Tour Striker

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='mostlyharmless' timestamp='1317087591' post='3593264']
Martin,

I really like your swing with irons and hybrids (e.g., [url="http://www.youtube.com/user/cmartingolf#p/u/10/HZWWVZ-oTCg"]http://www.youtube.c.../10/HZWWVZ-oTCg[/url]). It shows how you can get plenty of distance without trying too hard. Could you post a video of your driver swing and perhaps explain how the wrist/hand position at impact with the driver is the same (or different) than striking an iron on the turf?

With the irons it seems you almost let the club fall on the ball but that wouldn't work as well with the driver right?
[/quote]

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f73Eloq-mlQ[/media]

[mostlyharmless]

Thanks Martin. That makes perfect sense. Focus on compressing the ball agains the turf with the turf (ala TS) with the irons. For the driver then you prefer an action where the lag is released a little earlier.

So does the following make sense: With the irons you want a (slightly) abbreviated follow through (e.g., Luke Donald) but with the driver you want to full follow through (e.g., Greg Norman).

[mostlyharmless]

Does that also mean you don't want a bowed left wrist at impact with the Driver?

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='mostlyharmless' timestamp='1317190202' post='3596807']
Thanks Martin. That makes perfect sense. Focus on compressing the ball agains the turf with the turf (ala TS) with the irons. For the driver then you prefer an action where the lag is released a little earlier.

So does the following make sense: With the irons you want a (slightly) abbreviated follow through (e.g., Luke Donald) but with the driver you want to full follow through (e.g., Greg Norman).
[/quote]

Yes. The follow through will be more "Norman like" with the driver because you are letting the velocity slow down naturally and the driver has the most inertia pulling on you. I'm not a fan of "cutting off" the momentum.

[quote name='mostlyharmless' timestamp='1317190610' post='3596813']
Does that also mean you don't want a bowed left wrist at impact with the Driver?
[/quote]

It all depends on the way you grip the club. A "weak" grip will appear "bowed" while a strong grip will appear turned (logo more facing the caddy)

[JoeCool73]

[size="2"]Just bought the tour striker on Wednesday through amazon. Was at my house Friday with free shipping. Very sweet. I used it on Saturday and today which is Sunday. Ive hit approx 500 balls with the tour striker pro 5 iron and all were taken off the mats there which are a pretty tight lie i.e not the cotton candy fluff mats. The fist few buckets were horrible and I nearly broke the club in half over my right knee out of frustration. I did however keep at and and by the 4th bucket I was able to get line drives. By the 6th bucket I flushed a few and was hitting it pretty good. Nice trajectory, distance,etc. Also today went well Id probally hit about 40 percent flush which is pretty good. As I was hitting at the range and still cussing under my breath on every bad shot, I literally turned around and noticed a few people watching me. Well, not me really as much as the TS pro 5 iron. They asked all the usual questions about how can you hit that, whats it for, etc. I then let them try it out for 5 dollars a swing, just kidding. That would be nice huh. The 2 guys I let try it seemed like pretty good ball strikers at the range, although Im 73 handicap so what the hell do I know anyway. I was amazed that they were hitting chilli peppers and line drives with it at first as well. When they soled the club on the ground they could not believe how far forward their hands had to be at impact to hit it flush. Great product for sure. Really forces you to keep your hands in front of the ball at impact. I have a terrible time with flipping the ball through impact. Im 6'4'' pretty athletic work out 3-4 times a week plus cardio. Also played tennis and football in high school and college and could not believe that I physically cant stop my hands from flipping through impact. So as the story goes, the more desperate a golfer becomes, the more money he spends on aids, books,colonics,etc. Although Ive been using Greg Normans secret, that has helped my flip but using your club, you know when you catch it flush. You cant cheat with it and that's what I really like about it. So there you have it, a great club and the best training aid I have ever bought. Now, since I gave a fantastic yet humorous review, and probably sold a few more of your tour strikers at the driving range, I need something in return. What is the best tip, drill, feeling, etc, to stop flipping,casting, scooping, early release, um whatever you want to call it, (Im not real technical here, I went to the University of Maryland so Im barely literate. Thank God for speel checking as well), that will let me catch more flush shots. And Ive already tried the ruler or ball pen under the watch on the left hand and a host of others ones so hopefully you can come up with a good one. No pressure or anything. Ive always said I love golf but golf doesn't love me back, but now maybe it will at least like me a little. I think for all golfers, what you think your doing or feeling and what your actually doing are two different things. That's what makes this game maddening. Hitting bad shots is fine by me if I can learn from them. In all seriousness, thanks for making a great product that truly enhances ones self esteem while playing this ridiculous game. [/size]

[Cmartingolf]

Joe, thanks for the kind review. I'll post a video for you. The 5-iron is a mofo, for sure. Give me a couple of days. Cheers.

