Hogan's swing analysis by Jim Mclean

[HoganAfficianado]

reverse cupping?

What do you guys think about the reverse cupping Johnny Miller talks about in the second vid? The whole supination thing at impact doesnt seem like it would be a secret.

Here is a quote from Dan that was done on the bottom picture.

The left wrist was not mearly as bowed as most think at impact.......in the image below of Mr Hogan at impact you can clearly see that the ulna and the radius bones are both CLREARLY visible at impact which shows that the left wrist could not have been "bowed" as he struck the ball........not in the frame or 2 after this the left wrist went into a SLIGHTLY "bowed" position as the butt of the club went left and the left arm rotated left with the body as the UPPER left arm was fully "connected" through impact ;)

McClean believes he got his left wrist flat to slightly bowed just before impact. It would seem possible that Hogan would supinate to hit it lower.

[AltusBeliever]

My teacher has shown me video that seems to show Hogan supinating at the start of his downswing. I don't have a copy of this to post but I have seen it. It is a move switching him from cupped to bowed. I don't know what to make of it. Just reporting what I have seen.

[level4s]

What do you guys think about the reverse cupping Johnny Miller talks about in the second vid? The whole supination thing at impact doesnt seem like it would be a secret.

 

I think it's been a while since Johnny last read 5 Lessons. From pg. 114 "... 3) He must start to supinate his left wrist just before impact. That is, essentially, all he need concentrate on, PROVIDED..."

[ej002]

What do you guys think about the reverse cupping Johnny Miller talks about in the second vid? The whole supination thing at impact doesnt seem like it would be a secret.

 

Here is a quote from Dan that was done on the bottom picture.

The left wrist was not mearly as bowed as most think at impact.......in the image below of Mr Hogan at impact you can clearly see that the ulna and the radius bones are both CLREARLY visible at impact which shows that the left wrist could not have been "bowed" as he struck the ball........not in the frame or 2 after this the left wrist went into a SLIGHTLY "bowed" position as the butt of the club went left and the left arm rotated left with the body as the UPPER left arm was fully "connected" through impact ;)

 

McClean believes he got his left wrist flat to slightly bowed just before impact. It would seem possible that Hogan would supinate to hit it lower.

 

 

 

 

 

 

My teacher has shown me video that seems to show Hogan supinating at the start of his downswing. I don't have a copy of this to post but I have seen it. It is a move switching him from cupped to bowed. I don't know what to make of it. Just reporting what I have seen.

 

 

First of all supinated is the incorrect terminology. Your forarm suppinates (rolls over) it is called something like palmar flexion (or something). Hogan did not actively do this, it just happened, and if you look at that second picture it is not bowed at all. It is straight or even with the appearance of being slightly cupped. But he definately didnt shut it down on purpose. It is possible that he did it for a specialty shot (to explain the video), but that is NOT what he is doing in that second picture.

[HoganAfficianado]

If you look closely at both pictures there is a little more cup in the left wrist in the second pic. I'm thinking the last pic was before he changed his grip (pre-secret). Post-secret he had the face pre-set open with a weak grip at address and felt like he fanned it open on the backswing. This allowed him to come into the ball with a bowed left wrist and the ball would still not hook. I'm not saying he had a bowed left wrist at impact but that it ensured that the ball not hook. You could call it the super anti-hook swing.

[tembolo1284]

cool thread.

[groveler]

Johnny Miller is no dummy and he's quite right Hogan did an opposite move by cupping under.

[tembolo1284]

I gotta check this out again.

[williambenjamin11]

I think the more important thing is that left wrist must be level. Trumps out all the other things like bowing, flattening, palmar flexing, etc. Not that these doesn't happen, just saying keeping it level makes these almost automatic.

[TeeAce]

[quote name='HoganAfficianado' timestamp='1236117911' post='1529538']

McClean believes he got his left wrist flat to slightly bowed just before impact. It would seem possible that Hogan would supinate to hit it lower.


[/quote]

LOL.. here we go again with those terms

It was quite obvious what he wanted. In basics he wanted the face continue low after impact and loft remaining the same for long period. Same relative to the ground, not to the arc, which is big difference. And of course that was only the basic. If he wanted to hit it high, he didn't bow that so much or low, he bowed it more.

But please try not to use term supination with that move, because it's not it. The move was combination of ulnar deviation and palmar flexion, without forearm rotation. More we do PF, more we want to avoid supination because those two combined will take us miles to the left.

[williambenjamin11]

IMO, uncorking the left wrist/ulnar deviation and supination are TOTALLY INCOMPATIBLE.

Supination should not be done intentionally if you want ulnar deviation.

Ulnar deviation should not be done intentionally if you want supination.

To put it another way:

If you do UD, do everything you can to avoid supination.

If you do supination, do everything you can to avoid UD.

[MizunoJoe]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1320993906' post='3787195']
[quote name='HoganAfficianado' timestamp='1236117911' post='1529538']

McClean believes he got his left wrist flat to slightly bowed just before impact. It would seem possible that Hogan would supinate to hit it lower.


[/quote]

LOL.. here we go again with those terms

It was quite obvious what he wanted. In basics [b]he wanted the face continue low after impact and loft remaining the same for long period.[/b] Same relative to the ground, not to the arc, which is big difference. And of course that was only the basic. If he wanted to hit it high, he didn't bow that so much or low, he bowed it more.

