an inconvenient truth

[forgedcbuser]

just finished watching the dvd and i really have to suggest it to any and all who care...about just about anything in this world.

 

alot of compelling facts without making the situation too overly dramatic or end-all.

 

opinions?

and what do you do/have done to help?

[smarshal75]

Very interesting movie. The most memorable part, amongst all the other compelling information, was the frog in water animation. That lone example, pretty much sums up the human response to global warming. My effort to improve the situation was to change out all the incandecent (sp?) bulbs in my home to flourescent (small start I know). Next, my beloved Tacoma 4x4 may be going on the sale block.

[forgedcbuser]

not so much response or opinions here on gwrx but it's getting a bunch of comments on gea and golf disussions.

 

i hope the post sticks to the topic (pollution and global warming) and not a gore/democrat bash fest.

 

like most Americans, i too love my car and can't see myself driving an electric or hybrid car.

i wonder how far away new alcohol/ethenol based fuels and fuel cells, engines are.

if the effect of using a higher percentage ethenol gasoline will shorten the life span of my current engine,

will i use it just to creat fewer emissions?

[smarshal75]

Probably not many responses because this is a golf forum. Nonetheless, I like seeing spirited debate about such issues since it raises awareness. Interesting fact that in California, golf courses were required to retire their gas rental carts and switch to electric carts as part of emissions reduction legislation.

 

I don't think ethanol will pan out. There is too much of government subsidy needed to get farmers to grow fuel crops. Also the energy input needed to grow fuel crops doesn't equal the energy output.

 

Another challenge is getting oil companies to realize they are really energy companies. That meaning, all energy...solar, wind, hydro, geothermal, and so forth. Until then, they will not invest in the infrastructure to deliver alternative fuels.

 

Speaking of railroads, when are American's going to embrace rail again. Seriously, inner city light rail and interstate high speed rail. It works for the Japanese and the Europeans, why not us?

[samm980]

While I agree that pollution is a terrible thing I think we must also realize that for industrial progress pullution is a neccesary evil.

 

 

Besides we all know that Al Gore said that pollution and Global Warming are not the real problem, ManBearPig is our true enemy.

[smarshal75]

While I agree that pollution is a terrible thing I think we must also realize that for industrial progress pullution is a neccesary evil.

 

 

Besides we all know that Al Gore said that pollution and Global Warming are not the real problem, ManBearPig is our true enemy.

 

 

I don't think industrial progress has to be stunted by better emissions control. Toyota is proof positive that industrial progress and reduced emissions can be profitable. In any case, nature bats last and it will be our children who pay the price for our complacency.

[samm980]

I don't know if complacency is the word to use.

[smarshal75]

I don't know if complacency is the word to use.

 

 

Is procrastination better?

[forgedcbuser]

i would think complacency is a good word but not in the true sense...

we're complacent only because the effects (if any are actually going to happen) haven't bit us on the Word not allowed yet.

 

as for alternative fuels,

there's no doubt in my mind that more productive, possibly recycleable, cleaner fuel is being researched but as another poster suggested, it has to be embraced and funded by the companies which are willing to invest billions in the advancements of these technologies.

ie: auto companies would have to rebuild/restucture the build plants worldwide as well as re-train hundreds of thousands of employees costing ALOT of $$$.

 

maybe on a slight tangent but my main peeve is that there aren't even enough gov't regulations limiting pollution...ie: i live in NYC and even though styrofoam is recycleable, the recycle plants don't have the means to do it....so why even use it here?

[manship1856]

Americans put a man on the moon and brought him back safely to Earth in 1969, but you're telling me that with all the advances in science and technology we can't come up with a safe and efficient way to power my vehicle?? I refuse to believe it. I'm no conspiracy theorist, but I'm just saying there's a lot of money to be made peddling petrolium...

[The Boom Bapp]

I watched this movie and I was suprised at how much we (as a country) have done to our only home and found that I was overly effected knowing that my children will inherit this major burden!

