Accum #3, the roll, the clubHEAD travel, the #3 angle, the bent R wrist, the low plane, low hands, h

[jblacoustics]

Any of you guys have studied these lunacies?

[tembolo1284]

Only a handful of guys around here I think really understand these things.

One of them is iTeach.

[tembolo1284]

I'd love an explanation of how Hogan can get back to square when at P6 his face is still pretty damn open.

[Pinsplitter59]

Dear jblacoustics,
I think we all hear what you say.
I have a very old pair of JBL speakers in 1970's brown which are much better than all this modern stuff.
But there is an inate human compulsion to tame and control things outside.
A golf swing is a wild animal and our response is to attempt to tame and control it, because we want it to fetch water for us in the morning and mow the lawn.
Sitting in my cave trying to start a fire with flinty rocks I observe closely the behaviour of the target animal in order to gain the knowledge neccessary to catch it.
Names and descriptions become important. Interactions become important.
And the final problem of when the animal has been caught can it be tamed and contolled?
Its a lot like the young lady admitted to Dr. House's hospital last night, she had all sorts of strange symptoms and the good doctors ran every test and spent hours looking at multiple scans with no solution to the problems. Only by intuitively interpreting a digitally made image form her brain waves did Dr. House realize the problem was from an Egyptian parasite introduced nto her blood from the sperm of her boyfriend's father.
Now who would have thought of that? Your local teaching pro? I don't think so.

I lay the blame for this analysis and naming obsession directly on Dr. Julius Sumner Miller, who's 1960's television show called "Why Is It So?" was very popular and started the whole public obsession with wanting to know the whys and hows.
Then it gets so confusing because you can't undestand what people are talking about, like an atom has protons and neutrons, how can you fit a car into an atom?
Accumulator #3 is Warren Buffet, a low plane is a stealth bomber and ask Tembolo what a c*cked right hand is.
Back to basics please, elbow , hand, leg, knee etc. because they are unambiguous.
And do not be under the illusion that you are under an illusion.

[SPIF]

[quote name='Pinsplitter59' timestamp='1367538489' post='6960809']
Dear jblacoustics,
I think we all hear what you say.
I have a very old pair of JBL speakers in 1970's brown which are much better than all this modern stuff.
But there is an inate human compulsion to tame and control things outside.
A golf swing is a wild animal and our response is to attempt to tame and control it, because we want it to fetch water for us in the morning and mow the lawn.
Sitting in my cave trying to start a fire with flinty rocks I observe closely the behaviour of the target animal in order to gain the knowledge neccessary to catch it.
Names and descriptions become important. Interactions become important.
And the final problem of when the animal has been caught can it be tamed and contolled?
Its a lot like the young lady admitted to Dr. House's hospital last night, she had all sorts of strange symptoms and the good doctors ran every test and spent hours looking at multiple scans with no solution to the problems. Only by intuitively interpreting a digitally made image form her brain waves did Dr. House realize the problem was from an Egyptian parasite introduced nto her blood from the sperm of her boyfriend's father.
Now who would have thought of that? Your local teaching pro? I don't think so.

I lay the blame for this analysis and naming obsession directly on Dr. Julius Sumner Miller, who's 1960's television show called "Why Is It So?" was very popular and started the whole public obsession with wanting to know the whys and hows.
Then it gets so confusing because you can't undestand what people are talking about, like an atom has protons and neutrons, how can you fit a car into an atom?
Accumulator #3 is Warren Buffet, a low plane is a stealth bomber and ask Tembolo what a c*cked right hand is.
Back to basics please, elbow , hand, leg, knee etc. because they are unambiguous.
And do not be under the illusion that you are under an illusion.
[/quote]

Off the meds?

[ej002]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1367516279' post='6958655']
I'd love an explanation of how Hogan can get back to square when at P6 his face is still pretty damn open.
[/quote]
You been down to Texarkana and you don't understand this?

