Anyone else experience this putting phenomenon?

This is just a guess but perhaps you typically aim to the right of the hole then pull the putt. If you are used to putting that way then you change to lining up the ball with the hole, it will look left to you from the side and if you put your same pull swing on it, it will go left.

You might consider putting a line all the way around a ball, aiming it at a target and seeing if you can putt it so it rolls perfectly end-over-end with no wobble at the target. If I am right, this will probably be hard for you to do at first.

My guess would be that your stroke has developed such that you come across the line with your putter (meaning you come outside to in if you're a right handed player). To compensate, you've learned to line your feet and hips pointing to the right of the target line so that your outside-to-in stroke tracks up and down the target line due to the compensation in body alignment. Therefore, when you line up your ball first you probably end up lining your feet, hips and body with the ball target line. Your ingrained stroke then hits it left of the target line. Therefore, if you're very used to your alignment being to the right, the ball just looks "weird" when it's lined up dead at the target line.

You can do one of two things about this:

1) If you feel you have a consistent stroke and you are generally happy with your putting, don't worry about it. Plenty of good putters have putted without their feet, hips or shoulders being perfectly square (Nicklaus is an example that comes to mind). Just be aware that your tendency with your stroke is to hit it a little left of where your toe-line is pointed. If you really want to use your ball to aim and line up with, just be sure to focus on lining your putter's face with the target line and then let your feet and hips find their place naturally. I'd recommend going with this option if you can.

2) If you're not happy with your stroke you could work to change it. Honestly though, if you're going to be working on changing your stroke I'd say work with a good pro in your area. It's too tough to make changes to ingrained mechanics without somebody else being there to watch and make sure you do it right. There are specific drills that you can do to help you keep the putter on line throughout the swing. Setting up a string line over the target line and keeping your putter tracking on or inside of that line is one I like. Another is setting a board, running parallel to the target line, just outside of the toe of your putter and hitting shots with that in place.

Let me know if that helps or if it's totally off. I guess option 3 is to just hit it within 2' every time. I'd take that option if I could :).

Thanks for the response guys, I am not sure what it is yet. Frankly I was hoping others had this dilema as well. My putting is the weakest part of my game right now so I guess I had better delve into that. I am just confused because I can roll it on the line that is on the ball, but it goes straight left.

Your optics are off. You need to retrain your eyes by practicing with a laser trainer, chalk line, or some other training device that helps you with alignment.

DAVID ORR - PLEASE HELP!

Kevin

Your optics are off. You need to retrain your eyes by practicing with a laser trainer, chalk line, or some other training device that helps you with alignment.

 

DAVID ORR - PLEASE HELP!

 

Kevin

Thanks. Mr Orr, if you read this, please tell me you have heard of this problem before.

I would agree that your optics are off. I have a similar problem in that my putter arc is outside-in, meaning I cut across it. I determined my eyes were aimed left, which causes all kinds of nice problems. Your brain is very intuitive and will alter whatever is necessary to overcome alignment issues. It sounds like you aim right and comepnsate with a pull stroke. So when you do aim straight the ball goes left even though you swear you made a perfect stroke.

Sorry I'm not really adding anything that hasn't been said but I surmise that's the problem. I would suggest practicing aligning the ball straight and work on your putter arc. You need to come from the inside more, similar to hitting a draw on a full swing. Make sure your forearms are aligned. Take your grip and have someone place a shaft or stick along your mid-forearms toward the target. This dictates the direction of your stoke and should aim at the target. Like others stated it may be difficult and best done with assistance of others, but it would be a start. I would forget about it while playing though, it should be a gradual process that takes time to groove. That being said, if you putt well you could leave it alone.

Step 1. Do a test for eye dominance and determine your dominant eye.

Step 2. Behind the ball, close your non-dominant eye and line up your line with your target with your dominant eye behind the ball.

Step 3. Position your dominant eye over the ball when at address.