[JoeCool73]

Thanks for the reply. I am definetly looking forward to the flipping video. I struggle with that constantly. Tried tons of drills and it seems it comes and goes on a shot to shot basis. Today is Wednesday and Ive had the TS pro 5i for 5 days now. Ive hit approx. 800 balls with it now and flush it about 25 percent of the time, 50 percent ok shots and the other 25 percent unmentionables off the matts there. Id say that is pretty good so far all things considered. My question is Im 6'4'' with a wrist to floor measurement of 37-38 inches. I hit your ts pro 5i way,way better than my own clubs! The TS pro 5i is standard length and lie. My current set has a +4 upright lie and +1.5 stiff steel shafts. Have you seen in your experience tall guys like me play with a standard lie set and have success? Your club also feels way lighter than my set and I really like the lighter feel personally. My swing speed is around 100-105 mph with my driver. With that info in mind I recently bid and won a mint verified original used set of ping G5 RH stiff flex graphite t100i irons 3-pw for 200.00 bucks shipped that Im looking forward to. Am I crazy for wanting to play with graphite shafted irons. I am in my mid thirites and my friends tell me Im going to be playing old man irons. Here is a brief video my wife took of me at the range with my current wedge. This shot went pretty good, about a 125 with my 50 degree wedge. Funny thing is, I felt like my hands were way way forward at impact. At impact at the 12 sec mark, you can clearly see they are not. Thanks again for your time and any help on these matters.


[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYv4HBFg6DE[/media]
[url="http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYv4HBFg6DE"]
[/url]

[TucsonGolf]

OK, I'm on the cusp of ordering this product. Not a naysayer in the bunch. First post by the way.

Like a previous poster, I'm returning to golf after a 4 year layoff. Had a 7 handicap at one time, but have always been a flipper. My trajectory, especially on short irons, is horrible and I mostly attribute this to flipping. I do other things poorly as well, but there seems to be such a fine line between flipping and the appropriate forward lean.

Here's my question: Can you be a flipper and still take a divot? I almost always take a divot. I know that I hit the ball first. I completely understand this concept and do it OK. I can even draw the ball most times, but my trajectory and distances are horrible. And I just can't seem to compress the ball the way I feel I should. I guess that makes me a flipper.

Any other flippers who have no problem taking a divot?

Thanks!

[ben w]

yes, but your divots will be erratic and of varying sizes, depths, etc.

if you begin grooving a good swing, you'll take nice, thin divots all day long. by the end of a range session I generally take out a nice 10"x10" section that looks like one big, shallow divot.

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='JoeCool73' timestamp='1318423985' post='3661969']
Thanks for the reply. I am definetly looking forward to the flipping video. I struggle with that constantly. Tried tons of drills and it seems it comes and goes on a shot to shot basis. Today is Wednesday and Ive had the TS pro 5i for 5 days now. Ive hit approx. 800 balls with it now and flush it about 25 percent of the time, 50 percent ok shots and the other 25 percent unmentionables off the matts there. Id say that is pretty good so far all things considered. [b][size="3"]My question is Im 6'4'' with a wrist to floor measurement of 37-38 inches. I hit your ts pro 5i way,way better than my own clubs! The TS pro 5i is standard length and lie. My current set has a +4 upright lie and +1.5 stiff steel shafts. [/size][/b] Have you seen in your experience tall guys like me play with a standard lie set and have success? Your club also feels way lighter than my set and I really like the lighter feel personally. My swing speed is around 100-105 mph with my driver. With that info in mind I recently bid and won a mint verified original used set of ping G5 RH stiff flex graphite t100i irons 3-pw for 200.00 bucks shipped that Im looking forward to. Am I crazy for wanting to play with graphite shafted irons. I am in my mid thirites and my friends tell me Im going to be playing old man irons. Here is a brief video my wife took of me at the range with my current wedge. This shot went pretty good, about a 125 with my 50 degree wedge. Funny thing is, I felt like my hands were way way forward at impact. At impact at the 12 sec mark, you can clearly see they are not. Thanks again for your time and any help on these matters.


