Blue Monster Unworthy of the WGC?

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It's pretty weird not having The Players Championship in late March, but at least we get a World Golf Championship (WGC) event in its place. The fields for WGC events are always just as strong as they are for major championships, so it's definitely an added bonus. On top of that, we still get The Players Championship and Sawgrass in May.

 

 

Like I mentioned above, the fields are very strong for WGC events. The golf courses are usually equal to the task, but this week may be a little different. I was watching "The Approach" on The Golf Channel last night, and one of the topics really piqued my interest. The topic centered around whether or not The Blue Monster at Doral is worthy of having a World Golf Championship event.

 

 

Frank Nobilo argued for Doral, while Alex Miceli (the resident stats guy) argued against. In the end, it comes down to personal opinion. I'm going to break things down a little farther by listing arguments for and against, and I'll end by listing a few other courses that should be considered for future World Golf Championship events.

 

 

Arguments Against Doral

The main argument against Doral hosting a WGC event centers around the course difficulty. The winning score at the 2007 Ford Championship at Doral was -20, and the winning score in previous years wasn't much different. In 2007, only the winners of The FBR Open (Aaron Baddeley) and Pebble Beach Pro-Am (Phil Mickelson) ended with scores of -20 or lower.

 

 

Does the winning score really matter, and if so, why? Golf fans who argue against Doral have their reasons. The World Golf Championship events are supposed to be played at a higher level than the average PGA Tour events, and the golf courses should be held to higher standards as well. If fans want to see -20 or lower, they can tune into The FBR Open or Pebble Beach Pro-Am.

 

 

The last few weeks on the PGA Tour have been very exciting, and a lot of the credit goes to the golf courses and how challenging they have been. The Florida Swing has been very tough so far, with the winning scores ranging from -5 to -10. The U.S. Open is my favorite stroke-play event in golf, so it's obvious I'm a fan of the winning scores close to even par. I like to see the golf course win as many battles as the golfers. The tougher the course, the better.

 

 

In the end, naysayers of Doral are mostly arguing the fact it's not difficult enough for a prestigious event. The tee shot at the 18th hole is difficult, but other than that, the course isn't very intimidating for the world's best. The rough is practically non-existant, which makes the course a long hitter's paradise (surprise surprise). We only get a few WGC events each season, and it would be nice to see some tougher courses along the way. I'm definitely one of the naysayers.

 

 

Arguments For Doral

First and foremost, The Blue Monster is one of the most popular golf courses in the United States. When I hear TPC at Sawgrass, I immediately think of the island green at 17. The same can be said for Doral. When I hear Blue Monster, I immediately think of the intimidating tee shot the players will face at the 18th hole. It's undoubtedly one of the toughest finishing holes in golf. The familiarity factor definitely helps golf fans get into the action a little better.

 

 

Also, the Florida Swing is always played in March, and this year will be no different. The Blue Monster is one of the most popular golf courses in Florida, and the timing keeps things flowing. Why would the PGA Tour have a WGC event somewhere else in the United States during the Florida Swing? It makes perfect sense in that regard.

 

 

Finally, the entire field plays the same golf course, and the tournament winner will obviously be the golfer with the lowest score after four days. So it really shouldn't matter if the winning score is -30 or +30. On top of that, the golf course is always in great shape, and the world's best golfers are going to tee it up regardless. It doesn't hurt that Tiger always adds Doral to his schedule. If it's one of Tiger's favorite courses, it seems to be one of the fans' favorite courses.

 

 

Future WGC Courses

Since I'm obviously one of Doral's naysayers, I'll list some other courses I'd prefer to see in its place for World Golf Championship events. The first that comes to mind is Congressional Country Club. The 1997 U.S. Open was played at Congressional, and things went great. The last couple holes are tough as nails, and the rest of the course isn't much easier. We got to see PGA Tour golfers play Congressional the week before the 2005 U.S. Open (Booz Allen Classic), but that was a one-time only deal. I'd love to see it more than once or twice a decade.

