Adams brand recognition

[mswmn]

[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1386776697' post='8283133']
As Mizuno is known as and iron company, Adams seems to be stuck as being labeled as a hybrid company.[/quote]

I think they call this the "Fonzie" theory. It's a tough thing to shake. I'm not helping any...I have three Adams hybrids.

[Micah J]

It all boils down to Adidas and TM. Although Adams and TM still operate as seperate entities I see TM stealing patents (slot technology) and Ideas...pun intended. Adams makes killer irons...same 8620 and 431 stainless as other top brands. I'd stack Adams up there with any top iron manufacturer including Ping and Mizuno.

[SEP1006]

[quote name='Hifade' timestamp='1386781152' post='8283551']
Two things.......

(1) With all due respect, who cares who plays them on tour? Have "you" tried them and do they fit "your" game? That's what counts.

(2) I would argue that Adams is one of, if not, the most innovative OEM's making golf equipment today.
[/quote]


You are right on both accounts as are many who posted. Image as senior clubs and the re-sale market for Adams has a lot to do with it in my opinion.

[villaguy]

I played the Adams A4 tech for about 4 years and loved them, traded up to Adams A12pros fantastic irons , I am now paying Adams cmb irons they are some of the best irons on the market.

[Micah J]

I rock the CB3s which is a huge upgrade from the mx25s I gamed for several years. They make a sweet line of players irons also. My local pro still games the mb2s.

[2putttom]

[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386776333' post='8283093']
Seen a few threads on Adams irons and got me thinking, why don't more people play Adams irons? They seem to make some good equipment (CMB, CB2/CB3), but I almost never see anyone on these boards playing them.

Just curious, why are they so low on the proverbial totem pole of clubs compared to the other companies?

Is it lack of brand recognition? Or their brand name has a connotation with something "negative" (cheap or SGI?)? Are their products not that good?

What's your take?
[/quote]We are too busy enjoying our Adams equipment to blog about them.

[sanjaygolf]

My point was that not many PGA pros play and more importantly win with Adams irons and woods and that is a big reason why they don't have the same recognition as Titleist, TM, Callaway, and Ping. People want to play what the pros are playing. It doesn't mean that Adams isn't a great company or they make inferior clubs but you asked why they don't have the appeal like other brands and that's the reason why.

[LOVE4LPGA]

The [i]only [/i]high quality, major OEM with worse value retention (that is, resale value) than Adams Golf is Wilson Staff.

And that is saying something!

NIKE Golf is about tied with Adams Golf; meaning, awful value plunge in the after market.

I surmise the marketplace buying 1) over half of the new gear and 2) most of the used gear can only strongly hold up 2.5 - 3.0 brands. Such as, Taylor Made, Callaway, and Titleist. Then there is a huge middle ground (Cobra, Cleveland, Mizuno, etc.), and finally the far-less-bought clubs (Adams Golf, NIKE Golf, and Wilson Staff) compared to The Big Three.

[Jamboy72]

[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386779100' post='8283339']
[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386778975' post='8283329']
Quick, name a pro who plays Adams.
[/quote]
Are you a pro?
[/quote]

Badds - Not a tough question

[LOVE4LPGA]

[quote name='Fourmyle of Ceres' timestamp='1386776942' post='8283151']

The perception to me is they are available everywhere, often heavily discounted, they have almost zero Tour presence, they release new overlapping models with Taylormade-like frequency (and nobody but Taylormade can make that work, apparently) and they started out as makers of funky-looking almost infomercial-grade fairway woods then branched out into every possible kind of club at every possible price point.

None of that seems remotely in the same league with Titleist, Ping, Taylormade or Callaway in terms of being perceived as "serious" clubs. And they don't have the long history of some other second-tier brands like Wilson.

That doesn't mean there's anything wrong with them. But if I can buy a Ping or Titleist club for roughly the same price as an Adams club I know the Adams aren't going to get a second look. There's only so many clubs I'll own in a lifetime and the big four brands have enough models to meet my needs several times over. I never even look farther down the "totem pole".

[/quote]

Well stated. All definitely true.

[Jamboy72]

[quote name='Micah J' timestamp='1386787182' post='8284163']
I rock the CB3s which is a huge upgrade from the mx25s I gamed for several years. They make a sweet line of players irons also. My local pro still games the mb2s.
[/quote]

They make a ton of great stuff - My thoughts as to why there isn't more "recognition" is:

* Value - Top line products are at/above price points for other top line products from other OEM's, but resale/trade in, etc. is exceptionally low - You can buy a premium FW for $299 one season and struggle to get $100 for it at the beginning of the next

* Perception - This is probably one of the toughest pieces for any OEM to create and even tougher for it to change - Many see Adams as clubs for the older/senior crew and if they were to bag a club it would be a hybrid...and probably a used one at that!