[/quote]

Yikes...

Your clubs are effectively 7 up. I'm afraid you are the product of a terrible fit, imo. You were fit for the day you came to the fitter and you likely didn't discuss your goals and the fact you would be working on your swing. You are tall (I'm jealous) and present the shaft very vertical during impact. With those clubs, you have to do that. I put some thoughts into a video for you below. I think you'll do much better with your new bats. Hopefully they are standard lie! You can always bend them a little, but 7 up is nuts. If you were to lean the shaft and swing left, you'll hit the ball WAY left do to the bad lie angle.

Watch the video. Comments welcome.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ta8nOpU539U[/media]

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='TucsonGolf' timestamp='1318862792' post='3682925']
OK, I'm on the cusp of ordering this product. Not a naysayer in the bunch. First post by the way.

Like a previous poster, I'm returning to golf after a 4 year layoff. Had a 7 handicap at one time, but have always been a flipper. My trajectory, especially on short irons, is horrible and I mostly attribute this to flipping. I do other things poorly as well, but there seems to be such a fine line between flipping and the appropriate forward lean.

Here's my question: Can you be a flipper and still take a divot? I almost always take a divot. I know that I hit the ball first. I completely understand this concept and do it OK. I can even draw the ball most times, but my trajectory and distances are horrible. And I just can't seem to compress the ball the way I feel I should. I guess that makes me a flipper.

Any other flippers who have no problem taking a divot?

Thanks!
[/quote]

Tucson,

I just moved to Phoenix! I'm at the newly renovated Raven Golf Club.

Answer: Yes, you can be a flipper and take a divot. I don't see it too often, but I do see it. Those folks generally hit the ball pretty well but inconsistent.

I'm assuming you hit the ball higher and shorter than you would like?

[racolon]

Martin, I ordered mine last tuesday, they already charged me for it
But I dont have any tracking info and when I called they said they cant find my order, I know its probably a mistake, but I dont want the the refund, I want the TS

Hit me up when you can for details.
Thanks in advance

[racolon]

[quote name='Cmartingolf' timestamp='1318887778' post='3684737']
[quote name='TucsonGolf' timestamp='1318862792' post='3682925']
OK, I'm on the cusp of ordering this product. Not a naysayer in the bunch. First post by the way.

Like a previous poster, I'm returning to golf after a 4 year layoff. Had a 7 handicap at one time, but have always been a flipper. My trajectory, especially on short irons, is horrible and I mostly attribute this to flipping. I do other things poorly as well, but there seems to be such a fine line between flipping and the appropriate forward lean.

Here's my question: Can you be a flipper and still take a divot? I almost always take a divot. I know that I hit the ball first. I completely understand this concept and do it OK. I can even draw the ball most times, but my trajectory and distances are horrible. And I just can't seem to compress the ball the way I feel I should. I guess that makes me a flipper.

Any other flippers who have no problem taking a divot?

Thanks!
[/quote]

Tucson,

I just moved to Phoenix! I'm at the newly renovated Raven Golf Club.

Answer: Yes, you can be a flipper and take a divot. I don't see it too often, but I do see it. Those folks generally hit the ball pretty well but inconsistent.

I'm assuming you hit the ball higher and shorter than you would like?
[/quote]


BINGO!
I have exactly the same problem, Im a flipper too, take pretty good divots too, but I hit it way high and not the distance I used to like 7 months ago.

My swing went south after a swing change which obviously did not work for me....
I used to hit my 7 iron for 175 yards dead on, now I hit it for 148 and high as H*** and a slight fade, before I had a nice draw.
The only good thing of me going to short was that I had to rely on short game and putting to score, and thus, my game improved, but I am still short as H***

Went to Doral, took a 4 day class session 2 weeks ago, I was shown what I was doing good and what I was doing WRONG, I took with me some videos of my old swing, and the Pro suggested obviously what we worked on the classes, and as a training aid the TS Pro 7 iron

Im an 8 index, was at 7 but you know...

[TucsonGolf]

[quote name='Cmartingolf' timestamp='1318887778' post='3684737']
[quote name='TucsonGolf' timestamp='1318862792' post='3682925']
OK, I'm on the cusp of ordering this product. Not a naysayer in the bunch. First post by the way.

Like a previous poster, I'm returning to golf after a 4 year layoff. Had a 7 handicap at one time, but have always been a flipper. My trajectory, especially on short irons, is horrible and I mostly attribute this to flipping. I do other things poorly as well, but there seems to be such a fine line between flipping and the appropriate forward lean.

