When the distance comes

[wildcatden]

My junior boy age 12 (and a half) just does not hit the ball far.  Mostly in the total 190-210 (total) range off the tee.  Currently around 100lbs and 60" tall.  He has not started his puberty growth spurt(s) yet.

 

1. So when puberty hits and the distance possibly comes along with it, what kinds of jumps have you guys seen?

 

2. Also, in addition to building some strength and flexibility in the gym, what kinds of "swing workouts" did you do with driver to help them gain more speed....ESPECIALLY when the growth spurt(s) hit?  Just swing? Specific drills?

 

Note: We have had speed sticks for 4 years, have tried cycles of them pretty diligently, but have never seen any results from them.  For whatever reason, they just don't work for us.

 

My kid is at a cross roads. He's starting to dislike playing because the tournaments are 6000+ yards. He sees his peers hitting it further around the 230-240 mark.  There are some elite ones out at the 260-270 mark.  He is a smart kid and knows that when he is hitting 3W/5W/5H into par 4's and his peers are hitting 8i/9i that  it's not much of a fight.  It's draining on him mentally.  I've considered just stopping tournament play until he hits his growth spurt and the distance comes....if it ever comes? Maybe it doesn't for him.

[iteachgolf]

The distance will come.  Just for some it doesn’t come til about 15.  For most is happens fast (going from 210 to 275 yards in 6 months is common). Nothing you can do but wait.  Over speed training and working out significantly will have minimal gains if any at all.  I’d stick to smaller local events and stay athletic mixing in other sports even if it’s just for fun (anything the requires running and throwing is good). 

[wildcatden]

Thanks @iteachgolf for your response.  When the distance does come, I'd be curious what we should be doing with respect to the golf swing.  I can get him into a TPI led workout program for the strength and flexibility. But with respect to increasing/maximizing clubhead speed during that time period, are there certain swing drills to perform? 

 

I'm hoping that this can happen for him in the next year or so. Certainly realize that it is only going to happen when it happens.

 

[iteachgolf]

6 minutes ago, wildcatden said:

Thanks @iteachgolf for your response.  When the distance does come, I'd be curious what we should be doing with respect to the golf swing.  I can get him into a TPI led workout program for the strength and flexibility. But with respect to increasing/maximizing clubhead speed during that time period, are there certain swing drills to perform? 

 

I'm hoping that this can happen for him in the next year or so. Certainly realize that it is only going to happen when it happens.

 

I’d find a competent teacher who has a track record of success at developing players and trust the process.  The key for late developers is to develop the skills needed to shoot low scores so that the ONLY piece they are missing is distance.  The ones I’ve had the best success with learned to grind, love chipping and putting, and can shoot mid to low 70s only hitting 5-8 greens a round and thinking their way around the course.  Then when they get short irons vs long irons into holes the scores will come down massively.  

[ShortGolfer]

A challenging executive course may be a better use of his time while he is waiting for that growth spurt.

A good course will reward good course management skills and punish bad decisions. 

Aim for the pin and find that there is now a tree in the way!

It may be worthwhile to see how far he can go in terms of developing skills.  As well as discovering any other weaknesses besides distance.

 

[Galvin Lux]

Growth spurts happens out of nowhere, I remember not being able to drive 150 carry, to out of no where its 190-200, we are kind of stuck at 260 right now, but the jumps have been huge, each time we jump in carry distance was also the same time we changed shafts. 

[hangontight]

My 12 Year old had some significant gains this early spring after he did a 6 week TPI program - focus was 75% mobility & 25% strength.  He has done overspeed in the past, and this was by far more beneficial , for him at least.  Hard to say exactly where credit is due, but I sense that getting his legs & hips loosened up helped a lot - I could see him clearing so much  better and less early extension that you see in so many kids.    I learned that most of these kids can turn their shoulders with the best of them, but so many have tight hips and hamstrings.....for him at least, unlocking that rotary center a bit was helpful.    He still cant even come close to touching his toes,  but working on it.....cm by cm.      

 

Also, be encouraged and reminded that the process naturally has platues and even regression.  Looking back through the years I think we can all recall times that it just wasnt happening....spurts, bad swing habit, outgrown equipment...whatever the reason.  

