Rounds with a Vintage Bag

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

5 hours ago, Foozle said:

I agree with you on the TD's being the dawn of the modern era. I have a set in my collection which I broadly classify as steel shaft to game improvement. The TD's bookend my collection as, to me, they represent the first toe in the water towards game improvement but, on balance, are more classic blade than game improvement.

Coincidentally, I have just been sorting out my bag for what I hope will be my first hit of the season tomorrow and was debating between my Fg17 1 iron or TD 1 iron. The Fg17 won the toss but reading this might make me reconsider.....

 

I'd put the TDs more in the blade category than game improvement. To compare them to a modern set, it's like playing blades in 5i-PW, then having a couple of driving irons in the top end of the bag. It's also worth remembering that they came out after EYE2s, which are probably the most significant move to game improvement in irons ever. 

 

But having hollow-body long irons is definitely "modern" rather than "vintage". Incidentally, I debating whether to play the TDs or some Mizuno MS-11s that I hadn't played for a couple of years (most definitely classic blades). I think both came out in 1988.

 

Now, as for whether to play the FG-17 1i or the TD 1i, all I can say is that the TDs long irons aren't especially forgiving, but they do fizz off the face when hit well. 

I actually took along an FG-17 2i yesterday as well because I wanted to hit a proper ball on the course with it. On the last hole, I hit a superb drive, probably the best of the day, though I didn't get a lot of roll-out. Then I hit the 2i, and while I didn't nut it (bit out of the toe), it was only about 35 yards behind the driver. 

 

The shaft on the FG-17 is a bit short (same length as my FG-J8 3i), and light, so I think it might have been cut down. I'm debating lengthening the shaft, but I tried to add some weight first with lead tape, hence the need for an experiment on the course.

[Foozle]

6 hours ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

I'd put the TDs more in the blade category than game improvement. To compare them to a modern set, it's like playing blades in 5i-PW, then having a couple of driving irons in the top end of the bag. It's also worth remembering that they came out after EYE2s, which are probably the most significant move to game improvement in irons ever. 

 

But having hollow-body long irons is definitely "modern" rather than "vintage". Incidentally, I debating whether to play the TDs or some Mizuno MS-11s that I hadn't played for a couple of years (most definitely classic blades). I think both came out in 1988.

 

Now, as for whether to play the FG-17 1i or the TD 1i, all I can say is that the TDs long irons aren't especially forgiving, but they do fizz off the face when hit well. 

I actually took along an FG-17 2i yesterday as well because I wanted to hit a proper ball on the course with it. On the last hole, I hit a superb drive, probably the best of the day, though I didn't get a lot of roll-out. Then I hit the 2i, and while I didn't nut it (bit out of the toe), it was only about 35 yards behind the driver. 

 

The shaft on the FG-17 is a bit short (same length as my FG-J8 3i), and light, so I think it might have been cut down. I'm debating lengthening the shaft, but I tried to add some weight first with lead tape, hence the need for an experiment on the course.

We share views, interests and traits!

We agree on the classification of the TD's as remaining in the classic blade camp. We both have TD's and Fg17's and, interestingly MS-11's. MS-11's are quite rare here in the UK - I have no idea how my set found their way here - but they are hands down the softest feeling irons i own and definitely classic blades.

I always carry a 1 or 2 iron and in several sets such as my Redlines I play a 1 iron the same length as the 3 iron. Just makes them a little more user friendly whilst still getting the benefit of the lower running flight i am looking for in links golf when compared to the 3 iron.

[The Aspidistra in the Hall]

For this reason we defined iron clubs permitted at Morecambe's Persimmon Revival Open as "blades of simple construction".

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

16 hours ago, Foozle said:

We share views, interests and traits!

We agree on the classification of the TD's as remaining in the classic blade camp. We both have TD's and Fg17's and, interestingly MS-11's. MS-11's are quite rare here in the UK - I have no idea how my set found their way here - but they are hands down the softest feeling irons i own and definitely classic blades.

I always carry a 1 or 2 iron and in several sets such as my Redlines I play a 1 iron the same length as the 3 iron. Just makes them a little more user friendly whilst still getting the benefit of the lower running flight i am looking for in links golf when compared to the 3 iron.

 

I have a rather interesting set of sort of MS-11s that have just come in, but I'm not ready to post them yet...