Here's my question: Can you be a flipper and still take a divot? I almost always take a divot. I know that I hit the ball first. I completely understand this concept and do it OK. I can even draw the ball most times, but my trajectory and distances are horrible. And I just can't seem to compress the ball the way I feel I should. I guess that makes me a flipper.

Any other flippers who have no problem taking a divot?

Thanks!
[/quote]

Tucson,

I just moved to Phoenix! I'm at the newly renovated Raven Golf Club.

Answer: Yes, you can be a flipper and take a divot. I don't see it too often, but I do see it. Those folks generally hit the ball pretty well but inconsistent.

I'm assuming you hit the ball higher and shorter than you would like?
[/quote]

Martin-

Thanks for the quick reply. Yes, I hit the ball pretty well but inconsistent. I also hit it too high and short, but the high is a weird high, not a balloon, but more like up quickly and down quickly. I know that I dont compress the ball like I should.

Follow on question: What do you call someone who can generally square the club at impact, but adds loft rather than delofting? Is that still a flipper?

Also, welcome to AZ. I played the Rave years ago, but not since the renovation. I'll have to come out and introduce myself.

Thanks for all of your help.

[JoeCool73]

Hey thanks for the video instruction on my swing, that is really helpful for sure. I appreciate your time Martin for looking at my video and editing it, excellent. My pings will be here today. They are stiff flex graphite and green dot or +2 upright. So they are way less upright from my other set that you saw. According to the ping web fit chart with my wrist to floor measurement being approx. 38 inches ping recommends a white or silver or +3 to a +3.75 degree upright lie angle and +1/2 length shaft for my clubs. I purposely went lower than that a tad. Like you said I can bend them to a better lie angle if necessary. I guess sometimes numbers do lie based on preference and the way you play. I also ordered a HS Casio fs-10 1000 fps camera off of eBay for 120.00. Really want to look at my swing in slow motion. The swing above is about 1/2 speed for me. I was not trying to go full out. I do prefer to address the ball in an impact forward press position. With using your club and doing the forward press, My impact position is definitely improving. Now on full swings with the ts 5i my carry is about 175-180. I still hit some bad ones due to flipping casting etc. but when its flushed it is a feeling of greatness. Ha.. I always tease my wife that I wish I was shorter, 5'8 - 5'10. It would make buying clothes and even cars much easier for me. She laughs and tells me if I were shorter we would have never got married. I sometimes wonder would that be a good or bad thing..lol. Shes only 5'4 , and Im like hobbits and ompaloopas are taller than her..haha. Seriously thanks for the feedback and when my Casio camera gets here Ill upload some cool matrix style gold swings that everyone can laugh at. Thanks again. Not sure what you mean my +7 degrees up though.

[JoeCool73]

I know this probably sounds elementary to most of you guys but I been finding that if I keep my 3 left fingers tight it keeps my face square and straight to the target. Im still not sure about the right hand though.

[russc1597187869]

[quote name='JoeCool73' timestamp='1318940741' post='3687417']
Hey thanks for the video instruction on my swing, that is really helpful for sure. I appreciate your time Martin for looking at my video and editing it, excellent. My pings will be here today. They are stiff flex graphite and green dot or +2 upright. So they are way less upright from my other set that you saw. According to the ping web fit chart with my wrist to floor measurement being approx. 38 inches ping recommends a white or silver or +3 to a +3.75 degree upright lie angle and +1/2 length shaft for my clubs. I purposely went lower than that a tad. Like you said I can bend them to a better lie angle if necessary. I guess sometimes numbers do lie based on preference and the way you play. I also ordered a HS Casio fs-10 1000 fps camera off of eBay for 120.00. Really want to look at my swing in slow motion. The swing above is about 1/2 speed for me. I was not trying to go full out. I do prefer to address the ball in an impact forward press position. With using your club and doing the forward press, My impact position is definitely improving. Now on full swings with the ts 5i my carry is about 175-180. I still hit some bad ones due to flipping casting etc. but when its flushed it is a feeling of greatness. Ha.. I always tease my wife that I wish I was shorter, 5'8 - 5'10. It would make buying clothes and even cars much easier for me. She laughs and tells me if I were shorter we would have never got married. I sometimes wonder would that be a good or bad thing..lol. Shes only 5'4 , and Im like hobbits and ompaloopas are taller than her..haha. Seriously thanks for the feedback and when my Casio camera gets here Ill upload some cool matrix style gold swings that everyone can laugh at. Thanks again. Not sure what you mean my +7 degrees up though.
[/quote]
Martin also does long distance internet video instruction in which he analyzes your swing in more detail..It would be a great idea for you to avail yourself of his services..Martin has a thorough understanding of the fundamentals of the the golf swing ,having learned under the great George Knudson, and an ability to communicate clearly on effective ideas to improve your swing.

