What's wrong with Ben Hogan's Five Lessons?

[ezra76]

How bout a simple observation from a mid handicapper. I read that you turn your hips as fast as you can in the downswing, however, when I analyze Hogan's swing VS. mine when I've tried this, I am wide open to the target at impact, he is not at all. There is a move there he's not talking about or I missed. His legs are driving forward a ton, it's a turn I guess but looks like they slide towards the target. Mine don't do that. Perhaps I missed that part in the book where he describes it?

[JD3]

Ok i have some questions

1) people advocate hogan keeps his left arm glued to his chest on the downswing well quite frankly i don't see this at all watching him on film i see the left arm away from his chest coming in to the hitting area and then the upper part reconnecting as he hits the ball I may be wrong???2) did hogan actively supinate at impact?

3) did he "drag" the club on the takeaway to help get the elbows closer together

4) stories say hogan divulged his secret was the right elbow staying up and back in the downswing according to jim hardy is this true?

5) did he pull the left arm through the hitting area or "push" the right arm on the downswing?

6) did he actively rotate his forearms on the backswing ? did he rotate them on the downswing?

 

sorry for so many questions but honestly i'm just at the starting blocks!!

You're right as one can clearly see seperation between the left arm and chest prior to impact. It starts to connect when his arm is nearing the end of impact zone and it's over the left leg. I think the reason is when the arm is connected to the chest it will roll over, which is not what Mr. Hogan wanted to do prior to or during the 1st 2/3rds of impact. It connects at the point it does so the club can swing around to the left, and forearm roll over is a necessary component at that point. As much as the seperation is clear before and during most of impact, the lead arm tightly pressing against the chest is also distinctly visible when he's coming out of the impact zone.

[donmcd]

How bout a simple observation from a mid handicapper. I read that you turn your hips as fast as you can in the downswing, however, when I analyze Hogan's swing VS. mine when I've tried this, I am wide open to the target at impact, he is not at all. There is a move there he's not talking about or I missed. His legs are driving forward a ton, it's a turn I guess but looks like they slide towards the target. Mine don't do that. Perhaps I missed that part in the book where he describes it?

 

I did the same thing as you. tried driving with the hips, creating separation with the upper body. I don't think it's correct. easiest way to discover this is to grab a medicine ball in the gym and start throwing it against the wall (in a golfing motion like the basketball pass in 5 lessons). I have discovered by experimentation that leading with the hips just plain doesn't work. the most power you can generate is with an unwinding of your core...i.e. your body is in synch. try it and you'll see what I mean.

[FlyingWedge]

Two things in the book misleadining the arms bound together with elbows faceing forward -no! The second the base line shifting to the right-no! The base line never shifts |

[downtoscratch]

Mizuno67 Please explain how releasing the club with loft precludes

The face being square to the arc.

 

FlyingWedge Please explain your term shifting the base line.

 

Thanks, DTS

[FlyingWedge]

Downtoscratch

 

Hi the book thought the base line or target line shifted out to the right on the downswing the line never moves i agree with the illusion the angle of approach or arc of approach depending on hitter or swinger. The picture shows the line shifting on the downswing to right field. the only angle that changes is plane angle.

[Jeff Evans]

How bout a simple observation from a mid handicapper. I read that you turn your hips as fast as you can in the downswing, however, when I analyze Hogan's swing VS. mine when I've tried this, I am wide open to the target at impact, he is not at all. There is a move there he's not talking about or I missed. His legs are driving forward a ton, it's a turn I guess but looks like they slide towards the target. Mine don't do that. Perhaps I missed that part in the book where he describes it?

 

To quote: Five Lessons The Modern Fundamental of Golf on page 90 paragraph #3, "To begin the downswing, TURN YOUR HIPS BACK TO THE LEFT. THERE MUST BE ENOUGH LATERAL MOTION FORWARD TO TRANSFER THE WEIGHT TO THE LEFT FOOT."

[Jeff Evans]

good point maybe i don't know anything but fact is hogan released the club with loft on the face so how could it be square to the arc at any stage of his downswing

i read bobby clampett asked him how does he get his right elbow in the correct position in the downswing hogan replied the hips take care of it

sorry for the rant before everyone else has had one lol

 

 

How bout a simple observation from a mid handicapper. I read that you turn your hips as fast as you can in the downswing, however, when I analyze Hogan's swing VS. mine when I've tried this, I am wide open to the target at impact, he is not at all. There is a move there he's not talking about or I missed. His legs are driving forward a ton, it's a turn I guess but looks like they slide towards the target. Mine don't do that. Perhaps I missed that part in the book where he describes it?

 

To quote: Five Lessons The Modern Fundamental of Golf on page 90 paragraph #3, "To begin the downswing, TURN YOUR HIPS BACK TO THE LEFT. THERE MUST BE ENOUGH LATERAL MOTION FORWARD TO TRANSFER THE WEIGHT TO THE LEFT FOOT."

 

The lateral motion of the hips allows the right elbow to get in front of the right hip in a pitch elbow location so it is the hips take care of it as Mr. Hogan stated according to Mr. Clampett.