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David Duval a free agent again?


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[quote name='rybo' timestamp='1332341723' post='4549618']
Not surprised at all. I have known 5 people who have bought Scratch irons and all 5 no longer own the clubs. And these were very good players!

I got to hit 3 of the 5 sets and honestly didn't think they were anything special. They looked beautiful but nothing outstanding from a performance perspective. YMMV!
[/quote]

There a TON of people on this site that own Scratch and STILL play them (many are single digit to scratch golfers). I'd stack them (especially their tour custom equipment) up with any of the big OEM's.

This has more to do with Scratch's tour marketing than the quality or performance of their products.

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Unless your on golfwrx,you don't hear much about scratch golf.Just another cult brand if you ask me.People hear seem to get very excited but having stamping on their wedges which scratch do very nicely

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[quote name='andy-uk' timestamp='1332347783' post='4550230']
Unless your on golfwrx,you don't hear much about scratch golf.Just another cult brand if you ask me.People hear seem to get very excited but having stamping on their wedges which scratch do very nicely
[/quote]


+1

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At the tour pro level, I doubt that one iron performs much differently than another. They are all custom fitted and built, Scratch probably does that as well as anyone, but Duval and Moore are not exactly household names. Scratch is a boutique company that is going to struggle to compete with the big guys. I hope Duval dumped Scratch, rather than the other way round.

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As a newbie to Scratch... I'm am going to defend them to the end on this..... They make a solid club, have wonderful custom options.. Just hard to compete with MEGA companies R&D/PR $$$$ Accounts, and the $$$ to go spend it on ANY and everyone...

I love mine.

Callaway Paradym AI Smoke MAX 10.5*  GD Tour AD XC-6X
TM M2 16.5* VEYLIX ROME 888
PXG 0317X 20* Oban Devotion S
Mizuno Fli-Hi #4
Mizuno Pro 225 5-G Modus 120
Mizuno T24 RAW 52/58 Modus 120
 Limited Edition PING PLD Prime Tyne 4 


https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/530023/ladahls-witb-pxg-callaway-titleist-taylormade-trying-graphite-in-irons-updates-on-last-pag

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Last month i went for a fitting session with a bag full of titleist,left with a mixed bag of all sorts.the only clubs i keep was my driver and utitily.i loved titleist but their equipment is simply not for me.if you check out the witb threads alot of people with scratch gear seem very unwilling to use it.all the wedges ,irons custom this and that are spotless, never seen a course.my point is,if people used what worked NOT what they liked you would'nt see much scratch equipment here.just my 10p

TITLEIST 913D2 9* rip 60s
TITLEIST 906F2 15* Stock Titleist s
TAYLORMADE RESCUE 09 19* rip std
MIZUNO MP H4 4
MIZUNO MP54 5-PW s300
MIZUNO MP-T4 52* 56*
SCOTTY CAMERON NEWPORT
CALLAWAY SR2

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Still listed on their website

http://www.scratchgolf.com/tour/david-duval/

Callaway Tour Issued Rogue Triple Diamond Non LS 10.5 Ventus Velocore Blue 6 
Taylormade Stealth 2 Plus 15 Ventus Velocore Blue 7
Taylormade Stealth 2 Plus 18 Ventus Velocore Blue 7

Srixon ZX Utility 4 Iron Nippon Modus 120
Miura CB 301 QPQ 5-PW Nippon Modus 120 
Vokey SM9 Raw 50F 54D 58T Nippon Modus 120

2001 Scotty Cameron Circle T Timeless Tri-sole Newport 2   

Tour issued Odyssey 2 Ball Ten WH Insert 

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[quote name='rybo' timestamp='1332341723' post='4549618']
Not surprised at all. I have known 5 people who have bought Scratch irons and all 5 no longer own the clubs. And these were very good players!

I got to hit 3 of the 5 sets and honestly didn't think they were anything special. They looked beautiful but nothing outstanding from a performance perspective. YMMV!
[/quote]

I have hit their irons.. they are quality clubs. I also own a few of their wedges, purchased years back and still in my bag. If I were considering change they would be high on my list, and I am considered a good player. Measuring club performance is all about one's skill and attention to details, and whether or not there's a predisposition involved.