[Micah J]

Barney Adams started the company in a garage in Texas back in the 80s. How long has Titleist, Cobra, Wilson, Callaway and TM been around? Selling out to TM did 2 things...shared patents and more resources for both companies. You might as well say that any pro playing the TM brand is playing Adams.

[Gbyeball]

[quote name='villaguy' timestamp='1386786797' post='8284131']
I played the Adams A4 tech for about 4 years and loved them, traded up to Adams A12pros fantastic irons , I am now paying Adams cmb irons they are some of the best irons on the market.
[/quote]

All fantastic irons. Adams equipment top to bottom is first rate.

Took you long enough to make your second post. lol

[Micah J]

There's a lot to be said about perception, advertising and targeting a certain demographic regarding golf equipment. Bottom line is Adams irons and hybrids are some of the best on the market bar none. Sure I own a set of ping G5s and some old Callaway BBs but they all take a back seat to my CB3s. I game what feels good and works well for my swing not what Tiger, Phil and Rory get paid to game...loll

[sanjaygolf]

[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1386789208' post='8284347']
[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386779100' post='8283339']
[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386778975' post='8283329']
Quick, name a pro who plays Adams.
[/quote]
Are you a pro?
[/quote]

Badds - Not a tough question
[/quote]

World ranking - 186.

Name a succesful PGA pro who plays Adams

[bph7]

[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386790585' post='8284445']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1386789208' post='8284347']
[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386779100' post='8283339']
[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386778975' post='8283329']
Quick, name a pro who plays Adams.
[/quote]
Are you a pro?
[/quote]

Badds - Not a tough question
[/quote]

World ranking - 186.

Name a succesful PGA pro who plays Adams
[/quote]

They are just gonna say Badds is successful by definition because he has won. So let's rephrase your question to really hammer home your point: Name a player currently ranked inside the top 150 in OWGR who is currently an Adams staffer.

[setter02]

[quote name='TJCDAS' timestamp='1386776697' post='8283133']
As Mizuno is known as and iron company, Adams seems to be stuck as being labeled as a hybrid company.

Mizuno makes great wood and hybrids but they don't sell. Tour Edge golf makes outstanding equipment but sales are small.
[/quote]

Mizuno puts weak shaft offerings in their wood/hybrid products given the price point, thus hurting sales. TEE is boutique with a high price point, thus hurting sales.

Adams makes good gear, they just don't have the flash that carrying the new white thunder stick does (pre TM buyout and makeing a white headed Adams driver... ffs TM). They also started to release too many driver offerings at a high price point only to discount quickly when sales weren't there, hurting themselves.

[Fade to Black]

[quote name='bph7' timestamp='1386791154' post='8284493']
[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386790585' post='8284445']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1386789208' post='8284347']
[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386779100' post='8283339']
[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386778975' post='8283329']
Quick, name a pro who plays Adams.
[/quote]
Are you a pro?
[/quote]

Badds - Not a tough question
[/quote]

World ranking - 186.

Name a succesful PGA pro who plays Adams
[/quote]

They are just gonna say Badds is successful by definition because he has won. So let's rephrase your question to really hammer home your point: Name a player currently ranked inside the top 150 in OWGR who is currently an Adams staffer.
[/quote]

But are we here in GolfWRX not savvy enough to know that rankings should have no effect on whether the equipment is good or not? Its an indictment of budget, not quality. Why would you not play something that may be perfect for you just because it says Adams on it and not Mizuno/Titleist/Ping etc?

[Matty T]

[quote name='2putttom' timestamp='1386787404' post='8284183']
We are too busy enjoying our Adams equipment to blog about them.
[/quote]


I couldnt agree more!

[bph7]

[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386791700' post='8284545']
But are we here in GolfWRX not savvy enough to know that rankings should have no effect on whether the equipment is good or not? Its an indictment of budget, not quality. Why would you not play something that may be perfect for you just because it says Adams on it and not Mizuno/Titleist/Ping etc?
[/quote]

First of all, you didn't answer my question at all. But, since I actually answer people's questions, I will answer yours: Yes, at Golfwrx we are savvy enough to know that rankings don't matter, but wasn't your original question why the brand doesn't have more recognition? People have given multiple good answers: brand perception, marketing (in particular their lack of touring pros), resale value etc. So, hasn't your question been answered? You seem determined to show that these supposed "reasons" are bad ones, and you might be right, but the market is what it is, and if you wanted an explanation for Adams' place in the market, I think you have received it. Think about it like this: What factors help or hurt a golf OEM company's success in general? Quality of products, marketing, management, etc. We have eliminated quality as a possibly reason why they wouldn't sell well (because most agree that Adams does make top notch stuff). So, if its not the product itself, it's probably the marketing, right?