 

 

The second course that comes to mind is Whistling Straits, the site of the 2004 PGA Championship. To this day, that's still the only time I've seen a PGA Tour event held at Whistling Straits. It would be nice to see it more often, especially in a WGC capacity. Mixing it in every few years wouldn't make it any less enticing as a major championship venue either.

 

 

Finally, I'll give the Great Northwest a little love by mentioning Bandon Dunes. It's fairly new, but it would be a great test for the best golfers in the world. If nothing else, it would provide a new look for golf fans. It's high ranking in Golf Digest doesn't hurt its case any, so I say bring it on! It wouldn't fit into The Florida Swing very well, but flying doesn't take too long does it?

 

 

The Final Say

There are very good arguments for and against The Blue Monster as a WGC host venue, and as I've mentioned above, it all comes down to personal taste. Some fans like to see golfers struggle for pars, and some fans love to see tons of eagles and birdies. I'd rather see a competition between the golfer and course rather than a complete domination by the golfer over the course.

 

 

The past few events at Doral have been exciting for most fans, and I'm not trying to take anything away from it. It would still make a great PGA Tour event, but it probably won't make a great WGC event. There should be a difference between a regular PGA Tour and WGC event, but there won't be this week. Here's to hoping the course plays tougher than ever, and I look like a complete loser.

 

 

Now it's your turn to tell me what you think. Do you think Doral is worthy of hosting a World Golf Championship event? If so, why? If not, why? Finally, which other courses would you like to see host future WGC events? If you have anything to add, please comment below or discuss it in the forum. Thanks for reading this week's Thrash Talk!

[DRGJR72]

It's pretty weird not having The Players Championship in late March, but at least we get a World Golf Championship (WGC) event in its place. The fields for WGC events are always just as strong as they are for major championships, so it's definitely an added bonus. On top of that, we still get The Players Championship and Sawgrass in May.

 

 

Like I mentioned above, the fields are very strong for WGC events. The golf courses are usually equal to the task, but this week may be a little different. I was watching "The Approach" on The Golf Channel last night, and one of the topics really piqued my interest. The topic centered around whether or not The Blue Monster at Doral is worthy of having a World Golf Championship event.

 

 

Frank Nobilo argued for Doral, while Alex Miceli (the resident stats guy) argued against. In the end, it comes down to personal opinion. I'm going to break things down a little farther by listing arguments for and against, and I'll end by listing a few other courses that should be considered for future World Golf Championship events.

 

 

Arguments Against Doral

The main argument against Doral hosting a WGC event centers around the course difficulty. The winning score at the 2007 Ford Championship at Doral was -20, and the winning score in previous years wasn't much different. In 2007, only the winners of The FBR Open (Aaron Baddeley) and Pebble Beach Pro-Am (Phil Mickelson) ended with scores of -20 or lower.

 

 

Does the winning score really matter, and if so, why? Golf fans who argue against Doral have their reasons. The World Golf Championship events are supposed to be played at a higher level than the average PGA Tour events, and the golf courses should be held to higher standards as well. If fans want to see -20 or lower, they can tune into The FBR Open or Pebble Beach Pro-Am.

 

 

The last few weeks on the PGA Tour have been very exciting, and a lot of the credit goes to the golf courses and how challenging they have been. The Florida Swing has been very tough so far, with the winning scores ranging from -5 to -10. The U.S. Open is my favorite stroke-play event in golf, so it's obvious I'm a fan of the winning scores close to even par. I like to see the golf course win as many battles as the golfers. The tougher the course, the better.

 

 

In the end, naysayers of Doral are mostly arguing the fact it's not difficult enough for a prestigious event. The tee shot at the 18th hole is difficult, but other than that, the course isn't very intimidating for the world's best. The rough is practically non-existant, which makes the course a long hitter's paradise (surprise surprise). We only get a few WGC events each season, and it would be nice to see some tougher courses along the way. I'm definitely one of the naysayers.

