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Phil's Phrankenwood: Up-close photos added from Wed. practice round Pg 6


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[quote name='Cwebb' timestamp='1365611200' post='6801485']
What would be really nice,is if this helps inspire a "happy medium", where some of the companies reconsider some smaller driver heads with maxed out technology, say...in the mid 300cc area to low 400's.

I think we're to the point now where if everything was put together just right with the design, look, and tech, that something like this could possibly get some good sales
[/quote]

+1

360ish CC 9* - 12* Adjustable Loft 44" probably sells to the majority of all skill levels?



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[quote name='Yohanan' timestamp='1365619715' post='6803241']
[quote name='Cwebb' timestamp='1365611200' post='6801485']
What would be really nice,is if this helps inspire a "happy medium", where some of the companies reconsider some smaller driver heads with maxed out technology, say...in the mid 300cc area to low 400's.

I think we're to the point now where if everything was put together just right with the design, look, and tech, that something like this could possibly get some good sales
[/quote]

+1

360ish CC 9* - 12* Adjustable Loft 44" probably sells to the majority of all skill levels?
[/quote]

It would be better for all skill levels I'm sure, but marketing leads to sales, and distance is where marketing is now. The vast majority of golfers will buy the "longest" iron in the game vs the "most accurate" iron in the game as pathetic as that is.

[quote name='bushwood' timestamp='1365622179' post='6803563']
Anyone know the technical side of why the 3 wood technology is getting less spin? Is it because the center of gravity is more towards the face and maybe higher?
[/quote]

I think moving the COG towards the face (as with their standing wave) does both reduce spin and makes the face "hotter" across more of it, which is why the majority of the face on these fairway woods would be considered "sweetspot".

Ping G400 Max UST Proforce V2
TM M5 15* UST Proforce V2
Callaway Apex UW 19* PX HZRDUS Smoke Black
Srixon ZX5 - 4&5 MMT 105

Srixon ZX7 - 6-PW MMT 105
Edel SMS 50V/54V/58T Nippon 125
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The pics are getting better. Can't wait to see one at the address position.

Callaway Ai Smoke Triple  8* / Fuji Ventus Black TR 6X               

TM Qi10 15* / Project X HZRDUS Black 8X        

Edel SMS iron 4-5 / DG TI X100 /////  SMS PRO irons 6-PW / DG TI X100

Edel SMS 50V, 54T, 60T / DG TI S400/ BGT ZNE 130

Edel ARRAY F3 w/ 3 line alignment




 

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[quote name='Dscvrr St Louis' timestamp='1365613043' post='6801861']
[quote name='Pack7483' timestamp='1365612509' post='6801751']
[quote name='bepo' timestamp='1365611990' post='6801643']
All this talk about confidence in 460 cc and how hard to hit a "small" driver would be is moronic. It's no harder than hitting a 3 wood which is stupid easy these days. The smaller driver head is all about looks, a smaller head gives the feeling of precision and speed.

A big diver head in my opinion is useless. It looks clunky, slow and I only use a small area of the face anyways. No reason you couldn't get the same results with a smaller head.
[/quote]

My thoughts exactly!!!!! Been arguing this for 3 weeks now with my buddies!
[/quote]

My buds keep saying I am almost as long with the 3 wood (42.5") as I am with my driver(45") and they could be right, and which club do we all tend to hit on tight par 4's where the fairway is a premium..? 3 wood ! I know I am more accurate with my 3 over the driver for sure...so why not try it and see if losing out on anything at all.
[/quote]
Probably means that your driver loft is too low.

913 D2 w/ Diamana B Series '80x
910 f.d 15* w/ Ahina '82x
910h 19* w/ VTS85X proto
712 CB w. x100, Vokey SM5 50* w/ x100
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[quote name='BigWyoming' timestamp='1365543828' post='6795701']
We go on and on about launch angles and spin rates, but for my money the most important metric for drivers (and wedges) is how it fits your eye and inspires confidence.

[/quote]

Maybe it's just me but the look of the club is the least important aspect of any club for me. I could care less about shape, color, graphics, etc. If I can hit it long and straight consistently, that's all that matters to me. If there's a driver that looks like pickled pig foot that I can hit 300 yards in the middle of the fairway every time, that's the driver I'm playing.

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[quote name='JR Van' timestamp='1365634726' post='6805439']
[quote name='Dscvrr St Louis' timestamp='1365613043' post='6801861']
[quote name='Pack7483' timestamp='1365612509' post='6801751']
[quote name='bepo' timestamp='1365611990' post='6801643']
All this talk about confidence in 460 cc and how hard to hit a "small" driver would be is moronic. It's no harder than hitting a 3 wood which is stupid easy these days. The smaller driver head is all about looks, a smaller head gives the feeling of precision and speed.

