Son set house on fire

[williamevanl]

Advice?

There seems to be a lot of intelligent people on this board so... My 5 year old son who I have partial custody of set his mothers house on fire. Originally he told us that he did it to get his little brother in trouble (Who is two) His stepfather got stuck inside the house and had to be dragged out by the childs mother and is in a coma.

Question: How/do I punish him at all? He doesn't seem to care much and was even smiling about it a bit when I picked him up from a strangers house (the mom went with the stepfather who was lifeflighted to a hospital in Iowa City).

Question 2: Although he told me the what actually happened but his mother doesnt know and actually believes his story that his little brother is responsible so should I tell her? I'm pretty sure only bad things will come from it.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

I can see this thread going in many wrong directions. I am terribly sorry to hear this and am not sure what advice to give as it is a touchy subject.
Based on your story and your description of his posible lack of remorse I can only suggest speaking with a professional about this as there are many red flags.

[williamevanl]

[quote name='One_Putt_Blunder' timestamp='1314674711' post='3529121']
I can see this thread going in many wrong directions. I am terribly sorry to hear this and am not sure what advice to give as it is a touchy subject.
Based on your story and your description of his posible lack of remorse I can only suggest speaking with a professional about this as there are many red flags.
[/quote]


I plan to, my company provides a service for temporary free councelling so I'm going to contact them tomorrow but I certainly understand the reference to red flags as far as remorse goes but I guess I'm not sure if a 5 year old is supposed to be remorseful.

It was actually pretty strange. We asked him "aren't you sad that your stepfather is hurt" and he explained that he tried to cry about it but it is something he hasn't learned how to do yet, *??* then he said "nothing makes me cry" and later inquired about his toys.

The first time there was an emergency and I had to come and get him it was because he drowned a kitten in the toilet when he was two and his mom demanded that I come and get him and now this... My wife thinks crazy things but I feel like we are just jumping to conclusions.

[slicktry]

Uh, yeah, professional help is a MUST.

Question. Does he like rpg video games, and what sort of movies does he watch? Toddler (ie Sesame Street, busytown mysteries etc) or is he into more advanced (harry potter, vampires etc)? Might be acting out on what he sees. Also the above incident with the kitten makes me wonder if something hasn't already set in.

My prayers will be with both your families.

God Bless
Jer

[mkotthoff]

Scary stuff...I don't have any advice, but I wish all of you the best.

[williamevanl]

[quote name='slicktry' timestamp='1314676205' post='3529161']
Uh, yeah, professional help is a MUST.

Question. Does he like rpg video games, and what sort of movies does he watch? Toddler (ie Sesame Street, busytown mysteries etc) or is he into more advanced (harry potter, vampires etc)? Might be acting out on what he sees. Also the above incident with the kitten makes me wonder if something hasn't already set in.

My prayers will be with both your families.

God Bless
Jer
[/quote]

I don't think he plays any video games at his mom's house and we don't own any game systems. He likes Cars, lightening McQueen, Thomas the Train etc... He just seems to have a real knack for doing and saying things that just leave you shaking your head. He's not violent in general and he's behaves really well the majority of the time but then every once in a blue moon will do something strange.

My biggest concern now is my 3 year old son (that lives with me) as I imagine he probably has the same feelings towards him that he has towards his brother at his moms house. Before trying to frame him for the fire he was leaving wicked bite marks on his little brothers (the two year old at his moms) legs and thighs which is also concerning. So obviously on of my biggest concerns at this point is my youngest sons safety.

eek, my other concern is that I thought I was over thinking this but the replies so far are making me think otherwise.

[dlamb83]

Maybe I can shed some light on this,as I have gone through something similar. I have a 4 year old daughter. Her mother and I have joint custody. I have a 1 year old,and the oldest started being mean to her. Like the biting you speak of. I did everything I could to get her to stop being mean to her little sister. I did time outs,no toys,nothing fun she likes to do,and I even had to resort to spank her. Nothing worked at all. Well, I decide to get a professionals opinion. The professional stated that is very common in older children with younger siblings,to act out against them. The professional even came to my house to watch how she interacted with her sister. The conclusion was, she was doing it,because she did not like,not being the center of attention. My oldest was basically showing us she did not like having a sibling.

I asked what we could do to help her not act that way. The professional stated we had to reintroduce her to her sister. She said it is almost like having a pet,and not introducing them properly to people. She said the main issue was the oldest was not there to see her sister born,and not around much when she was a newborn. I work,and my wife in no way could handle a newborn,and a 4 year old,and get the rest she needed. She stayed with her mother,and would come over,but never had much time to see her little sister. When she finally did spend time,and see her,we were showing the new baby all the attention,and she registered it as daddy,and step mommy doesn't like me any more. So now we are in stages where the oldest is being nice,but man was it a struggle.