 

 

Arguments For Doral

First and foremost, The Blue Monster is one of the most popular golf courses in the United States. When I hear TPC at Sawgrass, I immediately think of the island green at 17. The same can be said for Doral. When I hear Blue Monster, I immediately think of the intimidating tee shot the players will face at the 18th hole. It's undoubtedly one of the toughest finishing holes in golf. The familiarity factor definitely helps golf fans get into the action a little better.

 

 

Also, the Florida Swing is always played in March, and this year will be no different. The Blue Monster is one of the most popular golf courses in Florida, and the timing keeps things flowing. Why would the PGA Tour have a WGC event somewhere else in the United States during the Florida Swing? It makes perfect sense in that regard.

 

 

Finally, the entire field plays the same golf course, and the tournament winner will obviously be the golfer with the lowest score after four days. So it really shouldn't matter if the winning score is -30 or +30. On top of that, the golf course is always in great shape, and the world's best golfers are going to tee it up regardless. It doesn't hurt that Tiger always adds Doral to his schedule. If it's one of Tiger's favorite courses, it seems to be one of the fans' favorite courses.

 

 

Future WGC Courses

Since I'm obviously one of Doral's naysayers, I'll list some other courses I'd prefer to see in its place for World Golf Championship events. The first that comes to mind is Congressional Country Club. The 1997 U.S. Open was played at Congressional, and things went great. The last couple holes are tough as nails, and the rest of the course isn't much easier. We got to see PGA Tour golfers play Congressional the week before the 2005 U.S. Open (Booz Allen Classic), but that was a one-time only deal. I'd love to see it more than once or twice a decade.

 

 

The second course that comes to mind is Whistling Straits, the site of the 2004 PGA Championship. To this day, that's still the only time I've seen a PGA Tour event held at Whistling Straits. It would be nice to see it more often, especially in a WGC capacity. Mixing it in every few years wouldn't make it any less enticing as a major championship venue either.

 

 

Finally, I'll give the Great Northwest a little love by mentioning Bandon Dunes. It's fairly new, but it would be a great test for the best golfers in the world. If nothing else, it would provide a new look for golf fans. It's high ranking in Golf Digest doesn't hurt its case any, so I say bring it on! It wouldn't fit into The Florida Swing very well, but flying doesn't take too long does it?

 

 

The Final Say

There are very good arguments for and against The Blue Monster as a WGC host venue, and as I've mentioned above, it all comes down to personal taste. Some fans like to see golfers struggle for pars, and some fans love to see tons of eagles and birdies. I'd rather see a competition between the golfer and course rather than a complete domination by the golfer over the course.

 

 

The past few events at Doral have been exciting for most fans, and I'm not trying to take anything away from it. It would still make a great PGA Tour event, but it probably won't make a great WGC event. There should be a difference between a regular PGA Tour and WGC event, but there won't be this week. Here's to hoping the course plays tougher than ever, and I look like a complete loser.

 

 

Now it's your turn to tell me what you think. Do you think Doral is worthy of hosting a World Golf Championship event? If so, why? If not, why? Finally, which other courses would you like to see host future WGC events? If you have anything to add, please comment below or discuss it in the forum. Thanks for reading this week's Thrash Talk!

 

Ok here goes. First and foremost it appears as if they are trying to bolster the Florida Swing. So Congresional and Whistling Straits are non contenders this time of the year. If they were to move to another time of the year....Like when the weather is condusive to golf in the Northern half of the country, then yes I would agree.

 

Point 2. As a person that has qualified/played in a tour event at Doral, I will say that not only is it a great venue and it has a tremendous amount of history, the players like the golf course. Talking with alot of them on the range and during the practice rounds//tournament rounds, they love the golf course, the history, the fact that there are alot of things to do(distractions), bars to go to in the immediate area. Perks if you will. Not to mention a good amount of the PGA tour players have houses in FLA. So it is local and they can go home, relax, take their jet or jet pass and go down there and enjoy.