[tembolo1284]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1367608812' post='6965430']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1367516279' post='6958655']
I'd love an explanation of how Hogan can get back to square when at P6 his face is still pretty damn open.
[/quote]
You been down to Texarkana and you don't understand this?
[/quote]

Geoff didn't talk about it using TGM terminology!

[ALIF]

[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1367516279' post='6958655']
I'd love an explanation of how Hogan can get back to square when at P6 his face is still pretty damn open.
[/quote]

ER of the left arm:)

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='chiva' timestamp='1367638891' post='6968102']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1367516279' post='6958655']
I'd love an explanation of how Hogan can get back to square when at P6 his face is still pretty damn open.
[/quote]

ER of the left arm:)
[/quote]

oh so the forearms do rotate?

[ALIF]

[quote name='PingG10guy' timestamp='1367639846' post='6968154']
[quote name='chiva' timestamp='1367638891' post='6968102']
[quote name='tembolo1284' timestamp='1367516279' post='6958655']
I'd love an explanation of how Hogan can get back to square when at P6 his face is still pretty damn open.
[/quote]

ER of the left arm:)
[/quote]

oh so the forearms do rotate?
[/quote]

Don't tell Kellygreen or Russ as they will be mad that I continue to believe such hearsay. Lol.

[PingG10guy]

the ironic thing is that if youre a real 6 HC then you have to have some forearm rotation

[ALIF]

[quote name='PingG10guy' timestamp='1367640730' post='6968212']
the ironic thing is that if youre a real 6 HC then you have to have some forearm rotation
[/quote]

Awesome post!

[tembolo1284]

You guys are again confusing real vs imaginary numbers. We've talked about this already.

[jblacoustics]

I think this is an entirely possible swing...

I don't believe in the automatic forearm rotation type of release. I believe in consciously making the L forearm to rotate. And I'm not saying do it with L arm.

Set the max uncock limit at setup, so you don't worry about clubhead digging the ground later thru impact.

With this, you can have the L arm thru impact as vertical and near your body/pelvis/thighs as possible and take advantage of angular momentum aka ice skater principle.

Then all you have to worry about is how to roll the L forearm/wrist/hand and spit/throw out the clubhead into the ball WITHOUT losing the angle between the L arm and shaft.

Pitch elbow will be useful, bent R elbow, bent R wrist, and most important is external rot of R shoulder from L arm parallel in BS up until end of transition and start of release.

I think hip rotation/pull/initiating DS is essential not only for sequencing but also for speed. Helps shoulder rotation a lot.

I think it's possible to do this together with R arm thrust or 3 R hands with L side of index finger going forward.

Whew...no high falluting terms there...made my fingers cry after all those typing...

[ej002]

Tembolo - Hogan opened it up and it squared itself. Yeah the forearm rotates as a result of the club releasing itself. Got to be in synch and pitchy elbow attacking from good angles. It just shuts. He even said himself that he didn't cup when he wanted to hit a draw

[jblacoustics]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1368592044' post='7038172']
Tembolo - Hogan opened it up and it squared itself. Yeah the forearm rotates as a result of the club releasing itself. Got to be in synch and pitchy elbow attacking from good angles. It just shuts. He even said himself that he didn't cup when he wanted to hit a draw
[/quote]

IMO, what you said is correct, but only if you turn your shoulders in a more horizontal/level manner, which is the one closing/rotating the face here because you're shoulders is like a merry-go-round.

I think Hogan turns his shoulders as less horizontal as possible, evidence being his neck tilt and eyes thru impact...so with Hogan, IMO he HAS to rotate it from open to shut/square intentionally. He said so very clearly in the '55 Life article.

So if a golfer turns his shoulders more level, the L forearm/wrist/arm rotating consciously would cause the face to have fast face closure rate IMO...