My other set of MS-11s have Precision FM 5.5 shafts, which are a touch soft, but beautifully smooth. The ones that have just come in have FM 6.0, which is a shaft I've been wanting to try out for a while.

 

Now, that FG-17 is the only FG-17 club I have. I do have a set of FG-J8s, which are pretty much identical. I measured the muscles of the FGJ8 3i and FG-17 2i with callipers, and the latter was about 1mm thinner. That's the only difference I can ascertain. Anyway, the J8s are one of my favourite iron sets. 

 

When I played in the UK, I always carried a long iron, but here in West Japan, there's not as much need for one as the fairways don't run much. Still, they're fun to try and hit (emphasis on "try"), so I like to slip one in when playing persimmon and blades.

 

15 hours ago, The Aspidistra in the Hall said:

For this reason we defined iron clubs permitted at Morecambe's Persimmon Revival Open as "blades of simple construction".

 

I think that's a good way of putting it. Back in the day, I played my Taylormade TDs with a persimmon driver and laminate woods, but I agree that they go against the spirit of "persimmon and blades" events, at least the long irons do. 

 

Edited April 2, 2021 by No_Catchy_Nickname
Added "Back in the day"

[Foozle]

14 minutes ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

I have a rather interesting set of sort of MS-11s that have just come in, but I'm not ready to post them yet...

My other set of MS-11s have Precision FM 5.5 shafts, which are a touch soft, but beautifully smooth. The ones that have just come in have FM 6.0, which is a shaft I've been wanting to try out for a while.

 

Now, that FG-17 is the only FG-17 club I have. I do have a set of FG-J8s, which are pretty much identical. I measured the muscles of the FGJ8 3i and FG-17 2i with callipers, and the latter was about 1mm thinner. That's the only difference I can ascertain. Anyway, the J8s are one of my favourite iron sets. 

 

When I played in the UK, I always carried a long iron, but here in West Japan, there's not as much need for one as the fairways don't run much. Still, they're fun to try and hit (emphasis on "try"), so I like to slip one in when playing persimmon and blades.

 

 

I think that's a good way of putting it. I played my Taylormade TDs with a persimmon driver and laminate woods, but I agree that they go against the spirit of "persimmon and blades" events, at least the long irons do. 

 

Based in Japan there will be a greater supply of MS11'S- most i see listed are in Japan.

Interesting story behind my set which have DG R400 shafts. 

The local branch of American Golf opened perhaps 15 years ago. I went in more out of curiosity as I was not in the market for clubs and was not collecting at that time. The MS11'S (2-SW) were on the second hand rack but, other than a slight ding on the SW, indistinguishable from new. They were marked up at £90 when only 6' away were new sets of Mizuno irons at £600+. I knew nothing about them but liked the look and feel and so decided to buy. At the counter I was told there was 10% off in the first week so call it £80!

A while later I happened to mention to my local Pro that I had a set of MS11 irons. "There is no such club" he said, "You mean TP11?"

Mild panic set in as I thought I may have bought a knock off or fake set of irons - hence the price. It was when I started to research that I realised what I had and how rare they are in the UK.

It also led me to find a full set of TP9's listed for £9.99 which i won for £21 incl shipping. It dawned on me that no one wanted the classic blades of my formative years anymore and as a result have been "filling my boots" ever since!😁

The MS11'S really are a gorgeous set and, as I said earlier, easily the softest feeling irons I own.

 

[NRJyzr]

2 hours ago, Foozle said:

The local branch of American Golf opened perhaps 15 years ago. I went in more out of curiosity as I was not in the market for clubs and was not collecting at that time. The MS11'S (2-SW) were on the second hand rack but, other than a slight ding on the SW, indistinguishable from new. They were marked up at £90 when only 6' away were new sets of Mizuno irons at £600+. I knew nothing about them but liked the look and feel and so decided to buy. At the counter I was told there was 10% off in the first week so call it £80!

 

That's one heck of a score, Foozle.  

 

This deserves that Andres Cantor "goooooaaalll" video, but I'll just mention it instead of posting it here.  LOL

 

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

2 hours ago, Foozle said:

Based in Japan there will be a greater supply of MS11'S- most i see listed are in Japan.

Interesting story behind my set which have DG R400 shafts. 

The local branch of American Golf opened perhaps 15 years ago. I went in more out of curiosity as I was not in the market for clubs and was not collecting at that time. The MS11'S (2-SW) were on the second hand rack but, other than a slight ding on the SW, indistinguishable from new. They were marked up at £90 when only 6' away were new sets of Mizuno irons at £600+. I knew nothing about them but liked the look and feel and so decided to buy. At the counter I was told there was 10% off in the first week so call it £80!

A while later I happened to mention to my local Pro that I had a set of MS11 irons. "There is no such club" he said, "You mean TP11?"

Mild panic set in as I thought I may have bought a knock off or fake set of irons - hence the price. It was when I started to research that I realised what I had and how rare they are in the UK.

It also led me to find a full set of TP9's listed for £9.99 which i won for £21 incl shipping. It dawned on me that no one wanted the classic blades of my formative years anymore and as a result have been "filling my boots" ever since!😁

The MS11'S really are a gorgeous set and, as I said earlier, easily the softest feeling irons I own.

 

 

Exactly, fill yer boots!

And nice score on the 2i as well. I don't have one...yet. But they are pretty rare, and the last one I saw at auction sold as a single club went for 70 quid plus, IIRC.

[Foozle]

49 minutes ago, NRJyzr said:

 

That's one heck of a score, Foozle.  

 

This deserves that Andres Cantor "goooooaaalll" video, but I'll just mention it instead of posting it here.  LOL

 

Pictures of the ill gotten gains!

The TP9's were 1-PW with almost new Crossline grips. The SW to complete came with another set where the seller had lost the SW so sent another instead. Sorry to rub it in but TP9 1-SW for £22 delivered! I have never been so lucky again!

However, to balance life's great equation, you should see the way i play! 😁

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

TP9 1i-SW for 22 pounds? Even if they were beaten up that would be a steal, but yours look to be in very good condition to boot!😍

 

Last year, I bought a set of MS-7s, which were a US release, and are similar to the TP-9s (but perhaps not identical). Mine were 2i-SW, and they were showing some wear, with a little bit of chrome peeling on the leading edge of a couple of the short irons, and the SW sole worn away. 
I think I paid about 60 pounds and I thought that was a great deal. Yours blows that out of the water.

 

Incidentally, the MS-7 SW is about the only Mizuno SW from that era that I get on with.

[elwhippy]

Those MS-11s are magnificent. 

[cold_war_era_golfer]

Back at Spring Valley Country Club.  I played a horrendous round although I did par this hole.  

I went with a half set of 1962 M Tourney V.F.Qs, 1, 3 Wilson 4300s, and an Achushnet Bullseye.

 

Edited May 22, 2021 by coldwareragolfer

[cold_war_era_golfer]

Played on top of what was once a garbage dump in the burbs of Chicago.  They have created an interesting Scottish Iinks style course. 

Jones Bag

Half set of 1964 MT2s

1963 M2 11i

MT2W Driver and a RT2W 3W

 

[Gsea]

On 4/24/2021 at 4:40 PM, coldwareragolfer said:

Played on top of what was once a garbage dump in the burbs of Chicago.  They have created an interesting Scottish Iinks style course. 

Jones Bag

Half set of 1964 MT2s

1963 M2 11i

MT2W Driver and a RT2W 3W

 

My favorite "vintage" in your pic the PBR ball marker. 

[Gsea]

Went 77 Hogans today. How you can play with the "light weight" new clubs is beyond me, have to feel the club head lol

 

[cold_war_era_golfer]

I picked up a beautiful set of M2s from @GolfNutRiblick and took the short irons to the par 3.

The 4w is from a 1965 set of MTs and the putter is OS M 5 P Bullseye.

 

[GolfNutRiblick]

Glad those Macs found the right home!👍🏻

[cold_war_era_golfer]

Back at Spring Valley CC.  1964-1965 2-11 DX2, 1964-1965 DX2W 3w, 1963-1964 Tourney M2TW Driver that a previous owner reshafted with a Dynamic Gold S500, late 50s Iron Master.  Wilson Duo Soft.  Jones carry bag.

[GolfNutRiblick]

Sweet Mac kit! 👍🏻

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

I played a full round with persimmon for the first time in over a year. I normally take them out for nine holes, but I was itching to try out some new Mizuno irons I'd bought (fancy MS-11s, I think) and one of my new Wood Bros drivers.

 

To be honest, I wasn't swinging that well as I made the mistake of going to the range in the morning and hitting 200+ balls. By the second nine, my back was pretty sore. I won't be doing that again.

 

I did hit some good shots, though I only hit driver on four holes. One good one, two OK, and one smother-hook. The good one was a beast; I outdrive my playing partners by nearly 30 yards☺️ 

 

The irons are really good, and I can see myself playing them with modern woods in the future as well as persimmon. The Precision FM 6.0 shaft seems to be a good fit for me.

 

Most pleasing was testing out the grind on an old Mizuno wedge (#12) that I have been working on. It had a large flat sole with no heel or toe relief. I like plenty of both, so I've been grinding away to get it how I like. I'd still like to take a bit more off the toe-end of the sole, and maybe round out the toe itself a bit, but it's pretty much done and ready for a chrome strip and reshaft. It worked really well out of bunkers (4 shots, 3 to within 6ft...only one save) and from the rough. Before grinding, it used to stick and dig into the rough and sand. Now it sweeps through them.

 

What surprised me was that after what I thought was a lot of grinding, the weight has only dropped 7 grams; that's less than a quarter of an ounce.

(If anyone's interested, here's a link to a picture of the sole before I ground it: https://forums.golfwrx.com/topic/1778733-best-sand-wedge-of-the-1980’s/page/2/#elControls_23311634_menu)

Edited June 4, 2021 by No_Catchy_Nickname

[Soloman1]

They do look like MS-11's. Is that a satin finish? Did you get them off Yahoo auction? Maybe a custom set/spec without the stamping? My memory must be going - didn't you get the set of MS-11's that I sold in Japan?

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

8 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

They do look like MS-11's. Is that a satin finish? Did you get them off Yahoo auction? Maybe a custom set/spec without the stamping? My memory must be going - didn't you get the set of MS-11's that I sold in Japan?

 

Good question. After taking a good look, I wouldn't go so far as to call it satin; it's more like lightly brushed chrome. Certainly not as shiny as the MS-11s that may have come from you. The identifying feature with that set was that all the lofts were a degree or two strong, except the 3i, which you said you'd kept as-is because it was "money". 

 

I've just compared 7-irons side-by-side, and apart from the custom stampings, the newer set do appear to have a few minor differences on the grind, but it might be just a trick of the light, as they have less glare than the full chrome versions.

 

The topline appears to be slightly thinners, and the toe seems a touch squarer. Also the sole of the toe looks a tiny bit thinner, but I'll need to bust out my callipers to check that.

 

Apart from the different stamping (no "MS-11"), the only other easily discernible difference is that the bottom groove on the newer set is filled in with white paint, but it's possible that was done post-sale.

 

One other notable point is that they have a P/S wedge between the PW and SW. I've not seen any sets of MS-11s with a P/S wedge. 

 

EDIT: Just did a bit of digging around, and found a couple of MS-11 sets with a P/S wedge, so they did offer one. 

 

Yes, they were a Yahoo! Auction purchase. 

Edited June 4, 2021 by No_Catchy_Nickname

[Soloman1]

Interesting. I never saw a P/S wedge either. You may have a special (as in rare) custom set.

Yeah, you're right. I never hit a poor shot with that 3-iron. I even surprised myself sometimes 🙂

 

They look great. Have fun, mate!

[cold_war_era_golfer]

Back at Spring Valley with a different Mac kit.  Minimal irons M2 FC4000s, M1W woods, And a Tommy Armour IMG with the original ball marker cap.  All in a Jones bag.  Special thanks to @GolfNutRiblick

[Robert L.]

Had my first round with my vintage set last Thursday. All in all I was quite satisfied with my round. My set consists of a Hogan driver and 4-wood, a Ginty, 1963 Haig Ultra irons, 3-PW, a modern-day Dynacraft wedge, and an Otey Crisman blade putter. I also used Wilson Duo Soft balls. Hitting the driver took a few holes to get used to, since I was spraying the ball all over the place, but once I got going it got a bit better. Oddly enough the best irons were the 3 and 4 irons, I kept hitting great shots with then, including the shot of the day on the 9th hole from about 185 yards out. I used my 3-iron for that shot, and the ball just didn't want to drop out of the sky! It finally wound up about 6 feet from the green for an easy chip! All in all I shot a 48 for 9 holes, and if the driver wasn't so balky my score would have been lower. I had so much fun playing with my vintage set that I'm going to keep on playing it for now.

