing him in the stat you mentioned. And this is more of an apple to half-apple comparison considering the season is only halfway done and usually there's a regression past this point.

 

 

[Tiptx1122]

TRUE

[Shilgy]

28 minutes ago, golferdude54 said:

 

The current tee to green stat on PGA Tour website takes into account shots within 30 yards from the edge of the green (categorized as around the green), that is not an accurate stat for ball striking. Datagolf.com even made note of this and recently put a new stat which is unfortunately called SG:BS which is strokes gained off the tee and approach shots in their live tournament stats.

 

If you excluded the around the green stat, Tiger in 2006 would still be over half a stroke ahead of Scheffler instead of Scheffler outpacing him in the stat you mentioned. And this is more of an apple to half-apple comparison considering the season is only halfway done and usually there's a regression past this point.

 

 

Can be a regression….though if everyone regresses he still can gain relatively..

[mosesgolf]

Imo no one is going to putt like Tiger or Jack ever again. 

[kwcsports]

true

 

[aenemated]

When anyone can just make up some (post-prime) Tiger ish like this and then execute it ... then we'll talk about "closest to Tiger."

 

 

 

Edited June 5, 2023 by aenemated

[jimecherry]

False scottie scheffler is almost as bad out of bunkers as he is on the green  right now ;}

[Valtiel]

Looking at just the SG stats right now it's mostly a putter issue, yeah. Compared to prime Tiger he is well behind in putting and a tick behind in iron play/approach. The former is because it's a little bit of a weakness for Scottie and the latter because it was such a strength for Tiger. You have to get into that +3 SG Total to start sniffing prime Tiger, and literally no one has done that during Tiger's professional career, during which he did it like 7 or 8 times which is bananas.

Tiger's "off" years during his prime were the current top players best ones. 

[JungleJimbo]

10 hours ago, LimaSierra said:

Scheffler hits the ball UNBELIEVABLY. His ballstriking stats are seriously out of this world. Scheffler is #1 in almost every category and he is further away from #2 than #2 is to 25th.

 

He is a machine who constantly is in contention, but always seems to lose too many strokes with the flatstick

 

48 minutes ago, Valtiel said:

Looking at just the SG stats right now it's mostly a putter issue, yeah. Compared to prime Tiger he is well behind in putting and a tick behind in iron play/approach. The former is because it's a little bit of a weakness for Scottie and the latter because it was such a strength for Tiger. You have to get into that +3 SG Total to start sniffing prime Tiger, and literally no one has done that during Tiger's professional career, during which he did it like 7 or 8 times which is bananas.

Tiger's "off" years during his prime were the current top players best ones. 

 

 

 

 

Rex Hoggard (Golf Channel) shared similar SG numbers for Scheffler, in this report "Scottie Scheffler dominates tee to green at Memorial, but on the greens ...". https://sports.yahoo.com/scottie-scheffler-dominates-tee-green-181500100.html

Quote

 

"First the good news. Scheffler continued to be a ball-striking robot, leading the field in strokes gained: off the tee, strokes gained: tee-to-green, strokes gained: approach the green and proximity to the hole. By any metric, he was dominant with a staggering 20.71-shot advantage on the field, which is the second-best gain (behind only Vijay Singh’s record mark of 21.14 in 2004 at TPC Boston) since the Tour introduced the category 20 years ago.

 

Now the bad news. He also continued a baffling trend on the greens, losing 8.5 shots to the field in strokes gained: putting for the week. Even his closing 67 at Muirfield Village, which temporarily tied him for the lead at 6 under, was a statistically awful effort on the greens.

On Sunday he made 43 feet of putts, which was exactly one foot better than his 42 feet on Thursday. His 46-foot average for the week was last in the field."

 

 

Edited June 5, 2023 by JungleJimbo

[Chris52]

Sort his putting out,and he can match Tiger,finished 3rd this  week with the worst putting stats of the players who made the cut,incredible.

[MoeMoe]

No where near Tiger.

[grm24]

I'm a fan of SS however he has a long way to go to ever be considered in Tiger's class on any level (on course accomplishments). While SS is on a blazing heater of a run currently with all of his top finishes it pales in comparison of some of the runs Tiger had. Here's one to chew on.

 

From the WGC Bridgestone in late 2007 and the abbreviated season Tiger had in 2008 consider this......

 

In Tiger's last 5 events of 2007 he won 4 of the 5 events. The one he didn't win he finished in 2nd place. In 2008 Tiger only played 7 events. Won 5 of them. Finished 2nd and 5th in the other two events. Including a win and a second place finish in a major. While only playing 6 PGA Tour events in 2008 Tiger should have won POY.

 

So his record from the end of 2007 and his 2008 season is 12 events played. 9 wins, 2 second place finishes and a 5th place finish. While not playing or missing nearly 6 months of time partly due to injury. In those 12 events only 6 people finished ahead of Tiger. As great of a run SS has been on he can't compare to Tiger even over that 12 event stretch.

 

Then there is this. From the mid 2006 PGA Tour season into the early 2007 PGA Tour season Tiger won seven consecutive starts on the PGA Tour. More wins than SS currently has.

 

Then Tiger had the other streak I documented above. Scotty or any other current tour players will never touch that run Tiger had. As long forgotten tw_focus used to crow here.... bet your house on it. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Edited June 5, 2023 by grm24

[golferdude54]

17 minutes ago, grm24 said:

Then there is this. From the mid 2006 PGA Tour season into the early 2007 PGA Tour season Tiger won seven consecutive starts on the PGA Tour. 

 

Nowadays it's a huge deal to get 5 wins in a season like Jordan Spieth, Justin Thomas, and Jason Day did. Tiger just says to them, "Cool, I won more than that many in a row 3 times."

[iBanesto]

Tiger's putting in his prime is probably unmatched.

 

To combine it with superior ball striking and short game, led to his greatness.

 

Tiger could match all the recent World No. 1's in ball striking but none of them came close to his clutch putting. None.

 

 

[Ferguson]

If Scheffler could do this and if Scheffler could do that, he'd be this, that and the other thing. 

Same thing can be said about anyone. 

 

Tiger had the complete game.

Scheffler has an incomplete game. 

 

 

 

 

 

  

[LimaSierra]

Feel like some just missed the point. I wasn’t saying scheffler was as good as Tiger just his putting was holding him back from being closest to Tiger 

 

but some of y’all get in such a tizzy when someone mentions Tiger

[Shilgy]

8 hours ago, Valtiel said:

Looking at just the SG stats right now it's mostly a putter issue, yeah. Compared to prime Tiger he is well behind in putting and a tick behind in iron play/approach. The former is because it's a little bit of a weakness for Scottie and the latter because it was such a strength for Tiger. You have to get into that +3 SG Total to start sniffing prime Tiger, and literally no one has done that during Tiger's professional career, during which he did it like 7 or 8 times which is bananas.

Tiger's "off" years during his prime were the current top players best ones. 

I count 3 times Tiger was over 3 sg .  Does someone have the numbers for prior to 2004 that you’re counting?

 

If Scheffler could putt he’d be pushing it.  He leads the tour in SG and is losing just a bout a quarter stroke per round putting.

9 hours ago, aenemated said:

When anyone can just make up some (post-prime) Tiger ish like this and then execute it ... then we'll talk about "closest to Tiger."

 

 

 

pssh, that swing looks like Scheffler’s stock follow through.🤣

[Ferguson]

44 minutes ago, LimaSierra said:

Feel like some just missed the point. I wasn’t saying scheffler was as good as Tiger just his putting was holding him back from being closest to Tiger 

 

but some of y’all get in such a tizzy when someone mentions Tiger

 

I used to play golf with a guy, who when after a round would say, "if it wasn't for the two doubles, seven bogeys and multiple three-putts, I would have shot 67."   Same thing applies in your comparison to Scheffler.   

 

"If he only could could putt................."

 

Why not pick a comparable player for your true / false examination?  

[bladehunter]

True. Or definitely the closest thing since Spieth 1.0.  He has it all. He needs to go to someone and work putting as a separate game.  And possibly look into different equipment options there.  With the putter tech ( LAB ) that’s coming down the pipe.. he needs to isolate how much of this is misreads and how much is missing line or pace.  

[LimaSierra]

30 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

True. Or definitely the closest thing since Spieth 1.0.  He has it all. He needs to go to someone and work putting as a separate game.  And possibly look into different equipment options there.  With the putter tech ( LAB ) that’s coming down the pipe.. he needs to isolate how much of this is misreads and how much is missing line or pace.  

Scheffler with 2010's Luke Donald putting would be Tiger level for sure imo

 

Right now Scheffler is reminding me of Vijay. Still wins a ton but the putting holds back an unbelievable ball striker

Edited June 5, 2023 by LimaSierra

[mosesgolf]

Even more than stats the most important instrument is between the years and no one will ever top Tiger in that regard.   Who is ever going to go 14/14 after holding 3rd round lead at majors.  His close out rate is over 90% after holding 3rd round lead for non majors.   Never happening again.  

[LimaSierra]

7 minutes ago, mosesgolf said:

Even more than stats the most important instrument is between the years and no one will ever top Tiger in that regard.   Who is ever going to go 14/14 after holding 3rd round lead at majors.  His close out rate is over 90% after holding 3rd round lead for non majors.   Never happening again.  

Tiger wasn't 14/14 after 54 hole leads in majors. 2009 PGA

 

Regardless this wasn't my point

Edited June 5, 2023 by LimaSierra

[IndyArcher]

I love watching Scottie, and he is my favorite player to follow currently. That said, he doesn't seem have the domineering presence on the course that Tiger did, IMO. Regarding his putting, I have heard a number of different projections, including from different commentators this weekend. SO many of his putts were right there, but just not in. It doesn't strike me as some major flaw, but I'm not more of an expert than anyone else, so I sure don't know. Whatever it is, I sure hope he can create some greater consistency. Scottie with a hot Scotty would be fun to watch!

[R_Swanson]

https://datagolf.com/all-time-ranking

 

Just gonna leave this here.

[jomatty]

SS is amazing but he has not been at the top of the game long enough to be mentioned in the same breath as Tiger.  Didn’t it take him like 2 years to get a win and wasn’t that less than 2 years ago? He is amazing but there is no way to know what kind of player he will end up being as far as being compared to the greats.  Maybe he will turn out to be that good, or maybe just really good.  Too soon to tell