[kekoa]

My son is stuck in this grey area as well and it just sucks.  He is a young 13 and carries it 195.  The club he plays out of is all kikuya so roll is almost non existent.  Most of the kids he plays against are all out there 240 carry.  Some outliers are in the 280+ range carry.  I've tried to sign my son of for tournaments that are more yardage appropriate in the 5,800 yard range, but he won't do it.  He'd rather compete against the older and more mature kids at 6,300 yards 😞.   Like @iteachgolf said, we are working on other areas of the game trying to be ready when the distance comes.    

 

[yellowlover519]

21 hours ago, iteachgolf said:

The distance will come.  Just for some it doesn’t come til about 15.  For most is happens fast (going from 210 to 275 yards in 6 months is common). Nothing you can do but wait.  Over speed training and working out significantly will have minimal gains if any at all.  I’d stick to smaller local events and stay athletic mixing in other sports even if it’s just for fun (anything the requires running and throwing is good). 

This happened to us in 2023.  40 yards of carry gains out of nowhere at age 14 in 6 months.

 

Some of it might have been from working out in the off-season, but I think most of it came with the start of puberty.

[iteachgolf]

As an example, the top 2024 I teach swung 92mph at 13-14 years old.  He swung 100-103 at 15-16 years old.  And then in the last 6 months speed has rocketed up (117mph and 173mph ball speed).  Swing is largely the same and he actually stopped all over speed training as he got injured every time he did it over any lengthy period.  Finally convinced Dad to be patient and just let it come and now he’s above PGA Tour average.  The other skills were strong enough (bogeyed 35th hole at US Jr to miss match play last year only swinging 100-103) that now that speed is there everything has gotten easier and more consistent. Just shot 61 from 7100 yards recently.  Went from hope we get any D1 offers to turning down a good number of really good offers to very good D1 programs (school won’t cost him a dime)

[wildcatden]

17 minutes ago, kekoa said:

My son is stuck in this grey area as well and it just sucks.  He is a young 13 and carries it 195.  The club he plays out of is all kikuya so roll is almost non existent.  Most of the kids he plays against are all out there 240 carry.  Some outliers are in the 280+ range carry.  I've tried to sign my son of for tournaments that are more yardage appropriate in the 5,800 yard range, but he won't do it.  He'd rather compete against the older and more mature kids at 6,300 yards 😞.   Like @iteachgolf said, we are working on other areas of the game trying to be ready when the distance comes.    

 

 

I think if my kid had a 195 carry (that's around 30+ yards more carry than my kid now) with the roll and the turf conditions here in NorCal, I wouldn't need to post.  I'm guessing that with  fairway roll on different turf that he is getting out to 230-240? 

 

We are going to play some USKG Locals and look for some shorter JGANC events.  Might be a good time to focus on the mental side of the game as well.

 

[kekoa]

6 minutes ago, wildcatden said:

 

I think if my kid had a 195 carry (that's around 30+ yards more carry than my kid now) with the roll and the turf conditions here in NorCal, I wouldn't need to post.  I'm guessing that with  fairway roll on different turf that he is getting out to 230-240? 

 

We are going to play some USKG Locals and look for some shorter JGANC events.  Might be a good time to focus on the mental side of the game as well.

 

More like 220 or so.  I also feel like my son's driver isn't optimized rn as he is just hitting the ball too high.  I need to look into some more lower launching/spinning shafts as the head he plays is high spin.  

 

His summer schedule is very light with tournaments.  We opted to do PGA jr league one more time as he has a good time with the team format.  Just started some light fitness training as well.  I'm hoping by next year we can try for TTC and a few AJGA's that are local to us.

[MikekiM]

My 14yo is really starting to gain some distance lately.  Hasn't exactly grown much, still only 62", but carrying it 250 with regularity now.   He's probably gained about 20y just in the last couple months.

I think I need to quit now, feign a career ending injury while I can still beat him.

 

 

 

[blades_are_life]

I didn't start getting numbers close to what I can hit now until 14 or 15.

[caligolfer2103]

My son is in exact same boat... 12.5YO, 5'3", 96lbs (soaking wet)... wiry strong. A couple thoughts...