[Dr.John]

I think it's safe today that high profile tour players aren't playing their present equipment soley because it performs better than other manufacturers offerings. Look at the number of players every year who jump ship from Titleist, TM, or Callaway only to fill their bag with another high profile manufacturer. Is it because of higher quality equipment? Of course not. They follow the money, we all know that. Rory ,as an example, signed with Nike because Nike offered more money than Titleist, end of story. Adams, does not offer high dollar endorsement contracts like TM, Callaway, or even Titleist. Therefore, they lack big name presense on tour. However, on the Senior tour, Adams has a very large presence. Why? Because the big name companies aren't offering big money contracts to very many senior players. So, they generally play what they feel allows them to play best. You'll see alot of older model irons and woods on the senior tour for this reason, and yes, plenty of Adams irons and woods in the bags. So, I feel it isn't wise to assume lack of presence on a tour where most of the high profile players are payed to play a specific brand is indicitive of the quality of the equipment. You'd be better served to see what the players are playing when not being paid to play a specific brand. Just my thoughts.

[Georgie Z]

My hybrids were Adams a few years ago.. I was very inconsistent and got rid of them. I think their new stuff is pretty ugly.

[2putttom]

[quote name='Dr.John' timestamp='1386794205' post='8284703']
I think it's safe today that high profile tour players aren't playing their present equipment soley because it performs better than other manufacturers offerings. Look at the number of players every year who jump ship from Titleist, TM, or Callaway only to fill their bag with another high profile manufacturer. Is it because of higher quality equipment? Of course not. They follow the money, we all know that. Rory ,as an example, signed with Nike because Nike offered more money than Titleist, end of story. Adams, does not offer high dollar endorsement contracts like TM, Callaway, or even Titleist. Therefore, they lack big name presense on tour. However, on the Senior tour, Adams has a very large presence. Why? Because the big name companies aren't offering big money contracts to very many senior players. So, they generally play what they feel allows them to play best. You'll see alot of older model irons and woods on the senior tour for this reason, and yes, plenty of Adams irons and woods in the bags. So, I feel it isn't wise to assume lack of presence on a tour where most of the high profile players are payed to play a specific brand is indicitive of the quality of the equipment. You'd be better served to see what the players are playing when not being paid to play a specific brand. Just my thoughts.
[/quote] When I was working at Bandon, I got to see what equipment the visiting pro's bagged off season....not what they got paid to play while on regular tour season.

[Super Tuna]

[quote name='LOVE4LPGA' timestamp='1386788194' post='8284267']
The [i]only [/i]high quality, major OEM with worse value retention (that is, resale value) than Adams Golf is Wilson Staff.

And that is saying something!

NIKE Golf is about tied with Adams Golf; meaning, awful value plunge in the after market.

I surmise the marketplace buying 1) over half of the new gear and 2) most of the used gear can only strongly hold up 2.5 - 3.0 brands. Such as, Taylor Made, Callaway, and Titleist. Then there is a huge middle ground (Cobra, Cleveland, Mizuno, etc.), and finally the far-less-bought clubs (Adams Golf, NIKE Golf, and Wilson Staff) compared to The Big Three.
[/quote]

Cleveland seems to be in the lower bracket for resale these days as well. I'd be stunned if someone could sell a lightly used Mashie for even $30 and the number of lists I saw for brand new 3-PW 588 forged irons for $400 with no takers this year was crazy.

[kwooten31]

I play the CB3's and also have a combo of the CB1's and ProA12's. To be honest they are some of the best I've ever hit, and I have played many different sets by many different OEM's. I have also paid the least amount for the Adams than any other so as long as it stays that way I'm happy....

[BlkNGld]

I think that the biggest reason is simply that there are a LOT of brands out there. In a crowded market getting someone to try or consider a club is half the battle. There are just too many brands out there and many of us are not going to try everything simply because of time constraints to go through everything.

When most people look at a major purchase (more than a couple of hundred dollars) they tend to quickly narrow the choices down to 2-4 products that get a serious look.

So how do people get there? In golf terms you can look at it either in overall brand or particular niches.

On an overall basis (woods and/or irons)

For a players club the list will usually include Titleist and (at least for irons) Mizuno.

For more of a weekend warrior the list is likely to be TM, Callaway and Ping, perhaps 2 of those 3.

That leaves a lot of companies vying for the last couple of spots just to get a serious look. And don't forget that the 'weekend warrior' products want to be included in the 'players' converstation and vice versa, so you may in fact have one spot left for the likes of Adams, Cleveland, Cobra, Nike, Wilson, etc to fight over.

And for particular products like wedges or hybrids the list can of course change.

I don't think it's because their products are junk. But by and large the 2nd tier OEMs have a more limited budge and have to choose wisely how and to whom they get their message out.

[kwooten31]

[quote name='2putttom' timestamp='1386794576' post='8284729']
[quote name='Dr.John' timestamp='1386794205' post='8284703']
I think it's safe today that high profile tour players aren't playing their present equipment soley because it performs better than other manufacturers offerings. Look at the number of players every year who jump ship from Titleist, TM, or Callaway only to fill their bag with another high profile manufacturer. Is it because of higher quality equipment? Of course not. They follow the money, we all know that. Rory ,as an example, signed with Nike because Nike offered more money than Titleist, end of story. Adams, does not offer high dollar endorsement contracts like TM, Callaway, or even Titleist. Therefore, they lack big name presense on tour. However, on the Senior tour, Adams has a very large presence. Why? Because the big name companies aren't offering big money contracts to very many senior players. So, they generally play what they feel allows them to play best. You'll see alot of older model irons and woods on the senior tour for this reason, and yes, plenty of Adams irons and woods in the bags. So, I feel it isn't wise to assume lack of presence on a tour where most of the high profile players are payed to play a specific brand is indicitive of the quality of the equipment. You'd be better served to see what the players are playing when not being paid to play a specific brand. Just my thoughts.
[/quote] When I was working at Bandon, I got to see what equipment the visiting pro's bagged off season....not what they got paid to play while on regular tour season.
[/quote]
Well come on, tell us please!

[Micah J]

I don't know about you guys but personally I can't go to a track and not notice at least a dozen linksters with a bag full of Adams golf clubs. Speedline drivers...gi irons and hybrids and even some Yes putters. Admittedly the irons I game are the only Adams brand in my bag but I think Adams is doing just fine as is. They don't need to change a thing.

[kwooten31]

[quote name='bph7' timestamp='1386793503' post='8284645']
[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386791700' post='8284545']
But are we here in GolfWRX not savvy enough to know that rankings should have no effect on whether the equipment is good or not? Its an indictment of budget, not quality. Why would you not play something that may be perfect for you just because it says Adams on it and not Mizuno/Titleist/Ping etc?
[/quote]

First of all, you didn't answer my question at all. But, since I actually answer people's questions, I will answer yours: Yes, at Golfwrx we are savvy enough to know that rankings don't matter, but wasn't your original question why the brand doesn't have more recognition? People have given multiple good answers: brand perception, marketing (in particular their lack of touring pros), resale value etc. So, hasn't your question been answered? You seem determined to show that these supposed "reasons" are bad ones, and you might be right, but the market is what it is, and if you wanted an explanation for Adams' place in the market, I think you have received it. Think about it like this: What factors help or hurt a golf OEM company's success in general? Quality of products, marketing, management, etc. We have eliminated quality as a possibly reason why they wouldn't sell well (because most agree that Adams does make top notch stuff). So, if its not the product itself, it's probably the marketing, right?
[/quote]
We have to hook up this spring and play a round, I enjoy most of your posts and you seem like a decent guy, rounds on me this spring....

[BlkNGld]

[quote name='bph7' timestamp='1386791154' post='8284493']
[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386790585' post='8284445']
[quote name='Jamboy72' timestamp='1386789208' post='8284347']
[quote name='Fade to Black' timestamp='1386779100' post='8283339']
[quote name='sanjaygolf' timestamp='1386778975' post='8283329']
Quick, name a pro who plays Adams.
[/quote]
Are you a pro?
[/quote]

Badds - Not a tough question
[/quote]

World ranking - 186.

Name a succesful PGA pro who plays Adams
[/quote]

They are just gonna say Badds is successful by definition because he has won. So let's rephrase your question to really hammer home your point: Name a player currently ranked inside the top 150 in OWGR who is currently an Adams staffer.
[/quote]

Short answer: Garrigus.

Long answer, aka disclaimer. I knew Garrigus was in the top 100, but if I hadn't spoken with him briefly while volunteering at a tournament I wouldn't have known he was with Adams.

Underscores why Els going to Adams would be so huge for them globally. He's one of those guys that is well liked enough that unless he can be middle of the pack and will still get decent galleries and air time.