[JoeCool73]

Sounds interesting for sure. What Martin said I totally agree with. The 2 dollar question is how to keep your hands from flipping through impact. Maybe Ill get a cast for my left hand...lol. I just got a hs camera that should help. Recieved it last night. Going to the range today to try it out with the TS pro 5i and my new set of ping g5s.

[racolon]

My TS is home!!! Range tonite, lets see how it goes.

TS Pro 7 iron

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='JoeCool73' timestamp='1319116610' post='3696623']
Sounds interesting for sure. What Martin said I totally agree with. The 2 dollar question is how to keep your hands from flipping through impact. Maybe Ill get a cast for my left hand...lol. I just got a hs camera that should help. Recieved it last night. Going to the range today to try it out with the TS pro 5i and my new set of ping g5s.
[/quote]

Great question!

1. It sure [b][u]helps[/u][/b] if you know the best way to use the club. That's why I made the TS, so people can't pick the ball off the ground with the bottom groove. The TS encourages you to have some lean and a bit of downward strike.

2. You don't want a cast on your left hand! Freedom and free wheeling is what you want. It is nice if that freedom and free wheeling makes for a great impact condition that has maximum leverage. Here's what to look for to avoid the dreaded "flip."

a. Grip - you will try and square the face. If your grip doesn't allow for a square strike without a flip, you will flip. Thus my suggestion to grip the club in an impact condition (give or take) then take that alignment back to a mid-body position.
b. Body - golfers who use a lot of pivot (generally the better athletes) will tend to grip the club stronger so their opening (pivoting) will present a face that is square.
c. Poor arm structure at the top of the swing can cause the wrist angles to unhinge early. Generally an overswing and overly bent right elbow will cause a person to cast and flip the club.

More to add, but my daughter wants to play!


[quote name='racolon' timestamp='1319126908' post='3697277']
My TS is home!!! Range tonite, lets see how it goes.

TS Pro 7 iron
[/quote]

Good luck!!

[JoeCool73]

Here is an updated video in high speed at 210 fps using the Tour Striker 5i pro. Even with what felt like a good swing, still flipping. The ball went about 175 on the first swing in the video, hence the thumbs up. However, once I viewed it on playback I used a different finger to salute the golf gods. That was eventually edited out of the final cut. Cant seem to make myself have a flat left wrist at impact, even though hit feels like it is.


[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_mgEXtxciA[/media]

[JoeCool73]

I really hope my pain and humiliation will help other guys reading this thread..lol. I agree with what your saying and I think I address the ball in an impact position. I don't go from that to a traditional position before the swing. What advantage would that give me? I literally try to hold that left wrist flat throughout the swing. I thought by preloading the flat left wrist would be a good thing. I am however up to try just about anything to get rid of this flip though.

[racolon]

My update from lastnight:

TS Pro 7 iron
60 balls = 16% efficiency
10 out of 60 balls went dead straight, high and long.. around 175 which I cant believe it

Punch shots:
15 balls = 53% efficiency
8 out of 15 balls came out low perfect how I wanted them, so I am guessing and considering that my issue is somewhere in my full swing.
The other 7 balls went either left or right but low as I wanted.

Driver:
Using a new driver / shaft combo, some pulls, some push fades, some nasty cuts, some high etc... Did hit 1 to the end of the range (no idea how long is that, but looked pretty long)

I have 15 video clips, around 8 to 16 seconds max, Martin, do you have an email I can send all these to you for analysis?