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='jblacoustics' timestamp='1369957943' post='7139044']
[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1368592044' post='7038172']
Tembolo - Hogan opened it up and it squared itself. Yeah the forearm rotates as a result of the club releasing itself. Got to be in synch and pitchy elbow attacking from good angles. It just shuts. He even said himself that he didn't cup when he wanted to hit a draw
[/quote]

IMO, what you said is correct, but only if you turn your shoulders in a more horizontal/level manner, which is the one closing/rotating the face here because you're shoulders is like a merry-go-round.

I think Hogan turns his shoulders as less horizontal as possible, evidence being his neck tilt and eyes thru impact...so with Hogan, IMO he HAS to rotate it from open to shut/square intentionally. He said so very clearly in the '55 Life article.

So if a golfer turns his shoulders more level, the L forearm/wrist/arm rotating consciously would cause the face to have fast face closure rate IMO...
[/quote]
Hogan's shoulders worked relatively flat in the backswing compared to some of the guys who use a pure rotated shoulder turn all the time (90 to the spine as Monte would say). Thats why Hogan's swing is strange to me. Shoulders work flat to steep, steep handpath but he shallows out and gets to elbow plane. He has the left shoulder lower longer than most and thats another piece people miss when they try and see it from the perspective of a "body release"; let the left shoulder go and you're throwing it away whether you like it or not. Not every swing of Hogan is the same as he could hit different shot shapes and has displayed different release patterns, but I think a lot of people chasing Hogan's swing forget the fact that there are some compensations

[jblacoustics]

Back then I'd agree, but at present I don't think Hogan turned his shoulders level. That is simply impossible given his neck tilt and how he's able to maintain it during the whole swing.

Just try swinging the shoulders level with his neck tilt, and his eyes looking more directly into the ball (eyes not looking down much). And take into account he's not tall and has long arms (these necessitates a more level shoulder turn). So his intent is really more vertical than most.

[jblacoustics]

I think his shoulders just looked level in BS bec his R shoulder didn't get up much, and was "cocked" (for lack of better term I can think of) very early and connected to his R side. So it looks like level. Take into account also that his L arm really gets across his R shoulder more than most. So the R shoulder gets blocked on a DTL view most of the frames at P4.

[ej002]

[quote name='jblacoustics' timestamp='1369957943' post='7139044']
[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1368592044' post='7038172']
Tembolo - Hogan opened it up and it squared itself. Yeah the forearm rotates as a result of the club releasing itself. Got to be in synch and pitchy elbow attacking from good angles. It just shuts. He even said himself that he didn't cup when he wanted to hit a draw
[/quote]

IMO, what you said is correct, but only if you turn your shoulders in a more horizontal/level manner, which is the one closing/rotating the face here because you're shoulders is like a merry-go-round.

I think Hogan turns his shoulders as less horizontal as possible, evidence being his neck tilt and eyes thru impact...so with Hogan, IMO he HAS to rotate it from open to shut/square intentionally. He said so very clearly in the '55 Life article.

So if a golfer turns his shoulders more level, the L forearm/wrist/arm rotating consciously would cause the face to have fast face closure rate IMO...
[/quote]

Damnit... SVS is that you?

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1370290245' post='7162056']
[quote name='jblacoustics' timestamp='1369957943' post='7139044']
[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1368592044' post='7038172']
Tembolo - Hogan opened it up and it squared itself. Yeah the forearm rotates as a result of the club releasing itself. Got to be in synch and pitchy elbow attacking from good angles. It just shuts. He even said himself that he didn't cup when he wanted to hit a draw
[/quote]

IMO, what you said is correct, but only if you turn your shoulders in a more horizontal/level manner, which is the one closing/rotating the face here because you're shoulders is like a merry-go-round.

I think Hogan turns his shoulders as less horizontal as possible, evidence being his neck tilt and eyes thru impact...so with Hogan, IMO he HAS to rotate it from open to shut/square intentionally. He said so very clearly in the '55 Life article.

So if a golfer turns his shoulders more level, the L forearm/wrist/arm rotating consciously would cause the face to have fast face closure rate IMO...
[/quote]

Damnit... SVS is that you?
[/quote]

Actually...i concur

[jblacoustics]

I wonder what you guys think now of using the R arm (aka 3 R hands wish) in the golf swing?