Try the basic String Between 2 Tees drill. Attach a string between 2 long tees (or pencils, etc). Line up a flat putt with the line on the ball under the string. Putt under the string along the line of the putt. Good check to see if it's you're swing path.

Good Luck.

Thanks for the response guys, I am not sure what it is yet. Frankly I was hoping others had this dilema as well. My putting is the weakest part of my game right now so I guess I had better delve into that. I am just confused because I can roll it on the line that is on the ball, but it goes straight left.

That's got me a little confused... Are you saying your putts start out on line and then curve left, or do they start out left off of the putter face and then keep going on a straight line after that?

Try the basic String Between 2 Tees drill. Attach a string between 2 long tees (or pencils, etc). Line up a flat putt with the line on the ball under the string. Putt under the string along the line of the putt. Good check to see if it's you're swing path.

 

Good Luck.

I have practiced hitting down the line between two clubs on the ground. I dont seem to have any problems hitting it on the line I see, I am sure that I probably do have stroke issues to boot though.

Thanks for the response guys, I am not sure what it is yet. Frankly I was hoping others had this dilema as well. My putting is the weakest part of my game right now so I guess I had better delve into that. I am just confused because I can roll it on the line that is on the ball, but it goes straight left.

 

 

That's got me a little confused... Are you saying your putts start out on line and then curve left, or do they start out left off of the putter face and then keep going on a straight line after that?

They go straight in the direction of the line on my ball, which now is left of target, but appeared to be straight when I lined it up from behind the ball.

Thanks for the response guys, I am not sure what it is yet. Frankly I was hoping others had this dilema as well. My putting is the weakest part of my game right now so I guess I had better delve into that. I am just confused because I can roll it on the line that is on the ball, but it goes straight left.

 

 

That's got me a little confused... Are you saying your putts start out on line and then curve left, or do they start out left off of the putter face and then keep going on a straight line after that?

 

They go straight in the direction of the line on my ball, which now is left of target, but appeared to be straight when I lined it up from behind the ball.

Ok, I think we all might be a little confused. I think what he is saying is when he lines the put up from behind, then when he gets over the ball it looks aimed to the left. If so I understand, I have a problem just like this. I also have trieid to pick a spot a few inches in front of the ball. The reason is that the ball is round not FLAT so you can't draw a straight line on it. So try to aim the line at a spot that you can see when standing over the ball and try that. I am no Pro and will never be, but I want to make more puts also and will try anything to do so........

Thanks for the response guys, I am not sure what it is yet. Frankly I was hoping others had this dilema as well. My putting is the weakest part of my game right now so I guess I had better delve into that. I am just confused because I can roll it on the line that is on the ball, but it goes straight left.

 

 

That's got me a little confused... Are you saying your putts start out on line and then curve left, or do they start out left off of the putter face and then keep going on a straight line after that?

 

They go straight in the direction of the line on my ball, which now is left of target, but appeared to be straight when I lined it up from behind the ball.

 

Ok, I think we all might be a little confused. I think what he is saying is when he lines the put up from behind, then when he gets over the ball it looks aimed to the left. If so I understand, I have a problem just like this. I also have trieid to pick a spot a few inches in front of the ball. The reason is that the ball is round not FLAT so you can't draw a straight line on it. So try to aim the line at a spot that you can see when standing over the ball and try that. I am no Pro and will never be, but I want to make more puts also and will try anything to do so........

What he said. Maybe as an alternative try linining it up from behind with one eye shut, like a rifle sight. It may be...I feel ridiculous even suggesting this as an explaination...it may be that your right eye is a lot more dominant than your left so, when you line it up using both eyes, it looks straight but but is actually pointing left because your dominant right eye takes over.

Looking over what I just wrote on review I would like to add that that explanation may be either really, really good or emmenently stupid. :black eye: I guess we'll find out.