As a side note : all the good players I've played against and know do not change clubs easily, especially when clubs were built for them. As for Duval, IMO "if" he has exited, it had nothing to do with Scratches irons. My guess would be his poor performance. OEM companies can't afford to waste their resources on players that are not reaching goals, and Duval is NOT.

  • TSR2 9.25° Tensei 1k Pro Red 61S
  • TSR2 15° Tour AD-VF 74S
  • T200 17° 2i Tensei AV Raw White Hybrid 90S
  • T100 3i & 4i MMT 95S
  • T100 5i-9i MMT 105S
  • T100 PW MMT 105S 113-SW.
  • SM10 F52.12, T58.4, DG200 127S
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They make some great stuff, just like all the others out there. (titleist, nike, TM, Callaway, Ping and most others). It's all about how they marketed their equipment. Losing Ryan Moore was a big hit to them because he was talked about on tour because of the custom grinds and how he didn't have the club number on his irons. But you give them a good marketer then you will hear their name more and more.

[size=4][font=trebuchet ms,helvetica,sans-serif]Callaway x2 Hot 2 Deep Tour Green
Callaway x2 Hot 5 Deep Tour Green
Nike Vapor Flex 21* Kuro Kage
Cleveland 588 TT 6-PW (main set)
Cobra F7 Forged One Length 4-PW (testing out to see how they work for me)
Cleveland 588 RTX 50*,56*, Callaway Mack Daddy 2 Tour Grind 60*[/font][/size]
Odyssey O-Works #7[url="http://www.callawaygolf.com/products/golf-clubs/odyssey-putters/o-works/putters-2017-o-works-7-wbw-ss.html"] [/url]

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[quote name='rybo' timestamp='1332341723' post='4549618']<br />Not surprised at all.  I have known 5 people who have bought Scratch irons and all 5 no longer own the clubs.  And these were very good players!<br /><br />I got to hit 3 of the 5 sets and honestly didn't think they were anything special. They looked beautiful but nothing outstanding from a performance perspective.  YMMV!<br />[/quote]<br /><br /><br />

LOVE my SB-1's. Absolutely the best irons I've ever owned. Can't imagine playing the game without my Scratch irons... (Oh, I'm currently a 7.5 index.)

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Lets all be honest..Golf endorsements are about money, first and foremost, yes there's a few players that will play what they want and forget about endorsements, but the vast majority play what they're paid to play. Maybe DD was dropping scratch because he didn't like the deal he had with them and he had offers on the table from other manufacturers that were more lucrative to him. Maybe scratch dropped DD because he wasn't performing up to their expectations.

Him leaving scratch shouldn't be considered a slam to their equipment, it just business.

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[quote name='Skaffa77' timestamp='1332347661' post='4550212']
[quote name='rybo' timestamp='1332341723' post='4549618']
Not surprised at all. I have known 5 people who have bought Scratch irons and all 5 no longer own the clubs. And these were very good players!

I got to hit 3 of the 5 sets and honestly didn't think they were anything special. They looked beautiful but nothing outstanding from a performance perspective. YMMV!
[/quote]

There a TON of people on this site that own Scratch and STILL play them (many are single digit to scratch golfers). I'd stack them (especially their tour custom equipment) up with any of the big OEM's.

This has more to do with Scratch's tour marketing than the quality or performance of their products.
[/quote]

I'm sure there are Golfwrx members who have and love their scratch irons. Scratch makes a nice club! However the 5 people who I personally know who had them all sold them off. That caught my attention! I'm sure if you knew 5 people who all sold off any brand of iron you'd remember it too.

It definitely looks like there is something going on with the Tour Marketing side of things if Duval has truly left Scratch.

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I have two sets of scratch irons and like them very much. both get played a lot and i have not issues with hitting them. I will say that what scratch allows guys that don't have tour contracts to do is get your irons the way you want them. with the OEM's you can't tell them what you want, you are stuck with what they have to offer. I went from Mizz to Titleist irons several years ago and there was a sizable difference in bouce, topline, shape, etc. I came to a point where I wanted a club for me, not a version of the club my favorite golfer plays. I hope Duval finds something that fits him and I hope he comes back. If you think that when playing an OEM iron you are playing what the pros play, you mistaken. The OEM's make great clubs. SCRATCH makes great custom clubs.

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Unfortunately Scratch is having a tough time. What they have is a beautiful product wwith the best iron grinder in the business (Don White). But their market is very limited and crowded. Plus it is a diminishing business. There really is no new technology in the blade or the wedge business (other than the new ATV multi-grind). Fewer people play blades with more and more people looking for help or a new advantage, including many tour players.
I like the Scratch clubs and I personally like Don who is a great guy in addition to his special hands. If he was willing to spend more time on the road he could have made a great living on Tour grinding.
Every major OEM makes a form or two of a forged blade. Scratch can't pay endorsements to a top player, fringe guys are the best they can attract (Duval unfortunately is at that point now). Duval's play doesn't sell clubs for Scratch.
It is a tough spot in a tough business.

In the bag: Playing --- TaylorMade  Qi 10 (core) driver w/Fujikura Ventus Blue 6S. 3wd TM (OG) SIM (special smaller tour only head, same that TW was playing prior to the '24 Genesis approx 160cc) @ 15.*) with Fujikura Ventus 7-S.  5 wd TM SIM w/Fujikura Speeder 857TR-S (Japan made)

HyBrids-Cleveland Hi-Bore #1 (16* plays like 2-Iron) W/Fuji-S Tipped 1/2".  SIM Max #4 (set @ 21.5* w/ Fuji Atmos HB8 9S.  IRONS:  TM M3 4i (2*weak)w SteelFiber i95-S,  P790 3, 5-PW,  w/Fuji Pro 95i-S. SW TM MG4  54*/11 bent to 53*/10 w/ Precision Rifle 6.0-S. LW TaylorMade Hi Toe 3, 58/10 w/Modus Tour 105 Stiff. Putter-- BOBBY GRACE Night&Day-Custom, "M.Coz-Bandsaw Prototype". Ball 2022 TaylorMade Tour Response
 Alternating clubs: the 5wd, TM Hybrid Stealth 2+ #2, 3Iron, depending on what part of the country, course, climate, and conditions.

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[quote name='rybo' timestamp='1332357169' post='4551322']
[quote name='Skaffa77' timestamp='1332347661' post='4550212']
[quote name='rybo' timestamp='1332341723' post='4549618']
Not surprised at all. I have known 5 people who have bought Scratch irons and all 5 no longer own the clubs. And these were very good players!

I got to hit 3 of the 5 sets and honestly didn't think they were anything special. They looked beautiful but nothing outstanding from a performance perspective. YMMV!
[/quote]

There a TON of people on this site that own Scratch and STILL play them (many are single digit to scratch golfers). I'd stack them (especially their tour custom equipment) up with any of the big OEM's.

This has more to do with Scratch's tour marketing than the quality or performance of their products.
[/quote]

I'm sure there are Golfwrx members who have and love their scratch irons. Scratch makes a nice club! However the 5 people who I personally know who had them all sold them off. That caught my attention! I'm sure if you knew 5 people who all sold off any brand of iron you'd remember it too.

It definitely looks like there is something going on with the Tour Marketing side of things if Duval has truly left Scratch.
[/quote]

Well...sadly, the people I know probably wouldn't be the best examples since they buy and sell stuff all the time.

Had a couple buddies (good golfers) that just didn't along with Mizuno irons. If I took that example too myopically and saw that Mizuno's tour presence is a bit "limited"...I might think Mizuno was a crappy or inferior brand.

I get what you are saying...wonder when we might hear the whole story...

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I have hit several Scratch wedges and irons with different grinds and they perform fine. And they are beautiful clubs. But like several have mentioned in this thread, I wonder if Scratch might be struggling to gain a place amoung the tour ranks and with PR. I still play tournaments and dont see many clubs in bags. Mostly a wedge every once and a while. I do notice a lot of them make it in the bag and dont stay. But I also agree that a revolving door of staff players/owners doesnt look good. Especially to other potential future staffers they might try to attract.

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I thought Duval bought in to Scratch. Could be wrong. I tried the Sb1 route. Did not work for my game at all and quickly came out of my bag. I agree at that level they would be exact specs for his game.
I think he switched to try and jump start his game. He was really struggling with the driver so not sure why the iron switch.
Big fan hope he finds something.
Does anyone know what he now has for irons??

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[quote name='MCoz' timestamp='1332358230' post='4551436']
Unfortunately Scratch is having a tough time. What they have is a beautiful product wwith the best iron grinder in the business (Don White). But their market is very limited and crowded. Plus it is a diminishing business. There really is no new technology in the blade or the wedge business (other than the new ATV multi-grind). Fewer people play blades with more and more people looking for help or a new advantage, including many tour players.
I like the Scratch clubs and I personally like Don who is a great guy in addition to his special hands. If he was willing to spend more time on the road he could have made a great living on Tour grinding.
Every major OEM makes a form or two of a forged blade. Scratch can't pay endorsements to a top player, fringe guys are the best they can attract (Duval unfortunately is at that point now). Duval's play doesn't sell clubs for Scratch.
It is a tough spot in a tough business.
[/quote]


I don't believe they are having a tough time, they had some growing pains for sure last year, which is a sign that that are doing better than expected. I think they are where they want to be right now. As years go on I am sure they will grow bigger for sure. I really think its the amount of inventory they can supply at one time. Im sure if they advertised more and put there clubs in more stores they could be a giant in this industry in the coming years.

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[quote name='mizuno player' timestamp='1332377285' post='4553194']
I thought Duval bought in to Scratch. Could be wrong. I tried the Sb1 route. Did not work for my game at all and quickly came out of my bag. I agree at that level they would be exact specs for his game.
I think he switched to try and jump start his game. He was really struggling with the driver so not sure why the iron switch.
Big fan hope he finds something.
Does anyone know what he now has for irons??
[/quote]


I believe you are talking about Ryan Moore....and he even realized that 50% of "0" = 0

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[quote name='MCoz' timestamp='1332358230' post='4551436']
Unfortunately Scratch is having a tough time. What they have is a beautiful product wwith the best iron grinder in the business (Don White). But their market is very limited and crowded. Plus it is a diminishing business. There really is no new technology in the blade or the wedge business (other than the new ATV multi-grind). Fewer people play blades with more and more people looking for help or a new advantage, including many tour players.
I like the Scratch clubs and I personally like Don who is a great guy in addition to his special hands. If he was willing to spend more time on the road he could have made a great living on Tour grinding.
Every major OEM makes a form or two of a forged blade. Scratch can't pay endorsements to a top player, fringe guys are the best they can attract (Duval unfortunately is at that point now). Duval's play doesn't sell clubs for Scratch.
It is a tough spot in a tough business.
[/quote]


Is the ATV really new technology or just a slightly improved upon version of the older Cobra Trusty's. I am not saying they are not better or not, only far from a new idea.

Tsr2 9*

BRNR Mini 13.5*

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Ping Fetch

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Seems Duval only has a contract with Ashworth/Adidas for his clothing and shoes. He no longer is sporting Perky Jerky on his bag and he is playing Bridgestone irons. At the beginning of the 2012 season, he was sporting iliac apparel but was not paid to do so. Perhaps his Scratch deal ran out or maybe he is looking to improve his game which is lacking. In any event, he has lost weight and I hope he finds some form and consistency. It would be great to see him succeed in his 40's a la Stricker or Vijay. Somewhere in there is the former #1 player in the world. Hope to see flashes of it again soon.

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[quote name='Shaank0' timestamp='1332377588' post='4553230']
[quote name='MCoz' timestamp='1332358230' post='4551436']
Unfortunately Scratch is having a tough time. What they have is a beautiful product wwith the best iron grinder in the business (Don White). But their market is very limited and crowded. Plus it is a diminishing business. There really is no new technology in the blade or the wedge business (other than the new ATV multi-grind). Fewer people play blades with more and more people looking for help or a new advantage, including many tour players.
I like the Scratch clubs and I personally like Don who is a great guy in addition to his special hands. If he was willing to spend more time on the road he could have made a great living on Tour grinding.
Every major OEM makes a form or two of a forged blade. Scratch can't pay endorsements to a top player, fringe guys are the best they can attract (Duval unfortunately is at that point now). Duval's play doesn't sell clubs for Scratch.
It is a tough spot in a tough business.
[/quote]


I don't believe they are having a tough time, they had some growing pains for sure last year, which is a sign that that are doing better than expected. I think they are where they want to be right now. As years go on I am sure they will grow bigger for sure. I really think its the amount of inventory they can supply at one time. Im sure if they advertised more and put there clubs in more stores they could be a giant in this industry in the coming years.
[/quote]

There are issues you are not aware of. The key ownership has money outside of the company. They are going to need to put more into the company. They are doing little to create growth. It isn't easy getting "floor space" in the retail stores. These places are about volume per sq. ft. Add to that the big guys are good at "buying the space" in golf shops. It is getting increasingly more difficult to get into the stores. They need major exposure thru the tour and irons and wedges don't get a lot of visibility. There is a reason hats and bags cost a lot of money, they get views. Putters are the easist to get free visibility especially if there is something that is recognizeable on the TV screen. A company needs numerous players, if you don't have one of the biggest names. Either way, the costs are large. One big name endorser may cost more than a small company's total annual sales.
Scratch will never be "a giant" as you suggest (no forged iron and wedge only producer without a significant splash of new technology can be), lets hope that they are a surviver!

In the bag: Playing --- TaylorMade  Qi 10 (core) driver w/Fujikura Ventus Blue 6S. 3wd TM (OG) SIM (special smaller tour only head, same that TW was playing prior to the '24 Genesis approx 160cc) @ 15.*) with Fujikura Ventus 7-S.  5 wd TM SIM w/Fujikura Speeder 857TR-S (Japan made)

HyBrids-Cleveland Hi-Bore #1 (16* plays like 2-Iron) W/Fuji-S Tipped 1/2".  SIM Max #4 (set @ 21.5* w/ Fuji Atmos HB8 9S.  IRONS:  TM M3 4i (2*weak)w SteelFiber i95-S,  P790 3, 5-PW,  w/Fuji Pro 95i-S. SW TM MG4  54*/11 bent to 53*/10 w/ Precision Rifle 6.0-S. LW TaylorMade Hi Toe 3, 58/10 w/Modus Tour 105 Stiff. Putter-- BOBBY GRACE Night&Day-Custom, "M.Coz-Bandsaw Prototype". Ball 2022 TaylorMade Tour Response
 Alternating clubs: the 5wd, TM Hybrid Stealth 2+ #2, 3Iron, depending on what part of the country, course, climate, and conditions.

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[quote name='pingmatt' timestamp='1332355235' post='4551108']
Lets all be honest..Golf endorsements are about money, first and foremost, yes there's a few players that will play what they want and forget about endorsements, but the vast majority play what they're paid to play. Maybe DD was dropping scratch because he didn't like the deal he had with them and he had offers on the table from other manufacturers that were more lucrative to him. Maybe scratch dropped DD because he wasn't performing up to their expectations.

Him leaving scratch shouldn't be considered a slam to their equipment, it just business.
[/quote]

+1000

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Stealth 19˚Hy Ventus Blue 8-S
SIM DHY 4 Modus GOST 95
P770 5-PW MMT 105
MG Hi-Toe 3 50˚, 54˚, 58˚ MMT 125
Evnroll ER2v Mid Slant
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Bushnell Pro X3

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