Sorry to hear this has happened. Just know this is not an uncommon issue families go through. You oldest son is just telling you and his mother ,in his own way,he doesn't like the fact he has brothers that take Daddy,and mommy's attention. When he is with you,you show both sons attention,and like wise at his mom's house. No matter what house he is at,he is having to share each parent,and he doesn't like sharing daddy and mommy time.I do hope all works out for you.

[bmorejared]

Sorry, but your son is showing classic signs of sociopathic behavior. Get him some help before another person or animal is harmed or even killed. Arson and animal killing are a little more than just cries for attention. I don't mean to be so blunt about it, but you seem to have somewhat of a "maybe it's not a big deal" type attitude, and you have turned to a golf forum for advice. You also seem to be strongly considering not telling his mother what really happened. Are you okay with his mother thinking the other kid seriously injured his father? Your son has committed two acts that would get him jail time if he were older. That should be a huge red flag for any parent.

[hammy83]

not trying to make the incident look good... but your son is obviously smart to successfully light the house of fire and then frame his brother. I've heard stories were grown adults screw this up. That being said I was a rather troublesome child. To this day I have no clue why I acted out but everything seems to be fine now.

I would say counselling is a must but make sure you go to a recommended source and not just anyone. I would take as much time as possible and show him how much fun you can all have together as a family and include him and his brother as much as possible. I see why he doesnt feel anything for his stepfather. At 5 when you hurt someone, he is probably thinking a banged knee or something minor. I doubt a 5 yr old understands how close he came to death and what death actually is which probably can be carried over to the incident with the cat. When I went and go help when I was young I took it as an attack as my mother made me go and I hated it. I would say try to do everything possible to let your son know its ok and dont force him or make him think he is the problem or you will just harvest resentment.

Lastly... I would be asking your ex wife what was in is reach to actually set the fire with. I know you accidently leave stuff out but all it takes is once. Maybe she can think about that when you tell her it was your 5 yr old. I think professional help should be the first of your priorities.

[StevenF]

I hope everything goes well with this. Can't imagine how difficult this must be to deal with. Definitely going to give my 4 yr old daughter more attention. We just had a baby and she has been difficult to handle lately dye to lack of attention.

[bell812]

http://sandrarose.com/2008/03/are-you-raising-a-sociopath/

I seriously doubt you could be "over-thinking" this behavior. Good luck.

[jpat59]

Dude talk to a professional about this and not a golf forum, that's pretty serious

[bigmoneyp]

I don't have advice for you as far as how to discipline him. My only advice would be to tell the mother what actually happened although she may already know. I can't imagine actually thinking the 2 year old did it. Also don't blame anything your son does on the video games he plays or the movies he watches.

[againstkyle]

[quote name='bmorejared' timestamp='1314680629' post='3529292']
Sorry, but your son is showing classic signs of sociopathic behavior. Get him some help before another person or animal is harmed or even killed. Arson and animal killing are a little more than just cries for attention. I don't mean to be so blunt about it, but you seem to have somewhat of a "maybe it's not a big deal" type attitude, and you have turned to a golf forum for advice. You also seem to be strongly considering not telling his mother what really happened. Are you okay with his mother thinking the other kid seriously injured his father? Your son has committed two acts that would get him jail time if he were older. That should be a huge red flag for any parent.
[/quote]

+100,000,000. Honestly, you need to follow this advice immediately and this thread should just be closed.

[bubbagump]

1st degree arson is no joke. That would get an adult some hard time in jail. I find it scary that it was intentionally done by a 5 year old to get his brother in trouble. Its not the same as if he wrote on the wall in marker and blamed it on his brother the father almost died and is now in a coma. Professional help I would think is a must.

[B5G4B]

As someone with experience encountering these sort of issues, my advice to the OP would be to seek comprehensive professional help immediately. I would also probably advise the mods to lock this topic due to it's sensitive nature and the ages of some of those involved. OP, I sincerely send best wishes to you and your family during this difficult time.

[Obsessotron]

[quote name='bmorejared' timestamp='1314680629' post='3529292']
Sorry, but your son is showing classic signs of sociopathic behavior. Get him some help before another person or animal is harmed or even killed. Arson and animal killing are a little more than just cries for attention.
[/quote]

Yeah I agree with you, behaviors like this at such a young age can be a very bad sign of what the future holds for this kid behaviorally. The OP needs to urgently get this managed by professionals before it goes any further.

[Kento]

Mom definately needs to know the truth and professional counselors need to be involved. This could have turned out so much worse and you need to take any action now to prevent it from happening again. This is very serious and I wish you the best of luck.

[TheDarkOne]

I would ground him for at least a week and no television.