First off it seems you need to somehow verify the line on the ball is in fact pointing at the cup. If the ball is going left either

A) it was pointed left to begin with (when you lined it up you thought it was straight) or

B) You are not setting up square to the line on the ball

C) Your stroke is not putting a true roll on the ball

So check these things A then B then C

A)

1: Line up a putt using the line to what you think is the center of the cup on a STRAIGHT putt (maybe 8-10 feet)

2: Using a piece of string and two tees check your line (or something slightly longer if you use shorter tees) - Tie the string to the top of each tee: stick one in the ground in the center of the cup opposite your ball, pull the string across the cup and stand with your ball directly between you and the cup. Now center the string on the ball and stick the second tee in the ground. Does the string go across the line on the ball? If so then on to B

B)

Now with the setup from A undisturbed, you need to get square with your string. Probably do this easiest with a shaft from another club or another couple of tees. Address the ball normally and then mark your toe position on you back foot in relation to the line from step A using another tee in front of your shoe. Now just use your putter as a makeshift ruler and note the distance from the string; move over the width of your stance and using your putter-ruler to match the distance and place another tee in the ground. These two "toe points" should now leave you with a square address to the target line from step A

C)

Now like another poster suggested you need a ball with a line perfectly drawn around the center. Actually it would be better if you have someone else to watch it as well, if you're popping your head up immediately to check how true the roll is you can almost bet it won't be a true roll or very good stroke. Now when you putt the ball you should see that line look almost stationary, almost no change. If it wobbles then you have identified the issue is in your stroke.

Sorry for the long post but the original question was posted almost with a tone like you were looking for an answer like "the curve of the ball creates an optical illusion causing it to look like it's pointed left, but really that's normal: Tiger and all those guys just aim right a little". I just wanted to be clear that there is a quantifiable issue with either the setup or the stroke here; there are no hidden "gotchas" that are inherent to the lining up the ball with the alignment aid other than the fact that the person did not align the ball properly, align their body properly, or stroke the ball properly (of course this entire post is in the context of an absolutely straight putt, the read of the break of course factors in otherwise).

First off it seems you need to somehow verify the line on the ball is in fact pointing at the cup. If the ball is going left either

A) it was pointed left to begin with (when you lined it up you thought it was straight) or

B) You are not setting up square to the line on the ball

C) Your stroke is not putting a true roll on the ball

 

So check these things A then B then C

A)

1: Line up a putt using the line to what you think is the center of the cup on a STRAIGHT putt (maybe 8-10 feet)

2: Using a piece of string and two tees check your line (or something slightly longer if you use shorter tees) - Tie the string to the top of each tee: stick one in the ground in the center of the cup opposite your ball, pull the string across the cup and stand with your ball directly between you and the cup. Now center the string on the ball and stick the second tee in the ground. Does the string go across the line on the ball? If so then on to B

 

B)

Now with the setup from A undisturbed, you need to get square with your string. Probably do this easiest with a shaft from another club or another couple of tees. Address the ball normally and then mark your toe position on you back foot in relation to the line from step A using another tee in front of your shoe. Now just use your putter as a makeshift ruler and note the distance from the string; move over the width of your stance and using your putter-ruler to match the distance and place another tee in the ground. These two "toe points" should now leave you with a square address to the target line from step A

 

C)

Now like another poster suggested you need a ball with a line perfectly drawn around the center. Actually it would be better if you have someone else to watch it as well, if you're popping your head up immediately to check how true the roll is you can almost bet it won't be a true roll or very good stroke. Now when you putt the ball you should see that line look almost stationary, almost no change. If it wobbles then you have identified the issue is in your stroke.

 

 

Sorry for the long post but the original question was posted almost with a tone like you were looking for an answer like "the curve of the ball creates an optical illusion causing it to look like it's pointed left, but really that's normal: Tiger and all those guys just aim right a little". I just wanted to be clear that there is a quantifiable issue with either the setup or the stroke here; there are no hidden "gotchas" that are inherent to the lining up the ball with the alignment aid other than the fact that the person did not align the ball properly, align their body properly, or stroke the ball properly (of course this entire post is in the context of an absolutely straight putt, the read of the break of course factors in otherwise).

