AJGA & Cheating

[kekoa]

For those dads who have been in AJGA for a while, how common is cheating?  A friend's son played an AJGA today and on one of the holes, the competitor hits a wayward drive towards a hazard/protected area.  The kid looks for his ball for a while and then walks to the other side of the hazard (which splits two fairways) and vala, he finds his ball with a perfectly clear view of the green.   Thing is, my buddy and his wife saw the competitors dad, drop a ball for his son on a nice fluffy lie near the adjacent fairway.   Rules officials were called, but they wanted to discuss it after the round as the group was slowing pace of play.   In the end, the AJGA staff let the suspected cheater off with a warning.  That was an interesting call since the AJGA staff states there was no 'proof' that the dad dropped the ball.  Isn't seeing the dad do this in plain view 'proof' enough?  

 

I've always thought cheating is rare as one reaches AJGA.  Guess not.

 

 

[sui generis]

29 minutes ago, kekoa said:

cheating is rare as one reaches AJGA

 

I refereed AJGA in the Southeast for a few years. Yes, once in awhile there was a question about a player's actions, but it was very, very rare. You should take comfort in the knowledge that the AJGA administration pays close attention to those players whose actions don't seem Kosher. You may not see that player again. 🙂

[Tannerbug33]

we have played with those people many times before i can tell you that the higher the quality tournament you go to the less it happens. recently played a event and a kid in the group in front of us duck hooks a ball to the left. was helping the group look i asked if he heard it hit a tree he said nope. 2 minutes latter he finds it on the other side of the fairway. parents in out group just rolled out eyes. 

 one thing im big on is if im helping locate my sons ball i ask another parent to go with me. and i never keep golf balls in my pocket, if i should find one i alway give it away are put it around a cooler if some one wants it. lots of times i give to a rules official since they usually avid golfers. i don't want to take a chance to have any thing being said about my son cheating because once its said its out there and never goes away. as for the case mentioned above no one was suprised that happened to that kid. he always has those breaks lol. 

[wegobomber31]

There is a lot of stake and youth sports often bring out the worst in parents. What these players/parents likely fail to realize is the reputation as a potential cheater is more damaging than having a bad tournament. I know one kid is rumored to have cheated on a hole in one on a par 4. That has followed him around more than a relatively meaningless developmental tour win. 

[Llortamaisey]

I kinda like how they handled it. Speed up play instead of hashing out the cheating on the spot, and then shadow ban the kid from future tournaments. They’re not playing for money, they’re playing for status. Not letting him play in future tournaments will send a message to his dad and negate any benefit he may have received from cheating. If they don’t shadow ban him, shame on them. 
 

Speed of play seems to be a more serious threat to junior golf than a one off dad dropping a ball. They’ll have to start playing 36 hole events over four days just to get juniors back to 4.5 hours per day on the course. 

[leezer99]

I wasn’t there but my wife was. Kid in the group ahead of my son hooked a ball on one, took an unplayable with line of sight relief and hit his next shot from the range. 
 

 

edit: since I just realized none of you probably know this, left of the cart path has always been marked OB. 
 

I’ll also add that NO kid would ever apply that rule. He was definitely coached by a parent to do so. 

Edited July 29 by leezer99

[Tugu]

Most people who have played an active schedule in junior golf has undoubtedly witnessed some form of cheating. But when full consideration is given to how many kids actually participate in the game, it's really a small minority of kids/parents who get up to this nonesense.

 

The stories I could tell...parents with binoculars, timers, phones for recording, instructions in code or foreign language, clean lie with surrounding bush trampled whilst deep in trees, balls always found by parent, noise in the backswing, comments on difficulty of shot a player faces, threats of DQ etc etc etc

 

Like life, there will always be people who want a leg up even when they are not due such an outcome.

Edited July 30 by Tugu

[ilikegolf26]

On 7/28/2023 at 10:04 PM, kekoa said:

For those dads who have been in AJGA for a while, how common is cheating?  A friend's son played an AJGA today and on one of the holes, the competitor hits a wayward drive towards a hazard/protected area.  The kid looks for his ball for a while and then walks to the other side of the hazard (which splits two fairways) and vala, he finds his ball with a perfectly clear view of the green.   Thing is, my buddy and his wife saw the competitors dad, drop a ball for his son on a nice fluffy lie near the adjacent fairway.   Rules officials were called, but they wanted to discuss it after the round as the group was slowing pace of play.   In the end, the AJGA staff let the suspected cheater off with a warning.  That was an interesting call since the AJGA staff states there was no 'proof' that the dad dropped the ball.  Isn't seeing the dad do this in plain view 'proof' enough?  

 

I've always thought cheating is rare as one reaches AJGA.  Guess not.

 

 

Hmmm, is Justin Doeden playing AJGA?  Thought he aged out of that?

[RobS]

Very recent sighting.  Kid hits a right, going towards a water hazard but it stops short on the downslope.  It rolled right up against some thick ground cover that kept it out of the water.  I was walking ahead of the group and had a clear view of it from about 20 yard away.  I kept walking and looked back and see his Dad walking around as if he's looking for the ball.  I'm thinking, how can that guy not see the ball?  I stop up ahead to watch the approach shots and the kid is taking a drop.  I assumed he took an unplayable because it would have been really hard to advance the ball forward from his stance and lie without potentially dumping it in the water.  My son and the other player were called over for the drop.  I asked my son about it after the round.  He said the kid called over saying he was short of the hazard but had an embedded ball.  Short of the hazard, yes, embedded ball, no way.  I asked if he saw the embedded ball and he said it was pretty deep, about half the ball and it seemed crazy that a ball could embed like that.  I almost laughed out loud and think I realized why the guy was walking back and forth searching for a ball that didn't require a search.  He probably had to step on it 2 or 3 times to get it to embed so his kid could take a drop and have a shot at the green.  Unbelievable.  My son said the player seemed like a good guy.  The kid was having trouble off the tee but the Dad was good at finding the ball.  I'm not so sure about the Dad.  An AJGA official driving by late in the round asked me and the other players Mom about the guy.  Seemed a little odd.  Maybe he has a reputation.  I simply said that "he seems to be very involved in the round".  The Mom laughed and said something to effect of, 'that's one way to say it'.

Edited August 10 by RobS

[MountainKing]

It was there for sure when I played, but parents weren't nearly as present or involved in the early to mid 90's like they are now, and they're generally the culprit for this behavior.  It's really sad the state that a lot of junior sports are in right now thanks to the parents.