[scomac2002]

2 hours ago, Robert L. said:

Had my first round with my vintage set last Thursday. All in all I was quite satisfied with my round. My set consists of a Hogan driver and 4-wood, a Ginty, 1963 Haig Ultra irons, 3-PW, a modern-day Dynacraft wedge, and an Otey Crisman blade putter. I also used Wilson Duo Soft balls. Hitting the driver took a few holes to get used to, since I was spraying the ball all over the place, but once I got going it got a bit better. Oddly enough the best irons were the 3 and 4 irons, I kept hitting great shots with then, including the shot of the day on the 9th hole from about 185 yards out. I used my 3-iron for that shot, and the ball just didn't want to drop out of the sky! It finally wound up about 6 feet from the green for an easy chip! All in all I shot a 48 for 9 holes, and if the driver wasn't so balky my score would have been lower. I had so much fun playing with my vintage set that I'm going to keep on playing it for now.

 

I remember the first time I played a round with vintage clubs and how I felt about it followed by writing about it on here.  It was probably 6 years ago, perhaps more.  I also recall a memorable 3 iron shot in that round.  

 

It has been awhile since I played a round with vintage.  Back injuries have a habit of doing that to a person as they stress ease of use during the recovery period.  That said, I did put together a half set or blades and laminates for a potential game about a month back when we first reopened.  I have yet to use them, but the intention is still there.

 

Good luck and good golf.  Just remember it's less about the destination and far more about the road travelled. 🏌️‍♂️

[cold_war_era_golfer]

Got out yesterday for 9.  

My buddy with modern cavity backs and metal driver beat me by one stroke and that's not counting his mulligan on one drive!

I'm still nowhere where I want to be but a year of playing vintage has been about the most fun I think I could have on a golf course.  

1963 M2s - 1965 DX Expediter - 1961 Tommy Armour Driver - 1965 DX2 3w - early 60s Iron Master IMG.

Edited July 10, 2021 by cold_war_era_golfer

[BIG STU]

On 6/27/2021 at 8:24 PM, scomac2002 said:

 

I remember the first time I played a round with vintage clubs and how I felt about it followed by writing about it on here.  It was probably 6 years ago, perhaps more.  I also recall a memorable 3 iron shot in that round.  

 

It has been awhile since I played a round with vintage.  Back injuries have a habit of doing that to a person as they stress ease of use during the recovery period.  That said, I did put together a half set or blades and laminates for a potential game about a month back when we first reopened.  I have yet to use them, but the intention is still there.

 

Good luck and good golf.  Just remember it's less about the destination and far more about the road travelled. 🏌️‍♂️

I have been itching to go back to vintage. And as you know like you I am coming off a back injury. I had pushed it some back in November and had some setbacks. I am back swinging and hitting the signature set good. I am getting bored with the scrambles some and I am going to lay off them some I think. I do enjoy the 9 and dines with my wife and will continue to play them.

Yep I am wanting to get out and play vintage more just do not want to kill my back yet. I think I am going to stay on my conditioning program because it seems to be building me back up. As bad as I want to do it I think I am going to give it a month or so. Even though I love my FCs ( just like cold wars) I am leaning towards my Hogan Precisions because they are lighter. Hope to be able to work up to my beloved FCs----- I also have 2 great drivers our esteemed member Richard 77 sent me a year or so back as a get well gift. He sent me a keyhole MT 2 W and a beautiful Penna 65 I have yet to hit but want to. 

[BIG STU]

On 4/24/2021 at 4:40 PM, cold_war_era_golfer said:

Played on top of what was once a garbage dump in the burbs of Chicago.  They have created an interesting Scottish Iinks style course. 

Jones Bag

Half set of 1964 MT2s

1963 M2 11i

MT2W Driver and a RT2W 3W

 

And PBR to boot!!!!!  A real man's beer ---- What I drink along with Yeungling when I do drink a beer. Real golf clubs and real beer what a combo!!!!!

[cold_war_era_golfer]

7 hours ago, BIG STU said:

And PBR to boot!!!!!  A real man's beer ---- What I drink along with Yeungling when I do drink a beer. Real golf clubs and real beer what a combo!!!!!

Aside from you playing circles around me I feel like if we ever came across one another on a course we'd have a lot in common!

[BIG STU]

17 hours ago, cold_war_era_golfer said:

Aside from you playing circles around me I feel like if we ever came across one another on a course we'd have a lot in common!

LOL I do not know if I can play circles around anyone now. But I can tell you we will have fun-- That is what golf is to me now fun---