Thanks a lot, to all of you. I will go through this ABC process and try to figure out what it is. You are right I was hoping it was something that people had experienced and knew immediately what it was that I was doing wrong. The good news is that I believe that once I suss that out, I believe I will be a really good putter, I have pretty good speed control but then miss the 2 footer coming back. I would rather have a 10 foot put than a 3 foot putt at this point.

One more question, if my intial aim turns out to be good with the line, how would my alignment make the sight picture different though? If I open or close my stance the line will still be in the same direction won't it? I'll let you know how it goes.

I used to point the line at my intended target but I felt this was not allowing me to be accurate enough (For Me) so now I take the line and square it to my target instead of pointing it at it.

On my Tee shots I point the line at where I want to start the ball.

Guys, thanks for the input, I think I kind of figured something out. Last night I drew a lie all around the ball then tried lining up, at first when I got to the side of the ball it looked dead left again. I knew it couldnt be though, because I had an alignment putter on the far side of the ball. I then adressed and re-adressed the ball with same results. Finally, instead of lining up the putter to the ball I kept my eye on my target as I came around and put the club down. my eyes followed the line from the target to the ball & lo & behold the line appeared the way it should be. I guess after a little more play that whenever I set up to the ball first the track an imaginary line from the ball to the putter my optics go wonky, however if I focus on the target first & trace an imaginary line in the opposite direction the line appears correct.

So I started rolling some puts down the intended line and the line of ball went crazy, and I was pulling the hell out of it. Figured that all your posts about my swing path were correct and just kep trying to roll the ball end over end. Anyway, by midnight (my wife thinks I am crazy) I was able to line up and putt the ball down the line that I had lined up from behind. I guess all of your suggestions were pretty much on target, so thanks for all of your help. Hope this will carry over to the course, if it works like I think it may, I will definitely save 4 or more stokes a round, if not more!

There is a book, "See it and Sink it" by Craig Farnsworth that talks about exactly this phenomenon. Interesting book and worth checking out IMO.

There is a book, "See it and Sink it" by Craig Farnsworth that talks about exactly this phenomenon. Interesting book and worth checking out IMO.

What does the book say?

The book basically says that many players will align the logo towards their intended target, but when they look at the ball in their address postition it looks misaligned. The problem is with the players visual system and the way they perceive the target.

Tom Kite was uncomfortable with this technique, the author had him align the ball, then set the putter square to the line, square his body up, and then putt over a spot in front of the ball instead of looking at the whole putting line.

The author claimed that with time, the logo will appear to look "straighter" as your mind gets used to the technique.

In a later section of the book, he also mentions that "eyes positoned outside the line shift the hole, perceptually, to the left of the actual location". He indicated this typically results in putts off the heel and putts that go left.

Hope this helps.

This is all great information guys, thanks. I have always had this same problem when trying to use the line.

The biggest problem is caused by how you walk into the putt

Most if not all players are setting themselves up to hook the putt, and then open the putterface because they dont believe the alignment made from behind the hole

to combat this walk down the line of the putt , then turn 90 deg into your posture

the line on the ball wont look off

if you then keep looking at the hole and back at the line on the ball , you will confuse the signal and re target

We have a program called Break 30 where we use this technique , initially it uses a cross rather than a line on the ball - this gives 360 alignment reference

The biggest problem is caused by how you walk into the putt

Most if not all players are setting themselves up to hook the putt, and then open the putterface because they dont believe the alignment made from behind the hole

to combat this walk down the line of the putt , then turn 90 deg into your posture

the line on the ball wont look off

 

if you then keep looking at the hole and back at the line on the ball , you will confuse the signal and re target

 

We have a program called Break 30 where we use this technique , initially it uses a cross rather than a line on the ball - this gives 360 alignment reference

Sounds interesting, I may try it out.