 

Manship hit the nail on the head, all this technology and richness of knowledge and we cannot do this one thing, we can make microprocessors the size of a needles head that holds a Terrabyte of info but we somehow cannot make an electric motor that generates an equivalent of 300HP for a car/truck?? A bigger agenda smashes this overdue concept obviously!

 

Waiting for the next modern day Preston Tucker to appear??

 

Things I have done.

1. Changed all (and I mean all) bulbs in my house to the energy saver bulbs.

2. Bought LED lights for my Holiday decoration.

3. Looking at moving to a hybrid.

4. Aggressive Recycle program has been adopted by my housing community after proposal 1 month ago.

5. Changed all filters and screens in my Heat/Air units to allow better efficiency when operating.

6. Changed my cars A/C units from Freon to new more efficient, environment friendly, & colder gas.

[asitlies]

Haven't seen it, but do you thnk it's showing one side of the debate while ignoring the other? Global temperatures always fluctuate - is it possible that we are in a normal fluctuation?

[forgedcbuser]

I watched this movie and I was suprised at how much we (as a country) have done to our only home and found that I was overly effected knowing that my children will inherit this major burden!

 

Manship hit the nail on the head, all this technology and richness of knowledge and we cannot do this one thing, we can make microprocessors the size of a needles head that holds a Terrabyte of info but we somehow cannot make an electric motor that generates an equivalent of 300HP for a car/truck?? A bigger agenda smashes this overdue concept obviously!

 

Waiting for the next modern day Preston Tucker to appear??

 

Things I have done.

1. Changed all (and I mean all) bulbs in my house to the energy saver bulbs.

2. Bought LED lights for my Holiday decoration.

3. Looking at moving to a hybrid.

4. Aggressive Recycle program has been adopted by my housing community after proposal 1 month ago.

5. Changed all filters and screens in my Heat/Air units to allow better efficiency when operating.

6. Changed my cars A/C units from Freon to new more efficient, environment friendly, & colder gas.

 

very admirable gestures;

i'm of a mind that humans do affect our surroundings BUT how much?

the dvd prompted me to comment on global warming...i believe GW exists but is it such a dramatic change that the earth we know will cease to exist?

i'm not sure and hearing contradictory scientific evidence has brought me to a point where i'm more 'on the fence' than ever before.

 

i posted this topic over on GEA and it's illicited some VERY intelligent posts...some backed with url's and charts...proving or dis-proving GW...insightful to say the very least.

 

overall though the moral behind it all (as i see it) is that why wouldn't or couldn't we do what we can for a cleaner environment (as you've done)?

 

Haven't seen it, but do you thnk it's showing one side of the debate while ignoring the other? Global temperatures always fluctuate - is it possible that we are in a normal fluctuation?

 

as i've quoted above,

there definitely are yay and nay sayers re: GW.

both sides have compelling cases and evidence but unless you're a scientist (and/or dedicated to researching the entire cause not just the possible effects), it's very difficult to FULLY understand the whole issue(s).

 

the dvd sparked huge interest imo because:

a) al gore is a public figure that is either appreciated or despised and as a politician CAN he be trusted to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

b) human beings are a visual being...meaning that we usually believe what our eyes tell us (a reason why the media is so compelling in our decisions).

so ie: if we see the images of a battered earth it'll sway our thoughts more emotionally than anything (instilled a bit of fear or reprisal).

 

the cyclical theory is plausible but scientific research can only go so far and how accurate and how reliable is data collected from say, 60 yrs ago?

global changes occured thru the centuries/millenia and how can anyone say with absolute fact and absolute certainty what the conditions were the last ice age for example.

 

so the ONE great thing about the movie is that it made people THINK about the issue...and it's always a good thing to consider all your options.

[asitlies]

nice post.

 

I just think doom and gloom sells better, or makes a better movie.