But please try not to use term supination with that move, because it's not it. The move was combination of ulnar deviation and palmar flexion, without forearm rotation. More we do PF, more we want to avoid supination because those two combined will take us miles to the left.
[/quote]

Should the feeling be that of trying to [b]hood[/b] the clubface rather than closing it, while keeping the handle moving ahead of the clubhead?

[TeeAce]

[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321037169' post='3788741']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1320993906' post='3787195']
[quote name='HoganAfficianado' timestamp='1236117911' post='1529538']

McClean believes he got his left wrist flat to slightly bowed just before impact. It would seem possible that Hogan would supinate to hit it lower.


[/quote]

LOL.. here we go again with those terms

It was quite obvious what he wanted. In basics [b]he wanted the face continue low after impact and loft remaining the same for long period.[/b] Same relative to the ground, not to the arc, which is big difference. And of course that was only the basic. If he wanted to hit it high, he didn't bow that so much or low, he bowed it more.

But please try not to use term supination with that move, because it's not it. The move was combination of ulnar deviation and palmar flexion, without forearm rotation. More we do PF, more we want to avoid supination because those two combined will take us miles to the left.
[/quote]

Should the feeling be that of trying to [b]hood[/b] the clubface rather than closing it, while keeping the handle moving ahead of the clubhead?
[/quote]

Exactly that.

@ Hogan had full UD at impact. Please keep separated your theory and what Hogan did

[MizunoJoe]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1321039165' post='3788885']
[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321037169' post='3788741']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1320993906' post='3787195']
[quote name='HoganAfficianado' timestamp='1236117911' post='1529538']

McClean believes he got his left wrist flat to slightly bowed just before impact. It would seem possible that Hogan would supinate to hit it lower.


[/quote]

LOL.. here we go again with those terms

It was quite obvious what he wanted. In basics [b]he wanted the face continue low after impact and loft remaining the same for long period.[/b] Same relative to the ground, not to the arc, which is big difference. And of course that was only the basic. If he wanted to hit it high, he didn't bow that so much or low, he bowed it more.

But please try not to use term supination with that move, because it's not it. The move was combination of ulnar deviation and palmar flexion, without forearm rotation. More we do PF, more we want to avoid supination because those two combined will take us miles to the left.
[/quote]

Should the feeling be that of trying to [b]hood[/b] the clubface rather than closing it, while keeping the handle moving ahead of the clubhead?
[/quote]

Exactly that.

@ Hogan had full UD at impact. [b]Please keep separated your theory and what Hogan did[/b]
[/quote]

I don't follow what you mean here. Hogan didn't do this? Should I actually do it or not?

[TeeAce]

[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321041619' post='3789079']
[

I don't follow what you mean here. Hogan didn't do this? Should I actually do it or not?
[/quote]

It was typo and should go to Williambenjamin to his post about UD / supination

[keiko]

Even if you guys could figure out what Hogan did or didn't do, you could not copy him nor would you want to. So what's the deal with this hogan fixation.
Just build your swing with solid fundamentals that work for you and produce results for you and stop worrying about what Hogan did or didn't do.
You guys need to get a life.

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

[quote name='keiko' timestamp='1321045462' post='3789293']
Even if you guys could figure out what Hogan did or didn't do, you could not copy him nor would you want to. So what's the deal with this hogan fixation.
Just build your swing with solid fundamentals that work for you and produce results for you and stop worrying about what Hogan did or didn't do.
You guys need to get a life.
[/quote]

Hey Keiko!! Welcome to the party! Glad you stopped by for a moment. Before you leave, could you post a few videos of your swing for all to see?

[MizunoJoe]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1321044363' post='3789241']
[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321041619' post='3789079']
[

I don't follow what you mean here. Hogan didn't do this? Should I actually do it or not?
[/quote]

It was typo and should go to Williambenjamin to his post about UD / supination
[/quote]

How about my question about the hooded face?

[MizunoJoe]

[quote name='keiko' timestamp='1321045462' post='3789293']
Even if you guys could figure out what Hogan did or didn't do, you could not copy him nor would you want to. So what's the deal with this hogan fixation.
Just build your swing with solid fundamentals that work for you and produce results for you and stop worrying about what Hogan did or didn't do.
You guys need to get a life.
[/quote]

Are you looking for a life in the "Hogan's Heroes" forum?

[williambenjamin11]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1321044363' post='3789241']
[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321041619' post='3789079']
[

I don't follow what you mean here. Hogan didn't do this? Should I actually do it or not?
[/quote]

It was typo and should go to Williambenjamin to his post about UD / supination
[/quote]

I think my post is actually agreeing with your own theory if you will digest it more.

[TeeAce]

[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321049884' post='3789561']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1321044363' post='3789241']
[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321041619' post='3789079']
[

I don't follow what you mean here. Hogan didn't do this? Should I actually do it or not?
[/quote]

It was typo and should go to Williambenjamin to his post about UD / supination
[/quote]

How about my question about the hooded face?
[/quote]

It was there: Exactly that.

[MizunoJoe]

[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1321078126' post='3791041']
[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321049884' post='3789561']
[quote name='TeeAce' timestamp='1321044363' post='3789241']
[quote name='MizunoJoe' timestamp='1321041619' post='3789079']
[

I don't follow what you mean here. Hogan didn't do this? Should I actually do it or not?
[/quote]

It was typo and should go to Williambenjamin to his post about UD / supination
[/quote]

How about my question about the hooded face?
[/quote]

It was there: Exactly that.
[/quote]

Thanks T. Now, as I understand it, you want the triangle to stay open through impact, so is this hooding action done to nullify what would be added loft due to the open triangle?