A big diver head in my opinion is useless. It looks clunky, slow and I only use a small area of the face anyways. No reason you couldn't get the same results with a smaller head.
[/quote]

My thoughts exactly!!!!! Been arguing this for 3 weeks now with my buddies!
[/quote]

My buds keep saying I am almost as long with the 3 wood (42.5") as I am with my driver(45") and they could be right, and which club do we all tend to hit on tight par 4's where the fairway is a premium..? 3 wood ! I know I am more accurate with my 3 over the driver for sure...so why not try it and see if losing out on anything at all.
[/quote]
Probably means that your driver loft is too low.
[/quote]

Could be, but have been working to get hips in the right position in the long clubs a little better, driver has the hips way to static, when I release them, getting a nice 13.5-15* launch from 9.5* with 24-2600 rpm. Just get the hips thru the irons and the 3 woods much better right now. Thanks for the advice..work in process still...30 years later!! LOL!!

Callaway Mavrik SZ 9.0 VA Composites Nemesys 65 04
Callaway Mavrik SZ 15 VA Composites Nemesys 75 04
Callaway Mavrik Pro Hybrid 18* Veylix Rome 888 S
Callaway 2019 Apex Pro DOT 4-PW Mits MMT 125 TX/ Vega Mizar Tour Oban CT 115 X
Odyssey WHP #3-Stability Tour, Scotty Cameron Special Select Newport 2.5, Toulon Long Island Garage-Stability Shaft
Callaway MD5 Jaws Tour Grey 50/54/58 and  Cobra Tour Versatile 50/54/58 Mitsubishi MMT 125TX Graphite
Lamkin Sonar Plus Wrap


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This is just plain silly.

Let me get this straight. Drivers have more than doubled in size in the past 15 years. The limit is now 460cc, and basically every player on the planet, tour pros included, is playing a driver above 400cc.

And now, Phil Mickelson decides that he wants to put a tiny club with driver loft and a driver length shaft on it, and everyone is drooling over it?!

Come on. Gimme a break! How is having a tiny head on a driver with the same loft and length a good thing? And importantly, how is it a good thing for a non-tour pro?

Hey, I love Phil. I root for him. I'll be shocked. SHOCKED. If this club stays in the bag for a prolonged period of time. There's a reason why large drivers are used by just about everyone.

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from what i gathered, he's able to hit the thing like a 3w, or more down at the ball, but with the 3w technology and apparently the weight distribution in the head, it's coming off with less spin. i dont know if that can be recreated in a 400+ cc head or not. I'd try out a smaller headed driver if i could get lower spin with a slightly downward angle of attack.

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[quote name='NoCalHack' timestamp='1365655056' post='6807915']
This is just plain silly.

Let me get this straight. Drivers have more than doubled in size in the past 15 years. The limit is now 460cc, and basically every player on the planet, tour pros included, is playing a driver above 400cc.

And now, Phil Mickelson decides that he wants to put a tiny club with driver loft and a driver length shaft on it, and everyone is drooling over it?!

Come on. Gimme a break! How is having a tiny head on a driver with the same loft and length a good thing? And importantly, how is it a good thing for a non-tour pro?

Hey, I love Phil. I root for him. I'll be shocked. SHOCKED. If this club stays in the bag for a prolonged period of time. There's a reason why large drivers are used by just about everyone.
[/quote]

I agree with this. If any player can make it work, its Phil, but I really don't see the point.

When I heard about it I thought it was going to be in the 300-350 cc range but 250 is pretty small to be playing at 45

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[quote name='hayzooos' timestamp='1365622553' post='6803617']
[quote name='Yohanan' timestamp='1365619715' post='6803241']
[quote name='Cwebb' timestamp='1365611200' post='6801485']
What would be really nice,is if this helps inspire a "happy medium", where some of the companies reconsider some smaller driver heads with maxed out technology, say...in the mid 300cc area to low 400's.

I think we're to the point now where if everything was put together just right with the design, look, and tech, that something like this could possibly get some good sales
[/quote]

+1

360ish CC 9* - 12* Adjustable Loft 44" probably sells to the majority of all skill levels?
[/quote]

It would be better for all skill levels I'm sure, but marketing leads to sales, and distance is where marketing is now. The vast majority of golfers will buy the "longest" iron in the game vs the "most accurate" iron in the game as pathetic as that is.

[quote name='bushwood' timestamp='1365622179' post='6803563']
Anyone know the technical side of why the 3 wood technology is getting less spin? Is it because the center of gravity is more towards the face and maybe higher?
[/quote]

I think moving the COG towards the face (as with their standing wave) does both reduce spin and makes the face "hotter" across more of it, which is why the majority of the face on these fairway woods would be considered "sweetspot".
[/quote]

We haven't seen the face of this yet . . . In any of these pics.

If a smaller size head and all this tech means more distance/roll and control and we will see more not less of these types of clubs from more OEMs.

I can just see the engineers from all the other companies working on this right now.

Can't wait for tomorrow to see it in action.

And this club or one like it in my bag.

Just will have to settle for a plain old 3 Deep? HeHe . . .

#isitapril19yet

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[quote name='ohcanada17' timestamp='1365622769' post='6803651']
Guess TM is right that 80% of golfers are playing the wrong loft! hahaa... Even Phyllis made the switch to more loft.
[/quote]

His current driver setup is roughly 8* if I remember correctly (although he's messed around with 6* before), and this smaller "Phrankenwood" driver is about 8.5*, so the loft isn't really that much higher in this case. If anything, with his other X-Hot 3Deep 3 wood being long and versatile for him, he can possibly make his future driver setups lower lofted and longer shafted for the purpose of being a pure distance club.

**testing several drivers right now** 😉
Adams XTD Ti Fairway Woods, 15* and 18* with **testing** X-Stiff Shafts
Adams XTD Ti Hybrid, 20* (set to 21*) with **testing** X-Stiff Hybrid Shaft
Adams CMB Irons, 4-PW with KBS Tour FLT Black 120 Stiff Shafts
TaylorMade Milled Grind Wedges, 52-12* (bent to 54*) and 58-12* (bent to 60*) with KBS Tour 125 Black Wedge Shafts

Odyssey O-Works Black #7 Tank, 36" with SuperStroke Mid Slim 2.0 CounterCore Grip

backup: STX Sync Series 8 Putter (Red Face Insert), 35" with SuperStroke Mid Slim 2.0 CounterCore Grip

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[quote name='jaker5' timestamp='1365677850' post='6808497']
Like the looks, just not sure how well it would fit into my setup
[/quote]

I feel your pain. Being left handed only and totally unavailable to purchase would cause you no end of bag set-up headaches. :russian_roulette:

PXG 0811X Gen2 9deg Driver - AD-GP 7TX
PXG 0341X Gen2 15deg Fairway - AD-GP 8TX
PXG 0311X Gen2 1 DI - KBS Prototype Graphite 95X
PXG 0311X Gen2 3 DI - KBS Prototype Graphite 95X
PXG 0311T Gen2 4-PW - Dynamic Gold X7
PXG 0311T Sugar Daddy 51 - Dynamic Gold X7
PXG 0311T Sugar Daddy 56 - Dynamic Gold X7
PXG 0311T Zulu 61 - Dynamic Gold X7
PXG Brandon H - 34.5”
PXG Operator H - 34.5”
Toulon Indianapolis - 34.5”
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How does this differ significantly from an old <insert any quality 10 to 15 year old Ti driver head here> of the same length? Head weight distribution? Something else?

What's the difference in performance?

The whole thing strikes me as being retro...

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Callaway GBB Epic Sub-Zero 3-wood 15* 

Callaway GBB Epic Sub-Zero 5-wood 18*
TaylorMade Steath Hybrid 22*
Ben Hogan Apex Edge 5-E Stiff
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Callaway JAWS Raw Full Face Wedge 54/12

Cleveland RTX-3 V-FG Zipcore Wedge 58/12
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[quote name='defaultoprime' timestamp='1365691940' post='6809873']
How does this differ significantly from an old <insert any quality 10 to 15 year old Ti driver head here> of the same length?
[/quote]

It's steel, much more forgiving even at a smaller size, and probably spins less too. It's really just taking today's technology and putting into a head size from 10-15 years ago.

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TM M5 15* UST Proforce V2
Callaway Apex UW 19* PX HZRDUS Smoke Black
Srixon ZX5 - 4&5 MMT 105

Srixon ZX7 - 6-PW MMT 105
Edel SMS 50V/54V/58T Nippon 125
Odyssey MXM #1W

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Upon reading abuot Phil's new "Phrankanwood", it dawned on me how similar the specs are to my beloved 8.5* TaylorMade R500 Tour Driver. The R500 Tour has a very smallish (325cc) head and a deep face. Despite the deep face, With a good lie in the fairway, you can hit this driver off the deck. Like Phil I use a 45" shaft in the club, but in my case, its a 757 Speeder Tourspec Shaft, tipped 1/2".

Having played this "small head" driver for years now, (nothing has ever able to knock it out of the bag), I can certainly understand why Phil thinks he has come up with something "special". However, to me, it seems Phil is actually just going "retro", i.e. back to the time when drivers were smaller but much more accurate and far more workable than today's huge, toaster-on-a-stick, 460cc heads which are more difficult to square at impact, less accurate, and virtually "unworkable" due to their size.