1) 6 months ago, his swing speed was stuck in the high 70s. Probably 180 carry, 200 total at best

2) Since then, he's probably gained a couple inches in height, started doing some strength work and changed coach, who entirely rearchitected his swing. His swing speed is now into the 85-86mps range. probably carries it 205 - 210 on his best drives and 220-ish total. But it's really tough to ascribe where the gains have come from, as I'm sure it's some of everything

3) He's still playing a USKids driver, but when he has tested out adult drivers this past weekend, he was gaining another 10 - 20 yards on top of that, so probably averaging 225 - 230 and maxing out at almost 240 yards. So, the equipment is definitely a factor

4) I posted about this earlier, but my older son sprouted a good 5 - 6" from age 12 - 14 so it's a massive growth period... My 12.5YO up until this year always trended below average height but this year has sprouted to above average

 

All this to say, I think there are a lot of factors behind this, some of which you can control (swing mechanics, equipment, strength work) but some which you can't (height / puberty) which I assume has a huge impact.

 

Like @kekoa said, I try to keep him in shorter yardage courses. My thought is if he can have a pitching wedge on his third shot into the longest par 5, then he can play it, so call it 220 drive + 190 wood + 100 wedge = 510ish max hole, that something he can play although we're starting to push that a bit more in recent tournaments. AND, we work a lot on short game bc that's where he should be able to make up strokes against longer kids - that's my son's motivation - knowing that he can compete against kids much longer than him bc his short game is often better... gives him special satisfaction even if he can't win against the elite kids.

 

Of course, take everything with a grain of salt! My son shoots in the 86-87 range most days so he's by no means a superstar and we're sort of learning as we go bc he finally said he wants to get serious about golf...

[isgerrior]

So here are my thoughts of a 15 and 13 year old sons.  My 15 is currently 5'6 112lbs.  He was 5' feet 100 lbs last year.  Last season he played freshman golf with a 185-195 carry driver.  Yea it sucked when he was hitting a 7 wood or hybrid vs other kids hitting 7 irons into greens but it is what it is.  Over the winter he did 2- 6 weeks cycles of the Stack system.  He runs track and played squash in the winter.  This year his carry is running around 225, with roll out to the 240ish range.  So yea still short, but we are kind of expecting the same 25-35 yard gains over this coming winter.  

My 13 year old is 5'6 and 115lbs.  Yup they are exactly 2 years apart and the same size.  He hits it as long if not further than the 15 year old. Because he has been bigger than most kids he has relied on that for his advantage.  The older one has a super tight short game so that helps him .  So in summary, i would think 25-30 yards gain is super reasonable per year for the 1-3 years of big growth gains.    Videos are from March, so a bit old.  The pink shorts is the younger one. They were 12 and 14 in March.

Edited July 27 by isgerrior

[wegobomber31]

On 6/13/2023 at 10:20 AM, wildcatden said:

My junior boy age 12 (and a half) just does not hit the ball far.  Mostly in the total 190-210 (total) range off the tee.  Currently around 100lbs and 60" tall.  He has not started his puberty growth spurt(s) yet.

 

1. So when puberty hits and the distance possibly comes along with it, what kinds of jumps have you guys seen?

 

2. Also, in addition to building some strength and flexibility in the gym, what kinds of "swing workouts" did you do with driver to help them gain more speed....ESPECIALLY when the growth spurt(s) hit?  Just swing? Specific drills?

 

Note: We have had speed sticks for 4 years, have tried cycles of them pretty diligently, but have never seen any results from them.  For whatever reason, they just don't work for us.

 

My kid is at a cross roads. He's starting to dislike playing because the tournaments are 6000+ yards. He sees his peers hitting it further around the 230-240 mark.  There are some elite ones out at the 260-270 mark.  He is a smart kid and knows that when he is hitting 3W/5W/5H into par 4's and his peers are hitting 8i/9i that  it's not much of a fight.  It's draining on him mentally.  I've considered just stopping tournament play until he hits his growth spurt and the distance comes....if it ever comes? Maybe it doesn't for him.

 

I wouldn't pull him out of tournaments...just enter him in the right ones.  You just want tournaments where if he plays well for him, he'll be in the contention and in the mix down the stretch and get a lot from the experience.  Plus he'll round out his game by learning to shave strokes in other areas.

 

My son was on the smaller side and is now probably average size.  There are always going to be guys that hit it 40 yards past you, at every level. And you have to find a way to beat them.