I cite Schlee again re his experiment (or was it Hogan's?) on swing speed machine...he swung with L arm only, then R arm only, then both arms. Swing speeds were 30%-70%-100% respectively.

Not saying using R arm will cause 70% increase in swing speed, but it will add a lot...

So if we use R arm as well, how do you close the face? Just shoulder turn ain't gonna do it IMO.

[PingG10guy]

[quote name='jblacoustics' timestamp='1370312782' post='7164568']
I wonder what you guys think now of using the R arm (aka 3 R hands wish) in the golf swing?

I cite Schlee again re his experiment (or was it Hogan's?) on swing speed machine...he swung with L arm only, then R arm only, then both arms. Swing speeds were 30%-70%-100% respectively.

Not saying using R arm will cause 70% increase in swing speed, but it will add a lot...

So if we use R arm as well, how do you close the face? Just shoulder turn ain't gonna do it IMO.
[/quote]

Iteachgolf changed your life in the other thread. You're joking with that question...or u are a true champion of your own ideas

[tylerdurden]

[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1370290245' post='7162056']
[quote name='jblacoustics' timestamp='1369957943' post='7139044']
[quote name='ej002' timestamp='1368592044' post='7038172']
Tembolo - Hogan opened it up and it squared itself. Yeah the forearm rotates as a result of the club releasing itself. Got to be in synch and pitchy elbow attacking from good angles. It just shuts. He even said himself that he didn't cup when he wanted to hit a draw
[/quote]

IMO, what you said is correct, but only if you turn your shoulders in a more horizontal/level manner, which is the one closing/rotating the face here because you're shoulders is like a merry-go-round.

I think Hogan turns his shoulders as less horizontal as possible, evidence being his neck tilt and eyes thru impact...so with Hogan, IMO he HAS to rotate it from open to shut/square intentionally. He said so very clearly in the '55 Life article.

So if a golfer turns his shoulders more level, the L forearm/wrist/arm rotating consciously would cause the face to have fast face closure rate IMO...
[/quote]

Damnit... SVS is that you?
[/quote]

HA! I actually miss him

[jblacoustics]

[quote name='PingG10guy' timestamp='1370326827' post='7165612']
[quote name='jblacoustics' timestamp='1370312782' post='7164568']
I wonder what you guys think now of using the R arm (aka 3 R hands wish) in the golf swing?

I cite Schlee again re his experiment (or was it Hogan's?) on swing speed machine...he swung with L arm only, then R arm only, then both arms. Swing speeds were 30%-70%-100% respectively.

Not saying using R arm will cause 70% increase in swing speed, but it will add a lot...

So if we use R arm as well, how do you close the face? Just shoulder turn ain't gonna do it IMO.
[/quote]

Iteachgolf changed your life in the other thread. You're joking with that question...or u are a true champion of your own ideas
[/quote]

Assuming that's the case, what's wrong with championing it? But golf has been there in several hundred years, you think there's something to champion? And Hogan did say he uses it. Snead too. Nelson too.

iTeach changed my life?...you think?...chit, someone's right about you guys...

It seems nobody really knows about #3 angle, specifically how to set it up, not tweak it during the swing...hope I can do that in 1.5 seconds with a maxed out full swing.

And no I wasn't kidding with the question.

[jblacoustics]

So pingg10, you think Schlee, Hogan, Snead, Nelson and Larry Mowry's life will be changed by iteach? Don't be a blind bat sir....have your own mind...them teachers are just guides...ask the winners will ya?

[hoganfan924]

Welcome back HG101/SVS!

[jblacoustics]

Wish there's something else out there we can discuss and fight about...

[tylerdurden]

Besides the steep shoulders which we've all heard you beat to death, what is it exactly that you are asking/talking about? And welcome back, hopefully you can help bring this forum back to life.

[tembolo1284]

So what's going on?

Tyler you won a major!?!?!?!