 

You can argue for any golf course in any state that would be worthy of a WGC event. Is Doral any better or any worse? That is personal opinion. If you look at the quality of the field over the history of Doral. I think you would say that it has to be at least a worthy contender. Time of the year has to be the major factor. There are only a few places in the states where they can hold a PGA tour event in March. Doral happens to be one of them. PGA national went to the Honda, so to little to late for them. Personally playing both of those courses.....PGA national is alot tougher in the wind, much more water and a little tighter. Doral has more space, but has added some serious distance.

 

So I don't really know. I am sure there are 50 golf courses that are more qualified to hold that type of event. But the bottome line is, Tim Finchem makes the decisions along with the sponsors and the players. They though Doral was good enough.

 

Dan

[Coach]

So I don't really know. I am sure there are 50 golf courses that are more qualified to hold that type of event. But the bottome line is, Tim Finchem makes the decisions along with the sponsors and the players. They though Doral was good enough.

 

Dan

I have not played Doral in years and I don't have a Pro game, but I like watching Doral even though I have no interest in playing the course over the 50 in the area that may or may not be better.

 

There is a thead on Golf Club Atlas now where an unnamed Tour Pro (through a poster who I know) says that Seminole is probably way too easy for Tour Pros to play an event there. Reality is not many private courses want a Pro event in prime season if they have a full membership. They are NOT going to play a regular PGA Tournament at Seminole!

[DRGJR72]

So I don't really know. I am sure there are 50 golf courses that are more qualified to hold that type of event. But the bottome line is, Tim Finchem makes the decisions along with the sponsors and the players. They though Doral was good enough.

 

Dan

I have not played Doral in years and I don't have a Pro game, but I like watching Doral even though I have no interest in playing the course over the 50 in the area that may or may not be better.

 

There is a thead on Golf Club Atlas now where an unnamed Tour Pro (through a poster who I know) says that Seminole is probably way too easy for Tour Pros to play an event there. Reality is not many private courses want a Pro event in prime season if they have a full membership. They are NOT going to play a regular PGA Tournament at Seminole!

 

Just a quick point. I was not saying that there were 50 golf courses better than Doral in the area, I meant in general. That is a WGC event and it could be played pretty much anytime of the year, and they could move it around in the schedule. But Doral is a great destination and a place that the tour guys love to play.

 

I have also played Seminole and the conditions would determine if it would be tour worthy. They get the greens to 14ish and they are super sloped. I don't know if it has the distance, parking, or the need/want to have an event there. Super private place but a super great golf course. They don't need the headache.

 

Dan

[mrnoncontactsports]

I really like this debate. It’s a good topic for discussion since the WGC events are an attempt to bring the game to the next level and the difficulty of the course with it. This week Doral showed its teeth with tough winds all week that really forced players to have to make shots that normally they don’t have to at this course. Are there better and more challenging courses in the U.S. that this event could be held at… yes that’s an easy answer.

 

The tougher question is whether or not there is another course that can provide a tougher venue in late march. I must say that I am a fan of the WGC at Doral, because I personally love the course since I have played it and it always provides a shoot out. Most notably would be 2005 with tiger and Phil gunning down the stretch. I think that it comes down to personal preference again, do you like a battle between players or the courses. Just because a course ay be tougher doesn’t necessarily mean the field will be closer to each other. I love it when someone can step up to tiger’s level and give him a run (come on Phil!).

 

The most interesting point I can make is whether or not the PGA should waste a WGC title on the event. I say this because like DRGJR72 said the players love the venue and would mostly likely play it regardless of the WGC title, most notably Tiger. And we all know that if tigers in an event it will do well. Tiger loves the course and the fact that he can dock his yacht in Miami and sleep there every night. So if the PGA could find a title sponsor willing to dish out at least 6 million in prize money the PGA would get two great events; a new great event at Doral and could add a WGC championship to another slow part of the season. I think that is the best option but it’s just my $.02.

[DemolitionMan]

Before anyone makes a case for/against Doral being worthy of a WGC event, maybe there should be a debate on what is the criteria for a WGC event. If you look at the history of the venues for this event, Doral is no better nor worse than just about any other course. Any debate is really personal opinion/preference.

 

Furthermore, let's put this debate in proper perspective. This WGC event has only been around since 1999, so it's not like it has established some long history of great tracks. Personally, I would have been fine with the event staying at Valderrama since we do not get to see that course enough on TV and it's a cool venue.

 

Is anyone seriously going to argue Doral is not as good as a choice as Mount Juliet Conrad (winning score -25)??? Capital City Club's Crabapple Course??? or Harding Park??? I don't think so.

[DRGJR72]

I really like this debate. It’s a good topic for discussion since the WGC events are an attempt to bring the game to the next level and the difficulty of the course with it. This week Doral showed its teeth with tough winds all week that really forced players to have to make shots that normally they don’t have to at this course. Are there better and more challenging courses in the U.S. that this event could be held at… yes that’s an easy answer.

 

The tougher question is whether or not there is another course that can provide a tougher venue in late march. I must say that I am a fan of the WGC at Doral, because I personally love the course since I have played it and it always provides a shoot out. Most notably would be 2005 with tiger and Phil gunning down the stretch. I think that it comes down to personal preference again, do you like a battle between players or the courses. Just because a course ay be tougher doesn’t necessarily mean the field will be closer to each other. I love it when someone can step up to tiger’s level and give him a run (come on Phil!).

 

The most interesting point I can make is whether or not the PGA should waste a WGC title on the event. I say this because like DRGJR72 said the players love the venue and would mostly likely play it regardless of the WGC title, most notably Tiger. And we all know that if tigers in an event it will do well. Tiger loves the course and the fact that he can dock his yacht in Miami and sleep there every night. So if the PGA could find a title sponsor willing to dish out at least 6 million in prize money the PGA would get two great events; a new great event at Doral and could add a WGC championship to another slow part of the season. I think that is the best option but it’s just my $.02.

 

I totaly agree with you with regard to the last paragraph. I am speaking from personal experience when I say that the players love that event and will play it regardless. Plus they really enjoy the golf course. It is fair and playable, although 18 is a total monster now. You can go there and have a great week, without feeling like you just had a root canal (aka US Open). The year that I qualified for Doral, the only big name that did not play that year was Tiger, and he has played almost every year since then. (I think he was scared of my game...LOL). I think that they are wasting the WGC event there, when they can still have a full field there with most of the top players. I think that you could put a WGC event later in the season across one of the events that not many people play in, and that opens you up to pretty much any course in the states during the summer. If you do that you are not limited to Florida, California, Mexico etc....How about a WGC event at Bandon Dunes or even better yet The International????

 

Dan

[emc]

I think it's a shame that 2 of the 3 individual WGC events (Bridgestone and Accenture) are in fixed locations, in America. I thought the original planof the WGC events was to spread the game globally. I'd love if the Australian Open was a WGC, and maybe one in South Africa or Asia would be cool too.

[Coach]

The tougher question is whether or not there is another course that can provide a tougher venue in late march. I must say that I am a fan of the WGC at Doral, because I personally love the course since I have played it and it always provides a shoot out. Most notably would be 2005 with tiger and Phil gunning down the stretch. I think that it comes down to personal preference again, do you like a battle between players or the courses. Just because a course ay be tougher doesn’t necessarily mean the field will be closer to each other. I love it when someone can step up to tiger’s level and give him a run (come on Phil!).

 

If you look at the "great" courses on Tour and additionally those not on Tour, most do not have much water in play. Augusta may have the most, as water really does not come into play that often at Pebble??? What is exciting about Doral are the water holes and how to play them down the stretch with 18 being obvious. Most architecture geeks do not like artificial water hazards but when a tournament is on the line, even Tiger plays the safe route which may eliminate birdie.

 

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