 

If the speed sticks aren't working, then your son is probably already swinging with max intent.  But rather than wait for puberty to hit I would encourage anything that promotes general strength and athleticism (including other sports)

 

To answer your question, my son just turned 16 and he went from 230 to 256 to 279 to 289 average over the last 3 years and I expect he'll add 10-15 yards per year over the next 3+.  He just started growing in the last 12-18 months, works out religiously but has no real 'man strength' to speak of.  He's just got done competing at 7300+ yds at sea level without issue.

 

And finally, even if your son never hits the ball 330 yards, the game can provide him with a lifetime of rewards and benefits.  Keep him grinding!

[isgerrior]

My son and his partner (blue shirts) just shot a -5, 31 to tie these mountain men. All 4 boys are the same age. 261 yard par 4, both blue kids drove tee shots onto the green others were 20 yards right. Accuracy countstoo. Not just pure distance. 

[wildcatden]

15 hours ago, isgerrior said:

My son and his partner (blue shirts) just shot a -5, 31 to tie these mountain men. All 4 boys are the same age. 261 yard par 4, both blue kids drove tee shots onto the green others were 20 yards right. Accuracy countstoo. Not just pure distance. 

 

 

 Don't disagree on accuracy as well. Problem for my kid is that on the 260 yard par 4 he would be 70 yards back. And 7/8 out of 10 times in the fairway. Being 70 yards back on short par 4's is not all that bad. But on the 350 yard par 4's, we are hitting 5W into the green and the longer kids are hitting 8i/9i/PW. 

 

 We are still just working on other parts of our game.  His iron play, even though those distances are short as well, is getting better. I attribute this to his work on getting setup and aligned properly in his routine.  His putting has improved greatly in the last month after getting him a new shaft because the old one was too short. He has always been a pretty good putter, but I was slacking on getting him into a new shaft. 

 

 He qualified for DCP Regionals at Chambers Bay yesterday. Here were his results:

 

Drive (5th place):  12 (170-180yards), 13 (180-190 yards), 13 (180-190 yards)

Chip (7th place):  15, 20, 5

Putt (Tied 1st):  25, 15, 20

 

Overall: 2nd place

 

Next steps:

 

If he can maintain his pre-shot and setup routines for stock shots, which tend to be straight/1-yard draw, then we plan to start working on hitting cuts and draws. He has worked on these skills before and he can do them, but they sometimes get him confused and the setup for one type of shot (example: cut) bleeds into his stock setup.  He can execute them when he puts the pieces of the puzzle together.  In addition, we are working on shots around the green. His stock greenside play is geared around Hinge&Hold technique. I had him read (again) Tom Watson's short game book and also look at Jason Day's short game techniques to show him that there are many creative ways to play the short game. I constantly push him to keep the LW in the bag and chip/short pitch with other clubs. 

 

Once again, many thanks to the posts here! Has been very helpful. It's still frustrating and seems so unfair to him, but all he can do is keep improving what he can improve.

Edited August 2 by wildcatden

[kekoa]

On 7/27/2023 at 8:00 AM, isgerrior said:

So here are my thoughts of a 15 and 13 year old sons.  My 15 is currently 5'6 112lbs.  He was 5' feet 100 lbs last year.  Last season he played freshman golf with a 185-195 carry driver.  Yea it sucked when he was hitting a 7 wood or hybrid vs other kids hitting 7 irons into greens but it is what it is.  Over the winter he did 2- 6 weeks cycles of the Stack system.  He runs track and played squash in the winter.  This year his carry is running around 225, with roll out to the 240ish range.  So yea still short, but we are kind of expecting the same 25-35 yard gains over this coming winter.  

My 13 year old is 5'6 and 115lbs.  Yup they are exactly 2 years apart and the same size.  He hits it as long if not further than the 15 year old. Because he has been bigger than most kids he has relied on that for his advantage.  The older one has a super tight short game so that helps him .  So in summary, i would think 25-30 yards gain is super reasonable per year for the 1-3 years of big growth gains.    Videos are from March, so a bit old.  The pink shorts is the younger one. They were 12 and 14 in March.

 

Hard to say from the angle, but it looks to me like the younger one has more speed than the older thus he is hitting it the same distance.   Great job and keep them playing!!  Thanks for sharing.

[TripleBogeysrbetter]

On 6/13/2023 at 11:20 AM, wildcatden said:

My junior boy age 12 (and a half) just does not hit the ball far.  Mostly in the total 190-210 (total) range off the tee.  Currently around 100lbs and 60" tall.  He has not started his puberty growth spurt(s) yet.

 

1. So when puberty hits and the distance possibly comes along with it, what kinds of jumps have you guys seen?

 

2. Also, in addition to building some strength and flexibility in the gym, what kinds of "swing workouts" did you do with driver to help them gain more speed....ESPECIALLY when the growth spurt(s) hit?  Just swing? Specific drills?

 

Note: We have had speed sticks for 4 years, have tried cycles of them pretty diligently, but have never seen any results from them.  For whatever reason, they just don't work for us.

 

My kid is at a cross roads. He's starting to dislike playing because the tournaments are 6000+ yards. He sees his peers hitting it further around the 230-240 mark.  There are some elite ones out at the 260-270 mark.  He is a smart kid and knows that when he is hitting 3W/5W/5H into par 4's and his peers are hitting 8i/9i that  it's not much of a fight.  It's draining on him mentally.  I've considered just stopping tournament play until he hits his growth spurt and the distance comes....if it ever comes? Maybe it doesn't for him.

1. My son didn't really start until 17 and just now at 20 is slowing down.  He was always behind the power curve.  He played in an event in the final group when he was a raising junior against a raising Senior and kid that was about to start college golf for a Div 1 program.  He was getting out driven by 50-70 yards each time.  He hung around with his short game.  They make a couple of mistakes on a par 4 and par 5 middle of the round and he actually had the outright lead. 

 

Then he realized he had the lead and he was like OMG OMG.  Hadn't learned to close yet. 😉  Finished 3rd.

 

He was only hitting it 225 or so and a lot of times needed a  5 or 6 iron on a lot of par 4s.   He could get up and down from anywhere.  We would go practice and he was always practicing short game.  Different shots.

 

He had a college coach watch him in 11th grade and he was missing a lot of greens that day.  The exact words were "Wow, he can get up and down."

 

Senior year of HS he just beat the cover off the ball.  Last summer before going back to college is probably the further I've ever seen him hit a ball.

 

I would say as a parent of a former late bloomer.  Stick to the putting and short game.  The distance will come.  Let those big kids crank it but what happens when they miss a fairway or green and can't get up and down or putt.

 

It's a mental drag to watch a smaller kid walk off a green with a lower score when you out drove them by 75+ yards.

 

Remember there are no pictures on the scorecard.

 

[wildcatden]

Follow on question:  How does the flex of the driver shaft relate to what flex to use in the irons? And fairways/hybrid?

 

Late last week, I decided to take him in for a driver fitting based upon advice here and a coach we know. I wasn't expecting anything, but we learned a lot.  We learned that he should be moving up to an R-Flex driver shaft as his swing speed increased to 80-81mph (vs 78mph) when using a slightly heavier shaft.  Perhaps getting more muscle engagement. For example, he swings his current Aerotech MX48 F2-Flex  (~48g uncut) slower than a Ventus Red 5 R-Flex (~58g uncut).   Note: I am using the "uncut" numbers as reference as I know the cutting down of the shaft, in our case 5" from 46" to 41" tip to grip, changes the weight measurement. One of the things I noticed prior to the driver fitting was that he was starting to hit a lot of pulls and pull-hooks. Perhaps overpowering the shaft. So all good, we are getting a new driver shaft.

 

So how does that driver shaft flex relate to irons and fairways/hyrbid?  His irons are USKG TS3-60 junior steel. His Fairways/Hybrid are TM Stealth2 3W (Ventus Red 5 A-Flex), Cobra F9 5-6W (Ventus Red 5 A-Flex) and TM 5H (Ventus Blue Hybrid 5 A-Flex). 

 

1. Is it better to stay a flex below on the fairways?

2. He likely needs to get his first set of adult irons soon. Stay below a flex such as a graphite Recoil F2 flex or Aerotech Steelfiber i70 A-Flex? 

 

I know that there is no standard for flex across manufacturers. I know that fitting may be the answer, but I'm also looking at cost here. For example, I'd be fine with putting him in a used set of Mizuno JPX 921 Forged/Tour, Cobra King Forged Tour, Wilson V6 or even Hogan PTx Pros.  

 

Edited August 9 by wildcatden

[kekoa]

On 8/8/2023 at 6:56 AM, Jcracks said:

Miles Russell just won the PGA Junior and he is 5'6" 14 year old freshman that might weigh 110 lbs soaking wet.  It isn't all about distance.  Getting the ball in the hole with the least number of shots is the game.

Its pretty obvious that Miles is just a different breed.  I'd bet a lot of money that a lot of D1 colleges are chomping at the bit to get him signed when they can. 

[kekoa]

40 minutes ago, wildcatden said:

Follow on question:  How does the flex of the driver shaft relate to what flex to use in the irons? And fairways/hybrid?

 

Late last week, I decided to take him in for a driver fitting based upon advice here and a coach we know. I wasn't expecting anything, but we learned a lot.  We learned that he should be moving up to an R-Flex driver shaft as his swing speed increased to 80-81mph (vs 78mph) when using a slightly heavier shaft.  Perhaps getting more muscle engagement. For example, he swings his current Aerotech MX48 F2-Flex  (~48g uncut) slower than a Ventus Red 5 R-Flex (~58g uncut).   Note: I am using the "uncut" numbers as reference as I know the cutting down of the shaft, in our case 5" from 46" to 41" tip to grip, changes the weight measurement. One of the things I noticed prior to the driver fitting was that he was starting to hit a lot of pulls and pull-hooks. Perhaps overpowering the shaft. So all good, we are getting a new driver shaft.

 

So how does that driver shaft flex relate to irons and fairways/hyrbid?  His irons are USKG TS3-57 junior steel. His Fairways/Hybrid are TM Stealth2 3W (Ventus Red 5 A-Flex), Cobra F9 5-6W (Ventus Red 5 A-Flex) and TM 5H (Ventus Blue Hybrid 5 A-Flex). 

 

1. Is it better to stay a flex below on the fairways?

2. He likely needs to get his first set of adult irons soon. Stay below a flex such as a graphite Recoil F2 flex or Aerotech Steelfiber i70 A-Flex? 

 

I know that there is no standard for flex across manufacturers. I know that fitting may be the answer, but I'm also looking at cost here. For example, I'd be fine with putting him in a used set of Mizuno JPX 921 Forged/Tour, Cobra King Forged Tour, Wilson V6 or even Hogan PTx Pros.  

 

For your son's swing speed I would say his driver flex does not need to correlate directly with iron flex at this time.  If you are in the market for a new set of irons then by all means I would bump him up to R flex in the adult irons.  Should you go steel or graphite?  I would personally stick to graphite until he starts to get into high 80 to 90 mph SS.  Its just a big guessing game at this point given that you still need to cut shafts down.  If you cut anymore than an inch or so, it changes the profile and weighting.  My son's set are R flex across the board.  Woods are in the 50 gram range and the recoil 460 in the irons and wedges.  I'm not going to tinker with anything until he can actually play full length clubs.  At this point, the process is just too frustrating compared to the actual benefit.  I truly believe a real fitting is only beneficial once the kid either plays full length clubs or swings driver at least 90 mph.  Just my opinion.

[iteachgolf]

Miles hits it far enough (swings it 105ish) and has one of the most complete short games I’ve ever seen.  He chips and putts it better than almost anyone he’s gonna play against.  Makes his margin for error a lot bigger than most. 

[wildcatden]

14 minutes ago, kekoa said:

For your son's swing speed I would say his driver flex does not need to correlate directly with iron flex at this time.  If you are in the market for a new set of irons then by all means I would bump him up to R flex in the adult irons.  Should you go steel or graphite?  I would personally stick to graphite until he starts to get into high 80 to 90 mph SS.  Its just a big guessing game at this point given that you still need to cut shafts down.  If you cut anymore than an inch or so, it changes the profile and weighting.  My son's set are R flex across the board.  Woods are in the 50 gram range and the recoil 460 in the irons and wedges.  I'm not going to tinker with anything until he can actually play full length clubs.  At this point, the process is just too frustrating compared to the actual benefit.  I truly believe a real fitting is only beneficial once the kid either plays full length clubs or swings driver at least 90 mph.  Just my opinion.

 

Yes, that's in line with what I am thinking on the graphite in the iron shafts. The Recoils and Steelfiber's seem to fit the bill on price and have good reviews. I have the tools at home to build his clubs, so I am in the buy a used iron set from eBay, 2nd Swing, etc... and pull the shafts thought process.  Of course, you never know because since starting this thread nearly 2 months ago, he has grown about 1/2-3/4" in height.   

[TripleBogeysrbetter]

2 hours ago, wildcatden said:

Follow on question:  How does the flex of the driver shaft relate to what flex to use in the irons? And fairways/hybrid?

 

Late last week, I decided to take him in for a driver fitting based upon advice here and a coach we know. I wasn't expecting anything, but we learned a lot.  We learned that he should be moving up to an R-Flex driver shaft as his swing speed increased to 80-81mph (vs 78mph) when using a slightly heavier shaft.  Perhaps getting more muscle engagement. For example, he swings his current Aerotech MX48 F2-Flex  (~48g uncut) slower than a Ventus Red 5 R-Flex (~58g uncut).   Note: I am using the "uncut" numbers as reference as I know the cutting down of the shaft, in our case 5" from 46" to 41" tip to grip, changes the weight measurement. One of the things I noticed prior to the driver fitting was that he was starting to hit a lot of pulls and pull-hooks. Perhaps overpowering the shaft. So all good, we are getting a new driver shaft.

 

So how does that driver shaft flex relate to irons and fairways/hyrbid?  His irons are USKG TS3-57 junior steel. His Fairways/Hybrid are TM Stealth2 3W (Ventus Red 5 A-Flex), Cobra F9 5-6W (Ventus Red 5 A-Flex) and TM 5H (Ventus Blue Hybrid 5 A-Flex). 

 

1. Is it better to stay a flex below on the fairways?

2. He likely needs to get his first set of adult irons soon. Stay below a flex such as a graphite Recoil F2 flex or Aerotech Steelfiber i70 A-Flex? 

 

I know that there is no standard for flex across manufacturers. I know that fitting may be the answer, but I'm also looking at cost here. For example, I'd be fine with putting him in a used set of Mizuno JPX 921 Forged/Tour, Cobra King Forged Tour, Wilson V6 or even Hogan PTx Pros.  

 

Easier said that done always but IMHO get some fittings.

 

My son played the wrong driver and flex for about 2 years or so.  We did one last summer as a 19yo and 6' 180lb muscle dude.  We are thinking 8.5 loft  X shift.

 

He walks out with a TS1 12.5 with 60 gram Regular.  He has what they termed "Dead hands or quite" don't remember exactly.  The old dude had to come over and watch cause the regular guy didn't understand.

 

He increased his distance and we changed a 5 wood because of it.  He was nuking the driver and 5 wood.

[wildcatden]

1 hour ago, TripleBogeysrbetter said:

Easier said that done always but IMHO get some fittings.

 

My son played the wrong driver and flex for about 2 years or so.  We did one last summer as a 19yo and 6' 180lb muscle dude.  We are thinking 8.5 loft  X shift.

 

He walks out with a TS1 12.5 with 60 gram Regular.  He has what they termed "Dead hands or quite" don't remember exactly.  The old dude had to come over and watch cause the regular guy didn't understand.

 

He increased his distance and we changed a 5 wood because of it.  He was nuking the driver and 5 wood.

 

Golf, the ultimate counterintuitive sport.   My mind knows that a fitting is next for irons. My wallet has not come to terms with it yet. 

[Golfingdawg19]

3 hours ago, kekoa said:

Its pretty obvious that Miles is just a different breed.  I'd bet a lot of money that a lot of D1 colleges are chomping at the bit to get him signed when they can. 

Miles has a Tour level short game and that is no exaggerating anything. The kid is Spieth like with the short game 

[kekoa]

1 hour ago, wildcatden said:

 

Golf, the ultimate counterintuitive sport.   My mind knows that a fitting is next for irons. My wallet has not come to terms with it yet. 

What are you really looking to achieve right now with an iron fitting?  We go by looks and feel only. lol!!