Thanks

[Finbarr Saunders]

[quote name='JoeCool73' timestamp='1319194901' post='3700501']
I really hope my pain and humiliation will help other guys reading this thread..lol. I agree with what your saying and I think I address the ball in an impact position. I don't go from that to a traditional position before the swing. What advantage would that give me? I literally try to hold that left wrist flat throughout the swing. I thought by preloading the flat left wrist would be a good thing. I am however up to try just about anything to get rid of this flip though.
[/quote]


I'm no expert but i noticed you had a groove on your right thumb from placing it on top of the shaft, the thumb must be placed to the left of center and it should feel as if does nothing in the golf swing. Once the thumb and forefinger start working together it can start to dominate and can force your right wrist to straighten, which will cause the left wrist to cup and thats one of the reasons why we flip at the ball


i found a video that might help

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OybkadM5Bxs&feature=related"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OybkadM5Bxs&feature=related[/url]

[JoeCool73]

Finbarr Saunders, that is an excellent tip. Im on youtube all the time looking at golf drill, tips,etc. I don't know how I missed that one. Amazing how many videos are on you tube, I will try it tonight. Thanks again for that link.

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='JoeCool73' timestamp='1319193828' post='3700481']
Here is an updated video in high speed at 210 fps using the Tour Striker 5i pro. Even with what felt like a good swing, still flipping. The ball went about 175 on the first swing in the video, hence the thumbs up. However, once I viewed it on playback I used a different finger to salute the golf gods. That was eventually edited out of the final cut. Cant seem to make myself have a flat left wrist at impact, even though hit feels like it is.


[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_mgEXtxciA[/media]
[/quote]

Joe, that is better than the first video!! Way better in a short period of time.

Do me a favor and "try" the mid body hands starting location and post that video.

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='JoeCool73' timestamp='1319194901' post='3700501']
I really hope my pain and humiliation will help other guys reading this thread..lol. I agree with what your saying and I think I address the ball in an impact position. I don't go from that to a traditional position before the swing. What advantage would that give me? I literally try to hold that left wrist flat throughout the swing. I thought by preloading the flat left wrist would be a good thing. I am however up to try just about anything to get rid of this flip though.
[/quote]

No holding of any flat left wrist... No holding, brother.

It's all in the sequence of the how the club releases, but like I said, there are a lot of little elements (grip, pivot) that determine how you will arrive at the ball. However, no holding, ever.

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='racolon' timestamp='1319201644' post='3700711']
My update from lastnight:

TS Pro 7 iron
60 balls = 16% efficiency
10 out of 60 balls went dead straight, high and long.. around 175 which I cant believe it

Punch shots:
15 balls = 53% efficiency
8 out of 15 balls came out low perfect how I wanted them, so I am guessing and considering that my issue is somewhere in my full swing.
The other 7 balls went either left or right but low as I wanted.

Driver:
Using a new driver / shaft combo, some pulls, some push fades, some nasty cuts, some high etc... Did hit 1 to the end of the range (no idea how long is that, but looked pretty long)

I have 15 video clips, around 8 to 16 seconds max, Martin, do you have an email I can send all these to you for analysis?

Thanks
[/quote]

[email protected]

I'll send you a cloud folder and you can upload them to save my inbox.

[Cmartingolf]

[quote name='Finbarr Saunders' timestamp='1319210375' post='3701183']
[quote name='JoeCool73' timestamp='1319194901' post='3700501']
I really hope my pain and humiliation will help other guys reading this thread..lol. I agree with what your saying and I think I address the ball in an impact position. I don't go from that to a traditional position before the swing. What advantage would that give me? I literally try to hold that left wrist flat throughout the swing. I thought by preloading the flat left wrist would be a good thing. I am however up to try just about anything to get rid of this flip though.
[/quote]


I'm no expert but i noticed you had a groove on your right thumb from placing it on top of the shaft, the thumb must be placed to the left of center and it should feel as if does nothing in the golf swing. Once the thumb and forefinger start working together it can start to dominate and can force your right wrist to straighten, which will cause the left wrist to cup and thats one of the reasons why we flip at the ball


i found a video that might help

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OybkadM5Bxs&feature=related"]http://www.youtube.c...feature=related[/url]
[/quote]

Very true. You don't need a right thumb to be a great striker.

Here's another from some guy...
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ckj4oGQfW8c[/media]

[JoeCool73]

Just read your post and Ill try that today for sure Martin, get into impact position with my grip then bring it back to a mid position then swing. I will give it a try and post a video of my swing. Here is one from last night. Sorry about the lighting, high speed cameras dont like not having a lot of light. I did try the right index finger and thumb off the club. You can totally see my hands flipping. Could not hit the ball like that, literally. I was like swing batter, batter,swing, and a miss. Your video above is exactly what Im talking about. Your first swing at the 11 second mark, you hear that sound you made when you came into impact on the mat. That sound is exactly what I want and do not have. I totally flip and sweep through the ball.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4SEwOkuChM[/media]