Need help identifying persimmon Macgregor Tourney Jumbo driver

[btomp]

Hello,

I am new to this forum. I am staying with my dad and he has this old persimmon driver and he asked me to help him find some more information about it, like its model and year. He got it when he was a kid, and it has since been refurbished twice I believe. I googled around and could not find a persimmon Macgregor wood with this same sole plate. Most of the images I came across stemmed from this forum though, and I see a lot of you all know a ton about classic clubs. So I was hoping somebody would be able to give me some information about this particular club. Any insight or other pictures of this club would be really apprecaited it.

 

 

text on plate says "MACGREGOR TOURNEY MODEL"

 

 

 

 

Top of driver says "Tommy Armour," however it is kind of sketchy looking and so we aren't sure if it was on the original club or added (incorrectly) when it was refurbished. My dad says there was definately a "T" there on the original club, but think it may have said "Tourney" instead of Tommy Armour.

 

 

 

 

[rex235]

btomp-

Judging from your photos (which appear to be LH, but mirror flopped)

Note the VERY LARGE face, the 5 screws in the soleplate..

This might be one of the early MacGregor Tommy Armour JUMBO Tourney Drivers, almost like a BJM-

But then-

Ironmaster, Teevons, and Charley Penna are whom one should contact when it comes to identification of these MacGregor clubs...

[HoganApexBlades]

Based on what I see and according to Jim Kaplan's MacGregor Golf History book, I think it's either a 1939 Tommy Armour Jumbo or a 1941 Tommy Armour Jumbo BJD Model or BJM Model. The five screws on the insert put it into that time period. Unfortunately, they don't have pictures of the soleplates from then so it's a guess at best.

Is the face 2 inches from the soleplate to the top of the head? The original head color was ebony and the insert was red fibre.

Does the shaft say TTW stiff?

You may have a very valuable club in your hands...

[btomp]

rex235,
yeah, your correct about it being a RH club.

HoganApexBlades,
Yeah, the face is 2 inches from the soleplate to the top of the head. Unfortunately, the shaft and grip are not what was on the original club.

Thanks for the thoughts so far.

[HoganApexBlades]

btomp - can you post another picture of the crown of the club without the GolfWRX watermark?

[Ironmaster Oddities]

Pre-WWII, gem.
Early Armours were made in at least 3 models. The different model name was stamped on the sole plate like yours, below the MacGregor Stamp. Armour or Tourney Model was the standard with a driver face depth of a little under 1-5/8". Ben Hogan Model was a deeper face driver, like a 693 or 945 or M-85 in later years. Shallower and more pear-shaped woods were the Demerit Model.
I have a BJD JUMBO driver with a sole plate like yours. Basically the same. except yours is missing the BJD stamped in the wood. I haven't seen one like yours. Very cool, especially with the provenance of your dad's ownership.
Uncle Bob

[btomp]

Clearer picture of the crown.

[attachment=2318167:Photo on 7-11-14 at 12.02 PM.jpg]

Ironmaster,
I have seen pictures of the BJD JUMBOS with this sole plate, and your right, they are pretty much the same except my dad's is lacking the stamp. The "OIL HARDENED JUMBO" jumbo stamp on mine appears to be what was originally on the club. The only way I could think it would be different would be if one of the refurbishers happened to have the old "JUMBO" and OIL HARDENED" stamps (I saw one for sale so it could be possible) himself and put fresh stamps on after sanding off what was original. If that is the case, he should have put the "JUMBO" above "oil hardened," but this is pure speculation. Does anybody know of a jumbo club from this era lacking the BJD stamp?

Also, we are not so sure about the originality "Tommy Armour" stamp on the crown. It definately appears to have been tampered with at some point.

Heres a picture of the club I was comparing it to in the first paragraph. There are notable differences, but again, I am wondering if these differences are original or due to the refurbishing the club has been through. My dad said it was in pretty terrible shape when he got it.

[attachment=2318187:bjm 001.JPG]

Thanks for the help so far.

[Ironmaster Oddities]

btomp,

you could be correct about the stampings. Keep in mind that nothing at MacGregor was cast in stone. Most of the final work was done by hand. The craftsman who made it may have just forgotten to stamp it correctly. Either way, it is a great and rare club. The "modern" Jumbos had 1-3/4 inch +/- club face depth. Whereas yours is probably 2 inches+/-.

As mentioned above by HoganApexBlades, the original color was black (ebony glaze). But the face was originally black, as well. If you look closely on yours, you can see evidence of the black face. Industry-wide,during that era, there may have been more clubs with stained club faces than not.

[btomp]

Ironmaster,
Yeah that seems like another reasonable possibility regarding the stamping.

My dad suspected the color may be different from what was on the original club. So, the original club, it seems to have been suggested, had a black face with a red insert, and then the head was a uniform black (ebony glaze) as well?

I am looking at this club (same as in above post but different angle):
[attachment=2318565:bjm 005.JPG]

This club has tan and red clubface, green head, and then black sole. Are these colors a product of refurbishing, or did Macgregor release clubs with that coloring?

Also, we're curious to know what this club might be worth. Anyone have an idea?

[bullrambler]

Nice pics; and nice acquisition and thanks for the comments from those who clarified some production options.