I believe that many players could improve their accuracy by using a smaller head driver design, like Phil's "Phrankenwood" or my R500 Tour, and they would do so with no loss of distance, in fact, a distance increase is more likely. I do believe the R500 Tour is one of the finest driver heads ever produced. This unique head hits wind-penetrating bullets with a muted sound and a super-solid feel that has not been duplciated by any other driver introduced before or since. Those unique flight characteristics also apply to the 9.5* and 10.5* lofts, which I also own and use. In fact I own quite a few R500 Tour drivers now because I began collecting them early on back in 2003...some are still brand new, never hit. As I acquired them all got the same 757 Tourspec shaft spec mentioned above.

Too bad Phil can never play this older TaylorMade Tour head, because chances are he would actually like it BETTER than his new Callaway "Phrankenwood", but at least he has the right idea about increaasing accuracy off the tee. I am sure the new club will help him!

[b]What's in Bobcat's Bag? (Showing more than 14 clubs due to options)[/b]

Driver: TM 2015 9.5* SLDR-C - 45.5" Miyazaki Kusala Black 61s (tipped 1/2")
Fairway: TM Tour-iussue V-Steel 15* 3W - 43.25" Fujikura 757 Speeder Stiff
Hybrid Fairway: TM Rescue Fairway 15* '3-Strong'- 42.75" Fujikura VP-90 Stiff
Hybrids: TM Rescue-Mid TP's 19*(3H) & 22*(4H) - Fujikura Vista Pro 90 Stiff
Driving Irons: TM TP UDI's 16* (#1) & 20* (#3) - KBS C-Taper Lite 110 Stiff Shafts
Irons: TM 2015 SLDR Irons (5-8i only) - KBS C-Taper Lite 110 Stiff Flex Steel
Hybrid Wedges: Cleveland 2011 Niblicks - 42*PW /49*DW / 56*SW - Stock Steel
Wedge: 2011 Cleveland CG-16 Black Pearl 58*/8* (SW/LW) - Stock Steel Shaft
Putter: Bettinardi BBX-81 Blade - 35" Bettinardi Stock Steel Putter Shaft
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[quote name='psumarkopolo' timestamp='1365712107' post='6813073']
too bad phil sucks and can't drive this ball at all...
[/quote]

Probably a bit strong, but is driving his problem so far today? Last I saw he was +2 or something like that and I didn't know what the issue was.

Ping G400 Max UST Proforce V2
TM M5 15* UST Proforce V2
Callaway Apex UW 19* PX HZRDUS Smoke Black
Srixon ZX5 - 4&5 MMT 105

Srixon ZX7 - 6-PW MMT 105
Edel SMS 50V/54V/58T Nippon 125
Odyssey MXM #1W

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[quote name='dbornack' timestamp='1365609860' post='6801185']
Obviously since this club is on the conforming list, it's been tested for C.O.R., right? This makes me think though.. what clubs AREN'T tested for that? 3woods? At what point can I call a driver a 3 wood, have it NOT tested, and be hitting a club that's hotter than allowed for a Driver?

** Just read the few posts above.. I guess all woods are tested for COR.. hmmm..
[/quote]

All clubs can be tested for CT, or how long the test pendulum stays on the face, which is a more convenient, accurate measurement than COR. But it mostly applies to metalwoods and not so much irons or wedges. The CT limit is 239 µs (microseconds) with a tolerance of 18 µs, effectively making the limit 257 µs. With COR, the limit was about 0.822 with a tolerance of 0.008, making the effective COR limit 0.83 for clubs. There's no loft threshold, or even "number of club" threshold for CT testing (the number at the bottom of the club is just an arbitrary form of identification that has become the modern convention), so whether it's a 17* driver or a 10* "3-wood" (it's only a tiny driver, everybody) or even a 12* iron or hybrid, it can be tested for spring effect. There's only a loft threshold for groove testing, which means that clubs with 25* of loft or greater are tested for conforming grooves. Hope this helps people's misconceptions on whether 3-woods can have higher CT than allowed for drivers.

**testing several drivers right now** 😉
Adams XTD Ti Fairway Woods, 15* and 18* with **testing** X-Stiff Shafts
Adams XTD Ti Hybrid, 20* (set to 21*) with **testing** X-Stiff Hybrid Shaft
Adams CMB Irons, 4-PW with KBS Tour FLT Black 120 Stiff Shafts
TaylorMade Milled Grind Wedges, 52-12* (bent to 54*) and 58-12* (bent to 60*) with KBS Tour 125 Black Wedge Shafts

Odyssey O-Works Black #7 Tank, 36" with SuperStroke Mid Slim 2.0 CounterCore Grip

backup: STX Sync Series 8 Putter (Red Face Insert), 35" with SuperStroke Mid Slim 2.0 CounterCore Grip

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