[aviator]

In my humble opinion, we all can and should do more. But, like most things in this world, it goes back to MONEY. Don't you think that the oil companies are doing everything in their power to slow down more fuel efficient vehicles and the development of alternative energy sources. That would drastically cut into their profit margins or possibly drive them totally out of business, there is NO way they are going to let that happen. Many of the politicians probably have a lot to lose if the oil companies suffer as well. This is just the tip of the iceberg so to speak, I'm sure it goes much deeper. Unfortunately, the love of money and greed will always drive this country and most of the world, even at the expense of this great planet God has given us. I guess that every little thing we do as individuals can only help the situation though!

[Placebo]

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the carbeurator that runs on water conspiricy story yet, and for the record processors don't hold terrabytes of info, they process it. But I digress. One poster mentioned that at his course they made them replace all the gas powered carts with electric. While I agree that every step towards cleaner air is a good thing overall, I can't help but wonder why some of the bigger obvious contributors have not been addressed. Commercial airlines for example. Has anyone ever assessed the amount of polution they are contributing? To the best of my knowledge they have no regulations on them whatsoever for emissions and they are much closer to the problem than any ground vehicle. This topic runs deeper than I think most people realize, Manship did a good job of putting it in a nutshell but the problem is deeply rooted throughout the world and needs some serious attention. If the majority of the worlds leading scientist agree it is a problem then who am I to disagree.

[specialblend218]

I haven't seen the movie but studied a lot of stuff related to this, since we have been studying Bio Diesel made from coconut shells at my school. I really think the biggest solution is to provide a cost effective way to decrease pollution. Unless the it's cheaper most people won't care. I'm not sure if the movie talks about it either, but in places all over Asia they drive these 2 stroke motor scooters that pollute up to 50 times as much as the average car in America. They don't care because they are cheap and easy to ride in the busy cities and they get great gas mileage. They have fuel cell scooters but no one buys them because they cost more. I don't see this changing in most countries unless the price goes down.

 

Just my two cents.

 

... This topic runs deeper than I think most people realize, ...

 

I agree there as so many levels of impact it's hard to know. Which is why I won't see the movie, since most movies like this just show gloom and doom and will not show the great lengths America has done to reduce pollution. I have way to many tree huggers at my school that drive me insane because they don't know all the facts in they so called believe. I'm not bashing all the tree huggers just the tree hugging people who don't care to study what the believe in.

[smarshal75]

I find it strange that we rely on and trust scientists on so many issues (e.g., diseases, energy, chemicals, drugs, crime analysis), yet there is always a higher level of suspicion about those studying climactic events and cycles. Is it because the T.V. weather man isn't always right?

 

Anyway, Gore presented a chart that showed a positive correlation between the CO2 emissions and temperature change. The chart showed a rather steady balance of CO2 increases and decreases over the last 650,000 years. When this chart reached the 20th century, CO2 emmission busted through the moving average along with temperatures. Yes, the earth goes through natural heating and cooling cycles. These cycles are gradual. As such, flora and fauna evolve and adapt to the changing conditions. However, humans, via green house gases, are now artificially speeding up this cycle, which doesn't give plants and animals sufficient time to adapt to the changing conditions.

 

You guys should take look at the Gaia Hypothesis. It is a very fascinating concept on Earth as a living organism that both supports and relies on each and every living thing on it.

[Baller]

 

 

Waiting for the next modern day Preston Tucker to appear??

 

 

Why so the big oil cartels can run him out of town as well? I agree Mr. Tucker was one of the greatest examples of the little guy, with a better product, going against an institution. The automakers and the Government realized the if the American public understood his vision, his single automobile would put the big three under greater financial restraints, which in theory had the potential the crumble the USA's economy, if the big automakers would have had to make changes. This is really the same type of situation here. It’s about lining the pockets of the rich. Oil money is very old money. Money that has ties to families which head our governments, our churches, our way of socialization. So if we the people make changes to better our future on this planet by stopping pollution, requesting electrical cars and such, will they run us out of town so to speak; like a Preston Tucker?

 

Things that make you say Hum :fool:

[Placebo]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science/12/29...c.ap/index.html

 

:fool: